What America Used To Be

[noose4]

I think that often liberals misunderstand the difference between the country as it was (with all its good and its bad) is not the same as prefering the ideals that the country represented. We don't see to return to times gone by but to ideals gone by.

When did these ideals actually exist? And what exactly were these ideals? Father Knows Best and Leave it to Beaver were tv shows and not representative of real life.

Again here we go using a ridiculous example to discredit an argument.

How about the idea that people are responsible for themselves and should be completely free to make any and all decisions regarding their lives as long as those decisions do not violate the rights of fellow citizens?

How about holding people accountable for the consequences of their decisions and not having people expect everyone else to pick up their mess?

How about the idea that you can make your own way without help from the government or without expecting to receive the fruits of another's labor?

None of that is "Leave it to Beaver".

I already answered that, nobody under the age of 80 was an adult when such things applied, the New Deal went into affect in the 1930's.

 

[Skull Pilot]

When did these ideals actually exist? And what exactly were these ideals? Father Knows Best and Leave it to Beaver were tv shows and not representative of real life.

Again here we go using a ridiculous example to discredit an argument.

How about the idea that people are responsible for themselves and should be completely free to make any and all decisions regarding their lives as long as those decisions do not violate the rights of fellow citizens?

How about holding people accountable for the consequences of their decisions and not having people expect everyone else to pick up their mess?

How about the idea that you can make your own way without help from the government or without expecting to receive the fruits of another's labor?

None of that is "Leave it to Beaver".

I already answered that, nobody under the age of 80 was an adult when such things applied, the New Deal went into affect in the 1930's.

So what?

because you believe that no one was ever free does not mean that people cannot want to be free again?

 

[Skull Pilot]

Again here we go using a ridiculous example to discredit an argument.

How about the idea that people are responsible for themselves and should be completely free to make any and all decisions regarding their lives as long as those decisions do not violate the rights of fellow citizens?

How about holding people accountable for the consequences of their decisions and not having people expect everyone else to pick up their mess?

How about the idea that you can make your own way without help from the government or without expecting to receive the fruits of another's labor?

None of that is "Leave it to Beaver".

While those are all "cute" ideas that many of us wish we could have, it's never happened. Unless you're counting the Wild West. Which in that case, I have to ask what you were smoking.

So it's "cute" to want to control your own destiny?

It's "cute" to want government that doesn't intrude on every aspect of our lives?

It's "cute" to be responsible and accountable?

What you dimocrat/progressives have not seemed to grasp is that the more responsibility you take away from people, the more irresponsible they become.

 

[California Girl]

I think that often liberals misunderstand the difference between the country as it was (with all its good and its bad) is not the same as prefering the ideals that the country represented. We don't see to return to times gone by but to ideals gone by.

When did these ideals actually exist? And what exactly were these ideals? Father Knows Best and Leave it to Beaver were tv shows and not representative of real life.

Now we are getting somewhere. TV and it's programmin on us have left us unable to tell fantasy from reality.

Where is the Fonze when his country needs him?

You wouldn't know 'somewhere' if it was signposted and on your SatNav. It is the typical liberal tactics - an old and somewhat tired one - instead of discussing or asking questions, you assume and ridicule based on that assumption.

Do you have any idea how pathetically stupid that makes you?

 

[noose4]

Again here we go using a ridiculous example to discredit an argument.

How about the idea that people are responsible for themselves and should be completely free to make any and all decisions regarding their lives as long as those decisions do not violate the rights of fellow citizens?

How about holding people accountable for the consequences of their decisions and not having people expect everyone else to pick up their mess?

How about the idea that you can make your own way without help from the government or without expecting to receive the fruits of another's labor?

None of that is "Leave it to Beaver".

I already answered that, nobody under the age of 80 was an adult when such things applied, the New Deal went into affect in the 1930's.

So what?

because you believe that no one was ever free does not mean that people cannot want to be free again?

If you were never "free" how can you be free again? The New Deal and subsequent other social programs have made life better for Americans, child labor laws, work place regulations, etc are good things, I dont want to live in a country that tells a widow with 5 kids that its too bad that their husband/father died but good luck making it on your own now.

 

[Skull Pilot]

I already answered that, nobody under the age of 80 was an adult when such things applied, the New Deal went into affect in the 1930's.

So what?

because you believe that no one was ever free does not mean that people cannot want to be free again?

If you were never "free" how can you be free again? The New Deal and subsequent other social programs have made life better for Americans, child labor laws, work place regulations, etc are good things, I dont want to live in a country that tells a widow with 5 kids that its too bad that their husband/father died but good luck making it on your own now.

Where in any of my posts have you heard me say I want to abolish child labor laws?

We can have such laws and not have a government that is growing in size scope and cost every minute of every day.

We can have some sort of social safety net without the government telling us what kind of health insurance to buy, or without the government taking 15% of our lifetime earnings to fund a Ponzi scheme like Social Security.

As I have said people should be responsible for their own actions. If they have a gaggle of kids they can't afford, is it my responsibility to pay for them?

Again the more responsibility you take away from people, the more irresponsible they become.

 

[Mr Natural]

What are you not free to do today that you were free to do let's say 100 years ago?

 

[Skull Pilot]

What are you not free to do today that you were free to do let's say 100 years ago?

Keep the money I earn.

 

[California Girl]

I already answered that, nobody under the age of 80 was an adult when such things applied, the New Deal went into affect in the 1930's.

So what?

because you believe that no one was ever free does not mean that people cannot want to be free again?

If you were never "free" how can you be free again? The New Deal and subsequent other social programs have made life better for Americans, child labor laws, work place regulations, etc are good things, I dont want to live in a country that tells a widow with 5 kids that its too bad that their husband/father died but good luck making it on your own now.

No one has actually suggested that. But - again - liberal tactic - assume and ridicule. I expect that from certain posters but I'm always disappointed when actually decent, intelligent lefties make use of it. Why don't you discuss instead of assuming and deriding... or are you afraid that you might actually see some validity in what others have to say?

 

[Mr Natural]

What are you not free to do today that you were free to do let's say 100 years ago?

Keep the money I earn.

Not for long.

 

[Modbert]

So it's "cute" to want to control your own destiny?

It's "cute" to want government that doesn't intrude on every aspect of our lives?

It's "cute" to be responsible and accountable?

What you dimocrat/progressives have not seemed to grasp is that the more responsibility you take away from people, the more irresponsible they become.

If you listen close enough, you may hear the sound of my real point going right over your head.

Again, YOU are the one who made this a Democrat/Republican issue. Not me.

 

[Skull Pilot]

So it's "cute" to want to control your own destiny?

It's "cute" to want government that doesn't intrude on every aspect of our lives?

It's "cute" to be responsible and accountable?

What you dimocrat/progressives have not seemed to grasp is that the more responsibility you take away from people, the more irresponsible they become.

If you listen close enough, you may hear the sound of my real point going right over your head.

Again, YOU are the one who made this a Democrat/Republican issue. Not me.

I didn't make it a repudlican issue at all because repudlicans are just as guilty as dimocrat/progressives are when it comes to he growth of government and the lessening of our liberties.

It's just that dimocrat/progressives are more vociferous in their praise of more intrusive more expensive government than the rest so I mention them more

 

[Modbert]

Again Skull, you may think I'm against you but in reality I'm not. I think you missed the point of this thread.

 

[Skull Pilot]

Again Skull, you may think I'm against you but in reality I'm not. I think you missed the point of this thread.

It's been known to happen.

We all see the world through our own particular set of tinted glasses

 

[uscitizen]

When did these ideals actually exist? And what exactly were these ideals? Father Knows Best and Leave it to Beaver were tv shows and not representative of real life.

Now we are getting somewhere. TV and it's programmin on us have left us unable to tell fantasy from reality.

Where is the Fonze when his country needs him?

You wouldn't know 'somewhere' if it was signposted and on your SatNav. It is the typical liberal tactics - an old and somewhat tired one - instead of discussing or asking questions, you assume and ridicule based on that assumption.

Do you have any idea how pathetically stupid that makes you?

Just as long as I do not appear as stupid as you are.

 

[noose4]

What are you not free to do today that you were free to do let's say 100 years ago?

Keep the money I earn.

Working people do better today with taxation than they did in the distant past when there was no income tax.

 

[California Girl]

Now we are getting somewhere. TV and it's programmin on us have left us unable to tell fantasy from reality.

Where is the Fonze when his country needs him?

You wouldn't know 'somewhere' if it was signposted and on your SatNav. It is the typical liberal tactics - an old and somewhat tired one - instead of discussing or asking questions, you assume and ridicule based on that assumption.

Do you have any idea how pathetically stupid that makes you?

Just as long as I do not appear as stupid as you are.

You appear to be far more stupid than I, but that is because, in fact, you are more stupid than I.

 

[noose4]

So what?

because you believe that no one was ever free does not mean that people cannot want to be free again?

If you were never "free" how can you be free again? The New Deal and subsequent other social programs have made life better for Americans, child labor laws, work place regulations, etc are good things, I dont want to live in a country that tells a widow with 5 kids that its too bad that their husband/father died but good luck making it on your own now.

No one has actually suggested that. But - again - liberal tactic - assume and ridicule. I expect that from certain posters but I'm always disappointed when actually decent, intelligent lefties make use of it. Why don't you discuss instead of assuming and deriding... or are you afraid that you might actually see some validity in what others have to say?

That wasnt ridicule it was a legitimate point.

 

[uscitizen]

You wouldn't know 'somewhere' if it was signposted and on your SatNav. It is the typical liberal tactics - an old and somewhat tired one - instead of discussing or asking questions, you assume and ridicule based on that assumption.

Do you have any idea how pathetically stupid that makes you?

Just as long as I do not appear as stupid as you are.

You appear to be far more stupid than I, but that is because, in fact, you are more stupid than I.

considering you have insufficient facts to base that conclusion on it proves you are more stupid than I?

 

[Skull Pilot]

What are you not free to do today that you were free to do let's say 100 years ago?

Keep the money I earn.

Working people do better today with taxation than they did in the distant past when there was no income tax.

care to prove that?

Because I am paying more in taxes (ALL taxes) than ever