CDZ Variation on "Thompson's Violinist" analogy with POLL

Discussion in 'Clean Debate Zone' started by Chuz Life, Apr 4, 2016.

?

Would the person who connects themself to the child be obligated to remain connected to the child?

  1. Yes, they assumed the risk so they would be obligated to keep the child alive for the 9 months.

    83.3%
  2. No, because (give your own explanation)

    16.7%
  1. Chuz Life
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    Chuz Life Gold Member

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    That was a very nicely worded rant.

    And if you want to believe that you would not have or should not have the legal right to maintain the connection to someone else's body if they were to connected theirs to yours in the way that I described in my questions? That's fine.

    I just wanted to be sure all the angles were examined.

    I obviously disagree with you, because I can not find it anywhere in our laws or in the Constitution . . . Where anyone has the right to use entrapment or especially accidental entrapment as an excuse / justification/ defense in the death of another human being.

    Also, for what it is worth? Cognition, self awareness, the ability to feel pain, etc... none of them are requirements for personhood.
     
    Last edited: Apr 23, 2017
  2. Xelor
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    Xelor Gold Member

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    Look, stop trying to "frame" and cast my answer. You asked the question and i gave you a very clear and highly literate answer to it. You don't need to tell me what I think or believe; I know that better than you. I told you what my position is on the matter about which you asked. Period.
     
  3. Chuz Life
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    Chuz Life Gold Member

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    This a forum for discussion. If you don't like seeing responses to your posts, you might consider not participating.

    You have ample room and time to add to or to clarify your posts as you may want to.

    Your answer to the question, so far, is still "hell no."

    Correct?

    If so, then my response is still the same too.
     
  4. Xelor
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    Xelor Gold Member

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    There's nothing to discuss. You asked a "yes or no" question and I provided my answer -- no -- along with how I arrived at that answer, which, though I shared that information, doesn't alter the fact that you asked a question to which the a direct answer is given by a binary set of choices. If you wanted to entreat for discussion, you should have asked an open ended question that does exactly that, and quite frankly, given the topic of the OP, and your ID, I'm quite certain I would not have bothered to respond because I'm quite certain that you aren't interested in doing anything other than advancing your own position.

    Hell, you aren't even willing to receive a direct and clear answer to your question and be done. You now have my answer to your question. My answer is neither more nor less than what I wrote, yet you keep "pushing" as though I've got something different or else to say in response to your question.

    In closing, let me remind you a pair of remarks we both earlier shared.

    Apparently, I was and have since been too subtle for you. Let me spell for you now what I hinted at earlier. Our conversation in this thread is done. I merely wanted to answer your question. That's it.
     
  5. Chuz Life
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    Chuz Life Gold Member

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    The record shows that I have accepted your answer and I have provided my reasons for why I disagree with your answer.

    I've not been "pushing" for anything more than that.

    Have you?
     
  6. Xelor
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    Xelor Gold Member

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    Okay...I didn't desire, have an interest in discovering, or request that information, and had I, I indeed would have asked for it. But fine, you shared it.

    Sure. If you say so. I call your repeating the question and telling me I didn't understand the allegory "pushing." You don't call it that. Okay. Whatever.
     
  7. Chuz Life
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    Chuz Life Gold Member

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    Please tell your therapist that I am sorry I made you feel pushed.
     
  8. SeaGal
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    SeaGal Gold Member

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    Obligated how?...morally, legally?

    Morally - easy answer is yes.

    Legally - not as clear-cut.

    Though I believe the number of babies aborted in this country is appalling, that the practice is barbaric and anti-science...though I also believe it is a mucked up society whose laws protect the embryo of an eagle, but not that of a human...I could never support forcibly restraining a woman for nine months. Better to ensure wide spread availability of birth control, which it already is, advocate for responsible behavior which includes accepting responsibility for the results of ones behavior - and to counter the assertion that a fetus is just a collection of cells with sound science.

    Never in the history of mankind has unwanted pregnancy been so easily preventable. Abortion should be decided at the state level. Some states have enacted fetal homicide laws - that will become a sticky wicket at some point.

    The point another poster made concerning a man's role is thought provoking - having no say or rights to say yea or nay regarding an abortion is still held legally responsible for 18 years if the child is born. His only choice comes before conception. As in your scenario - the choice made by the person who gets physically attached also 'attaches or detaches' the other person - with or without their consent.
     
  9. Chuz Life
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    Chuz Life Gold Member

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    Why not?


    Who said anything about forcibly restraining anyone?

    Please stick to the OP.

    That's a nice rant and I agree with some of it too.... but it has nothing or very little to do with the purpose and the subject of this thread. Please try harder to stay on topic.

    Thanks.
     
  10. SeaGal
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    SeaGal Gold Member

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    I believe that a question to clarify meaning is a legitimate component of any discussion. Your scenario was an illustration of two adults knowingly engaging in an activity that causes one of them to become attached to, and responsible for a helpless child - is that not correct?

    Even in a hypothetical question, such as yours, the means of obligation is absolutely relevant to the answer. Morally or legally? By choice or by law? (and all that 'by law' entails)

    If that question is unacceptable within the parameters of your story - then I agree...we're done here.
     

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