Time for a little truth on DACA.

[busybee01]

Your Father had a DUI, so we are prohibiting you from getting a drivers license. Your Mother wrote a bad check, and because of that you will not be allowed to have a checking account.

These statements if they were ever made, would be roundly denounced by pretty much everyone. The idea of children being punished for the crimes of their parents would be the exact opposite of what this nation supposedly stands for. Yet, a minority believe this is wholly appropriate in the case of the so called "dreamers". Children punished for a crime committed by their parents.

Your father robbed a bank, so you are on probation for all intents and purposes. We know you come from criminal stock. You must check in with the police regularly, and if you ever miss an appointment, off to jail you go.

I said above that a minority believe in deporting the DACA "dreamers". That is absolutely true. Now, supporters will argue that this is why people voted for Trump. Well, there were a lot of reasons to vote for Trump. Myself, I wanted to see some changes to NAFTA, or perhaps even withdrawal from the trade deal. I certainly did not want the TPP to become a treaty we were stuck with. Deporting the dreamers wasn't one of the reasons I voted for him. Yet, somehow the opponents of Trump, and the most vocal supporters all agree one one thing. You have to support everything if you support one thing. Which is asinine to say the very least.

Your Grandfather refused to go to Vietnam, so we are declaring you a deserter and sending you to prison.

Now, I'll admit that Obama's action concerning the "Dreamers" was not exactly right. I'll admit that the law says one thing. But if any of you have read my posts before, I love to quote among others Saint Augustine who taught us that an unjust law, is no law. The letter of the law is never a substitute to the moral right or wrong. Doing the wrong thing, because the law says so, is the worst of reasons. You are still doing the wrong thing, and you can never be a "good guy" if you do the wrong thing.

Morality is what is developed by what we are taught. The lessons from parents, schools, and Religion that teach us the idea of right and wrong. Absolute blind adhearance to the letter of the law even when the law is wrong is just as wrong. The law is on the books is no excuse, and even less reason.

Among the other things I've posted many times before is a belief that through compromise, we can accomplish some good things. We used to do this all the time. It is how the nation operated for more than two hundred years. No one would be happy with the compromise, but they would eventually agree to it. The my way or the highway mentality was left to movies, bad parents, and potentates. There was no room for them in real life. The Rolling Stones sang a song about it, you can't always get what you want, but you can get what you need.

Deporting the Dreamers might make you feel better, but is it the right thing? I would argue no. It is punishing the children for a crime committed by the parents. That I would always argue against. As for the parents, and what punishment is appropriate, we can always talk about that. We can reach some sort of agreement.

But those of you who support Trump should realize that the wind is blowing against you on this issue. The smart thing is to go with it, and find something else to get in return for the compromise. Screaming it's my way or the highway is going to get you nothing but defeated in the next elections. I don't think I would like that, because the Democratic Party has embraced the crazy in their effort to be seen opposing Trump, and that is just slightly dumber than the my way or the highway nonsense.

Willingness to compromise does not make you a fucking traitor. It doesn't make someone unamerican. It makes them a realist. Politics is the art of the possible. You might have heard that, or not.

Oh, and those of you who hate Trump and think all evil in the world is contained in the Republicans. Get over yourselves already. Figure out what you stand for, and standing against Trump is not standing for anything.

If a man robs a bank and buys a house with the proceeds, and then the government kicks the thief's kids out of the house so the state can seize it to recoup the stolen money, how is that not right?

DACA kids are receiving a benefit from the crime their parents committed they would otherwise not have enjoyed.

That analogy is ridiculous. No violence was used in the committing of a crime and society was not injured. We would not kick the kids on the street and leave them to their own devices.

 

[BluesLegend]

These kids are free to return to their own countries, we are not holding them responsible for their parents crimes.

The thousands of American citizens killed, raped, assaulted, robbed by illegals? Cry me a river that illegals will be inconvenienced by deportation back to their own damn country.

If you side with illegals over American citizens, you are a traitor.

The fact is that they re Americans now. Their memories of their home country may be hazy at best. My father was in the Army when he married a woman from a foreign country. I was brought back to this country when I was young. Yet if I went back it would be as a American not as someone born in that country.

The fact is that there have not been thousands of crimes committed by illegals. You lie using bogus statistics from bogus organizations.

DACA does not hurt American citizens. It is supported strongly by voters. You are the traitor to this country as you side with white supremacists. I would gladly trade one of them for you and send you back.

You LIE they are not American citizens they are illegals. Do you know what the word "illegal" means? Have you read our immigration laws?

You LIE the fact is illegals commit thousands of crimes, just in a single state. God that was one big fat whopper lie holy shit.

 

[Vastator]

These kids are free to return to their own countries, we are not holding them responsible for their parents crimes.

This is their own country and deporting them holds them responsible for their parents decision to bring them here.

No. This isn't their country. If it were; we wouldn't be having this discussion. It is precisely because this is not their country that this issue exists.

 

[busybee01]

Generations ago, Congress passed our immigration laws, and the President at the time signed them into law. They said that any foreign national who comes into the country without a visa, should be deported. The law made no exception for very young children.

DACA is a program created by Executive Order by Barack Obama. In doing so, he simply ignored the law. And then violated it. Is this what Presidents should do?

If Obama's heart told him it was bad to deport someone who had been brought into the country illegally by his parents when he was maybe 1 or two years old... why didn't Obama go to Congress (then fully controlled by Democrats), get them to pass a bill changing the immigration laws to allow grown adults who were brought in as young children to stay? Why did he take it upon himself to violate his own oath of office and break the laws passed by Congress instead? If this idea was as popular as the liberals say it is, there should have been no problem getting Congress to change the law... should there?

The reason is, because most Americans didn't want the law changed. And the Congressmen knew they might lose their next election if they changed the law that way, that's why.

Congress has had plenty of time - decades - to change the law. And they have deliberately kept it unchanged.

If your heart says that's not right... have YOU tried to get Congress to change the law? Or are you pretty sure you'd never succeed... because most American people don't want the law changed?

The American way is to have laws passed by our Representatives and signed by the President... and to have them changed by those representatives and signed into different form by the President. And to OBEY them until they are changed.

People who don't want to follow that pattern, should maybe find a different country where they don't do that. Until they do, no, they shouldn't just start letting illegal aliens who were brought here as kids, stay. That would violate the law - a law that America clearly doesn't want changed. Only a small but vocal minority want it differently.

Some anti-Americans would love to see our highest elected officials violate refuse to do their jobs and start violating American law instead. It would be the first step toward tearing down any American law they feel like, and transforming the country into something the American people don't want.

And those anti-Americans know that their best chance of success is to get Americans to say, "Where is your heart?" ....and carefully ignore the more important question, "Do we want our elected officials to obey and enforce the law we made our representatives pass... or not?"

Laws are not absolute. Things can change based on the circumstances of a case. The fact is that we have always carved out exceptions on a case by case even if statutes are changed. There are also times that we have used laws as weapons against certain groups of people.

Technically Obama did not have the power to create DACA however the courts have agreed that Presidents have the power to execute discretion in who they deport. Obama could have said that we will not deport people who were brought here as children and that would be legal. Even if DACA were legally overturned , the President has no obligation to deport them. Trump is going out of his way to say they will not be deported.

The fact is that Republicans have blocked attempts to make DACA legal not by voting it down but by using parliamentary tricks. DACA had 55 votes in the Senate but was filibustered. The House majority Republicans even refused to allow the House to vote on it.

The fact is that voters do support DACA and even amnesty. However it has not been a major voting issue in the past. If DACA becomes that, it will rebound to the detriment of Republicans.

 

[Aries]

These kids are free to return to their own countries, we are not holding them responsible for their parents crimes.

This is their own country and deporting them holds them responsible for their parents decision to bring them here.

No. This isn't their country. If it were; we wouldn't be having this discussion. It is precisely because this is not their country that this issue exists.

This is where they were raised. This is the only country they know.
DACA recipients can not have any convictions. Must be working or in school. Must pay high recertification costs. They are students or professionals. This is the country they serve and I appreciate their service.

 

[busybee01]

These kids are free to return to their own countries, we are not holding them responsible for their parents crimes.

The thousands of American citizens killed, raped, assaulted, robbed by illegals? Cry me a river that illegals will be inconvenienced by deportation back to their own damn country.

If you side with illegals over American citizens, you are a traitor.

The fact is that they re Americans now. Their memories of their home country may be hazy at best. My father was in the Army when he married a woman from a foreign country. I was brought back to this country when I was young. Yet if I went back it would be as a American not as someone born in that country.

The fact is that there have not been thousands of crimes committed by illegals. You lie using bogus statistics from bogus organizations.

DACA does not hurt American citizens. It is supported strongly by voters. You are the traitor to this country as you side with white supremacists. I would gladly trade one of them for you and send you back.

You LIE they are not American citizens they are illegals. Do you know what the word "illegal" means? Have you read our immigration laws?

You LIE the fact is illegals commit thousands of crimes, just in a single state. God that was one big fat whopper lie holy shit.

They are Americans in the way they think and the way they see the world. To send them to a country they may not even remember is cruel. You would be right at home in Hitler's Germany. They were all law and order as well.

You are the liar. You dare to use God in your post. Where is your proof?

 

[WaitingFor2020]

The thousands of American citizens killed, raped, assaulted, robbed by illegals? Cry me a river that illegals will be inconvenienced by deportation back to their own damn country.

By god lay down your life to keep a woman from having an abortion but once the kid is here, regardless of whose kid it is, the kid be damned and put out in the street. Yeah, you probably think you're a fucking Christian, too.

 

[Vastator]

These kids are free to return to their own countries, we are not holding them responsible for their parents crimes.

This is their own country and deporting them holds them responsible for their parents decision to bring them here.

No. This isn't their country. If it were; we wouldn't be having this discussion. It is precisely because this is not their country that this issue exists.

This is where they were raised. This is the only country they know.
DACA recipients can not have any convictions. Must be working or in school. Must pay high recertification costs. They are students or professionals. This is the country they serve and I appreciate their service.

I don't. Nor do appreciate their presence. Time to say adios...

 

[BluesLegend]

These kids are free to return to their own countries, we are not holding them responsible for their parents crimes.

This is their own country and deporting them holds them responsible for their parents decision to bring them here.

No. This isn't their country. If it were; we wouldn't be having this discussion. It is precisely because this is not their country that this issue exists.

This is where they were raised. This is the only country they know.
DACA recipients can not have any convictions. Must be working or in school. Must pay high recertification costs. They are students or professionals. This is the country they serve and I appreciate their service.

They are illegals FACT, suck it.

 

[BluesLegend]

These kids are free to return to their own countries, we are not holding them responsible for their parents crimes.

The thousands of American citizens killed, raped, assaulted, robbed by illegals? Cry me a river that illegals will be inconvenienced by deportation back to their own damn country.

If you side with illegals over American citizens, you are a traitor.

The fact is that they re Americans now. Their memories of their home country may be hazy at best. My father was in the Army when he married a woman from a foreign country. I was brought back to this country when I was young. Yet if I went back it would be as a American not as someone born in that country.

The fact is that there have not been thousands of crimes committed by illegals. You lie using bogus statistics from bogus organizations.

DACA does not hurt American citizens. It is supported strongly by voters. You are the traitor to this country as you side with white supremacists. I would gladly trade one of them for you and send you back.

You LIE they are not American citizens they are illegals. Do you know what the word "illegal" means? Have you read our immigration laws?

You LIE the fact is illegals commit thousands of crimes, just in a single state. God that was one big fat whopper lie holy shit.

They are Americans in the way they think and the way they see the world. To send them to a country they may not even remember is cruel. You would be right at home in Hitler's Germany. They were all law and order as well.

You are the liar. You dare to use God in your post. Where is your proof?

Oh God here we go, they identify American so they are American? Holy shit liberals are fucked up in the head.

 

[BluesLegend]

The thousands of American citizens killed, raped, assaulted, robbed by illegals? Cry me a river that illegals will be inconvenienced by deportation back to their own damn country.

By god lay down your life to keep a woman from having an abortion but once the kid is here, regardless of whose kid it is, the kid be damned and put out in the street. Yeah, you probably think you're a fucking Christian, too.

Blow it out your ass lib, where's your compassion for the other 3 BILLION poor kids on the planet, many in much more dire situations than these illegals from Mexico? Got nothing to say? Yeah we thought so.

 

[Liquid Reigns]

Your Father had a DUI, so we are prohibiting you from getting a drivers license. Your Mother wrote a bad check, and because of that you will not be allowed to have a checking account.

These statements if they were ever made, would be roundly denounced by pretty much everyone. The idea of children being punished for the crimes of their parents would be the exact opposite of what this nation supposedly stands for. Yet, a minority believe this is wholly appropriate in the case of the so called "dreamers". Children punished for a crime committed by their parents.

Your father robbed a bank, so you are on probation for all intents and purposes. We know you come from criminal stock. You must check in with the police regularly, and if you ever miss an appointment, off to jail you go.

I said above that a minority believe in deporting the DACA "dreamers". That is absolutely true. Now, supporters will argue that this is why people voted for Trump. Well, there were a lot of reasons to vote for Trump. Myself, I wanted to see some changes to NAFTA, or perhaps even withdrawal from the trade deal. I certainly did not want the TPP to become a treaty we were stuck with. Deporting the dreamers wasn't one of the reasons I voted for him. Yet, somehow the opponents of Trump, and the most vocal supporters all agree one one thing. You have to support everything if you support one thing. Which is asinine to say the very least.

Your Grandfather refused to go to Vietnam, so we are declaring you a deserter and sending you to prison.

Now, I'll admit that Obama's action concerning the "Dreamers" was not exactly right. I'll admit that the law says one thing. But if any of you have read my posts before, I love to quote among others Saint Augustine who taught us that an unjust law, is no law. The letter of the law is never a substitute to the moral right or wrong. Doing the wrong thing, because the law says so, is the worst of reasons. You are still doing the wrong thing, and you can never be a "good guy" if you do the wrong thing.

Morality is what is developed by what we are taught. The lessons from parents, schools, and Religion that teach us the idea of right and wrong. Absolute blind adhearance to the letter of the law even when the law is wrong is just as wrong. The law is on the books is no excuse, and even less reason.

Among the other things I've posted many times before is a belief that through compromise, we can accomplish some good things. We used to do this all the time. It is how the nation operated for more than two hundred years. No one would be happy with the compromise, but they would eventually agree to it. The my way or the highway mentality was left to movies, bad parents, and potentates. There was no room for them in real life. The Rolling Stones sang a song about it, you can't always get what you want, but you can get what you need.

Deporting the Dreamers might make you feel better, but is it the right thing? I would argue no. It is punishing the children for a crime committed by the parents. That I would always argue against. As for the parents, and what punishment is appropriate, we can always talk about that. We can reach some sort of agreement.

But those of you who support Trump should realize that the wind is blowing against you on this issue. The smart thing is to go with it, and find something else to get in return for the compromise. Screaming it's my way or the highway is going to get you nothing but defeated in the next elections. I don't think I would like that, because the Democratic Party has embraced the crazy in their effort to be seen opposing Trump, and that is just slightly dumber than the my way or the highway nonsense.

Willingness to compromise does not make you a fucking traitor. It doesn't make someone unamerican. It makes them a realist. Politics is the art of the possible. You might have heard that, or not.

Oh, and those of you who hate Trump and think all evil in the world is contained in the Republicans. Get over yourselves already. Figure out what you stand for, and standing against Trump is not standing for anything.

DACA truth? The truth is DACA recipients aren't being or going to be deported in any round up or anything else. DACA was/is unconstitutional the way it was implemented. Either Congress now does something or they don't regarding illegals.

Deportation is not a punishment. People move all over all the time, yes many even move from one country to another, and guess what, they take their children with them. These Dreamers are now in their 20's and 30's, moving via removal/deportation, they can adapt. Their jobs here can be filled by a legal worker or the business can innovate.

 

[Liquid Reigns]

How many of the dreamers have started the process to become a legal American? If they haven't could you explain why us Americans should give them a free pass?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

DACA has no ability to apply for or adjust status, they are illegals awaiting their deportation proceedings that have been paroled into the US, they simply no longer accrue illegal presence. They can't start any process from within the US to gain any type of legality here, it must be done through Congress via a bill and then signed by the President, otherwise they can be deported at any time.

 

[Liquid Reigns]

How many of the dreamers have started the process to become a legal American? If they haven't could you explain why us Americans should give them a free pass?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

They were not able to begin that process until Obama's DACA order.

DACA doesn't allow them to begin any process, they can not adjust their status from EWI unless they leave the country and apply from outside the US or Congress passes an amnesty bill and the President signs it.

 

[Liquid Reigns]

These kids are free to return to their own countries, we are not holding them responsible for their parents crimes.

This is their own country and deporting them holds them responsible for their parents decision to bring them here.

No this isn't 'their country'. Their parents took them from 'their' country and brought them here or they were sent or came without their parents. They can GO directly back to "their country" and protest and create havoc there.

Yes their parents.... so why are we punishing people for what their parents do? Trumps parents came here illegally, should he be punished for his parents wrong doings?

Deportation is not punishment. :SHRUG:

Trumps parents came here illegally? watafuknmoron SMFH

Ideological and political hack. :YAWN:

 

[Liquid Reigns]

Your Father had a DUI, so we are prohibiting you from getting a drivers license. Your Mother wrote a bad check, and because of that you will not be allowed to have a checking account.

These statements if they were ever made, would be roundly denounced by pretty much everyone. The idea of children being punished for the crimes of their parents would be the exact opposite of what this nation supposedly stands for. Yet, a minority believe this is wholly appropriate in the case of the so called "dreamers". Children punished for a crime committed by their parents.

Your father robbed a bank, so you are on probation for all intents and purposes. We know you come from criminal stock. You must check in with the police regularly, and if you ever miss an appointment, off to jail you go.

I said above that a minority believe in deporting the DACA "dreamers". That is absolutely true. Now, supporters will argue that this is why people voted for Trump. Well, there were a lot of reasons to vote for Trump. Myself, I wanted to see some changes to NAFTA, or perhaps even withdrawal from the trade deal. I certainly did not want the TPP to become a treaty we were stuck with. Deporting the dreamers wasn't one of the reasons I voted for him. Yet, somehow the opponents of Trump, and the most vocal supporters all agree one one thing. You have to support everything if you support one thing. Which is asinine to say the very least.

Your Grandfather refused to go to Vietnam, so we are declaring you a deserter and sending you to prison.

Now, I'll admit that Obama's action concerning the "Dreamers" was not exactly right. I'll admit that the law says one thing. But if any of you have read my posts before, I love to quote among others Saint Augustine who taught us that an unjust law, is no law. The letter of the law is never a substitute to the moral right or wrong. Doing the wrong thing, because the law says so, is the worst of reasons. You are still doing the wrong thing, and you can never be a "good guy" if you do the wrong thing.

Morality is what is developed by what we are taught. The lessons from parents, schools, and Religion that teach us the idea of right and wrong. Absolute blind adhearance to the letter of the law even when the law is wrong is just as wrong. The law is on the books is no excuse, and even less reason.

Among the other things I've posted many times before is a belief that through compromise, we can accomplish some good things. We used to do this all the time. It is how the nation operated for more than two hundred years. No one would be happy with the compromise, but they would eventually agree to it. The my way or the highway mentality was left to movies, bad parents, and potentates. There was no room for them in real life. The Rolling Stones sang a song about it, you can't always get what you want, but you can get what you need.

Deporting the Dreamers might make you feel better, but is it the right thing? I would argue no. It is punishing the children for a crime committed by the parents. That I would always argue against. As for the parents, and what punishment is appropriate, we can always talk about that. We can reach some sort of agreement.

But those of you who support Trump should realize that the wind is blowing against you on this issue. The smart thing is to go with it, and find something else to get in return for the compromise. Screaming it's my way or the highway is going to get you nothing but defeated in the next elections. I don't think I would like that, because the Democratic Party has embraced the crazy in their effort to be seen opposing Trump, and that is just slightly dumber than the my way or the highway nonsense.

Willingness to compromise does not make you a fucking traitor. It doesn't make someone unamerican. It makes them a realist. Politics is the art of the possible. You might have heard that, or not.

Oh, and those of you who hate Trump and think all evil in the world is contained in the Republicans. Get over yourselves already. Figure out what you stand for, and standing against Trump is not standing for anything.

If a man robs a bank and buys a house with the proceeds, and then the government kicks the thief's kids out of the house so the state can seize it to recoup the stolen money, how is that not right?

DACA kids are receiving a benefit from the crime their parents committed they would otherwise not have enjoyed.

That analogy is ridiculous. No violence was used in the committing of a crime and society was not injured. We would not kick the kids on the street and leave them to their own devices.

At age 18 many "kids" are kicked out and left to their own devices. The states receiving homes kick them out at 18, adoption agencies do the same. These DACA recipients are in their 20's and 30's now, adults that can adapt to their surroundings, either here if congress passes an amnesty bill and the president signs it, or in their country of birth of which they are citizens of.

 

[busybee01]

These kids are free to return to their own countries, we are not holding them responsible for their parents crimes.

The thousands of American citizens killed, raped, assaulted, robbed by illegals? Cry me a river that illegals will be inconvenienced by deportation back to their own damn country.

If you side with illegals over American citizens, you are a traitor.

The fact is that they re Americans now. Their memories of their home country may be hazy at best. My father was in the Army when he married a woman from a foreign country. I was brought back to this country when I was young. Yet if I went back it would be as a American not as someone born in that country.

The fact is that there have not been thousands of crimes committed by illegals. You lie using bogus statistics from bogus organizations.

DACA does not hurt American citizens. It is supported strongly by voters. You are the traitor to this country as you side with white supremacists. I would gladly trade one of them for you and send you back.

You LIE they are not American citizens they are illegals. Do you know what the word "illegal" means? Have you read our immigration laws?

You LIE the fact is illegals commit thousands of crimes, just in a single state. God that was one big fat whopper lie holy shit.

They are Americans in the way they think and the way they see the world. To send them to a country they may not even remember is cruel. You would be right at home in Hitler's Germany. They were all law and order as well.

You are the liar. You dare to use God in your post. Where is your proof?

Oh God here we go, they identify American so they are American? Holy shit liberals are fucked up in the head.

That is the standard when you can't argue a point. I am a Reagan conservative and Reagan was a human being unlike yourself.

Tennessee's Republican AG said it best in a letter. "Many of the DACA recipients, some of whose records I reviewed, have outstanding accomplishments and laudable ambitions, which if achieved, will be of great benefit and service to our country. They have an appreciation for the opportunities afforded them by our country."

 

[TroglocratsRdumb]

The DACA issue really brings out how racist the Democrats are.
All countries have immigration laws.
There is nothing racist about enforcing our immigration laws.
Illegal Aliens who disrespect our immigration laws are racist.
Democrats who brag about making white voters the minority through illegal immigration are racist.
Amnesty is about satisfying the Democratic Party's racism.

Here are some fine examples:

Brown Berets; “Go back to Boston! Go back to Plymouth Rock, Pilgrims! Get out! We are the future. You are old and tired. Go on. We have beaten you. Leave like beaten rats. You old white people. It is your duty to die … Through love of having children, we are going to take over.

Los Angeles City Council. “They’re afraid we’re going to take over the governmental institutions and other institutions. They’re right. We will take them over … We are here to stay.”

Professor University of Texas; “We have an aging white America. They are not making babies. They are dying. The explosion is in our population … I love it. They are shitting in their pants with fear. I love it.”

Chairman of the California Democratic Party, “Remember 187 — proposition to deny taxpayer funds for services to non-citizens — was the last gasp of white America in California.”

California Coalition of Hispanic Organizations and California State Secretary of Health, Education and Welfare under Governor Jerry Brown, also awarded the Presidential Medal of Freedom by President Bill Clinton, “California is going to be a Hispanic state. Anyone who doesn’t like it should leave.”

Mexican Consul General , “We are practicing ‘La Reconquista’ in California.”

Professor Loyola Marymount University; “We need to avoid a white backlash by using codes understood by Latinos …”

Racist Univison reporter Jorge Ramos: America Is ‘Our Country, Not Theirs’

 

[busybee01]

How many of the dreamers have started the process to become a legal American? If they haven't could you explain why us Americans should give them a free pass?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

They were not able to begin that process until Obama's DACA order.

DACA doesn't allow them to begin any process, they can not adjust their status from EWI unless they leave the country and apply from outside the US or Congress passes an amnesty bill and the President signs it.

The President has to deport them first. Obama used his discretion not to deport them just as Trump is doing. That is constitutional as decided by the Supreme Court.

 

[busybee01]

Your Father had a DUI, so we are prohibiting you from getting a drivers license. Your Mother wrote a bad check, and because of that you will not be allowed to have a checking account.

These statements if they were ever made, would be roundly denounced by pretty much everyone. The idea of children being punished for the crimes of their parents would be the exact opposite of what this nation supposedly stands for. Yet, a minority believe this is wholly appropriate in the case of the so called "dreamers". Children punished for a crime committed by their parents.

Your father robbed a bank, so you are on probation for all intents and purposes. We know you come from criminal stock. You must check in with the police regularly, and if you ever miss an appointment, off to jail you go.

I said above that a minority believe in deporting the DACA "dreamers". That is absolutely true. Now, supporters will argue that this is why people voted for Trump. Well, there were a lot of reasons to vote for Trump. Myself, I wanted to see some changes to NAFTA, or perhaps even withdrawal from the trade deal. I certainly did not want the TPP to become a treaty we were stuck with. Deporting the dreamers wasn't one of the reasons I voted for him. Yet, somehow the opponents of Trump, and the most vocal supporters all agree one one thing. You have to support everything if you support one thing. Which is asinine to say the very least.

Your Grandfather refused to go to Vietnam, so we are declaring you a deserter and sending you to prison.

Now, I'll admit that Obama's action concerning the "Dreamers" was not exactly right. I'll admit that the law says one thing. But if any of you have read my posts before, I love to quote among others Saint Augustine who taught us that an unjust law, is no law. The letter of the law is never a substitute to the moral right or wrong. Doing the wrong thing, because the law says so, is the worst of reasons. You are still doing the wrong thing, and you can never be a "good guy" if you do the wrong thing.

Morality is what is developed by what we are taught. The lessons from parents, schools, and Religion that teach us the idea of right and wrong. Absolute blind adhearance to the letter of the law even when the law is wrong is just as wrong. The law is on the books is no excuse, and even less reason.

Among the other things I've posted many times before is a belief that through compromise, we can accomplish some good things. We used to do this all the time. It is how the nation operated for more than two hundred years. No one would be happy with the compromise, but they would eventually agree to it. The my way or the highway mentality was left to movies, bad parents, and potentates. There was no room for them in real life. The Rolling Stones sang a song about it, you can't always get what you want, but you can get what you need.

Deporting the Dreamers might make you feel better, but is it the right thing? I would argue no. It is punishing the children for a crime committed by the parents. That I would always argue against. As for the parents, and what punishment is appropriate, we can always talk about that. We can reach some sort of agreement.

But those of you who support Trump should realize that the wind is blowing against you on this issue. The smart thing is to go with it, and find something else to get in return for the compromise. Screaming it's my way or the highway is going to get you nothing but defeated in the next elections. I don't think I would like that, because the Democratic Party has embraced the crazy in their effort to be seen opposing Trump, and that is just slightly dumber than the my way or the highway nonsense.

Willingness to compromise does not make you a fucking traitor. It doesn't make someone unamerican. It makes them a realist. Politics is the art of the possible. You might have heard that, or not.

Oh, and those of you who hate Trump and think all evil in the world is contained in the Republicans. Get over yourselves already. Figure out what you stand for, and standing against Trump is not standing for anything.

If a man robs a bank and buys a house with the proceeds, and then the government kicks the thief's kids out of the house so the state can seize it to recoup the stolen money, how is that not right?

DACA kids are receiving a benefit from the crime their parents committed they would otherwise not have enjoyed.

That analogy is ridiculous. No violence was used in the committing of a crime and society was not injured. We would not kick the kids on the street and leave them to their own devices.

At age 18 many "kids" are kicked out and left to their own devices. The states receiving homes kick them out at 18, adoption agencies do the same. These DACA recipients are in their 20's and 30's now, adults that can adapt to their surroundings, either here if congress passes an amnesty bill and the president signs it, or in their country of birth of which they are citizens of.

Were they 18 when they came into this country? I would disagree that they can adapt easily. Again a President has discretion in who to deport.