So how about that Vick fella?

[Article 15]

yeah, I should digress.

It's lonely on my side, I'll jump over to the other side where the ****** is always guilty

funny, but...

I'm going to go ahead and assume his niggerness has nothing to do with it and it's all about the fact that he tortured animals. To some people that's the worst, most evil crime anyone can commit.

His niggerness will always have something to do with it. Although some ******* do get forgiven after much worse cases. Like Kobe. And Michael Jackson. People still worship MJ.

Consentual affairs and possible rapes of young women...OK.

Inappropriate relationships with young boys...OK.

Killing dogs...NO WAY.

Winning (and making Thriller, I guess) changes things.

 

[chanel]

There all scum and don't deserve to be paid zillions of dollars. I'd even be able to accept the outrageous salaries if these dirtballs were positive role models, but they are exactly the opposite. They undo a lot of what I do for a living. Kids worship these creeps.

Vick was told to keep his nose clean, not just "don't get arrested" He blew it.

Oh but Paulie - my husband said the story is bullshit. Vick will stay. He's probably right.

 

[Paulie]

.

Vick was told to keep his nose clean, not just "don't get arrested" He blew it.

Oh but Paulie - my husband said the story is bullshit. Vick will stay. He's probably right.

Chanel, he blew WHAT?

There's no evidence that he did anything wrong. A co-defendant crashed Vick's party, was told to leave, caused a scene, and then got shot afterwards.

How does that mean Vick HIMSELF blew it? The guy might as well just lock himself in his house and never go out in public again, because any random potential felon might just happen to end up in his presence, and then you guys are all going to scream "he blew it!" everytime.

How about just waiting for the facts before coming to a conclusion? Isn't that how the legal system is supposed to work in this country?

 

[strollingbones]

paulie...you have been a vick excuse maker from the beginning...get over it..hes a total thug

 

[Paulie]

Yup,

However, bones was one of the few here (along with me) that expressed disgust over the Jackson worship after he died.

If I know bones, she was most likely disgusted with MJ long before his history with little boys. And since she's like anti-sports, she was probably never a fan of Kobe either.

But then, bones isn't the only one coming to hasty conclusions now, is she?

 

[Paulie]

paulie...you have been a vick excuse maker from the beginning...get over it..hes a total thug

When you see me making one single excuse for him in this particular case, let me know.

 

[chanel]

the article stated he might lose his job. That wasn't just two Vick haters on the internet. He threw a party for himself that his co-defendent just happened to crash. Wasn't it in VA beach? What a coinkindink! Not. Keeping his noe clean might mean quiet parties at home. TFB.

I know a girl who is an Eagles cheerleader. No facebook. If she posts, she's fired. Apparently the Eagles have rules.

 

[Paulie]

the article stated he might lose his job. That wasn't just two Vick haters on the internet. He threw a party for himself that his co-defendent just happened to crash. Wasn't it in VA beach? What a coinkindink! Not. Keeping his noe clean might mean quiet parties at home. TFB.

I know a girl who is an Eagles cheerleader. No facebook. If she posts, she's fired. Apparently the Eagles have rules.

Coincidences are not valid evidence in a court of law. No jury would convict him of anything just because it's 'coincidental' that the co-defendant showed up.

You've drawn a hasty conclusion because the guy has zero credibility in your eyes. That's fine, but at least just admit it.

As far as the Eagles letting him go, that's their perogative. Who am I to question their rules? I'm only speaking on the question of whether or not he broke the law here, which so far according to the facts we do know, he didn't.

 

[manifold]

How about just waiting for the facts before coming to a conclusion? Isn't that how the legal system is supposed to work in this country?

That's exactly how the legal system works. But the court of public opinion is not subject to the rigors of the legal system, nor would it be reasonable to expect it to be.

 

[Paulie]

How about just waiting for the facts before coming to a conclusion? Isn't that how the legal system is supposed to work in this country?

That's exactly how the legal system works. But the court of public opinion is not subject to the rigors of the legal system, nor would it be reasonable to expect it to be.

The court of public opinion can persuade a jury. That's what worries me most.

Anyway, apparently they ID'd the shooter, and it ain't Vick.

But supposedly no one's talking.

He must be guilty!!!!

 

[MikeK]

[...]

This why the US justice system is so fucked up. There will never be a successful "innocent until proven guilty" system, because people's feelings cloud their judgement.

[...]

Unfortunately there is no way to eliminate human nature from the process. And because the offense Vick was convicted of, extreme animal cruelty for profit, is to most people heinous and unforgiveable, the metaphorical bounty on his head should not surprise you.

Lots of people want Michael Vick to suffer. If I were he I would stay home and watch television for the next two years.

 

[Paulie]

[...]

This why the US justice system is so fucked up. There will never be a successful "innocent until proven guilty" system, because people's feelings cloud their judgement.

[...]

Unfortunately there is no way to eliminate human nature from the process. And because the offense Vick was convicted of, extreme animal cruelty for profit, is to most people heinous and unforgiveable, the metaphorical bounty on his head should not surprise you.

Lots of people want Michael Vick to suffer. If I were he I would stay home and watch television for the next two years.

The guy spent 2 years in prison.

He did his time.

Before you decide that 2 years in prison isn't enough, go spend 2 years there yourself and then come talk to me.

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

You can take the brother out of the <insert racist idiom> but you can't take the <repeat racist idiom> out of the brother.

you can take the failed musician out of the spotlight, but he will never move on of his own free will.

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

The tragedy of the once-highest paid NFL player continues …

The AP reports that gunfire disrupted the wee hours of Mike Vick’s 30th birthday party last week. No, the onetime dogfighting ‘heavyweight’ did not pull the trigger nor receive the bullet; however, the fiasco occurred just outside the Virginia Beach nightclub hosting the soiree, and police identified the wounded man as a co-defendant in Vick’s dogfighting case.

CBS adds that, according to Vick’s attorney, #7 wasn’t present at the nightclub when the bullets started flying. Plus, Vick and his brother Marcus apparently hadn’t even invited the victim, who had “crashed the party” and insulted its hosts.

Michael Vick Just Can’t Avoid Trouble - Kevin Mack - Bring Back Grossman - True/Slant

Predictions?

He's a man of the people. He will not walk away from his roots. Anyone who uses dogs in fights in our culture is most likely going to end up how Vick will end up. Sad, but give him time.

 

[MikeK]

[...]

His niggerness will always have something to do with it. Although some ******* do get forgiven after much worse cases. Like Kobe. And Michael Jackson. People still worship MJ.

Consentual affairs and possible rapes of young women...OK.

Inappropriate relationships with young boys...OK.

Killing dogs...NO WAY.

With the exception of some bimbo who made a special effort to go to Kobe Bryant's room where she admittedly engaged in preliminary physical contact with him and then charged him with forcible rape, I'm not aware of any "possible rapes" Bryant was charged with. If I'm mistaken, please set me straight. As for the bimbo in question, I don't believe her. And even if Bryant did force a conclusion to the act which she went out of her way to initiate it's her own fault. She got what she asked for. So there is no reason for me to harbor any hostility toward Kobe Bryant.

As for Michael Jackson's alleged dalliances with young boys, the main mitigating factor in his case is nothing was ever conclusively proved. And he is so much the silly little quince there is nothing about him which is suggestive of the typically contemptible pedophile. There also is the fact that the little boys who he is alleged to have behaved inappropriately with were delivered to him by their parents.

So the factors of doubt and the absence of substantive harm in Jackson's example do not come close in terms of wanton criminality to the heartless, vicious cruelty of forcing innocent animals to fight and kill each other for sport and profit. So while I'm aware of no specific crime for which I can despise Michael Jackson, if I had an opportunity to cause Michael Vick to suffer I would make the most of it. And be assured I would feel no different if he were White.

 

[Paulie]

[...]

His niggerness will always have something to do with it. Although some ******* do get forgiven after much worse cases. Like Kobe. And Michael Jackson. People still worship MJ.

Consentual affairs and possible rapes of young women...OK.

Inappropriate relationships with young boys...OK.

Killing dogs...NO WAY.

With the exception of some bimbo who made a special effort to go to Kobe Bryant's room where she admittedly engaged in preliminary physical contact with him and then charged him with forcible rape, I'm not aware of any "possible rapes" Bryant was charged with. If I'm mistaken, please set me straight. As for the bimbo in question, I don't believe her. And even if Bryant did force a conclusion to the act which she went out of her way to initiate it's her own fault. She got what she asked for. So there is no reason for me to harbor any hostility toward Kobe Bryant.

As for Michael Jackson's alleged dalliances with young boys, the main mitigating factor in his case is nothing was ever conclusively proved. And he is so much the silly little quince there is nothing about him which is suggestive of the typically contemptible pedophile. There also is the fact that the little boys who he is alleged to have behaved inappropriately with were delivered to him by their parents.

So the factors of doubt and the absence of substantive harm in Jackson's example do not come close in terms of wanton criminality to the heartless, vicious cruelty of forcing innocent animals to fight and kill each other for sport and profit. So while I'm aware of no specific crime for which I can despise Michael Jackson, if I had an opportunity to cause Michael Vick to suffer I would make the most of it. And be assured I would feel no different if he were White.

Bones, I'm going to let you take this one.

If ever there were excuses being made for negative behavior...

 

[driveby]

He's a shitty QB .......

 

[MikeK]

The guy spent 2 years in prison.

He did his time.

Before you decide that 2 years in prison isn't enough, go spend 2 years there yourself and then come talk to me.

If he did two years for larceny I would concede to that. But the fact that Vick, who already was earning the kind of money the ordinary person only hopes for, chose to do what he did for no reasons other then innate cruelty and greed, causes emotion to transcend reason.

I should mention here that I consider the existing system of imposing prison terms as punishment for any type of criminal offense to be counterproductive and wasteful. I have my own ideas about this which are based mainly on the principle that punishment should fit the crime. And locking Vick up for two years is a perfect example of a bad fit. I believe the appropriate punishment for Vick would be to lock him in a cage with an hungry, pissed off mountain lion, give him a pocket knife to defend himself with, televise it and allow the public to bet on the outcome.

Would you prefer that to two years in the joint?

 

[Paulie]

The guy spent 2 years in prison.

He did his time.

Before you decide that 2 years in prison isn't enough, go spend 2 years there yourself and then come talk to me.

If he did two years for larceny I would concede to that. But the fact that Vick, who already was earning the kind of money the ordinary person only hopes for, chose to do what he did for no reasons other then innate cruelty and greed, causes emotion to transcend reason.

I should mention here that I consider the existing system of imposing prison terms as punishment for any type of criminal offense to be counterproductive and wasteful. I have my own ideas about this which are based mainly on the principle that punishment should fit the crime. And locking Vick up for two years is a perfect example of a bad fit. I believe the appropriate punishment for Vick would be to lock him in a cage with an hungry, pissed off mountain lion, give him a pocket knife to defend himself with, televise it and allow the public to bet on the outcome.

Would you prefer that to two years in the joint?

I don't know, dude. I'm not really cool with murdering someone because they killed an animal, which is pretty much what you're proposing here.

That isn't justice to me. In an execution case, there is at least some form of justice served, as the family of the original victim can obtain some form of closure.

Animals don't have the ability to reason, so allowing one to kill a human being because the human killed one of them isn't logical. Not a single animal understands that it was somehow offered some kind of 'justice'. Only those who are most strongly opposed to animal cruelty have their appetites satisfied.

Anyway, Leavenworth is hell. I don't know exactly how Vick was treated there, but 2 years inside that joint is otherwise torture in its own right.

 

[MikeK]

I don't know, dude. I'm not really cool with murdering someone because they killed an animal, which is pretty much what you're proposing here.

Actually I'm not. If murder was my intention I would have him tossed in with a couple of full-size, hungry lions, or a pissed-off bear. But Vick is a big, strong athletic guy who is twice the weight of the average mountain lion, and with a blade in one hand he would have a fighting chance to come out alive. Bloody, but alive -- and certainly not inclined to put animals through that ever again.

Animals don't have the ability to reason, so allowing one to kill a human being because the human killed one of them isn't logical.

The fact that animals can't reason is what makes them innocent and pure. And the fact that humans can reason is what makes some of them such rotten bastards they deserve to be tied up and boiled.

Not a single animal understands that it was somehow offered some kind of 'justice'. Only those who are most strongly opposed to animal cruelty have their appetites satisfied.

You might be surprised at how many people are extremely opposed to cruelty to animals. And that even includes many people who hunt for the table. They will not tolerate inflicting needless pain on an animal and many of them despise trophy hunters.

Anyway, Leavenworth is hell. I don't know exactly how Vick was treated there, but 2 years inside that joint is otherwise torture in its own right.

Paulie,

In the philosophical sense, doing time is like getting laid. Unless one has had the experience there is no way they can understand how bad or how good it really is. And that is why I believe prison as the universal punishment for any offense is counterproductive and wasteful.