So, Gutenberg Didn’t Actually Invent the Printing Press

[Unkotare]

Wow, some people have the strangest reactions to these seemingly innocuous topics.

Some people seem threatened by the fact that moveable type was not first invented in Europe.

Some people have a cartoonishly inaccurate idea about the history of the worlds largest empire.

Some people then go one step further to use this of all topics to express their hatred for the United States of America.

Strange.

 

[Picaro]

Some people are morons and get all upset when it's pointed out their racist mythology is a load of rubbish. Anybody who thinks Gutenburg went to China, copied down and drew Chinese presses, came back to Europe and copied his from plans is and idiot. The Chinese had zero to do with Gutenburg's invention. It;s a simple fact. Get over it. The same goes for many of the mills and other machinery invented in the alleged 'Dark Ages' and after.

 

[martybegan]

Why split hairs? It was no secret in the 1400's to put ink on an engraved surface and transfer it to paper or some similar substance. Gutenberg used existing technology and his own innovations to build the first reliable recognizable commercial device that revolutionized the world.

Exactly, It was his press that went into widespread commercial use and started the publishing boom.

(And incidentally started the death knell for the scribe profession)

 

[Unkotare]

...Anybody who thinks Gutenburg went to China, copied down and drew Chinese presses, came back to Europe and copied his from plans .....

Wow, who said that?

 

[Picaro]

...Anybody who thinks Gutenburg went to China, copied down and drew Chinese presses, came back to Europe and copied his from plans .....

Wow, who said that?

You would have eventually. You're a dumb troll, and wouldn't be able to stop yourself.

 

[Unkotare]

...Anybody who thinks Gutenburg went to China, copied down and drew Chinese presses, came back to Europe and copied his from plans .....

Wow, who said that?

You would have eventually. ....

“Would have eventually”?

Did you really just post that?

 

[zaangalewa]

Wow, some people have the strangest reactions to these seemingly innocuous topics.

Some people seem threatened by the fact that moveable type was not first invented in Europe. ...

Example: That some Vikings reached America ist without any effect or importance, because the Vikings did not publish this. (Naturally it is important for our knowledge about the Vikings).

America for example got its name from the German card producer Martin Waldseemüller and his team, because of the reports of America Vespucchi, ah sorry: Amerigo Vespucchi. He made clear it is a new continent. In science for example it is not important who solved a problem - it is important who published it. That's why everyone calls America "America".

Besides that moveable types make not a big sensne in the chinese system of writing the background of this what had happened afterwards is totally different. Insects had eyes a long time before mammals had eyes - but this means not the eyes of mammals are a product of the eyes of insects. Both are an independent "product" of the light all around us.

What you call "Wow, some people have the strangest reactions" is just simple that you don't understand the philosophical essentials of the western world.

 

[Unkotare]

Wow, some people have the strangest reactions to these seemingly innocuous topics.

Some people seem threatened by the fact that moveable type was not first invented in Europe. ...

Example: That some Vikings reached America ist without any effect or importance, because the Vikings did not publish this. (Naturally it is important for our knowledge about the Vikings).

America for example got its name from the German card producer Martin Waldseemüller and his team, because of the reports of America Vespucchi, ah sorry: Amerigo Vespucchi. He made clear it is a new continent. In science for example it is not important who solved a problem - it is important who published it. That's why everyone calls America "America".

Besides that moveable types make not a big sensne in the chinese system of writing the background of this what had happened afterwards is totally different. Insects had eyes a long time before mammals had eyes - but this means not the eyes of mammals are a product of the eyes of insects.

What you call "Wow, some people have the strangest reactions" is just simple that you don't understand the philosophical essentials of the western world.

Is there a doctor in the house?


Now someone is upset about the Vikings coming to N America, and that...insects have eyes...?

??????

Btw, moveable type works really, really well with Chinese characters.

 

[zaangalewa]

Wow, some people have the strangest reactions to these seemingly innocuous topics.

Some people seem threatened by the fact that moveable type was not first invented in Europe. ...

Example: That some Vikings reached America ist without any effect or importance, because the Vikings did not publish this. (Naturally it is important for our knowledge about the Vikings).

America for example got its name from the German card producer Martin Waldseemüller and his team, because of the reports of America Vespucchi, ah sorry: Amerigo Vespucchi. He made clear it is a new continent. In science for example it is not important who solved a problem - it is important who published it. That's why everyone calls America "America".

Besides that moveable types make not a big sensne in the chinese system of writing the background of this what had happened afterwards is totally different. Insects had eyes a long time before mammals had eyes - but this means not the eyes of mammals are a product of the eyes of insects.

What you call "Wow, some people have the strangest reactions" is just simple that you don't understand the philosophical essentials of the western world.

Is there a doctor in the house?


Now someone is upset about the Vikings coming to N America, and that...insects have eyes...?

??????

Btw, moveable type works really, really well with Chinese characters.

But it's totally different to find a "letter" under 10,000 or 100,000 or more other "letters". If the chinese invention had had the same consequences as the invention of Guternberg we would be now 200 years in the future and the world history would be another one. The German monk "Schwarz" (black) for example stole the secret how to make Schwarzpulver (=black powder) in China. Two results of this was hundreds years later: the Nobel price and a man who made a little step to the moon without playing sax.

 

[OldLady]

Movable type was first created by Bi Sheng (990-1051), who used baked clay, which was very fragile.
Well, considering the letters were always breaking and that block printing was usually used because it was cheaper, I would say Gutenberg can have the cup for figuring out how to fashion letters from something durable and introducing it to Europe where it caught like a house afire and made us all the well educated people we are today. I read someplace that in China, the Emperor only allowed the most elite among his own staff to learn to read and write, so it would not have revolutionized their civilization like it did the West.
I love Gutenberg. I hope he has statues somewhere.

 

[Unkotare]

Wow, some people have the strangest reactions to these seemingly innocuous topics.

Some people seem threatened by the fact that moveable type was not first invented in Europe. ...

Example: That some Vikings reached America ist without any effect or importance, because the Vikings did not publish this. (Naturally it is important for our knowledge about the Vikings).

America for example got its name from the German card producer Martin Waldseemüller and his team, because of the reports of America Vespucchi, ah sorry: Amerigo Vespucchi. He made clear it is a new continent. In science for example it is not important who solved a problem - it is important who published it. That's why everyone calls America "America".

Besides that moveable types make not a big sensne in the chinese system of writing the background of this what had happened afterwards is totally different. Insects had eyes a long time before mammals had eyes - but this means not the eyes of mammals are a product of the eyes of insects.

What you call "Wow, some people have the strangest reactions" is just simple that you don't understand the philosophical essentials of the western world.

Is there a doctor in the house?


Now someone is upset about the Vikings coming to N America, and that...insects have eyes...?

??????

Btw, moveable type works really, really well with Chinese characters.

But it's totally different to find a "letter" under 10,000 or 100,000 or more other "letters". ...

Only if you don’t understand the language.

 

[Picaro]

Movable type was first created by Bi Sheng (990-1051), who used baked clay, which was very fragile.
Well, considering the letters were always breaking and that block printing was usually used because it was cheaper, I would say Gutenberg can have the cup for figuring out how to fashion letters from something durable and introducing it to Europe where it caught like a house afire and made us all the well educated people we are today. I read someplace that in China, the Emperor only allowed the most elite among his own staff to learn to read and write, so it would not have revolutionized their civilization like it did the West.
I love Gutenberg. I hope he has statues somewhere.

the Chinese made the same cheap defective junk then they make now. And again, block printing was known by the aryan cultures and the Mesopotamian cultures around 4,000 B.C. There is no proof the Chinese invented it or anything else; India and SE Asia is the likely source of anything they claim to have invented.

 

[OldLady]

Movable type was first created by Bi Sheng (990-1051), who used baked clay, which was very fragile.
Well, considering the letters were always breaking and that block printing was usually used because it was cheaper, I would say Gutenberg can have the cup for figuring out how to fashion letters from something durable and introducing it to Europe where it caught like a house afire and made us all the well educated people we are today. I read someplace that in China, the Emperor only allowed the most elite among his own staff to learn to read and write, so it would not have revolutionized their civilization like it did the West.
I love Gutenberg. I hope he has statues somewhere.

the Chinese made the same cheap defective junk then they make now. And again, block printing was known by the aryan cultures and the Mesopotamian cultures around 4,000 B.C. There is no proof the Chinese invented it or anything else; India and SE Asia is the likely source of anything they claim to have invented.

What's your problem with China? Honestly, Picaro, you are so grumpy lately

 

[zaangalewa]

Wow, some people have the strangest reactions to these seemingly innocuous topics.

Some people seem threatened by the fact that moveable type was not first invented in Europe. ...

Example: That some Vikings reached America ist without any effect or importance, because the Vikings did not publish this. (Naturally it is important for our knowledge about the Vikings).

America for example got its name from the German card producer Martin Waldseemüller and his team, because of the reports of America Vespucchi, ah sorry: Amerigo Vespucchi. He made clear it is a new continent. In science for example it is not important who solved a problem - it is important who published it. That's why everyone calls America "America".

Besides that moveable types make not a big sensne in the chinese system of writing the background of this what had happened afterwards is totally different. Insects had eyes a long time before mammals had eyes - but this means not the eyes of mammals are a product of the eyes of insects.

What you call "Wow, some people have the strangest reactions" is just simple that you don't understand the philosophical essentials of the western world.

Is there a doctor in the house?


Now someone is upset about the Vikings coming to N America, and that...insects have eyes...?

??????

Btw, moveable type works really, really well with Chinese characters.

But it's totally different to find a "letter" under 10,000 or 100,000 or more other "letters". ...

Only if you don’t understand the language.

No. 100 and 100x100 is not the same. A question in this context: When you see a sand grain take another and add this second one. Add another then you have three sand grains and so on. In a machine minded form of logic is now everything explained - but the human reality is not machine minded. After a while you will have some sand grains and more time later it will be a pile of sand. So: When becomes a grain of sand a pile of sand? This change in the quality (made by quantity in this case) is important. How long do you need to learn some letters and to work with Gutenbergs system? 'Some' time, I would say. And how long do you need to learn the same with a pile of letters? - I'm sure I never would learn this - except perhaps I have someone behind me with a very sharp sabre. Fortunatelly exist today photocopiers. To paint a message and to copy it seems to be much more easy.

 

[Unkotare]

...

 

[zaangalewa]

...

If you move your finger in the other direction then you will perhaps slowly start to begin to understand what I tried to explain to you in this context. Knowledge is not arbitrary. The chinese invention - if it had really existed and/or is really comparable - had no tradition. In the tradition of Gutenberg is a sea of new knowledge which is available for everyone in the whole world. But if you prefer "old" knowledge, then study what the ancient Greek pilosophers said - or what Lao Tse, Confucius and the Shakyamuni said. You will find lots of "Gutenberg"-books (relatively cheap books, made for everyone) about this in all languages of the world, hopefully.

 

[Unkotare]

.... The chinese invention - if it had really existed and/or is really comparable - had no tradition.......

A tradition at least 600 years old before Gutenberg made his notable version. Your bias does not rest on fact.

 

[zaangalewa]

.... The chinese invention - if it had really existed and/or is really comparable - had no tradition.......

A tradition at least 600 years old before Gutenberg made his notable version. Your bias does not rest on fact.

And this sentence is exactly the problem. Where is the tradition? No one would speak about this Chinese invention without Gutenberg - even in case the name Gutenberg would be unknown, because someone eliminates him out of history. Some people think history is what's written in history books and what children learn in school. It's not! History are the facts of history. I guess Gutenberg would just simple say "I am not a Gutenbergist". He made only a very simple system, which every idiot is able to make. But not any other idiot of all idiots on our planet - and this are lots of masses of people - had the same simple idea and showed a way where many many ... many little little ... little steps moved more than only a mountain. Gutenberg made the world go round.

 

[Unkotare]

.... The chinese invention - if it had really existed and/or is really comparable - had no tradition.......

A tradition at least 600 years old before Gutenberg made his notable version. Your bias does not rest on fact.

And this sentence is exactly the problem. Where is the tradition? ......

600 years seems like a pretty well-established tradition. What did Gutenberg print that became so widely read? Oh yeah, holy text. What were the early Chinese moveable print blocks used for? Oh yeah, holy texts.

 

[Mike Dwight]