Shrink the Rich; Not Government

[Sallow]

Which -other- union did he break?

Moving goalposts?

When you blame others for your lack of wealth.. yes, you are.

Well..that's one take.

Another is that conservatives have been deconstructing the very protections and regulations that made a middle class in this country possible.

I don't have a "lack of wealth" by the way. I own a co-op on the upper east side of Manhattan, work in the financial industry and in this year alone I traveled to Shanghai, Taiwan and Guatemala. Oh..and I renovated the kitchen and bathroom. With black marble, brushed nickle and several other types of stones and metals. Along with a brand spanking new stainless steel oven, convection oven/microwave, refridgerator and dish washer. All designer crap (My girlfriend designed the whole thing..)

But..thanks for the concern.

OK then. First of all, congrats on your success. Why don't you start the ball rolling by turning over 90% of your income to the government? How many poor people could you have fed instead of giving yourself a rather decadent bathroom and kitchen? I only ask because you seem to feel that other Americans should do so. You should be willing to do no less than you would ask from a fellow American, no?

Line item tax return?

I like that idea. Okay..I will do that..if I can opt out of paying for 11 carrier groups..2 ongoing wars and over 700 bases world wide...600 of which we probably don't need.

Deal?

 

[AVG-JOE]

Just one more note...

Warren Buffett, one of the richest men on the planet, would prefer to pay a little more in taxes than the 16% he pays, especially when compared to the 32% his employees pay on average. He 'gets' it...

http://www.usmessageboard.com/polit...h-with-the-hope-they-spend-does-not-work.html

What's keeping him from giving more of his money to the government voluntarily?

Hint: Nothing.

Absolutely. And if you watch the program that's linked in the thread you'll see that he and the other super rich guys featured in the program, Ted Turner and Bill Gates are in fact giving away billions, but that's not the point.

The point is unfair taxes where the average middle class Joe pays about 30% and those making upper 7 and 8 figures are paying around 16%. The reason? The amount of influence that can be purchased in congress for 2% to 5% of the income of the upper 5%.

If you believe that the very wealthy should only pay 16% while the middle class pays 30% then you think that the current tax code is fair and this is the point where we disagree. If, on the other hand, we agree that the current code is patently unfair, the next step in the discussion is how to fix it.

Where do we stand, Dave?

 

[NYcarbineer]

Probably started with Reagan smashing the Unions..on down to Dubya changing overtime rules.

But heck..for the most part if you ain't born into the fraternity of ultra-rich...no real way in.

You probably believe that shit, too.

Lemme guess. You are a grandson of Sam Walton..

daveman works for the government.

 

[Sallow]

Just one more note...

Warren Buffett, one of the richest men on the planet, would prefer to pay a little more in taxes than the 16% he pays, especially when compared to the 32% his employees pay on average. He 'gets' it...

http://www.usmessageboard.com/polit...h-with-the-hope-they-spend-does-not-work.html

What's keeping him from giving more of his money to the government voluntarily?

Hint: Nothing.

Absolutely. And if you watch the program that's linked in the thread you'll see that he and the other super rich guys featured in the program, Ted Turner and Bill Gates are in fact giving away billions, but that's not the point.

The point is unfair taxes where the average middle class Joe pays about 30% and those making upper 7 and 8 figures are paying around 16%. The reason? The amount of influence that can be purchased in congress for 2% to 5% of the income of the upper 5%.

If you believe that the very wealthy should only pay 16% while the middle class pays 30% then you think that the current tax code is fair and this is the point where we disagree. If, on the other hand, we agree that the current code is patently unfair, the next step in the discussion is how to fix it.

Where do we stand, Dave?

Well Turner's essentially broke now. (Well not by our standards..but he's done giving away cash). Gates still has around 54 billion. He's a little slow on the giveaway..

 

[AVG-JOE]

Let me tell you how to get rich in America. It is very simple.
Start working full time at age 18. Go to college at night and weekends. Work 2 jobs while young.
Drive old cars and do not borrow $. 1st residence buy in an older urban neighborhood for a cheap price. Build equity and then move.
DO NOT HAVE CHILDREN UNTIL AFTER AGE 30.
Do not buy cameras, TVs, ANYTHING new until you have at least 50 % equity in your home. Save a dollar here and there and then at age 30 save twenty dollars here and there and at age 40 save a hundred dollars here and there. Before long you will have 100K saved in cash at age 45.
Do not spend $$ on watches, leather coats, ANYTHING faddy ever. Save that $$. Do not ever carry a balance on a charge card. Do not eat at fancy restaurants unless you have 50% equity in your home.
I did all of that and my net worth is over a million now easy in a bad economy. I drive a 1999 Sienna van with 250K on it. I make 1/2 what my neighbor makes and he is broke, owes 200K on his business, 350K on his home and 100K on charge cards. He drives new cars, his wife has an Infinity sports car, his kids wear designer clothes and he has NO $$ for Christmas.
A disciplined American would have to be deaf, dumb and blind NOT to get wealthy here.

'Cause everybody knows that's how Paris Hilton did it.

P.S. - what you describe is a fairly secure, upper middle class life that is STILL one medical crisis away from poverty. WEALTH is something different.

 

[Sallow]

You probably believe that shit, too.

Lemme guess. You are a grandson of Sam Walton..

daveman works for the government.

Even better!

I work in the private sector and he works in the public sector.

The irony of that...

 

[Sallow]

Let me tell you how to get rich in America. It is very simple.
Start working full time at age 18. Go to college at night and weekends. Work 2 jobs while young.
Drive old cars and do not borrow $. 1st residence buy in an older urban neighborhood for a cheap price. Build equity and then move.
DO NOT HAVE CHILDREN UNTIL AFTER AGE 30.
Do not buy cameras, TVs, ANYTHING new until you have at least 50 % equity in your home. Save a dollar here and there and then at age 30 save twenty dollars here and there and at age 40 save a hundred dollars here and there. Before long you will have 100K saved in cash at age 45.
Do not spend $$ on watches, leather coats, ANYTHING faddy ever. Save that $$. Do not ever carry a balance on a charge card. Do not eat at fancy restaurants unless you have 50% equity in your home.
I did all of that and my net worth is over a million now easy in a bad economy. I drive a 1999 Sienna van with 250K on it. I make 1/2 what my neighbor makes and he is broke, owes 200K on his business, 350K on his home and 100K on charge cards. He drives new cars, his wife has an Infinity sports car, his kids wear designer clothes and he has NO $$ for Christmas.
A disciplined American would have to be deaf, dumb and blind NOT to get wealthy here.

'Cause everybody knows that's how Paris Hilton did it.

P.S. - what you describe is a fairly secure, upper middle class life that is STILL one medical crisis away from poverty. WEALTH is something different.

Exactly!

 

[daveman]

Probably started with Reagan smashing the Unions..on down to Dubya changing overtime rules.

But heck..for the most part if you ain't born into the fraternity of ultra-rich...no real way in.

Your so full of shit... Reagan didnt crush unions. I wish he had of, but alas... another liberal lie.

Lie? Reagan used government to break the Air Traffic Controller Union. No lie..just your ignorance of history.

Psssst! "Unions" =/= "union".

 

[daveman]

The richest 10,000 Americans "earn" on average $50,000,000 a year. Any reason they couldn't be just as happy with 30% of $50 million? Especially since most of their income isn't "earned" at all. It's what Adam Smith called the money landlords earn in their sleep.

Any reason you can't get off your ass and work?

Been there.
Done that.
Really sucked at it.

So why should everyone else have to pay for your failure?

You been on vacation?

Nope. I work for a living. Try it sometime.

 

[Sallow]

Your so full of shit... Reagan didnt crush unions. I wish he had of, but alas... another liberal lie.

Lie? Reagan used government to break the Air Traffic Controller Union. No lie..just your ignorance of history.

Psssst! "Unions" =/= "union".

No..Unions.

After the Government essentially took away the right to strike..it had a chilling effect on all other Unions.

There haven't been many strikes since then..

 

[daveman]

Probably started with Reagan smashing the Unions..on down to Dubya changing overtime rules.

But heck..for the most part if you ain't born into the fraternity of ultra-rich...no real way in.

You probably believe that shit, too.

Lemme guess. You are a grandson of Sam Walton..

Nope. I'm a grandson of a farmer and carpenter. My financial status is due strictly to my effort. I've inherited nothing but some keepsakes of no financial worth and some great memories.

 

[GHook93]

This all comes from a 63 year old man who still lives with mommy and has never made more than minimum wage!

 

[ConservativeDad]

Moving goalposts?



Well..that's one take.

Another is that conservatives have been deconstructing the very protections and regulations that made a middle class in this country possible.

I don't have a "lack of wealth" by the way. I own a co-op on the upper east side of Manhattan, work in the financial industry and in this year alone I traveled to Shanghai, Taiwan and Guatemala. Oh..and I renovated the kitchen and bathroom. With black marble, brushed nickle and several other types of stones and metals. Along with a brand spanking new stainless steel oven, convection oven/microwave, refridgerator and dish washer. All designer crap (My girlfriend designed the whole thing..)

But..thanks for the concern.

OK then. First of all, congrats on your success. Why don't you start the ball rolling by turning over 90% of your income to the government? How many poor people could you have fed instead of giving yourself a rather decadent bathroom and kitchen? I only ask because you seem to feel that other Americans should do so. You should be willing to do no less than you would ask from a fellow American, no?

Line item tax return?

I like that idea. Okay..I will do that..if I can opt out of paying for 11 carrier groups..2 ongoing wars and over 700 bases world wide...600 of which we probably don't need.

Deal?

Sure, why not? Your particular drop in the bucket goes only towards whatever causes triphammers your fuzzy little liberal heart.

 

[daveman]

Just one more note...

Warren Buffett, one of the richest men on the planet, would prefer to pay a little more in taxes than the 16% he pays, especially when compared to the 32% his employees pay on average. He 'gets' it...

http://www.usmessageboard.com/polit...h-with-the-hope-they-spend-does-not-work.html

What's keeping him from giving more of his money to the government voluntarily?

Hint: Nothing.

Absolutely. And if you watch the program that's linked in the thread you'll see that he and the other super rich guys featured in the program, Ted Turner and Bill Gates are in fact giving away billions, but that's not the point.

The point is unfair taxes where the average middle class Joe pays about 30% and those making upper 7 and 8 figures are paying around 16%. The reason? The amount of influence that can be purchased in congress for 2% to 5% of the income of the upper 5%.

If you believe that the very wealthy should only pay 16% while the middle class pays 30% then you think that the current tax code is fair and this is the point where we disagree. If, on the other hand, we agree that the current code is patently unfair, the next step in the discussion is how to fix it.

Where do we stand, Dave?

I don't know where "we" stand. I stand where you can't tax a nation into prosperity. I stand where I'm not envious of what others have and insisting they give some of it to me.

Where do you stand, Joe?

 

[georgephillip]

The premise of this thread is Class Warfare...Nothing more.

Don't buy into it.

'You think the richest 10,000 Americans are confused about the existence of the class war?

What will it take to convince you?

When the rich have sufficiently off-shored enough of "their" wealth and the Fed really cranks up the presses, turning every $10 bill you own into a $5?

How about a $1...in a country with 200 million private guns?

 

[daveman]

You probably believe that shit, too.

Lemme guess. You are a grandson of Sam Walton..

daveman works for the government.

Yeah? So? Did you have a point, or are you just mindlessly lashing out?

 

[GHook93]

LOL, it's always the rich fucking people in the mind of the libtard commie. Rather it can't be the fact that government policies that put restraints on business create an unfriendly business environment? Unfriendly environments to business cause they to look else where.

Maybe the government needs to be run by businessmen and work towards giving US businesses an advantage in the global economy!

 

[Sallow]

You probably believe that shit, too.

Lemme guess. You are a grandson of Sam Walton..

Nope. I'm a grandson of a farmer and carpenter. My financial status is due strictly to my effort. I've inherited nothing but some keepsakes of no financial worth and some great memories.

Well good on you and congrats.

Nothing wrong with hard work. I am a big advocate for it.

 

[daveman]

What's keeping him from giving more of his money to the government voluntarily?

Hint: Nothing.

Absolutely. And if you watch the program that's linked in the thread you'll see that he and the other super rich guys featured in the program, Ted Turner and Bill Gates are in fact giving away billions, but that's not the point.

The point is unfair taxes where the average middle class Joe pays about 30% and those making upper 7 and 8 figures are paying around 16%. The reason? The amount of influence that can be purchased in congress for 2% to 5% of the income of the upper 5%.

If you believe that the very wealthy should only pay 16% while the middle class pays 30% then you think that the current tax code is fair and this is the point where we disagree. If, on the other hand, we agree that the current code is patently unfair, the next step in the discussion is how to fix it.

Where do we stand, Dave?

Well Turner's essentially broke now. (Well not by our standards..but he's done giving away cash). Gates still has around 54 billion. He's a little slow on the giveaway..

Did Turner give his money to the government, as you insist he should (being an eeeevil rich man)?

 

[daveman]

Lemme guess. You are a grandson of Sam Walton..

daveman works for the government.

Even better!

I work in the private sector and he works in the public sector.

The irony of that...

Really? Are you one of those idiots who thinks the military spending is socialism?

That wouldn't surprise me much, actually.