Gunny
Gold Member
If you DO see them roaming the streets killing people, you might want to seek some professional help about that.
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Senate tinkering with Gun Sales
- Thread starter matty
- Start date
If you DO see them roaming the streets killing people, you might want to seek some professional help about that.
Old Rocks
Diamond Member
June 19, 2004
United States Congress
House of Representatives
Washington, D.C.
Dear Representative
The following national law enforcement organizations, consisting of the International Association of Chiefs of Police, Police Foundation, Major Cities Chiefs Association, Police Executive Research Forum, National Organization of Black Law Enforcement Executives, Hispanic American Police Command Officers Association, National Association of School Resource Officers, National Black Police Association and the International Brotherhood of Police Officers, collectively represent America's law enforcement professionals. Their agencies are on the front lines of America's war on crime, drugs, and terrorism. These organizations represent law enforcement management, rank-and-file officers and other policing professionals. The law enforcement leaders who comprise their memberships applaud your past efforts to make our cities and counties safer and hope you will continue that work by ensuring the federal ban against military-style assault weapons does not expire.
Law enforcement is committed to reducing violence and fear in all our communities. Police are especially concerned about weaponry that increases the threat of violence against officers and the citizens they protect. In the past, the nation's peace officers have joined together to oppose the sale of armor-piercing ammunition, undetectable firearms and military-style assault weapons that have no legitimate sporting purpose.
HAPCOA - Hispanic American Police Command Officers Association
United States Congress
House of Representatives
Washington, D.C.
Dear Representative
The following national law enforcement organizations, consisting of the International Association of Chiefs of Police, Police Foundation, Major Cities Chiefs Association, Police Executive Research Forum, National Organization of Black Law Enforcement Executives, Hispanic American Police Command Officers Association, National Association of School Resource Officers, National Black Police Association and the International Brotherhood of Police Officers, collectively represent America's law enforcement professionals. Their agencies are on the front lines of America's war on crime, drugs, and terrorism. These organizations represent law enforcement management, rank-and-file officers and other policing professionals. The law enforcement leaders who comprise their memberships applaud your past efforts to make our cities and counties safer and hope you will continue that work by ensuring the federal ban against military-style assault weapons does not expire.
Law enforcement is committed to reducing violence and fear in all our communities. Police are especially concerned about weaponry that increases the threat of violence against officers and the citizens they protect. In the past, the nation's peace officers have joined together to oppose the sale of armor-piercing ammunition, undetectable firearms and military-style assault weapons that have no legitimate sporting purpose.
HAPCOA - Hispanic American Police Command Officers Association
Old Rocks
Diamond Member
Police chiefs: Restore assault weapons ban
The Miami Herald ^ | 9-19-07 | SUSANNAH A. NESMITH
Posted on Wednesday, September 19, 2007 11:49:54 AM by nin_kasi
Miami-Dade Officer Jose Somohano was shot and killed with a Mak-90 assault rifle three years to the day after the federal law prohibiting the sale of such weapons expired.
The International Association of Chiefs of Police issued a report at noon Wednesday calling for, among other things, a renewal of the ban, arguing that it helps keep police officers safe by reducing the ``firepower available to criminals.''
The report hits home for South Florida law enforcement officers, who have been facing an increasing number of these guns on the street since the ban expired. Miami-Dade Mayor Carlos Alvarez, a former police officer and police director, can't hide his anger when he talks about the fact that lawmakers let the ban expire.
''While I feel very strongly about the Second Amendment, I don't think that our founding fathers had AK-47s in mind,'' he said. ``There's absolutely no reason I can see having these weapons out on the street.''
His voice rising, he brings up Shawn LaBeet, the man who killed Somohano: ``This guy just went to a gun store with a fake ID and bought one.''
LaBeet bought nine guns in the past year, including the semiautomatic Mak-90, which is similar to an AK-47. The gun was covered under the assault weapons ban and was illegal to sell for 10 years until September 2004.
''It's one thing to talk philosophically about the right to bear arms and it's another to see what these assault rifles can do,'' Alvarez said.
Local police say the numbers of murders committed with assault weapons has been steadily rising since the ban expired on Sept. 13, 2004.
In the city of Miami, 20 percent of murders this year were committed with assault weapons, up from 4 percent in 2004.
Police chiefs: Restore assault weapons ban
The Miami Herald ^ | 9-19-07 | SUSANNAH A. NESMITH
Posted on Wednesday, September 19, 2007 11:49:54 AM by nin_kasi
Miami-Dade Officer Jose Somohano was shot and killed with a Mak-90 assault rifle three years to the day after the federal law prohibiting the sale of such weapons expired.
The International Association of Chiefs of Police issued a report at noon Wednesday calling for, among other things, a renewal of the ban, arguing that it helps keep police officers safe by reducing the ``firepower available to criminals.''
The report hits home for South Florida law enforcement officers, who have been facing an increasing number of these guns on the street since the ban expired. Miami-Dade Mayor Carlos Alvarez, a former police officer and police director, can't hide his anger when he talks about the fact that lawmakers let the ban expire.
''While I feel very strongly about the Second Amendment, I don't think that our founding fathers had AK-47s in mind,'' he said. ``There's absolutely no reason I can see having these weapons out on the street.''
His voice rising, he brings up Shawn LaBeet, the man who killed Somohano: ``This guy just went to a gun store with a fake ID and bought one.''
LaBeet bought nine guns in the past year, including the semiautomatic Mak-90, which is similar to an AK-47. The gun was covered under the assault weapons ban and was illegal to sell for 10 years until September 2004.
''It's one thing to talk philosophically about the right to bear arms and it's another to see what these assault rifles can do,'' Alvarez said.
Local police say the numbers of murders committed with assault weapons has been steadily rising since the ban expired on Sept. 13, 2004.
In the city of Miami, 20 percent of murders this year were committed with assault weapons, up from 4 percent in 2004.
Police chiefs: Restore assault weapons ban
Gunny
Gold Member
Lautenberg is a doddering old fool who continues to be re-elected (after having come out of retirement because "The Torch" torched himself) because he has a name that people recognize.
Senate Panel Defeats Bill on Gun Show Sales
Va. Tech Survivors Backed Measure
Sen. Henry L. Marsh III (D-Richmond), right, and Sen. R. Creigh Deeds (D-Bath) could not overcome opposition to gun control on the Senate Courts of Justice Committee. (By Steve Helber -- Associated Press)
By Sandhya Somashekhar
Washington Post Staff Writer
Thursday, January 24, 2008; Page B01
RICHMOND, Jan. 23 -- A bill that would have restricted certain gun sales in Virginia and that had received passionate support from survivors of the Virginia Tech massacre was defeated by a Senate committee Wednesday, ending the major gun control effort of this year's General Assembly session.
The legislation had failed repeatedly over the years but had taken on a greater urgency this year because of the April 16 shootings. Supporters had said this year was their best chance of winning approval because of the Virginia Tech tragedy, and Gov. Timothy M. Kaine (D) had made it a priority.
But Republicans and rural Democrats on the Senate Courts of Justice Committee teamed up to reject the bill, which would have required background checks for buyers at gun shows. Sens. Richard L. Saslaw, Janet D. Howell and Linda T. "Toddy" Puller, Fairfax County Democrats, voted in favor of the bill, and Sen. Ken Cuccinelli II, a Fairfax Republican, voted against it.
Under current law, only people who buy guns from licensed dealers must be checked through the federal database that identifies convicted felons and others deemed a danger to the community. Between 22 percent and 35 percent of gun show vendors do not have licenses, Virginia State Police say.
Senate Panel Defeats Bill on Gun Show Sales - washingtonpost.com
Now if they want to close a "loophole", why don't they try closing THAT one?
I'll have to agree with this. There's a BIG difference between background checks and firearms registration. Gun shows shouldn't get a free pass. IMO, they should require whoever is running the show to ensure all dealers/sellers are licensed to sell firearms, and background checks should be required on ALL firearms purchases.
That's just a no brainer. I'm all for responsible gun ownership. I don't consider that being responsible at all.
Gunny
Gold Member
June 19, 2004
United States Congress
House of Representatives
Washington, D.C.
Dear Representative
The following national law enforcement organizations, consisting of the International Association of Chiefs of Police, Police Foundation, Major Cities Chiefs Association, Police Executive Research Forum, National Organization of Black Law Enforcement Executives, Hispanic American Police Command Officers Association, National Association of School Resource Officers, National Black Police Association and the International Brotherhood of Police Officers, collectively represent America's law enforcement professionals. Their agencies are on the front lines of America's war on crime, drugs, and terrorism. These organizations represent law enforcement management, rank-and-file officers and other policing professionals. The law enforcement leaders who comprise their memberships applaud your past efforts to make our cities and counties safer and hope you will continue that work by ensuring the federal ban against military-style assault weapons does not expire.
Law enforcement is committed to reducing violence and fear in all our communities. Police are especially concerned about weaponry that increases the threat of violence against officers and the citizens they protect. In the past, the nation's peace officers have joined together to oppose the sale of armor-piercing ammunition, undetectable firearms and military-style assault weapons that have no legitimate sporting purpose.
HAPCOA - Hispanic American Police Command Officers Association
The 2nd Amendment doesn't qualify the right to own and bear arms with the term "sporting purpose."
Gunny
Gold Member
Police chiefs: Restore assault weapons ban
The Miami Herald ^ | 9-19-07 | SUSANNAH A. NESMITH
Posted on Wednesday, September 19, 2007 11:49:54 AM by nin_kasi
Miami-Dade Officer Jose Somohano was shot and killed with a Mak-90 assault rifle three years to the day after the federal law prohibiting the sale of such weapons expired.
The International Association of Chiefs of Police issued a report at noon Wednesday calling for, among other things, a renewal of the ban, arguing that it helps keep police officers safe by reducing the ``firepower available to criminals.''
The report hits home for South Florida law enforcement officers, who have been facing an increasing number of these guns on the street since the ban expired. Miami-Dade Mayor Carlos Alvarez, a former police officer and police director, can't hide his anger when he talks about the fact that lawmakers let the ban expire.
''While I feel very strongly about the Second Amendment, I don't think that our founding fathers had AK-47s in mind,'' he said. ``There's absolutely no reason I can see having these weapons out on the street.''
His voice rising, he brings up Shawn LaBeet, the man who killed Somohano: ``This guy just went to a gun store with a fake ID and bought one.''
LaBeet bought nine guns in the past year, including the semiautomatic Mak-90, which is similar to an AK-47. The gun was covered under the assault weapons ban and was illegal to sell for 10 years until September 2004.
''It's one thing to talk philosophically about the right to bear arms and it's another to see what these assault rifles can do,'' Alvarez said.
Local police say the numbers of murders committed with assault weapons has been steadily rising since the ban expired on Sept. 13, 2004.
In the city of Miami, 20 percent of murders this year were committed with assault weapons, up from 4 percent in 2004.
Police chiefs: Restore assault weapons ban
You can put all the body armor in the world on and be shot dead with a single shot .22 LR.
As I already the presented, the number of deaths PERIOD has been increasing. Guess that's how that "more people = more deaths" no-brainer works. You're more like to die from the flu. Better hide until it's over.
DamnYankee
No Neg Policy
- Apr 2, 2009
- 4,516
- 441
- 48
Lautenberg is a doddering old fool who continues to be re-elected (after having come out of retirement because "The Torch" torched himself) because he has a name that people recognize.
Senate Panel Defeats Bill on Gun Show Sales
Va. Tech Survivors Backed Measure
Sen. Henry L. Marsh III (D-Richmond), right, and Sen. R. Creigh Deeds (D-Bath) could not overcome opposition to gun control on the Senate Courts of Justice Committee. (By Steve Helber -- Associated Press)
By Sandhya Somashekhar
Washington Post Staff Writer
Thursday, January 24, 2008; Page B01
RICHMOND, Jan. 23 -- A bill that would have restricted certain gun sales in Virginia and that had received passionate support from survivors of the Virginia Tech massacre was defeated by a Senate committee Wednesday, ending the major gun control effort of this year's General Assembly session.
The legislation had failed repeatedly over the years but had taken on a greater urgency this year because of the April 16 shootings. Supporters had said this year was their best chance of winning approval because of the Virginia Tech tragedy, and Gov. Timothy M. Kaine (D) had made it a priority.
But Republicans and rural Democrats on the Senate Courts of Justice Committee teamed up to reject the bill, which would have required background checks for buyers at gun shows. Sens. Richard L. Saslaw, Janet D. Howell and Linda T. "Toddy" Puller, Fairfax County Democrats, voted in favor of the bill, and Sen. Ken Cuccinelli II, a Fairfax Republican, voted against it.
Under current law, only people who buy guns from licensed dealers must be checked through the federal database that identifies convicted felons and others deemed a danger to the community. Between 22 percent and 35 percent of gun show vendors do not have licenses, Virginia State Police say.
Senate Panel Defeats Bill on Gun Show Sales - washingtonpost.com
Now if they want to close a "loophole", why don't they try closing THAT one?
I'll have to agree with this. There's a BIG difference between background checks and firearms registration. Gun shows shouldn't get a free pass. IMO, they should require whoever is running the show to ensure all dealers/sellers are licensed to sell firearms, and background checks should be required on ALL firearms purchases.
That's just a no brainer. I'm all for responsible gun ownership. I don't consider that being responsible at all.
I see it as analogous to holding employers of illegal immigrants responsible for that. Instead of trying to enforce from the bottom up, they should be enforcing from the top down. These are the people who are running the country though....
I'm posting this again for the cheap seats:
Murder rates in the U.S. are hovering at 40 year lows.
Source: Crime in the United States, 2008, FBI, Uniform Crime Reports.
Homicide Rate (per 100,000), 1950–2007 — Infoplease.com
Murder rates in the U.S. are hovering at 40 year lows.
.........Year --- Homicide rate
1950 --- 4.6
1951 --- 4.4
1952 --- 4.6
1953 --- 4.5
1954 --- 4.2
1955 --- 4.1
1956 --- 4.1
1957 --- 4.0
1958 --- 4.8
1959 --- 4.9
1960 --- 5.1
1961 --- 4.8
1962 --- 4.6
1963 --- 4.6
1964 --- 4.9
1965 --- 5.1
1966 --- 5.6
1967 --- 6.2
1968 --- 6.9
1969 --- 7.3
1970 --- 7.9
1971 --- 8.6
1972 --- 9.0
1973 --- 9.4
1974 --- 9.8
1975 --- 9.6
1976 --- 8.8
1977 --- 8.8
1978 --- 9.0
1979 --- 9.7
1980 --- 10.2
1981 --- 9.8
1982 --- 9.1
1983 --- 8.3
1984 --- 7.9
1985 --- 7.9
1986 --- 8.6
1987 --- 8.3
1988 --- 8.4
1989 --- 8.7
1990 --- 9.4
1991 --- 9.8
1992 --- 9.3
1993 --- 9.5
1994 --- 9.0
1995 --- 8.2
1996 --- 7.4
1997 --- 6.8
1998 --- 6.3
1999 --- 5.7
2000 --- 5.5
2001 --- 5.6
2002 --- 5.6
2003 --- 5.7
2004 --- 5.5
2005 --- 5.9
2006 --- 6.1
2007 --- 5.9
1951 --- 4.4
1952 --- 4.6
1953 --- 4.5
1954 --- 4.2
1955 --- 4.1
1956 --- 4.1
1957 --- 4.0
1958 --- 4.8
1959 --- 4.9
1960 --- 5.1
1961 --- 4.8
1962 --- 4.6
1963 --- 4.6
1964 --- 4.9
1965 --- 5.1
1966 --- 5.6
1967 --- 6.2
1968 --- 6.9
1969 --- 7.3
1970 --- 7.9
1971 --- 8.6
1972 --- 9.0
1973 --- 9.4
1974 --- 9.8
1975 --- 9.6
1976 --- 8.8
1977 --- 8.8
1978 --- 9.0
1979 --- 9.7
1980 --- 10.2
1981 --- 9.8
1982 --- 9.1
1983 --- 8.3
1984 --- 7.9
1985 --- 7.9
1986 --- 8.6
1987 --- 8.3
1988 --- 8.4
1989 --- 8.7
1990 --- 9.4
1991 --- 9.8
1992 --- 9.3
1993 --- 9.5
1994 --- 9.0
1995 --- 8.2
1996 --- 7.4
1997 --- 6.8
1998 --- 6.3
1999 --- 5.7
2000 --- 5.5
2001 --- 5.6
2002 --- 5.6
2003 --- 5.7
2004 --- 5.5
2005 --- 5.9
2006 --- 6.1
2007 --- 5.9
Source: Crime in the United States, 2008, FBI, Uniform Crime Reports.
Homicide Rate (per 100,000), 1950–2007 — Infoplease.com
Learn the truth:
Fewer Police Officers Killed in Line of Duty in 2008
Based on their analysis of preliminary data, the National Law Enforcement Officers Memorial Fund (NLEOMF) and Concerns of Police Survivors (C.O.P.S.) reported on Dec. 29 they found that 140 officers have died in the line of duty this year, a 23 percent reduction from the 2007 figure of 181. Other than 1996, when 139 officers were killed, 2008 represents the lowest year for officer fatalities since 1965, when 136 officers died in the line of duty.
This year's reduction includes a steep, 40 percent drop in the number of officers who were shot and killed, from 68 in 2007 to 41 in 2008. The last time firearms-related fatalities were this low was 1956, when there were 35 such deaths. The 2008 figure is 74 percent lower than the total for 1973, when a near-record high 156 law enforcement officers were shot and killed.
Fewer Police Officers Killed in Line of Duty in 2008 -- Occupational Health & Safety
Fewer Police Officers Killed in Line of Duty in 2008
- Dec 31, 2008
Based on their analysis of preliminary data, the National Law Enforcement Officers Memorial Fund (NLEOMF) and Concerns of Police Survivors (C.O.P.S.) reported on Dec. 29 they found that 140 officers have died in the line of duty this year, a 23 percent reduction from the 2007 figure of 181. Other than 1996, when 139 officers were killed, 2008 represents the lowest year for officer fatalities since 1965, when 136 officers died in the line of duty.
This year's reduction includes a steep, 40 percent drop in the number of officers who were shot and killed, from 68 in 2007 to 41 in 2008. The last time firearms-related fatalities were this low was 1956, when there were 35 such deaths. The 2008 figure is 74 percent lower than the total for 1973, when a near-record high 156 law enforcement officers were shot and killed.
Fewer Police Officers Killed in Line of Duty in 2008 -- Occupational Health & Safety
The reason the murder rate is low is because the population is getting older.
Guns should be regulated better in the United States. We have the highest gun death rate among the wealthy democracies. We can do better.
Gun Control Doesn't Work...Here's the Proof.
[FONT=arial,arial]These are the 13 states with the most pro-Second Amendment laws according to the Brady Center (Oklahoma being the most pro-Second Amendment in the nation) with total firearm murders from 2007 according to the FBI and population from the Census Bureau:[/FONT]
----------State-----------------------------# of Firearm Homicides-----------Population
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
- Arkansas ----------------------130 ------------2,810,872
- [FONT=arial,arial]Idaho -------------------------------------------------25 ---------------------1,466,465[/FONT]
- [FONT=arial,arial]New Mexico ---------------------------------------81 ---------------------1,954,599[/FONT]
- [FONT=arial,arial]South Dakota ---------------------------------------4 -----------------------781,919[/FONT]
- [FONT=arial,arial]West Virginia --------------------------------------37 --------------------1,818,470[/FONT]
- [FONT=arial,arial]Mississippi ---------------------------------------119 ---------------------2,910,540[/FONT]
- [FONT=arial,arial]Alaska -----------------------------------------------21 --------------------- 670,053[/FONT]
- [FONT=arial,arial]Louisiana ------------------------------------------455----------------------4,287,768[/FONT]
- [FONT=arial,arial]Missouri -------------------------------------------247 ---------------------5,842,713[/FONT]
- [FONT=arial,arial]North Dakota ----------------------------------------3 -----------------------635,867[/FONT]
- [FONT=arial,arial]Utah ---------------------------------------------------38 --------------------2,550,063[/FONT]
- [FONT=arial,arial]Kentucky ------------------------------------------131 --------------------4,206,074[/FONT]
- [FONT=arial,arial]Oklahoma -------------------------------- --------132 --------------------3,579,212[/FONT]
- California -----------------------1,605-----36,457,549
- New Jersey ----------------------260-------8,724,560
- Connecticut ----------------------57 -------3,504,809
- Massachusetts ------------------114 -------6,437,193
- Maryland ------------------------414------- 5,615,727
- New York ------------------------500 -----19,306,183
- Rhode Island -------------------- --9 ------ 1,067,610
- Hawaii -----------------------------3 -------1,285,498
- Illinois ---------------------------343* -----12,831,970
- Pennsylvania ---------------------527 ------12,440,621
- Michigan -------------------------444 ------10,095,643
- Delaware--------------------------22 ---------853,476
- North Carolina--------------------369 --------8,856,505
The District of Columbia is not listed on the Brady Center ranking list but it did have the strictest gun control in the nation in 2007:
- District of Columbia-----------------181--------581,530
The number listed is the population divided by the total firearm homicides to render 1 homicide per (X) number of residents. (Red are Strict Gun Control, Blue are Pro-gun)
- District of Columbia -----------1 / 3,212
- Louisiana ---------------------1 / 9,423
- Maryland ---------------------1 / 13,564
- Arkansas ---------------------1 / 21,622
- California ---------------------1 / 22,714
- Michigan ---------------------1 / 22,737
- Pennsylvania -----------------1 / 23,606
- Missouri ----------------------1 / 23,654
- North Carolina ----------------1 / 24,001
- New Mexico ------------------1 / 24,130
- Mississippi --------------------1 / 24,458
- Oklahoma --------------------1 / 25,115
- Alaska -----------------------1 / 31,907
- Kentucky ---------------------1 / 32,107
- New Jersey -------------------1 / 33,556
- Illinois ------------------------1 / 37,410
- New York ---------------------1 / 38,612
- Delaware ---------------------1 / 38,794
- West Virgina ------------------1 / 49,147
- Massachusetts ----------------1 / 56,466
- Idaho -------------------------1 / 58,658
- Connecticut -------------------1 / 61,487
- Utah --------------------------1 / 67,106
- Rhode Island -------------------1 / 118,623
- South Dakota ------------------1 / 195,479
- North Dakota -------------------1 / 211,955
- Hawaii -------------------------1 / 428,499
That is why the Brady Center uses violent crime or firearm deaths instead of actual firearm homicides even though the firearm homicides are provided by the FBI online every year.
Link to FBI Stats Table 20 - Crime in the United States 2007
Link to Brady Center state rankings list http://www.stategunlaws.org/xshare/p...d_rankings.pdf
Population from the U.S. Census Bureau State and County QuickFacts
Wikipedia Firearm Homicides for the District of Columbia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crime_in_Washington,_D.C.
This blog is entirely my own work and research...reproduce it freely in support of the 2nd amendment.
Last edited:
Gunny
Gold Member
The reason the murder rate is low is because the population is getting older.
Guns should be regulated better in the United States. We have the highest gun death rate among the wealthy democracies. We can do better.
Absurd as well as a non sequitur. If the murder rate is lower it would because less people are being murdered.
I addressed the rate of murder by firearms, not murder in general except to show what percentage firearms played in murder.
You are the one that bitches about no one doing anything but insulting you. I drag up the states and you give some baseles, one-liner opinion in response?
Way to go.
Great post Missourian. What the anti-gun crowd is prone to overlooking is that criminals do not respect gun laws and enacting more only serves to punish and trample the rights of honest citizens who do respect them. You can restrict ownership and ban guns all day long but there will always be a black market for them, which in turn only becomes even more profitable with heavier restrictions.
The answer to gun crime is simple.....enforce the laws already in place. If you want to pass a gun law that would really make a difference and serve as a deterrant increase the punishment for the use of guns in violent crimes and robbery. If there was a mandatory 25 years without parole for using a gun in a crime you would see a bigger effect than any ban would ever hope to achieve. Those that still chose to use them would at least be off the streets.
I find a person's view on gun control is very often an indicator of who they are at heart, we tend to project ourselves onto others. I personally believe (and the statistics are with me) that the overwhelming majority of American's will do the right thing when in possession of a firearm. Many people may be nasty or have character flaws but very, very few are cold blooded murderers. The people I have met through organizations such as the NRA and my local gun club tend to be among the most ethical and law abiding people I know.
A common belief among the gun-ban crowd is that more guns means people are going to act homicidal and bloodthirsty, contrary to all available statistics. Take Mayor Daley of Chicago and his comments regarding the Heller decision which he called frightening and added this gem. Then, why dont we do away with the court system and go back to the Old West? You have a gun and I have a gun and well settle in the streets,
Chicago which has had a gun ban in place for over 26 years has one of the highest rates of violent crime in the country and 75% of homicides involve guns. Yet the mayor is somehow frightened that a law abiding citizen might own a gun and *gasp* possibly protect their home and family in the jungle Chicago politicians have created. Even more disgusting is his refusal to respect the decision of the Supreme Court and the inalienable rights protected by the Constitution and insisting on keeping Chicago's handgun ban in place.
Banning and restricting guns does not reduce crime and it never will, statistics have consistently proven that. Stripping freedoms and inalienable rights from people who have done no wrong and committed no crime is and always will be oppression no matter how you dress it up. If we cannot trust a law abiding citizen to own a firearm then we have no right to call ourselves a civilized nation. Instead we are at worst a nation of savages and at best a fascist nanny state. Truly civilized people respect the rights and welfare of their fellow citizens, we don't need an authority figure holding the proverbial gun to our heads to do so.
The answer to gun crime is simple.....enforce the laws already in place. If you want to pass a gun law that would really make a difference and serve as a deterrant increase the punishment for the use of guns in violent crimes and robbery. If there was a mandatory 25 years without parole for using a gun in a crime you would see a bigger effect than any ban would ever hope to achieve. Those that still chose to use them would at least be off the streets.
I find a person's view on gun control is very often an indicator of who they are at heart, we tend to project ourselves onto others. I personally believe (and the statistics are with me) that the overwhelming majority of American's will do the right thing when in possession of a firearm. Many people may be nasty or have character flaws but very, very few are cold blooded murderers. The people I have met through organizations such as the NRA and my local gun club tend to be among the most ethical and law abiding people I know.
A common belief among the gun-ban crowd is that more guns means people are going to act homicidal and bloodthirsty, contrary to all available statistics. Take Mayor Daley of Chicago and his comments regarding the Heller decision which he called frightening and added this gem. Then, why dont we do away with the court system and go back to the Old West? You have a gun and I have a gun and well settle in the streets,
Chicago which has had a gun ban in place for over 26 years has one of the highest rates of violent crime in the country and 75% of homicides involve guns. Yet the mayor is somehow frightened that a law abiding citizen might own a gun and *gasp* possibly protect their home and family in the jungle Chicago politicians have created. Even more disgusting is his refusal to respect the decision of the Supreme Court and the inalienable rights protected by the Constitution and insisting on keeping Chicago's handgun ban in place.
Banning and restricting guns does not reduce crime and it never will, statistics have consistently proven that. Stripping freedoms and inalienable rights from people who have done no wrong and committed no crime is and always will be oppression no matter how you dress it up. If we cannot trust a law abiding citizen to own a firearm then we have no right to call ourselves a civilized nation. Instead we are at worst a nation of savages and at best a fascist nanny state. Truly civilized people respect the rights and welfare of their fellow citizens, we don't need an authority figure holding the proverbial gun to our heads to do so.
Old Rocks
Diamond Member
Gun Deaths - MedicineNet - Health and Medical Information Produced by Doctors
Gun Deaths - United States Tops The List
The United States leads the world's richest nations in gun deaths -- murders, suicides, and accidental deaths due to guns - according to a study published April 17, 1998 by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) in the International Journal of Epidemiology.
The U.S. was first at 14.24 gun deaths per 100,000 people. Two other countries in the Americas came next. Brazil was second with 12.95, followed by Mexico with 12.69.
Japan had the lowest rate, at 0.05 gun deaths per 100,000 (1 per 2 million people). The police in Japan actively raid homes of those suspected of having weapons.
The 36 countries in the study were the richest in the World Bank's 1994 World Development Report, having the highest GNP per capita income.
The United States accounted for 45 percent of the 88,649 gun deaths reported in the study, the first comprehensive international scrutiny of gun-related deaths.
The gun-related deaths per 100,000 people in 1994 by country were as follows:
U.S.A. 14.24
Brazil 12.95
Mexico 12.69
Estonia 12.26
Argentina 8.93
Northern Ireland 6.63
Finland 6.46
Switzerland 5.31
France 5.15
Canada 4.31
Norway 3.82
Austria 3.70
Portugal 3.20
Israel 2.91
Belgium 2.90
Australia 2.65
Slovenia 2.60
Italy 2.44
New Zealand 2.38
Denmark 2.09
Sweden 1.92
Kuwait 1.84
Greece 1.29
Germany 1.24
Hungary 1.11
Ireland 0.97
Spain 0.78
Netherlands 0.70
Scotland 0.54
England and Wales 0.41
Taiwan 0.37
Singapore 0.21
Mauritius 0.19
Hong Kong 0.14
South Korea 0.12
Japan 0.05
OK, there is the problem. What do we do about it? Or do we just wait until those that do not like gun ownership do something?
Gun Deaths - United States Tops The List
The United States leads the world's richest nations in gun deaths -- murders, suicides, and accidental deaths due to guns - according to a study published April 17, 1998 by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) in the International Journal of Epidemiology.
The U.S. was first at 14.24 gun deaths per 100,000 people. Two other countries in the Americas came next. Brazil was second with 12.95, followed by Mexico with 12.69.
Japan had the lowest rate, at 0.05 gun deaths per 100,000 (1 per 2 million people). The police in Japan actively raid homes of those suspected of having weapons.
The 36 countries in the study were the richest in the World Bank's 1994 World Development Report, having the highest GNP per capita income.
The United States accounted for 45 percent of the 88,649 gun deaths reported in the study, the first comprehensive international scrutiny of gun-related deaths.
The gun-related deaths per 100,000 people in 1994 by country were as follows:
U.S.A. 14.24
Brazil 12.95
Mexico 12.69
Estonia 12.26
Argentina 8.93
Northern Ireland 6.63
Finland 6.46
Switzerland 5.31
France 5.15
Canada 4.31
Norway 3.82
Austria 3.70
Portugal 3.20
Israel 2.91
Belgium 2.90
Australia 2.65
Slovenia 2.60
Italy 2.44
New Zealand 2.38
Denmark 2.09
Sweden 1.92
Kuwait 1.84
Greece 1.29
Germany 1.24
Hungary 1.11
Ireland 0.97
Spain 0.78
Netherlands 0.70
Scotland 0.54
England and Wales 0.41
Taiwan 0.37
Singapore 0.21
Mauritius 0.19
Hong Kong 0.14
South Korea 0.12
Japan 0.05
OK, there is the problem. What do we do about it? Or do we just wait until those that do not like gun ownership do something?
Burp
Always carry, never tell
- Jan 22, 2009
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Gun Deaths - MedicineNet - Health and Medical Information Produced by Doctors
Gun Deaths - United States Tops The List
The United States leads the world's richest nations in gun deaths -- murders, suicides, and accidental deaths due to guns - according to a study published April 17, 1998 by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) in the International Journal of Epidemiology.
The U.S. was first at 14.24 gun deaths per 100,000 people. Two other countries in the Americas came next. Brazil was second with 12.95, followed by Mexico with 12.69.
Japan had the lowest rate, at 0.05 gun deaths per 100,000 (1 per 2 million people). The police in Japan actively raid homes of those suspected of having weapons.
The 36 countries in the study were the richest in the World Bank's 1994 World Development Report, having the highest GNP per capita income.
The United States accounted for 45 percent of the 88,649 gun deaths reported in the study, the first comprehensive international scrutiny of gun-related deaths.
The gun-related deaths per 100,000 people in 1994 by country were as follows:
U.S.A. 14.24
Brazil 12.95
Mexico 12.69
Estonia 12.26
Argentina 8.93
Northern Ireland 6.63
Finland 6.46
Switzerland 5.31
France 5.15
Canada 4.31
Norway 3.82
Austria 3.70
Portugal 3.20
Israel 2.91
Belgium 2.90
Australia 2.65
Slovenia 2.60
Italy 2.44
New Zealand 2.38
Denmark 2.09
Sweden 1.92
Kuwait 1.84
Greece 1.29
Germany 1.24
Hungary 1.11
Ireland 0.97
Spain 0.78
Netherlands 0.70
Scotland 0.54
England and Wales 0.41
Taiwan 0.37
Singapore 0.21
Mauritius 0.19
Hong Kong 0.14
South Korea 0.12
Japan 0.05
OK, there is the problem. What do we do about it? Or do we just wait until those that do not like gun ownership do something?
1994? Wow....pulling stats from 1994 to prove your point is a little pathetic.
Hows this:
UN: Brazil Ranks Second Worldwide in Gun Deaths
Rio de Janeiro
09 May 2005
A U.N. report says Brazil ranks second in the world for deaths by firearms, behind Venezuela. Officials attribute much of the gun violence to illegal drug and gang activities. A senior lawmaker is calling for swifter action to ban firearms.
According to the U.N. Education, Scientific and Cultural Organization survey of 54 countries, Brazil averages nearly 22 gun-related deaths per 100,000 inhabitants, second only to Venezuela.
UN: Brazil Ranks Second Worldwide in Gun Deaths
Gun Deaths - MedicineNet - Health and Medical Information Produced by Doctors
Gun Deaths - United States Tops The List
The United States leads the world's richest nations in gun deaths -- murders, suicides, and accidental deaths due to guns - according to a study published April 17, 1998 by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) in the International Journal of Epidemiology.
The U.S. was first at 14.24 gun deaths per 100,000 people. Two other countries in the Americas came next. Brazil was second with 12.95, followed by Mexico with 12.69.
Japan had the lowest rate, at 0.05 gun deaths per 100,000 (1 per 2 million people). The police in Japan actively raid homes of those suspected of having weapons.
The 36 countries in the study were the richest in the World Bank's 1994 World Development Report, having the highest GNP per capita income.
The United States accounted for 45 percent of the 88,649 gun deaths reported in the study, the first comprehensive international scrutiny of gun-related deaths.
The gun-related deaths per 100,000 people in 1994 by country were as follows:
U.S.A. 14.24
Brazil 12.95
Mexico 12.69
Estonia 12.26
Argentina 8.93
Northern Ireland 6.63
Finland 6.46
Switzerland 5.31
France 5.15
Canada 4.31
Norway 3.82
Austria 3.70
Portugal 3.20
Israel 2.91
Belgium 2.90
Australia 2.65
Slovenia 2.60
Italy 2.44
New Zealand 2.38
Denmark 2.09
Sweden 1.92
Kuwait 1.84
Greece 1.29
Germany 1.24
Hungary 1.11
Ireland 0.97
Spain 0.78
Netherlands 0.70
Scotland 0.54
England and Wales 0.41
Taiwan 0.37
Singapore 0.21
Mauritius 0.19
Hong Kong 0.14
South Korea 0.12
Japan 0.05
OK, there is the problem. What do we do about it? Or do we just wait until those that do not like gun ownership do something?
Old Rocks,
You're a gun owner and I understand you have the best intentions but the stats you posted only reinforce my argument.
[SIZE=-1][SIZE=-1]Americans have been gravely misled about foreign gun ownership and the severity and effectiveness of foreign gun bans. It simply is not true to state that "the U.S. has more gun availability and far less restriction than any other modern industrial nation."[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]That honor goes to Israel where, nevertheless, murder "rates are much lower than in the United States despite ... [Israel`s] greater availability of guns to law-abiding civilians," writes Israeli judge Abraham Tennenbaum (formerly an official with the Israeli National Police and then a professor of criminology).[/SIZE]
[/SIZE][SIZE=-1][In] Switzerland, where the laws are similar to those in Israel and gun availability is comparable to that in the U.S. In Switzerland, handgun licenses are available to any law-abiding applicant. In half the Swiss cantons (similar to U.S. states), licensees are free to carry their personal handguns concealed. Beyond this freedom of ownership, every law-abiding military-age Swiss male is issued a firearm and he must keep it at home to perform his mandatory militia obligation.[/SIZE]
In Austria, every law-abiding citizen has a legal right to buy handguns, and roughly ten per cent of Austrians have done so (compared to 16 per cent of U.S. citizens).
NRA-ILA :: Gun Laws Around The World: Do They Work? By Don B. Kates
[SIZE=-1]That honor goes to Israel where, nevertheless, murder "rates are much lower than in the United States despite ... [Israel`s] greater availability of guns to law-abiding civilians," writes Israeli judge Abraham Tennenbaum (formerly an official with the Israeli National Police and then a professor of criminology).[/SIZE]
[/SIZE][SIZE=-1][In] Switzerland, where the laws are similar to those in Israel and gun availability is comparable to that in the U.S. In Switzerland, handgun licenses are available to any law-abiding applicant. In half the Swiss cantons (similar to U.S. states), licensees are free to carry their personal handguns concealed. Beyond this freedom of ownership, every law-abiding military-age Swiss male is issued a firearm and he must keep it at home to perform his mandatory militia obligation.[/SIZE]
In Austria, every law-abiding citizen has a legal right to buy handguns, and roughly ten per cent of Austrians have done so (compared to 16 per cent of U.S. citizens).
NRA-ILA :: Gun Laws Around The World: Do They Work? By Don B. Kates
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This was my first post to USMB:
Why do the rural communities with twice as many legal gun owners and four times the owned firearms have 25 times less gun crime than urban communities?
Look here for firearm ownership study
Of the 22 Missouri counties with populations between 25K and 50K, having a combined population of 806,764 persons, there were 163 total firearm assaults and 2604 total assaults utilizing weapons of any kind.
MSHP stats for 22 rural Missouri counties
During the same period, in only the city of St. Louis and the city of Kansas City contained within the state of Missouri (half is in Kansas of course), with a combined population of 793,587 persons, there were a total of 4,143 firearm assaults and 8986 total assaults utilizing weapons of any kind.
MSHP stats for St. Louis
MSHP stats for KC, MO
The 2006 stats on Missouri crime came from this website : Missouri State Highway Patrol Statisical Analysis Center, they are the most recent available.
The 2004 rural/urban chart came from this website : Department of Health Policy and Management, Harvard School of Public Health, Boston, Massachusetts, USA 2004 study.
If the links for the MSHP data are broken, you can find the information for 2006 here: MO SAC - Data and Statistics - Uniform Crime Reporting (UCR) Statistical Query
This blog is entirely my own work and research...reproduce it freely in support of the 2nd amendment.
Guns don't kill people, Cities kill people.
Why do the rural communities with twice as many legal gun owners and four times the owned firearms have 25 times less gun crime than urban communities?
Look here for firearm ownership study
Of the 22 Missouri counties with populations between 25K and 50K, having a combined population of 806,764 persons, there were 163 total firearm assaults and 2604 total assaults utilizing weapons of any kind.
MSHP stats for 22 rural Missouri counties
During the same period, in only the city of St. Louis and the city of Kansas City contained within the state of Missouri (half is in Kansas of course), with a combined population of 793,587 persons, there were a total of 4,143 firearm assaults and 8986 total assaults utilizing weapons of any kind.
MSHP stats for St. Louis
MSHP stats for KC, MO
The 2006 stats on Missouri crime came from this website : Missouri State Highway Patrol Statisical Analysis Center, they are the most recent available.
The 2004 rural/urban chart came from this website : Department of Health Policy and Management, Harvard School of Public Health, Boston, Massachusetts, USA 2004 study.
If the links for the MSHP data are broken, you can find the information for 2006 here: MO SAC - Data and Statistics - Uniform Crime Reporting (UCR) Statistical Query
This blog is entirely my own work and research...reproduce it freely in support of the 2nd amendment.
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As you can see from this link to Wikipedia, List of countries by intentional homicide rate to 1999 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia, the U.K.'s homicide rate has always been far less than the homicide rate in the U.S., predating the U.K.'s enactment of gun control laws.
Conversely, the suicide rate in Japan is more than twice that of the U.S. even though private gun ownership is nearly nonexistent in Japan. (Japan 23.7 per 100,000 citizens - U.S. 11 per 100,000 citizens). List of countries by suicide rate - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Conversely, the suicide rate in Japan is more than twice that of the U.S. even though private gun ownership is nearly nonexistent in Japan. (Japan 23.7 per 100,000 citizens - U.S. 11 per 100,000 citizens). List of countries by suicide rate - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
DamnYankee
No Neg Policy
- Apr 2, 2009
- 4,516
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Learn the truth:
Fewer Police Officers Killed in Line of Duty in 2008
This year is ending as one of the safest years for U.S. law enforcement in decades. The number of officers killed in the line of duty fell sharply this year when compared with 2007, and officers killed by gunfire reached a 50-year low.
- Dec 31, 2008
Based on their analysis of preliminary data, the National Law Enforcement Officers Memorial Fund (NLEOMF) and Concerns of Police Survivors (C.O.P.S.) reported on Dec. 29 they found that 140 officers have died in the line of duty this year, a 23 percent reduction from the 2007 figure of 181. Other than 1996, when 139 officers were killed, 2008 represents the lowest year for officer fatalities since 1965, when 136 officers died in the line of duty.
This year's reduction includes a steep, 40 percent drop in the number of officers who were shot and killed, from 68 in 2007 to 41 in 2008. The last time firearms-related fatalities were this low was 1956, when there were 35 such deaths. The 2008 figure is 74 percent lower than the total for 1973, when a near-record high 156 law enforcement officers were shot and killed.
Fewer Police Officers Killed in Line of Duty in 2008 -- Occupational Health & Safety
B.b.b.but they should have an exemption in the "assault" weapons ban....
DamnYankee
No Neg Policy
- Apr 2, 2009
- 4,516
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The reason the murder rate is low is because the population is getting older.
Guns should be regulated better in the United States. We have the highest gun death rate among the wealthy democracies. We can do better.
My goodness.... That must mean that there really isn't a problem with the Mexican drug cartels and gun trafficking, huh?
Now, is it guns that should be regulated, or is it the procurement?
Under current [Virginia] law, only people who buy guns from licensed dealers must be checked through the federal database that identifies convicted felons and others deemed a danger to the community. Between 22 percent and 35 percent of gun show vendors do not have licenses, Virginia State Police say.
Senate Panel Defeats Bill on Gun Show Sales - washingtonpost.com
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