Realistic Goals for Environment?

Does anyone know the environmental impact of producing and disposing of batteries used in hybrid cars? I bring this up to point out that we seem enfatuated with fads and not actually doing things that will have a positive long term impact.
 
It was the state of californication that decided to curb its air pollution....Thanks for playing
Before the EPA every state had their own standards. To encourage industry relocation those standards might be lowered. That is the choice of that state but it affected other states too.
 
I can definitely see a federal role in keeping states playing nicely with each other. I'm sure legal disputes on environmental issues don't receive satisfactory outcomes. We definitely need the EPA, in what role i'm not 100% sure, but I definitely have trust issues. Some political think tank could create scientific data that they could force on the rest of the country.
 
So one state cant sue another state? I wonder if you are a product of the public indoctrination stations called schools?
One state can sue another state in the Supreme Court, if SCOTUS agrees to take the case, but it is hardly a straightforward process since, without the EPA, there wouldn't be accepted standards to measure damage.
 
So one state cant sue another state? I wonder if you are a product of the public indoctrination stations called schools?
One state can sue another state in the Supreme Court, if SCOTUS agrees to take the case, but it is hardly a straightforward process since, without the EPA, there wouldn't be accepted standards to measure damage.
The same standards that caused the river to be polluted? by the EPA...
 
So one state cant sue another state? I wonder if you are a product of the public indoctrination stations called schools?
One state can sue another state in the Supreme Court, if SCOTUS agrees to take the case, but it is hardly a straightforward process since, without the EPA, there wouldn't be accepted standards to measure damage.
The same standards that caused the river to be polluted? by the EPA...
If you refer to your link, here is the headline:
Colorado declares 'state of disaster emergency' after the EPA accidentally spilled 3 million gallons of wastewater

Accidents are not standards. Look it up.
 
I remember smog, water unsafe to swim in, and medical waste washing up on beaches. If we want a clean environment, maybe it doesn't make sense to eliminate the EPA and the regulations that led to a cleaner environment.
I think regulations should be at state level. Fed gov has no business doing that mess

This is one of the few places I support the Feds being involved.

Pollution does not stop at a state line, it affects neighboring states as well who have no power to regulate what is happening to them.

Pollution being dumped up stream in one state will reach every state downstream.
well, you certainly make a good argument. But why would a state not have laws like that?!

Plain and simply, money. More relaxed regulations means more businesses come your way and your tax base goes up. More relaxed regulations means more profit for the companies which means more taxes for the state.
Its hard to argue, man.
Here is a question that would need to be discussed : what about the constitutionality of it?

General welfare! That is what the put everything under! :21:
 
I think regulations should be at state level. Fed gov has no business doing that mess

This is one of the few places I support the Feds being involved.

Pollution does not stop at a state line, it affects neighboring states as well who have no power to regulate what is happening to them.

Pollution being dumped up stream in one state will reach every state downstream.
well, you certainly make a good argument. But why would a state not have laws like that?!

Plain and simply, money. More relaxed regulations means more businesses come your way and your tax base goes up. More relaxed regulations means more profit for the companies which means more taxes for the state.
Its hard to argue, man.
Here is a question that would need to be discussed : what about the constitutionality of it?

General welfare! That is what the put everything under! :21:
I know but we both know that is bullshit.
There are a lot of great things i would like the fed gov to do but they dont have the power so i cant support it.
 
So one state cant sue another state? I wonder if you are a product of the public indoctrination stations called schools?
One state can sue another state in the Supreme Court, if SCOTUS agrees to take the case, but it is hardly a straightforward process since, without the EPA, there wouldn't be accepted standards to measure damage.
The same standards that caused the river to be polluted? by the EPA...

If private companies had not been using toxic chemicals in their mines for decades, there would not have been a build up to get spilled during a botched clean up attempt.

That is like you setting your house on fire and then bitching because the fire department got shit all wet.
 
This is one of the few places I support the Feds being involved.

Pollution does not stop at a state line, it affects neighboring states as well who have no power to regulate what is happening to them.

Pollution being dumped up stream in one state will reach every state downstream.
well, you certainly make a good argument. But why would a state not have laws like that?!

Plain and simply, money. More relaxed regulations means more businesses come your way and your tax base goes up. More relaxed regulations means more profit for the companies which means more taxes for the state.
Its hard to argue, man.
Here is a question that would need to be discussed : what about the constitutionality of it?

General welfare! That is what the put everything under! :21:
I know but we both know that is bullshit.
There are a lot of great things i would like the fed gov to do but they dont have the power so i cant support it.

We do know it is, but it is the catch all phrase.
 
So one state cant sue another state? I wonder if you are a product of the public indoctrination stations called schools?
One state can sue another state in the Supreme Court, if SCOTUS agrees to take the case, but it is hardly a straightforward process since, without the EPA, there wouldn't be accepted standards to measure damage.
The same standards that caused the river to be polluted? by the EPA...
quote) not defending the EPA on the Colorado river spill, but it was an accident, EPA was trying to clean up a mess left buy mining, and made a mistake. so that makes the years of good clean up by the EPA not relevant ?????. this is not to say that there has not been over kill & in some cases & lack off proper clean up in others. we need the EPA watching out for US not big money polluters looking to make more profit.
 
So one state cant sue another state? I wonder if you are a product of the public indoctrination stations called schools?
One state can sue another state in the Supreme Court, if SCOTUS agrees to take the case, but it is hardly a straightforward process since, without the EPA, there wouldn't be accepted standards to measure damage.
The same standards that caused the river to be polluted? by the EPA...
quote) not defending the EPA on the Colorado river spill, but it was an accident, EPA was trying to clean up a mess left buy mining, and made a mistake. so that makes the years of good clean up by the EPA not relevant ?????. this is not to say that there has not been over kill & in some cases & lack off proper clean up in others. we need the EPA watching out for US not big money polluters looking to make more profit.
Lefties want the government to take care of themselves. We on the right show the failures of said government yet the left continues to rely on said government even if it kills them.

FBI warned about all the latest shooters, fails to protect, children die.
EPA spills TONS of toxic materials into the Colorado River and you guys just dismiss it. If this was a business that spilled all those chemicals, would you dismiss it or hold them accountable?
 
Lefties want the government to take care of themselves. We on the right show the failures of said government yet the left continues to rely on said government even if it kills them.

FBI warned about all the latest shooters, fails to protect, children die.
EPA spills TONS of toxic materials into the Colorado River and you guys just dismiss it. If this was a business that spilled all those chemicals, would you dismiss it or hold them accountable?
Lefties want the government to work so when it fails we want it fixed. Righties don't want government to work so they look for excuses to eliminate it. It is known as throw the baby out with the bathwater syndrome.
 
Lefties want the government to take care of themselves. We on the right show the failures of said government yet the left continues to rely on said government even if it kills them.

FBI warned about all the latest shooters, fails to protect, children die.
EPA spills TONS of toxic materials into the Colorado River and you guys just dismiss it. If this was a business that spilled all those chemicals, would you dismiss it or hold them accountable?
Lefties want the government to work so when it fails we want it fixed. Righties don't want government to work so they look for excuses to eliminate it. It is known as throw the baby out with the bathwater syndrome.
The baby that survived the liberal abortion doctors?
 
Lefties want the government to take care of themselves. We on the right show the failures of said government yet the left continues to rely on said government even if it kills them.

FBI warned about all the latest shooters, fails to protect, children die.
EPA spills TONS of toxic materials into the Colorado River and you guys just dismiss it. If this was a business that spilled all those chemicals, would you dismiss it or hold them accountable?
Lefties want the government to work so when it fails we want it fixed. Righties don't want government to work so they look for excuses to eliminate it. It is known as throw the baby out with the bathwater syndrome.
You do know that if all your rights in the constitution are eliminated, you will be at the mercy of said government, like Hitler's Nazis and Stalin's Commies. Why are you so stupid to not know that? Did you go to public schools?

The only thing federal government is supposed to do is protect US from invasion, not take care of US from cradle to grave. So far of late, they cant even protect US from invasion, and keep people enslaved to the government by having the poor rely for their sustenance. Are you one of those people? Why cant you be reliant on yourself, and if a business does wrong, go after them by not purchasing their products, instead of a government entity that damages this planet much worse?
 
You do know that if all your rights in the constitution are eliminated, you will be at the mercy of said government, like Hitler's Nazis and Stalin's Commies. Why are you so stupid to not know that? Did you go to public schools?
Which constitutional right did I say I'd like to give up? There is no constitutional right to put toxic waste into a river or blow smoke into my neighbor's yard.

The only thing federal government is supposed to do is protect US from invasion, not take care of US from cradle to grave. So far of late, they cant even protect US from invasion, and keep people enslaved to the government by having the poor rely for their sustenance. Are you one of those people? Why cant you be reliant on yourself, and if a business does wrong, go after them by not purchasing their products, instead of a government entity that damages this planet much worse?
I don't know what ideological fantasy world you live in but on this planet that just doesn't work.

Here's an example I saw just the other day on HGTV. They said that some home builders create a company and build a handful of houses as cheaply as possible, knowing that in a few years they will leak and deteriorate. After building the houses the company is dissolved. After a few years the home owners realize the problems but their warranties are worthless since the companies are no longer to be found.
 
You do know that if all your rights in the constitution are eliminated, you will be at the mercy of said government, like Hitler's Nazis and Stalin's Commies. Why are you so stupid to not know that? Did you go to public schools?
Which constitutional right did I say I'd like to give up? There is no constitutional right to put toxic waste into a river or blow smoke into my neighbor's yard.

The only thing federal government is supposed to do is protect US from invasion, not take care of US from cradle to grave. So far of late, they cant even protect US from invasion, and keep people enslaved to the government by having the poor rely for their sustenance. Are you one of those people? Why cant you be reliant on yourself, and if a business does wrong, go after them by not purchasing their products, instead of a government entity that damages this planet much worse?
I don't know what ideological fantasy world you live in but on this planet that just doesn't work.

Here's an example I saw just the other day on HGTV. They said that some home builders create a company and build a handful of houses as cheaply as possible, knowing that in a few years they will leak and deteriorate. After building the houses the company is dissolved. After a few years the home owners realize the problems but their warranties are worthless since the companies are no longer to be found.
But what about the union electricians and plumbers who were hired by the company to follow the rules the government told the company to use? It is the fucking government that is the problem tard, because you so much want the government to protect you, and they fail, fail, fail.....
 
Macron talked about there being no backup earth, and that resonated with me. I think one of the greatest tragedies in the last 20 years is the politicization of environmental issues. I agree with most republicans that the Paris Accord was a siphoning of us wealth with no impact on the environment. I also agree that college are getting paid to find results that are politically favorable. I don't want to get too much into climate change. Humans are definitely adding CO2, but I haven't seen anything that proves they are principle cause of a cataclysmic warming period. The earth has gone through many warming periods with little human impact. It seems keeping the earth a livable place should be right up there with defense. There does not have to be draconian measures that cripple businesses, but it would be nice if there was some sort of plan. Considering our schizophrenic form of rule where everything completely changes every 4 to 8 years, I see little hope of a meaningful plan clean up pollution. Our rivers are toxic if not flammable, the ocean is becoming a trash pile, and we have particles of plastic in our drinking water. I'm a republican, and this does not seem acceptable to either side of the aisle.
You can correct me if I'm wrong, you seem to say that you are willing to protect the environment on condition it doesn't cost you anything?
 
Macron talked about there being no backup earth, and that resonated with me. I think one of the greatest tragedies in the last 20 years is the politicization of environmental issues. I agree with most republicans that the Paris Accord was a siphoning of us wealth with no impact on the environment. I also agree that college are getting paid to find results that are politically favorable. I don't want to get too much into climate change. Humans are definitely adding CO2, but I haven't seen anything that proves they are principle cause of a cataclysmic warming period. The earth has gone through many warming periods with little human impact. It seems keeping the earth a livable place should be right up there with defense. There does not have to be draconian measures that cripple businesses, but it would be nice if there was some sort of plan. Considering our schizophrenic form of rule where everything completely changes every 4 to 8 years, I see little hope of a meaningful plan clean up pollution. Our rivers are toxic if not flammable, the ocean is becoming a trash pile, and we have particles of plastic in our drinking water. I'm a republican, and this does not seem acceptable to either side of the aisle.
I remember smog, water unsafe to swim in, and medical waste washing up on beaches. If we want a clean environment, maybe it doesn't make sense to eliminate the EPA and the regulations that led to a cleaner environment.
You do know that if you pulled your head out of your ass, you too would see what a failure the EPA and other Government Agencies have failed the United States and its citizens.
The EPA accidentally ripped a hole in a toxic mine in Colorado — it ruined a river and people are furious
Last week, the Animas River, which flows from southwest Colorado to New Mexico, started filling up with a toxic yellow stew from an old gold mine.
It's changed the color of the river to a mustard yellow, and so far it's stretched more than 100 miles, heading toward the Colorado River.

635747980876464066-AP-APTOPIX-Mine-Waste-Leak.jpg
So if the EPA is not perfect it should be eliminated? There have been many successes THAT I CAN SEE WITH MY OWN EYES!

New York City: 1973 vs. 2013
new_york_city_1973_vs_2013.jpg
The Clean Air Act of 1970 was the cause of the vast improvement, the EPA was tasked to support the law.
 
Laws, the enforcement of which the EPA is wholly or partially responsible:

Air
Water
Land
Endangered species
Hazardous waste
Other
Programs of the EPA

EPA Safer Choice
The EPA Safer Choice label, previously known as the Design for the Environment (DfE) label, helps consumers and commercial buyers identify and select products with safer chemical ingredients, without sacrificing quality or performance. When a product has the Safer Choice label, it means that every intentionally-added ingredient in the product has been evaluated by EPA scientists. Only the safest possible functional ingredients are allowed in products with the Safer Choice label.

Safer Detergents Stewardship Initiative
Through the Safer Detergents Stewardship Initiative (SDSI),[41] EPA's Design for the Environment (DfE) recognizes environmental leaders who voluntarily commit to the use of safer surfactants. Safer surfactants are the ones that break down quickly to non-polluting compounds and help protect aquatic life in both fresh and salt water. Nonylphenol ethoxylates, commonly referred to as NPEs, are an example of a surfactant class that does not meet the definition of a safer surfactant.

The Design for the Environment, which was renamed to EPA Safer Choice in 2015, has identified safer alternative surfactants through partnerships with industry and environmental advocates. These safer alternatives are comparable in cost and are readily available. CleanGredients[42] is a source of safer surfactants.

Energy Star
In 1992 the EPA launched the Energy Star program, a voluntary program that fosters energy efficiency. As of 2006, more than 40,000 Energy Star products were available including major appliances, office equipment, lighting, home electronics, and more. In addition, the label can also be found on new homes and commercial and industrial buildings. In 2006, about 12 percent of new housing in the United States was labeled Energy Star.[43]

The EPA estimates it saved about $14 billion in energy costs in 2006 alone. The Energy Star program has helped spread the use of LED traffic lights, efficient fluorescent lighting, power management systems for office equipment, and low standby energy use.[44]

Smart Growth
EPA's Smart Growth Program, which began in 1998, is to help communities improve their development practices and get the type of development they want. Together with local, state, and national experts, EPA encourages development strategies that protect human health and the environment, create economic opportunities, and provide attractive and affordable neighborhoods for people of all income levels.[45]

Pesticides
EPA administers the Federal Insecticide, Fungicide, and Rodenticide Act (FIFRA) (which is much older than the agency) and registers all pesticides legally sold in the United States.

Fuel economy
Manufacturers selling automobiles in the United States are required to provide EPA fuel economy test results for their vehicles and the manufacturers are not allowed to provide results from alternate sources.[citation needed] The fuel economy is calculated using the emissions data collected during two of the vehicle's Clean Air Act certification tests by measuring the total volume of carbon captured from the exhaust during the tests.[citation needed]

The testing system was originally developed in 1972 and used driving cycles designed to simulate driving during rush-hour in Los Angeles during that era. Until 1984 the EPA reported the exact fuel economy figures calculated from the test.[citation needed] In 1984, the EPA began adjusting city (aka Urban Dynamometer Driving Schedule or UDDS) results downward by 10% and highway (aka HighWay Fuel Economy Test or HWFET) results by 22% to compensate for changes in driving conditions since 1972, and to better correlate the EPA test results with real-world driving. In 1996, the EPA proposed updating the Federal Testing Procedures[46] to add a new higher-speed test (US06) and an air-conditioner-on test (SC03) to further improve the correlation of fuel economy and emission estimates with real-world reports. In December 2006 the updated testing methodology was finalized to be implemented in model year 2008 vehicles and set the precedent of a 12-year review cycle for the test procedures.[47]

In February 2005, EPA launched a program called "Your MPG" that allows drivers to add real-world fuel economy statistics into a database on the EPA's fuel economy website and compare them with others and with the original EPA test results.[48]

The EPA conducts fuel economy tests on very few vehicles. "Just 18 of the EPA's 17,000 employees work in the automobile-testing department in Ann Arbor, Michigan, examining 200 to 250 vehicles a year, or roughly 15 percent of new models. As to that other 85 percent, the EPA takes automakers at their word—without any testing-accepting submitted results as accurate."[49] Two-thirds of the vehicles the EPA tests themselves are randomly selected and the remaining third is tested for specific reasons.

Although originally created as a reference point for fossil-fueled vehicles, driving cycles have been used for estimating how many miles an electric vehicle will get on a single charge.[50]

Air quality
The Air Quality Modeling Group (AQMG) is in the EPA's Office of Air and Radiation (OAR) and leads in the full range of air quality models, air pollution forecast, atmospheric dispersion modeling and other mathematical simulation techniques used in assessing the impacts of air pollution sources and control strategies. It serves other EPA headquarters staff, EPA regional Offices, and State and local environmental agencies, coordinates with the EPA's Office of Research and Development on the development of new models and techniques, and wider issues of atmospheric research and conducts modeling analyses to support policy and regulatory decisions of the EPA's Office of Air Quality Planning and Standards (OAQPS). It is located in Research Triangle Park, North Carolina. Controlling air pollution helps diminish the risk of pollution-related diseases.

The EPA began regulating greenhouse gases (GHGs) from mobile and stationary sources of air pollution under the Clean Air Act (CAA) for the first time on January 2, 2011. Standards for mobile sources have been established pursuant to Section 202 of the CAA, and GHGs from stationary sources are controlled under the authority of Part C of Title I of the Act per Regulation of Greenhouse Gases Under the Clean Air Act. The BenMAP open-source tool, created by the agency, estimates the health benefits from improvements in air quality.

Oil spill prevention program
EPA’s oil spill prevention program includes the Spill Prevention, Control, and Countermeasure (SPCC) and the Facility Response Plan (FRP) rules. The SPCC Rule applies to all facilities that store, handle, process, gather, transfer, refine, distribute, use or consume oil or oil products. Oil products includes petroleum and non-petroleum oils as well as: animal fats, oils and greases; fish and marine mammal oils; and vegetable oils. It mandates a written plan for facilities that store more than 1,320 gallons of fuel above ground or more than 42,000 gallons below-ground, and which might discharge to navigable waters (as defined in the Clean Water Act) or adjoining shorelines. Secondary spill containment is mandated at oil storage facilities and oil release containment is required at oil development sites.[51]

Toxics Release Inventory
The Toxics Release Inventory (TRI) is a resource for learning about toxic chemical releases and pollution prevention activities reported by industrial and federal facilities. TRI data support informed decision-making by communities, government agencies, companies, and others.[52]

WaterSense
WaterSense is an EPA program launched in June 2006 to encourage water efficiency in the United States through the use of a special label on consumer products.[53] Products include high-efficiency toilets (HETs), bathroom sink faucets (and accessories), and irrigation equipment. WaterSense is a voluntary program, with EPA developing specifications for water-efficient products through a public process and product testing by independent laboratories.[54]

Drinking water
EPA ensures safe drinking water for the public, by setting standards for more than 160,000 public water systems nationwide. EPA oversees states, local governments and water suppliers to enforce the standards under the Safe Drinking Water Act. The program includes regulation of injection wells in order to protect underground sources of drinking water. Select readings of amounts of certain contaminants in drinking water, precipitation, and surface water, in addition to milk and air, are reported on EPA's Rad Net web site[55] in a section entitled Envirofacts.[56] Despite mandatory reporting certain readings exceeding EPA MCL levels may be deleted or not included.[57][58] In 2013, an EPA draft revision relaxed regulations for radiation exposure through drinking water, stating that current standards are impractical to enforce. The EPA recommended that intervention was not necessary until drinking water was contaminated with radioactive iodine 131 at a concentration of 81,000 picocuries per liter (the limit for short term exposure set by the International Atomic Energy Agency), which was 27,000 times the prior EPA limit of 3 picocuries per liter for long term exposure.[59]

National Pollutant Discharge Elimination System
The National Pollutant Discharge Elimination System (NPDES) permit program addresses water pollution by regulating point sources which discharge to US waters. Created in 1972 by the Clean Water Act, the NPDES permit program authorizes state governments to perform its many permitting, administrative, and enforcement aspects.[60] As of 2017, EPA has approved 46 states to administer all or portions of the permit program.[61] EPA regional offices manage the program in the remaining areas of the country.[60] The Water Quality Act of 1987 extended NPDES permit coverage to industrial stormwater dischargers and municipal separate storm sewer systems.[62]

Radiation protection
EPA has the following seven project groups to protect the public from radiation.[63]

  1. Radioactive Waste Management[64]
  2. Emergency Preparedness and Response Programs[65] Protective Action Guides And Planning Guidance for Radiological Incidents: EPA developed a manual as guideline for local and state governments to protect the public from a nuclear accident,[66] the 2017 version being a 15-year update.
  3. EPA’s Role in Emergency Response – Special Teams[67]
  4. Technologically Enhanced Naturally Occurring Radioactive Materials (TENORM) Program[68]
  5. Radiation Standards for Air and Drinking Water Programs[69]
  6. Federal Guidance for Radiation Protection[70]
Tools for Schools
EPA's Indoor Air Quality Tools for Schools Program helps schools to maintain a healthy environment and reduce exposures to indoor environmental contaminants. It helps school personnel identify, solve, and prevent indoor air quality problems in the school environment. Through the use of a multi-step management plan and checklists for the entire building, schools can lower their students' and staff's risk of exposure to asthma triggers.[71]

Environmental Education
The National Environmental Education Act of 1990 requires EPA to provide national leadership to increase environmental literacy. EPA established the Office of Environmental Education to implement this program.[72]

Environmental Impact Statement Reviews
EPA is responsible for reviewing Environmental Impact Statements of other federal agencies' projects, under the National Environmental Policy Act (NEPA).

Clean School Bus USA
Clean School Bus USA is a national partnership to reduce children's exposure to diesel exhaust by eliminating unnecessary school bus idling, installing effective emission control systems on newer buses and replacing the oldest buses in the fleet with newer ones. Its goal is to reduce both children's exposure to diesel exhaust and the amount of air pollution created by diesel school buses.[73]

Environmental justice
The EPA has been criticized for its lack of progress towards environmental justice. Administrator Christine Todd Whitman was criticized for her changes to President Bill Clinton's Executive Order 12898 during 2001, removing the requirements for government agencies to take the poor and minority populations into special consideration when making changes to environmental legislation, and therefore defeating the spirit of the Executive Order.[74] In a March 2004 report, the inspector general of the agency concluded that the EPA "has not developed a clear vision or a comprehensive strategic plan, and has not established values, goals, expectations, and performance measurements" for environmental justice in its daily operations. Another report in September 2006 found the agency still had failed to review the success of its programs, policies and activities towards environmental justice.[75] Studies have also found that poor and minority populations were underserved by the EPA's Superfund program, and that this situation was worsening.[74]

And many others
 

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