Question About Global Warming.....

Discussion in 'Science and Technology' started by manu1959, Oct 16, 2006.

  1. manu1959
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    manu1959 Left Coast Isolationist

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    last year at this time the united states had been hit more more hurricans than in the history of the united states and there were cries of global warming being the casue....

    so far this year 0....so is global warming fixed?

    edit: wow?
    http://www.noaanews.noaa.gov/stories2006/s2720.htm
     
  2. manu1959
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    manu1959 Left Coast Isolationist

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  3. sitarro
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    sitarro Gold Member Supporting Member

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    Here is an interesting perspective.....

    http://newsbusters.org/stories/cnn_anchor_falls_asleep.html

    Senate Debates Global Warming, CNN Anchor Snoozes
    Posted by Matthew Sheffield on December 6, 2006 - 19:14.
    As already noted here on NewsBusters, the Senate held a hearing today examining the role of the media in promoting climate alarmism. With others covering the newsmaking part of the discussion, I decided to drop by to observe things from a blogger's point of view.

    I went into the discussion expecting it would be more interesting than your typical congressional hearing and wasn't disappointed. Dr. David Deming, a geophysicist from the University of Oklahoma recounted an experience he had with an NPR reporter who hung up on him after he declined to say that he thought global temperature increases were human-caused.

    Apparently I was not joined in my assessment of things by CNN "American Morning" anchor Miles O'Brien who fell asleep during the discussion, according to several witnesses. Only a colleague's nudge prevented the slumbering former science correspondent from missing the entire discussion. One would think that O'Brien could have scared up some more interest considering his ongoing feud with the Inhofe.

    I also heard some interesting scientific debate as to whether ice core temperature readings can really be used as a reliable indicator of whether carbon dioxide is related to global climate changes. Don't expect to hear much about this, though, since the CO2 proponent, Dr. Daniel Schrag of Harvard, was less-than-articulate arguing the affirmative. As of the writing of this posting, I haven't found a single news source that quoted from today's hearing. I did see and converse with several reporters but so far have yet to read any coverage.

    What I did find online, though, was an AP article which briefly mentioned the hearing but quoted no one other than California Democrat Barbara Boxer, the incoming EPW chair. It went out late today and could easily have quoted from any of the Republican members of the committee but did not.

    In the committee room, it was striking to me just how inept that the global warming alarmists seem to be at making their arguments. While many scientists do indeed take the position that humans' carbon dioxide emissions do cause global warming, they and their political allies seemed quite poor at making their case.

    Boxer provided the best example. She began her statement with a grab bag of short, context-less quotations from various businesses and government agencies about how global warming is a humongous problem that needs immediate action. Most of her quotes were from non-scientific groups and were not even about the subject of the media's coverage of climate change, the topic of the hearing.

    That's bad enough as a rhetorical device but apparently it wasn't bad enough for Boxer. In the middle of the hearing, she reverted to quoting cue cards of media coverage of the issue, ostensibly to show how the press is not being led by alarmists. Unfortunately for her, though, her quotations (from such bastions of conservatism as the New York Times as the Tulsa World) did just the opposite, at least if you didn't automatically agree with her. When Inhofe and my colleague at the Businesses and Media Institute Dan Gainor pointed out her problem, Boxer seemed utterly oblivious.

    It only got worse for Boxer, though, as she reverted to the soundbites once again (using many of the same ones she'd already quoted previously) at the end of her testimony but with an added twist. Instead of asking the witnesses what they thought about a specific statement, the California Democrat asked them to “raise your hand” if you disagree with one of her out-of-context quotes. At first, hostile witnesses played along but eventually it got so absurd that Dr. Deming finally called her on it.

    None of this seemed to bother a reporter from Roll Call with whom I was seated. She seemed decidedly against Inhofe and scoffed whenever he or one of his witnesses would challenge the liberal point of view. I didn't catch her name but I wasn't exactly surprised since besides the fact that most MSM reporters ideologically line up with Democrats, Barbara Boxer did one thing well—framing the hearings as a matter of whether the government was trying to control the news media.

    That was far from the case as anyone who wasn't asleep could have observed.
     
  4. Hobbit
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    Hobbit Senior Member

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    Manu, you can't disprove global warming the way they've defined it. If temperatures go up, it's because of global warming. If temperatures go down, it's because of global warming. If there are more hurricanes, global warming. If there are fewer hurricanes, global warming. If it rains more or less, global warming. If ice shelves grow or shrink, global warming, either that or the growing ice shelves will be ignored. It doesn't matter what happens, it's all global warming.
     
  5. KarlMarx
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    KarlMarx Senior Member

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    Has anyone heard of "The Medieval Warm Period"? It lasted for 400 years from approximately 800 to about 1300 AD.

    I saw a program on the MWP on The History Channel (I think) on Sunday.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medieval_Warm_Period

    The program went on to say that the "mini ice age" that followed it lasted about 400 to 500 years, ending about the late 1700s to early 1800s.. which just coincides with the beginning of the Industrial Revolution.

    Now, if two events occur at the same time, does that mean they are related? The answer is no, not necessarily. The end of a naturally occurring climate cycle (the mini ice age) occurred at the same time as the beginning of a man made event (The Industrial Revolution).

    Looking at just this, one might conclude that Global Warming may not be caused by man, after all.
     
  6. Hobbit
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    Hobbit Senior Member

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    Yeah, during the MWP, vikings grew crops in Greenland (as archeological evidence has shown). This is the same Greenland that proves that the Earth is doomed because the ice has receded 1/100 inches.
     
  7. manu1959
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    manu1959 Left Coast Isolationist

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    i agree....al gore as rainman
     
  8. Gunny
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    Gunny Gold Member

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    Pretty-much. I made my wife turn our damned thermostat down. Sorry about the fuss.:embarassed:
     
  9. bobn
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    bobn Member

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    The difference with the recent warming is that we have satellites up there and all kinds of surface measurements to detect changes. So it should be a lot easier to attribute the trend to specific causes.

    For example the early 20th century warming is thought to be largely solar caused, as sunspot records indicate a solar irradiance increase at that time significant enough to explain it.

    But the late 20th century warming cannot be explained as the same solar cause as the long term trend has been basically flat since 1950. Currently the only explaination that fits well for the late 20th century warming is an increased greenhouse effect.

    As for trends in the further past - such as the medieval warm period and little ice age. They may have been solar or something else, but we its more difficult to know because there is less data. It's difficult enough figuring out the precise nature of the temperature trends let alone trying to attribute then to something.

    So AGW theory - or the theory that recent warming is anthropogenic - is not based on saying that temperature has not changed in the past naturally. It is based on the recent warming (last 30 years) being better explained as due to enhanced greenhouse effect than anything else.
     
  10. Hobbit
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    Hobbit Senior Member

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    Except for the fact that Mars has also had a warming trend, and there's no pollution on Mars. The sun is getting hotter.

    Oh, and average global temperature has only gone up by less than 1 degree farenheit in the past 100 years.
     

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