Private Gun Sales.

[progressive hunter]

I'm curious how many people buy or sell guns from or to a person they don't know.

I have never bought or sold a gun in a private sale. I don't want to buy a gun from someone only to find out it's a piece of junk and I don't want to buy any guns that may have been used in a crime so I only buy from licensed dealers.

I don't want to sell a gun to a person I don't know who may not be responsible or may commit crimes with a gun.

I asked a licenced FFL I hadn't purchaced from before what kind of warranty he offered ... He said "A Taillight Warranty"...as in, when your taillights disappear from view, so does the warranty.

I buy from private individuals, FFLs and online gun stores.

Never had an issue.

Selling is a different story...

I will only sell to unknown individual with a Missouri CCW. Otherwise I'll just sell or trade with folks I know or my local FFL.

I oppose banning private sales.

A ban of private sales is a de facto registration scheme. The first step to confiscation.

Do you oppose background checks for private sales?

Yes, for several reasons.
One is that they then let the government know what you have.
It also costs money.
The government won't let just anyone do a background checks, so you have to go through and pay an FFL.
Background check are pointless since any criminal will just get their weapons illegally.
Federal background check laws are specifically illegal according to the constitution.

The idea of turning the whole country into a supervised institution is insane.
What a normal society does instead is put only dangerous people into supervised institutions.

So you don't care if you sell a gun to a guy who uses it to murder someone or is felon or if you buy a possibly stolen gun that some criminal is selling you?

I think the $25 bucks an FFL charges is worth it for my own peace of mind

it violates the 2nd A,,,

I have no problem with felons and the adjudicated mentally ill not being allowed to have firearms.

I most certainly do have a problem with federal laws prohibiting felons and mentally ill from owning firearms.
It is NOT legal for the federal government to make ANY gun law, but felons can not be legally discriminated against.
Mentally ill can be, but obviously if they are mentally ill, they need to be institutionalized, since you can't let them get flammable,, toxins, explosives, etc. So federal gun laws make no sense and are not legal.

Good for you.

As far as I'm concerned any one who commits a felony has proven he isn't responsible enough to be trusted with a gun.

so passing bad checks as a college student means he cant protect his family when hes 45,,,

if they are to dangerous to be trusted with a gun they shouldnt be let out of prison or put on lifetime parole,,

cause if they wanted a gun no law will stop them,,

You have to hang a lot of bad paper to be convicted of a felony so yeah fuck that college student because he knew what he was doing.

Not true.
Governments get to impose fines and fees, so are eager to get felony convictions whenever possible.
One can just be counting on the next paycheck, and you get fired.

I've never bounced a check but I have had people pay me and bounce a check usually they cover it and there are no charges ever filed.

To get a felony charge you usually have to write a bad check for 300 dollars and you only get that felony charge if you do not cover the check.

If you don't cover a check you are stealing. If you're a fucking thief then you should be treated like one.

key word being "usually",,

covering the check after your caught doesnt change the fact you wrote it,, and thats the crime,,

 

[progressive hunter]

I'm curious how many people buy or sell guns from or to a person they don't know.

I have never bought or sold a gun in a private sale. I don't want to buy a gun from someone only to find out it's a piece of junk and I don't want to buy any guns that may have been used in a crime so I only buy from licensed dealers.

I don't want to sell a gun to a person I don't know who may not be responsible or may commit crimes with a gun.

I asked a licenced FFL I hadn't purchaced from before what kind of warranty he offered ... He said "A Taillight Warranty"...as in, when your taillights disappear from view, so does the warranty.

I buy from private individuals, FFLs and online gun stores.

Never had an issue.

Selling is a different story...

I will only sell to unknown individual with a Missouri CCW. Otherwise I'll just sell or trade with folks I know or my local FFL.

I oppose banning private sales.

A ban of private sales is a de facto registration scheme. The first step to confiscation.

Do you oppose background checks for private sales?

Yes, for several reasons.
One is that they then let the government know what you have.
It also costs money.
The government won't let just anyone do a background checks, so you have to go through and pay an FFL.
Background check are pointless since any criminal will just get their weapons illegally.
Federal background check laws are specifically illegal according to the constitution.

The idea of turning the whole country into a supervised institution is insane.
What a normal society does instead is put only dangerous people into supervised institutions.

So you don't care if you sell a gun to a guy who uses it to murder someone or is felon or if you buy a possibly stolen gun that some criminal is selling you?

I think the $25 bucks an FFL charges is worth it for my own peace of mind

it violates the 2nd A,,,

I have no problem with felons and the adjudicated mentally ill not being allowed to have firearms.

I most certainly do have a problem with federal laws prohibiting felons and mentally ill from owning firearms.
It is NOT legal for the federal government to make ANY gun law, but felons can not be legally discriminated against.
Mentally ill can be, but obviously if they are mentally ill, they need to be institutionalized, since you can't let them get flammable,, toxins, explosives, etc. So federal gun laws make no sense and are not legal.

Good for you.

As far as I'm concerned any one who commits a felony has proven he isn't responsible enough to be trusted with a gun.

so passing bad checks as a college student means he cant protect his family when hes 45,,,

if they are to dangerous to be trusted with a gun they shouldnt be let out of prison or put on lifetime parole,,

cause if they wanted a gun no law will stop them,,

You have to hang a lot of bad paper to be convicted of a felony so yeah fuck that college student because he knew what he was doing.

one piece of paper will do it,,,

and what about the guy in florida that got hit with a fed felony for letting wedding balloons go in a national park??

You don't get a felony charge unless you don't cover the check and if you don't cover the check you are nothing but a fucking thief.

not true,,

and youre still an american,,

If you merely bounce a check and cover it there will be no criminal charges filed against you.

If you write a bad check and never cover it you're a fucking thief and IDGAF if you get slapped with a felony charge.

not always,,

Care to provide a link that supports your assertion that merely bouncing a check and covering it results in a felony charge?

not gonna waste my time since we all know that is up to the prosecution and the judge,,

they convict you and part of the judgement is to pay restitution,,

unless youre saying you can steal something and get off if you give it back,, which is the same thing,,

So you're just spouting bullshit.

If you cover a bounced check you do not get charged with a felony. If you don't cover a bounced check then you are a fucking thief.

not true,, if you pay it back you might get lucky and not be charged,, depends on a lot of factors like time,,
if youre caught 3 yrs later you will definitely get charged,,

 

[Jarlaxle]

Sure, I would. In fact, it's the only way I would sell a gun except to a FFL dealer. First names only, contact only through a burner phone bought for cash, cash sale, meet at a neutral site.

 

[Rigby5]

I'm curious how many people buy or sell guns from or to a person they don't know.

I have never bought or sold a gun in a private sale. I don't want to buy a gun from someone only to find out it's a piece of junk and I don't want to buy any guns that may have been used in a crime so I only buy from licensed dealers.

I don't want to sell a gun to a person I don't know who may not be responsible or may commit crimes with a gun.

I asked a licenced FFL I hadn't purchaced from before what kind of warranty he offered ... He said "A Taillight Warranty"...as in, when your taillights disappear from view, so does the warranty.

I buy from private individuals, FFLs and online gun stores.

Never had an issue.

Selling is a different story...

I will only sell to unknown individual with a Missouri CCW. Otherwise I'll just sell or trade with folks I know or my local FFL.

I oppose banning private sales.

A ban of private sales is a de facto registration scheme. The first step to confiscation.

Do you oppose background checks for private sales?

Yes, for several reasons.
One is that they then let the government know what you have.
It also costs money.
The government won't let just anyone do a background checks, so you have to go through and pay an FFL.
Background check are pointless since any criminal will just get their weapons illegally.
Federal background check laws are specifically illegal according to the constitution.

The idea of turning the whole country into a supervised institution is insane.
What a normal society does instead is put only dangerous people into supervised institutions.

So you don't care if you sell a gun to a guy who uses it to murder someone or is felon or if you buy a possibly stolen gun that some criminal is selling you?

I think the $25 bucks an FFL charges is worth it for my own peace of mind

it violates the 2nd A,,,

I have no problem with felons and the adjudicated mentally ill not being allowed to have firearms.

I most certainly do have a problem with federal laws prohibiting felons and mentally ill from owning firearms.
It is NOT legal for the federal government to make ANY gun law, but felons can not be legally discriminated against.
Mentally ill can be, but obviously if they are mentally ill, they need to be institutionalized, since you can't let them get flammable,, toxins, explosives, etc. So federal gun laws make no sense and are not legal.

Good for you.

As far as I'm concerned any one who commits a felony has proven he isn't responsible enough to be trusted with a gun.

so passing bad checks as a college student means he cant protect his family when hes 45,,,

if they are to dangerous to be trusted with a gun they shouldnt be let out of prison or put on lifetime parole,,

cause if they wanted a gun no law will stop them,,

You have to hang a lot of bad paper to be convicted of a felony so yeah fuck that college student because he knew what he was doing.

one piece of paper will do it,,,

and what about the guy in florida that got hit with a fed felony for letting wedding balloons go in a national park??

You don't get a felony charge unless you don't cover the check and if you don't cover the check you are nothing but a fucking thief.

not true,,

and youre still an american,,

If you merely bounce a check and cover it there will be no criminal charges filed against you.

If you write a bad check and never cover it you're a fucking thief and IDGAF if you get slapped with a felony charge.

not always,,

Care to provide a link that supports your assertion that merely bouncing a check and covering it results in a felony charge?

Not covering a check does not have to be intentional.
You could have been counting on an income that falls through.
It could happen to anyone.
But it is still a felony.

 

[progressive hunter]

I'm curious how many people buy or sell guns from or to a person they don't know.

I have never bought or sold a gun in a private sale. I don't want to buy a gun from someone only to find out it's a piece of junk and I don't want to buy any guns that may have been used in a crime so I only buy from licensed dealers.

I don't want to sell a gun to a person I don't know who may not be responsible or may commit crimes with a gun.

I asked a licenced FFL I hadn't purchaced from before what kind of warranty he offered ... He said "A Taillight Warranty"...as in, when your taillights disappear from view, so does the warranty.

I buy from private individuals, FFLs and online gun stores.

Never had an issue.

Selling is a different story...

I will only sell to unknown individual with a Missouri CCW. Otherwise I'll just sell or trade with folks I know or my local FFL.

I oppose banning private sales.

A ban of private sales is a de facto registration scheme. The first step to confiscation.

Do you oppose background checks for private sales?

Yes, for several reasons.
One is that they then let the government know what you have.
It also costs money.
The government won't let just anyone do a background checks, so you have to go through and pay an FFL.
Background check are pointless since any criminal will just get their weapons illegally.
Federal background check laws are specifically illegal according to the constitution.

The idea of turning the whole country into a supervised institution is insane.
What a normal society does instead is put only dangerous people into supervised institutions.

So you don't care if you sell a gun to a guy who uses it to murder someone or is felon or if you buy a possibly stolen gun that some criminal is selling you?

I think the $25 bucks an FFL charges is worth it for my own peace of mind

it violates the 2nd A,,,

I have no problem with felons and the adjudicated mentally ill not being allowed to have firearms.

I most certainly do have a problem with federal laws prohibiting felons and mentally ill from owning firearms.
It is NOT legal for the federal government to make ANY gun law, but felons can not be legally discriminated against.
Mentally ill can be, but obviously if they are mentally ill, they need to be institutionalized, since you can't let them get flammable,, toxins, explosives, etc. So federal gun laws make no sense and are not legal.

Good for you.

As far as I'm concerned any one who commits a felony has proven he isn't responsible enough to be trusted with a gun.

so passing bad checks as a college student means he cant protect his family when hes 45,,,

if they are to dangerous to be trusted with a gun they shouldnt be let out of prison or put on lifetime parole,,

cause if they wanted a gun no law will stop them,,

You have to hang a lot of bad paper to be convicted of a felony so yeah fuck that college student because he knew what he was doing.

one piece of paper will do it,,,

and what about the guy in florida that got hit with a fed felony for letting wedding balloons go in a national park??

You don't get a felony charge unless you don't cover the check and if you don't cover the check you are nothing but a fucking thief.

not true,,

and youre still an american,,

If you merely bounce a check and cover it there will be no criminal charges filed against you.

If you write a bad check and never cover it you're a fucking thief and IDGAF if you get slapped with a felony charge.

not always,,

Care to provide a link that supports your assertion that merely bouncing a check and covering it results in a felony charge?

Not covering a check does not have to be intentional.
You could have been counting on an income that falls through.
It could happen to anyone.
But it is still a felony.

shoulda coulda woulda doesnt change anything,,,

 

[Rigby5]

I'm curious how many people buy or sell guns from or to a person they don't know.

I have never bought or sold a gun in a private sale. I don't want to buy a gun from someone only to find out it's a piece of junk and I don't want to buy any guns that may have been used in a crime so I only buy from licensed dealers.

I don't want to sell a gun to a person I don't know who may not be responsible or may commit crimes with a gun.

Does this mean you support requiring unlicensed dealers at gun shows to run background checks providing a serial number on the weapon?

It means I think that you should know whether or not the guy you are selling a gun to is legally eligible to own it. I don't care what kind of gun it is.

And how is that determined unless a thorough background check is conducted?

That's kind of a stupid question isn't it?

If I was going to sell a gun to a person I didn't know I would do it through an FFL.

I don't want to be the guy that sold a person planning to commit murder a gun. And I certainly don't want to unknowingly purchase a stolen gun.

Which again is why I don't ever buy guns from anyone but a licensed dealer and why I don't sell guns to people in private sales.

You never answered my original question -
Do you support unlicensed dealers selling guns to any jackass, kook or criminal at guns shows without a BG check?
(Quite legal in around half the states at present)

Never seen a gun show that did not require background checks for all transfers.
The claim there is a gun show or internet loop hole, is totally untrue in my experience.
Fake hype.

 

[progressive hunter]

I'm curious how many people buy or sell guns from or to a person they don't know.

I have never bought or sold a gun in a private sale. I don't want to buy a gun from someone only to find out it's a piece of junk and I don't want to buy any guns that may have been used in a crime so I only buy from licensed dealers.

I don't want to sell a gun to a person I don't know who may not be responsible or may commit crimes with a gun.

Does this mean you support requiring unlicensed dealers at gun shows to run background checks providing a serial number on the weapon?

It means I think that you should know whether or not the guy you are selling a gun to is legally eligible to own it. I don't care what kind of gun it is.

And how is that determined unless a thorough background check is conducted?

That's kind of a stupid question isn't it?

If I was going to sell a gun to a person I didn't know I would do it through an FFL.

I don't want to be the guy that sold a person planning to commit murder a gun. And I certainly don't want to unknowingly purchase a stolen gun.

Which again is why I don't ever buy guns from anyone but a licensed dealer and why I don't sell guns to people in private sales.

You never answered my original question -
Do you support unlicensed dealers selling guns to any jackass, kook or criminal at guns shows without a BG check?
(Quite legal in around half the states at present)

Never seen a gun show that did not require background checks for all transfers.
The claim there is a gun show or internet loop hole, is totally untrue in my experience.
Fake hype.

only if youre a dealer,, private sales dont require a background check,,, in missouri,,

 

[Rigby5]

I'm curious how many people buy or sell guns from or to a person they don't know.

I have never bought or sold a gun in a private sale. I don't want to buy a gun from someone only to find out it's a piece of junk and I don't want to buy any guns that may have been used in a crime so I only buy from licensed dealers.

I don't want to sell a gun to a person I don't know who may not be responsible or may commit crimes with a gun.

Does this mean you support requiring unlicensed dealers at gun shows to run background checks providing a serial number on the weapon?

It means I think that you should know whether or not the guy you are selling a gun to is legally eligible to own it. I don't care what kind of gun it is.

And how is that determined unless a thorough background check is conducted?

That's kind of a stupid question isn't it?

If I was going to sell a gun to a person I didn't know I would do it through an FFL.

I don't want to be the guy that sold a person planning to commit murder a gun. And I certainly don't want to unknowingly purchase a stolen gun.

Which again is why I don't ever buy guns from anyone but a licensed dealer and why I don't sell guns to people in private sales.

You never answered my original question -
Do you support unlicensed dealers selling guns to any jackass, kook or criminal at guns shows without a BG check?
(Quite legal in around half the states at present)

Never seen a gun show that did not require background checks for all transfers.
The claim there is a gun show or internet loop hole, is totally untrue in my experience.
Fake hype.

only if youre a dealer,, private sales dont require a background check,,, in missouri,,

I did not say anything about the state.
The state is irrelevant.
What I said is that all the gun shows I have been to in any state, has always been in a fair ground, National Guard Armory, convention center, etc., and every single one of those locations required every single vendor to do background checks on any gun purchase.
With internet, all purchases also have to go through an FFL because no one will take a firearm shipping order any other way. There is no way to ship a firearm directly to anyone but an FFL.

Never heard of anyone being able to ever buy without a background check, except from local want-ads in the newspaper.

 

[progressive hunter]

I'm curious how many people buy or sell guns from or to a person they don't know.

I have never bought or sold a gun in a private sale. I don't want to buy a gun from someone only to find out it's a piece of junk and I don't want to buy any guns that may have been used in a crime so I only buy from licensed dealers.

I don't want to sell a gun to a person I don't know who may not be responsible or may commit crimes with a gun.

Does this mean you support requiring unlicensed dealers at gun shows to run background checks providing a serial number on the weapon?

It means I think that you should know whether or not the guy you are selling a gun to is legally eligible to own it. I don't care what kind of gun it is.

And how is that determined unless a thorough background check is conducted?

That's kind of a stupid question isn't it?

If I was going to sell a gun to a person I didn't know I would do it through an FFL.

I don't want to be the guy that sold a person planning to commit murder a gun. And I certainly don't want to unknowingly purchase a stolen gun.

Which again is why I don't ever buy guns from anyone but a licensed dealer and why I don't sell guns to people in private sales.

You never answered my original question -
Do you support unlicensed dealers selling guns to any jackass, kook or criminal at guns shows without a BG check?
(Quite legal in around half the states at present)

Never seen a gun show that did not require background checks for all transfers.
The claim there is a gun show or internet loop hole, is totally untrue in my experience.
Fake hype.

only if youre a dealer,, private sales dont require a background check,,, in missouri,,

I did not say anything about the state.
The state is irrelevant.
What I said is that all the gun shows I have been to in any state, has always been in a fair ground, National Guard Armory, convention center, etc., and every single one of those locations required every single vendor to do background checks on any gun purchase.
With internet, all purchases also have to go through an FFL because no one will take a firearm shipping order any other way. There is no way to ship a firearm directly to anyone but an FFL.

Never heard of anyone being able to ever buy without a background check, except from local want-ads in the newspaper.

thats never been the case in missouri,, only dealers are required to run the check,, a private seller does not and there are as many private seller booths as dealers,,

 

[Rigby5]

I'm curious how many people buy or sell guns from or to a person they don't know.

I have never bought or sold a gun in a private sale. I don't want to buy a gun from someone only to find out it's a piece of junk and I don't want to buy any guns that may have been used in a crime so I only buy from licensed dealers.

I don't want to sell a gun to a person I don't know who may not be responsible or may commit crimes with a gun.

Does this mean you support requiring unlicensed dealers at gun shows to run background checks providing a serial number on the weapon?

It means I think that you should know whether or not the guy you are selling a gun to is legally eligible to own it. I don't care what kind of gun it is.

And how is that determined unless a thorough background check is conducted?

That's kind of a stupid question isn't it?

If I was going to sell a gun to a person I didn't know I would do it through an FFL.

I don't want to be the guy that sold a person planning to commit murder a gun. And I certainly don't want to unknowingly purchase a stolen gun.

Which again is why I don't ever buy guns from anyone but a licensed dealer and why I don't sell guns to people in private sales.

You never answered my original question -
Do you support unlicensed dealers selling guns to any jackass, kook or criminal at guns shows without a BG check?
(Quite legal in around half the states at present)

Never seen a gun show that did not require background checks for all transfers.
The claim there is a gun show or internet loop hole, is totally untrue in my experience.
Fake hype.

only if youre a dealer,, private sales dont require a background check,,, in missouri,,

I did not say anything about the state.
The state is irrelevant.
What I said is that all the gun shows I have been to in any state, has always been in a fair ground, National Guard Armory, convention center, etc., and every single one of those locations required every single vendor to do background checks on any gun purchase.
With internet, all purchases also have to go through an FFL because no one will take a firearm shipping order any other way. There is no way to ship a firearm directly to anyone but an FFL.

Never heard of anyone being able to ever buy without a background check, except from local want-ads in the newspaper.

thats never been the case in missouri,, only dealers are required to run the check,, a private seller does not and there are as many private seller booths as dealers,,

What gun shows allow people to sell without background checks?
If that is true, I may visit one.
But I have gone to gunshows in TX, NM, CA, UT,NV, OR, WA, IL, OH, WI, etc., and every single site always demanded all sale got checked, or the vendor was kicked out.
Again, the state has nothing to do with it.
I am referring to the owner of the building the gun show is renting from, who demands it.

 

[progressive hunter]

I'm curious how many people buy or sell guns from or to a person they don't know.

I have never bought or sold a gun in a private sale. I don't want to buy a gun from someone only to find out it's a piece of junk and I don't want to buy any guns that may have been used in a crime so I only buy from licensed dealers.

I don't want to sell a gun to a person I don't know who may not be responsible or may commit crimes with a gun.

Does this mean you support requiring unlicensed dealers at gun shows to run background checks providing a serial number on the weapon?

It means I think that you should know whether or not the guy you are selling a gun to is legally eligible to own it. I don't care what kind of gun it is.

And how is that determined unless a thorough background check is conducted?

That's kind of a stupid question isn't it?

If I was going to sell a gun to a person I didn't know I would do it through an FFL.

I don't want to be the guy that sold a person planning to commit murder a gun. And I certainly don't want to unknowingly purchase a stolen gun.

Which again is why I don't ever buy guns from anyone but a licensed dealer and why I don't sell guns to people in private sales.

You never answered my original question -
Do you support unlicensed dealers selling guns to any jackass, kook or criminal at guns shows without a BG check?
(Quite legal in around half the states at present)

Never seen a gun show that did not require background checks for all transfers.
The claim there is a gun show or internet loop hole, is totally untrue in my experience.
Fake hype.

only if youre a dealer,, private sales dont require a background check,,, in missouri,,

I did not say anything about the state.
The state is irrelevant.
What I said is that all the gun shows I have been to in any state, has always been in a fair ground, National Guard Armory, convention center, etc., and every single one of those locations required every single vendor to do background checks on any gun purchase.
With internet, all purchases also have to go through an FFL because no one will take a firearm shipping order any other way. There is no way to ship a firearm directly to anyone but an FFL.

Never heard of anyone being able to ever buy without a background check, except from local want-ads in the newspaper.

thats never been the case in missouri,, only dealers are required to run the check,, a private seller does not and there are as many private seller booths as dealers,,

What gun shows allow people to sell without background checks?
If that is true, I may visit one.
But I have gone to gunshows in TX, NM, CA, UT,NV, OR, WA, IL, OH, WI, etc., and every single site always demanded all sale got checked, or the vendor was kicked out.
Again, the state has nothing to do with it.
I am referring to the owner of the building the gun show is renting from, who demands it.

every one I've been to in missouri,, cant speak about other states,,,

and I've been to a lot of them,,

and the property owner has nothing to do with it,, the law is the law,,,

 

[Shawnee_b]

Background checks don't include information on what you are buying.

The hell they don't. Ever see an over the counter 4473?

Look at line 1,2,3 and the 5 columns.

https://www.atf.gov/firearms/docs/4473-part-1-firearms-transaction-record-over-counter-atf-form-53009/download

 

[Shawnee_b]

Anything you bought from an FFL dealer, they know you have it.

Are you sure that's not the record of sale the FFL has to keep?

As far as I know the FFL keeps those files and the only way the ATF gets them is if they perform an audit
[/QUOTE]

Yes the FFL has to keep 4473's on everyone. Also a bound book. Available to the BATF at anytime they ask (and they have). Retire, turn it all in, every paper, every detail.

 

[Rigby5]

I'm curious how many people buy or sell guns from or to a person they don't know.

I have never bought or sold a gun in a private sale. I don't want to buy a gun from someone only to find out it's a piece of junk and I don't want to buy any guns that may have been used in a crime so I only buy from licensed dealers.

I don't want to sell a gun to a person I don't know who may not be responsible or may commit crimes with a gun.

Does this mean you support requiring unlicensed dealers at gun shows to run background checks providing a serial number on the weapon?

It means I think that you should know whether or not the guy you are selling a gun to is legally eligible to own it. I don't care what kind of gun it is.

And how is that determined unless a thorough background check is conducted?

That's kind of a stupid question isn't it?

If I was going to sell a gun to a person I didn't know I would do it through an FFL.

I don't want to be the guy that sold a person planning to commit murder a gun. And I certainly don't want to unknowingly purchase a stolen gun.

Which again is why I don't ever buy guns from anyone but a licensed dealer and why I don't sell guns to people in private sales.

You never answered my original question -
Do you support unlicensed dealers selling guns to any jackass, kook or criminal at guns shows without a BG check?
(Quite legal in around half the states at present)

Never seen a gun show that did not require background checks for all transfers.
The claim there is a gun show or internet loop hole, is totally untrue in my experience.
Fake hype.

only if youre a dealer,, private sales dont require a background check,,, in missouri,,

I did not say anything about the state.
The state is irrelevant.
What I said is that all the gun shows I have been to in any state, has always been in a fair ground, National Guard Armory, convention center, etc., and every single one of those locations required every single vendor to do background checks on any gun purchase.
With internet, all purchases also have to go through an FFL because no one will take a firearm shipping order any other way. There is no way to ship a firearm directly to anyone but an FFL.

Never heard of anyone being able to ever buy without a background check, except from local want-ads in the newspaper.

thats never been the case in missouri,, only dealers are required to run the check,, a private seller does not and there are as many private seller booths as dealers,,

What gun shows allow people to sell without background checks?
If that is true, I may visit one.
But I have gone to gunshows in TX, NM, CA, UT,NV, OR, WA, IL, OH, WI, etc., and every single site always demanded all sale got checked, or the vendor was kicked out.
Again, the state has nothing to do with it.
I am referring to the owner of the building the gun show is renting from, who demands it.

every one I've been to in missouri,, cant speak about other states,,,

and I've been to a lot of them,,

and the property owner has nothing to do with it,, the law is the law,,,

No, the property owner does matter.
If the property owner demands background check are a condition of being able to rent a table, then everyone who rents a table has to do the background check.
And so far, all gun shows I have been to have been at government buildings, and they have all required background checks. Such as National Guard armories, state fair grounds, convention centers, park pavilions, etc.

The only good part is that when the property owner gets involved, he arranges for the background checks to be free.

 

[progressive hunter]

I'm curious how many people buy or sell guns from or to a person they don't know.

I have never bought or sold a gun in a private sale. I don't want to buy a gun from someone only to find out it's a piece of junk and I don't want to buy any guns that may have been used in a crime so I only buy from licensed dealers.

I don't want to sell a gun to a person I don't know who may not be responsible or may commit crimes with a gun.

Does this mean you support requiring unlicensed dealers at gun shows to run background checks providing a serial number on the weapon?

It means I think that you should know whether or not the guy you are selling a gun to is legally eligible to own it. I don't care what kind of gun it is.

And how is that determined unless a thorough background check is conducted?

That's kind of a stupid question isn't it?

If I was going to sell a gun to a person I didn't know I would do it through an FFL.

I don't want to be the guy that sold a person planning to commit murder a gun. And I certainly don't want to unknowingly purchase a stolen gun.

Which again is why I don't ever buy guns from anyone but a licensed dealer and why I don't sell guns to people in private sales.

You never answered my original question -
Do you support unlicensed dealers selling guns to any jackass, kook or criminal at guns shows without a BG check?
(Quite legal in around half the states at present)

Never seen a gun show that did not require background checks for all transfers.
The claim there is a gun show or internet loop hole, is totally untrue in my experience.
Fake hype.

only if youre a dealer,, private sales dont require a background check,,, in missouri,,

I did not say anything about the state.
The state is irrelevant.
What I said is that all the gun shows I have been to in any state, has always been in a fair ground, National Guard Armory, convention center, etc., and every single one of those locations required every single vendor to do background checks on any gun purchase.
With internet, all purchases also have to go through an FFL because no one will take a firearm shipping order any other way. There is no way to ship a firearm directly to anyone but an FFL.

Never heard of anyone being able to ever buy without a background check, except from local want-ads in the newspaper.

thats never been the case in missouri,, only dealers are required to run the check,, a private seller does not and there are as many private seller booths as dealers,,

What gun shows allow people to sell without background checks?
If that is true, I may visit one.
But I have gone to gunshows in TX, NM, CA, UT,NV, OR, WA, IL, OH, WI, etc., and every single site always demanded all sale got checked, or the vendor was kicked out.
Again, the state has nothing to do with it.
I am referring to the owner of the building the gun show is renting from, who demands it.

every one I've been to in missouri,, cant speak about other states,,,

and I've been to a lot of them,,

and the property owner has nothing to do with it,, the law is the law,,,

No, the property owner does matter.
If the property owner demands background check are a condition of being able to rent a table, then everyone who rents a table has to do the background check.
And so far, all gun shows I have been to have been at government buildings, and they have all required background checks. Such as National Guard armories, state fair grounds, convention centers, park pavilions, etc.

The only good part is that when the property owner gets involved, he arranges for the background checks to be free.

sounds like missouri protects the rights of its people more than other states,, cause I never been to a show that required a private seller to do the checks,,

could be the promoters dont do business with places that require it,,

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

I'm curious how many people buy or sell guns from or to a person they don't know.

I have never bought or sold a gun in a private sale. I don't want to buy a gun from someone only to find out it's a piece of junk and I don't want to buy any guns that may have been used in a crime so I only buy from licensed dealers.

I don't want to sell a gun to a person I don't know who may not be responsible or may commit crimes with a gun.

Collectors know what to look for in a used gun to avoid buying junk.

I’ve made one private purchase, a Brno Model 1.

The rest of my collection was obtained using my collector’s license.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

Background checks don't include information on what you are buying.

Yes, they do.

In Section D of the ATF form 4473 (background check form) filled out by the dealer....

View attachment 476093

Anything you bought from an FFL dealer, they know you have it.

That’s not ‘registration,’ de facto or otherwise.

 

[progressive hunter]

I'm curious how many people buy or sell guns from or to a person they don't know.

I have never bought or sold a gun in a private sale. I don't want to buy a gun from someone only to find out it's a piece of junk and I don't want to buy any guns that may have been used in a crime so I only buy from licensed dealers.

I don't want to sell a gun to a person I don't know who may not be responsible or may commit crimes with a gun.

Collectors know what to look for in a used gun to avoid buying junk.

I’ve made one private purchase, a Brno Model 1.

The rest of my collection was obtained using my collector’s license.

whats a collectors license and what does it do for you??

 

[westwall]

I'm curious how many people buy or sell guns from or to a person they don't know.

I have never bought or sold a gun in a private sale. I don't want to buy a gun from someone only to find out it's a piece of junk and I don't want to buy any guns that may have been used in a crime so I only buy from licensed dealers.

I don't want to sell a gun to a person I don't know who may not be responsible or may commit crimes with a gun.

I asked a licenced FFL I hadn't purchaced from before what kind of warranty he offered ... He said "A Taillight Warranty"...as in, when your taillights disappear from view, so does the warranty.

I buy from private individuals, FFLs and online gun stores.

Never had an issue.

Selling is a different story...

I will only sell to unknown individual with a Missouri CCW. Otherwise I'll just sell or trade with folks I know or my local FFL.

I oppose banning private sales.

A ban of private sales is a de facto registration scheme. The first step to confiscation.

Do you oppose background checks for private sales?

Yes, for several reasons.
One is that they then let the government know what you have.
It also costs money.
The government won't let just anyone do a background checks, so you have to go through and pay an FFL.
Background check are pointless since any criminal will just get their weapons illegally.
Federal background check laws are specifically illegal according to the constitution.

The idea of turning the whole country into a supervised institution is insane.
What a normal society does instead is put only dangerous people into supervised institutions.

So you don't care if you sell a gun to a guy who uses it to murder someone or is felon or if you buy a possibly stolen gun that some criminal is selling you?

I think the $25 bucks an FFL charges is worth it for my own peace of mind

No one intent on murder is ever going to be effected by a gun law, so there is no reason not to sell to them.
Felons can not legally be prevented from the right of self defense.
Creating a 2nd tier of reduced rights for felons is illegal.
Stolen guns get sold to felons who are wiling to pay more for them, so there is risk of buying a stolen one.

I disagree as regards felons. Felons have proven that they have no regard for the Rights of others so I have no problem limiting theirs.

 

[progressive hunter]

I'm curious how many people buy or sell guns from or to a person they don't know.

I have never bought or sold a gun in a private sale. I don't want to buy a gun from someone only to find out it's a piece of junk and I don't want to buy any guns that may have been used in a crime so I only buy from licensed dealers.

I don't want to sell a gun to a person I don't know who may not be responsible or may commit crimes with a gun.

I asked a licenced FFL I hadn't purchaced from before what kind of warranty he offered ... He said "A Taillight Warranty"...as in, when your taillights disappear from view, so does the warranty.

I buy from private individuals, FFLs and online gun stores.

Never had an issue.

Selling is a different story...

I will only sell to unknown individual with a Missouri CCW. Otherwise I'll just sell or trade with folks I know or my local FFL.

I oppose banning private sales.

A ban of private sales is a de facto registration scheme. The first step to confiscation.

Do you oppose background checks for private sales?

Yes, for several reasons.
One is that they then let the government know what you have.
It also costs money.
The government won't let just anyone do a background checks, so you have to go through and pay an FFL.
Background check are pointless since any criminal will just get their weapons illegally.
Federal background check laws are specifically illegal according to the constitution.

The idea of turning the whole country into a supervised institution is insane.
What a normal society does instead is put only dangerous people into supervised institutions.

So you don't care if you sell a gun to a guy who uses it to murder someone or is felon or if you buy a possibly stolen gun that some criminal is selling you?

I think the $25 bucks an FFL charges is worth it for my own peace of mind

No one intent on murder is ever going to be effected by a gun law, so there is no reason not to sell to them.
Felons can not legally be prevented from the right of self defense.
Creating a 2nd tier of reduced rights for felons is illegal.
Stolen guns get sold to felons who are wiling to pay more for them, so there is risk of buying a stolen one.

I disagree as regards felons. Felons have proven that they have no regard for the Rights of others so I have no problem limiting theirs.

you arent the god that gives and takes our rights,, but thanks for your opinion,,