CDZ Net Insanity

[FA_Q2]

Myself I am not so "worried" about what the govt. will do to the internet, but what corporations will do.
In the 1980's Microsoft tried unsuccessfully in conjunction with other companies to make the internet something that could be owned. They wanted consumers to have to pay a "toll" to Microsoft and browser makers to access the internet.
They did not succeed. But they have not given up. On the Xbox1, they have resurrected this idea in the form of a "pay wall". If you have an XB1, you cannot access the internet in anyway, including viewing Netflix without having a Microsoft "live account". In fact, a toll.
I believe, as computer technology continues to drift towards devices and away from traditional PC's...that not only will content be controlled, but there will be a "pay per use" system in place.
Some may say we have that now with ISPs, you have to pay to have internet access.
No, you are paying access to the infrastructure that company has built. Not the internet itself. I am saying, I believe that there will be fees above infrastructure costs like the Microsoft paywall on XB1.
Annnd, I believe these devices will control and filter what you see and do not see.
For instance, your iPhone will simply not access Piratebay, Isohunt Kickass etc.

The internet *IS* owned. There is not a single part of the internet anywhere, that is not "owned" by someone. Every section, every router, every T1 line, every fiber line, is owned by someone somewhere.

Kickass, piratebay, isohunt, are all methods for downloading media you haven't paid for.

If there was 'carhunt', which allowed me to illegally drive your car, would you want that website blocked? Yes.

The law is the law. Both are breaking the law. Any argument that uses "A company might prevent people from breaking the law", is a failed argument. And by the way, if government had complete control over the internet, there is a very high chance they would block all those sites too, except not just on your Iphone, but everything.

As far as XBox Live.... if that's the best example you can come up with, then you have convinced me there's nothing to be worried about.

XBox live is a service that microsoft provides. Quite frankly, I'm surprised they provide *ANY* XBox Live service free. The fact you have a pay for the premium service, is not surprising, or unreasonable.

I suppose in your world, you would expect Microsoft to provide all services free? How does that make sense? And in a world governed by that idea, would there be many services?

If the terms and conditions of the Xbox are so bad.... buy something else. All the other subscription services have a price too.

Load Linux on your Xbox, and access everything. Better yet, just buy a computer if you want to access the internet. Game consoles are generally...... (gasp) for playing games. Shocking I know.

Well gee...so we have established you like to to put words in other peoples mouths. Got it.
And you like to make broad assumptions on what someone says...got it.
And finally you make claims on something you apparently don't know anything about.
Got that too.

So lets break it down.
XBox...prior to XB1 you only had to have a live account to play video games online.
You can watch Netflix and all of the other dozens of media apps just fine without the live account.
That is not a "premium service". It cost Microsoft exactly $.0 to allow the device to access the internet for non-gaming apps.
"Game consoles are generally for playing games" - where have you been?
Game consoles are very-very quickly moving to media/entertainment devices. Games are actually being use less than the media capability for most people. In other words they spend more time watching media than playing games today. That's a fact.
"A company might not allow people to break the law"...I was using PirateBay ect...wait for it...as an EXAMPLE of things that will be filtered. If they can block those, they can block anything.
"All of the other subscription services have a price too". No they don't.
XBox is the only device on the market, currently, that has a pay wall.
All other devices do not require a subscription to access internet based apps. None.
And I don't have an XB1, and I will not be buying one for this reason.

Companies sell what the customers are willing to purchase, period. If there are people that do not want to have a pay wall between themselves and the internet then there will be products without the pay wall. If Microsoft's implementation of the xbox1 unacceptable to you then the answer is really simple: do not buy one. Don't like filters on your products - don't buy products that filter your internet.


The reality is there that you do NOT have that same option as soon as the government gets involved. If the government gets involved and decides to filter something then you have no option - ALL products must comply with that filter. You have no choice at all. The actions of companies does not scare me one bit because they want my money and someone will make a product to obtain it - that is a fact. The actions of the government on the other hand are a MUCH bigger problem. Understand that this is EXACTLY how companies get what they want when the customers will not accept it. They lobby the government to do it for them that way they can get what they want without having to worry about the competition edging in on them when the customer does not like the result.

 

[iamwhatiseem]

... If Microsoft's implementation of the xbox1 unacceptable to you then the answer is really simple: do not buy one.

I didn't. For that reason. Not sure why everyone keeps telling me if I don't like it, then don't buy it - which I said I didn't buy one in the first post.
Currently, I do not believe our government is going to filter the internet. I do believe however they will try, and likely succeed, in figuring out how to tax it. That is something they are good at.
I also am very concerned about how the government already spies on us through the internet. There are not enough laws on the books to prevent a gov't agency in tapping into your computer and seeing everything you do online.

 

[FA_Q2]

... If Microsoft's implementation of the xbox1 unacceptable to you then the answer is really simple: do not buy one.

I didn't. For that reason. Not sure why everyone keeps telling me if I don't like it, then don't buy it - which I said I didn't buy one in the first post.
Currently, I do not believe our government is going to filter the internet. I do believe however they will try, and likely succeed, in figuring out how to tax it. That is something they are good at.
I also am very concerned about how the government already spies on us through the internet. There are not enough laws on the books to prevent a gov't agency in tapping into your computer and seeing everything you do online.

Everyone keeps pointing that out because it seems that you are arguing that companies are going to adversely affect your ability to access the internet. That statement is universal - don't buy anything that does not meet your needs and you don't need to worry about things like additional pay walls or filters.

They will likely tax it - they tax the rain here so taxing the internet is not unbelievable even if it is grossly wrong.

The surveillance state is another thread altogether. This is not a problem with internet law but what powers we have allowed the government out of asinine fear. It saddens me as that is just another step in the total loss of freedom - something that the people seem all too willing to accept.

 

[iamwhatiseem]

... If Microsoft's implementation of the xbox1 unacceptable to you then the answer is really simple: do not buy one.

I didn't. For that reason. Not sure why everyone keeps telling me if I don't like it, then don't buy it - which I said I didn't buy one in the first post.
Currently, I do not believe our government is going to filter the internet. I do believe however they will try, and likely succeed, in figuring out how to tax it. That is something they are good at.
I also am very concerned about how the government already spies on us through the internet. There are not enough laws on the books to prevent a gov't agency in tapping into your computer and seeing everything you do online.

Everyone keeps pointing that out because it seems that you are arguing that companies are going to adversely affect your ability to access the internet. That statement is universal - don't buy anything that does not meet your needs and you don't need to worry about things like additional pay walls or filters.

They will likely tax it - they tax the rain here so taxing the internet is not unbelievable even if it is grossly wrong.

The surveillance state is another thread altogether. This is not a problem with internet law but what powers we have allowed the government out of asinine fear. It saddens me as that is just another step in the total loss of freedom - something that the people seem all too willing to accept.

Habit I guess, when it comes to economics and business - I am as conservative as they come. And for that reason I am anti-corporate relating to what corporatism has become today.
I fear corporations more than the government, for they are the ones truly in control anyway.

 

[FA_Q2]

... If Microsoft's implementation of the xbox1 unacceptable to you then the answer is really simple: do not buy one.

I didn't. For that reason. Not sure why everyone keeps telling me if I don't like it, then don't buy it - which I said I didn't buy one in the first post.
Currently, I do not believe our government is going to filter the internet. I do believe however they will try, and likely succeed, in figuring out how to tax it. That is something they are good at.
I also am very concerned about how the government already spies on us through the internet. There are not enough laws on the books to prevent a gov't agency in tapping into your computer and seeing everything you do online.

Everyone keeps pointing that out because it seems that you are arguing that companies are going to adversely affect your ability to access the internet. That statement is universal - don't buy anything that does not meet your needs and you don't need to worry about things like additional pay walls or filters.

They will likely tax it - they tax the rain here so taxing the internet is not unbelievable even if it is grossly wrong.

The surveillance state is another thread altogether. This is not a problem with internet law but what powers we have allowed the government out of asinine fear. It saddens me as that is just another step in the total loss of freedom - something that the people seem all too willing to accept.

Habit I guess, when it comes to economics and business - I am as conservative as they come. And for that reason I am anti-corporate relating to what corporatism has become today.
I fear corporations more than the government, for they are the ones truly in control anyway.

I believe your fear is misguided then.

I fear government collusion with corporations. That is not a function of the company though. Government collusion with religion was horrific. It is the government melding with special interest that is the root of the problem, what it is colluding with is irrelevant.

in modern times it is companies. In the past it was religion. In the future it will be something else but there is but one constant there - government. We didnt solve the problems of thocracies by limiting religion. We did it by isolating government from religion. You will only deal with corporatocracy by doing the same thing.

 

[iamwhatiseem]

... If Microsoft's implementation of the xbox1 unacceptable to you then the answer is really simple: do not buy one.

I didn't. For that reason. Not sure why everyone keeps telling me if I don't like it, then don't buy it - which I said I didn't buy one in the first post.
Currently, I do not believe our government is going to filter the internet. I do believe however they will try, and likely succeed, in figuring out how to tax it. That is something they are good at.
I also am very concerned about how the government already spies on us through the internet. There are not enough laws on the books to prevent a gov't agency in tapping into your computer and seeing everything you do online.

Everyone keeps pointing that out because it seems that you are arguing that companies are going to adversely affect your ability to access the internet. That statement is universal - don't buy anything that does not meet your needs and you don't need to worry about things like additional pay walls or filters.

They will likely tax it - they tax the rain here so taxing the internet is not unbelievable even if it is grossly wrong.

The surveillance state is another thread altogether. This is not a problem with internet law but what powers we have allowed the government out of asinine fear. It saddens me as that is just another step in the total loss of freedom - something that the people seem all too willing to accept.

Habit I guess, when it comes to economics and business - I am as conservative as they come. And for that reason I am anti-corporate relating to what corporatism has become today.
I fear corporations more than the government, for they are the ones truly in control anyway.

I believe your fear is misguided then.

I fear government collusion with corporations. That is not a function of the company though. Government collusion with religion was horrific. It is the government melding with special interest that is the root of the problem, what it is colluding with is irrelevant.

in modern times it is companies. In the past it was religion. In the future it will be something else but there is but one constant there - government. We didnt solve the problems of thocracies by limiting religion. We did it by isolating government from religion. You will only deal with corporatocracy by doing the same thing.

Well, hard to argue with that.
Indeed, throughout mankind's history what has plagued us is the corruption of lawmakers. In one form or another. Today it is corporatism, and the financial elite.
Which, once again, the useful idiots, liberals, play a key role.
Obama is a corporatist, he is a liberal elite. He has been the greatest asset to the financial system and corporations in modern times. There has been no time in our history, except maybe the late 1800's where it has been this good to be wealthy in America.
But I digress. The thread is about net neutrality and the freedom of the net.