Zone1 Mary Is The Mother Of Jesus Christ, She Isn't Actually Jesus Christ

[ding]

Apparently the central tenant of Protestantism is focus on others.

 

[hadit]

That is a preposterous conclusion as I have said nothing of the sort.

We know that Mary and Joseph were married for at LEAST 12 years, and probably for many more. That means, if Mary was celibate, so was Joseph. If he was not, he was an adulterer. The more rational conclusion, knowing how God views sex between married people, is that they enjoyed a robust sex life and had multiple children.

We don't know if Joseph had other children, or if he cared for other family members. Since he is not mentioned after Jesus was twelve, another possibility is that he was much older than Mary, a widower, and Mary was his second wife and cared for his children as well. But we don't know.

And you turn that uncertainty into the absolutely certain proclamation that Mary never had sex with Joseph and never had any children other than Yeshua Himself. Thank you for admitting that your belief is based on an uncertainty, and your version of events is no more substantiated than any others'.

It is Protestants who insist (with a poor translation) that Mary and Joseph had other children.

Ah, the old, "poor translation" gambit. There's really no other translation that says anything different, unless you're determined to put things in that aren't there. Obviously, Mary's virginal status meant very little or nothing to the Gospel writers. If it was to be significant, you would expect to find some mention of it somewhere, instead of a church tradition that popped up after the fact.

So, they are left in peace to believe that. What is interesting is that Protestants will not leave Catholics/Orthodox in peace with a different belief.

That's because there's no Biblical evidence that Mary was a perpetual virgin.

 

[hadit]

To be clear: You could have ended at, "Protestants don't kneel." Why is that?

Because it's not true. We kneel before God, but since He is not contained in a building or a person or a statue, that kneeling doesn't have to face a carved piece of stone or wood, nor does it have to be in a building.

 

[hadit]

Try researching historical information sometime. Truth/possible confirmation is found in other writings as well.

When it is found SOLELY in other writings, it is to be questioned, and if it requires the bending and twisting of Scripture to find justification, questioned even more.

 

[Meriweather]

why the plethora of statues, if that's all they are?

That's not the question. The question is why does it bother Protestants to the point they feel the need to go into scandal-mongering and defamation of Catholics? Once again, statues are not idols, they are mere art and images just like the Cherub images on the Ark of the Covenant and in the Temple; just like the image of the snake Moses held up in the desert, which represented the people's faith in healing. Are you absolutely positive that all you are annoyed by in a similar sign of faith done by people not of your denomination? You want your sign of faith to be recognized. Very well. How great your sign of faith that of those who never kneel in prayer as it is a sign that the left hand doesn't know what the right hand is doing.

Catholics don't care what Protestants are doing because we are confident in our own beliefs. Tearing down the beliefs of another is one sign of uncertainty about the validity of one's own beliefs. What others are doing, what others believe, does not matter.

 

[Meriweather]

Because it's not true. We kneel before God, but since He is not contained in a building or a person or a statue, that kneeling doesn't have to face a carved piece of stone or wood, nor does it have to be in a building.

Are you saying that if there is imagery in a church, God is not there? Perhaps advise God his presence was not in the Ark or the Temple, either?

 

[LeroyDumonde]

From that day they would be liable to death as the body, in welcoming disobedience/evil inclinations lost the perfection of a bodily existence.

That's not what the Bible says.

 

[LeroyDumonde]

Scripture??

Gen 2:17 "But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die."

How come Bible thumpers never read their own Bible?

 

[Meriweather]

That's not what the Bible says.

Are you of the mind that the Bible said they would drop dead immediately?

 

[LeroyDumonde]

Are you of the mind that the Bible said they would drop dead immediately?

I'm of the mind that the Bible said that they would die the same day that they ate the fruit. I came to that mind because that's what the Bible says that God said.

 

[Meriweather]

I'm of the mind that the Bible said that they would die the same day that they ate the fruit. I came to that mind because that's what the Bible says that God said.

Consider that may be your own conclusion. Then consider the author's conclusion. Does he not go on to say that Adam lived 930 years? Doesn't that give some indication of how the author wished his original audience to understand the Book of Genesis?

 

[BreezeWood]

We know that Mary and Joseph were married for at LEAST 12 years, and probably for many more.

no, they experienced true love and were heavenly bound the reason for their notoriety - not by any religion or law nor conformity to fallacious commandments were they ever so united.

 

[LeroyDumonde]

Consider that may be your own conclusion. Then consider the author's conclusion. Does he not go on to say that Adam lived 930 years? Doesn't that give some indication of how the author wished his original audience to understand the Book of Genesis?

The Bible is riddled with internal contradictions. This is just one of them. The Bible says that they would die the same day that they ate the fruit. It doesn't say that they'd become mortal or that their death would take 900 years.

 

[DukeU]

Gen 2:17 "But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die."

How come Bible thumpers never read their own Bible?

They do.

I quoted this very scripture a few pages back.

 

[Weatherman2020]

I even refuse to call her the mother of God. Jesus is God in human form, but in the spiritual form God has no mother so that just sounds weird. Anyways, I've been getting lectured today because even though I respect Mary, I don't worship her and I just really don't get it either.


Mary didn't heal the sick or raise the dead, Jesus did. She also didn't die for our sins on the cross because she was a sinner. A repented sinner, but a sinner nonetheless so she couldn't die in our place, she doesn't have the power to forgive sins, and she isn't God. Jesus is the Savior not Mary.

Satan always takes truth and twists it into lies.

In this case Mary worship.

 

[LeroyDumonde]

They do.

I quoted this very scripture a few pages back.

And yet you asked me the reference for the very same scripture. Brilliant.

 

[Meriweather]

The Bible is riddled with internal contradictions. This is just one of them. The Bible says that they would die the same day that they ate the fruit. It doesn't say that they'd become mortal or that their death would take 900 years.

No. The Bible does not say, "Today you will die."

English is a subjective language; Hebrew is pictorial. English has tens of thousands of words, Hebrew only about six thousand. Depending on its use, the same Hebrew word can indicate any one of a number of things. For example, day. Day can mean a 24-hour period. It can also indicate a very long stretch of time when something was occurring. Genesis is a great example of this. On the first day, God created....meaning not a 24-hour period, but the stretch of time needed to create light and to separate light and darkness.

Or, if you want, you can pick up the Bible verse that says to God a day is a thousand years, and a thousand years is a day. Since Adam only lived 930 years, to God it must have seemed that Adam died on the day he ate the forbidden fruit.

 

[DukeU]

And yet you asked me the reference for the very same scripture. Brilliant.

I asked you for the scripture that says A&E would die the very day they eat of the tree of knowledge of Good & Evil.

You have yet to quote it.

 

[Meriweather]

Satan always takes truth and twists it into lies.

In this case Mary worship.

Exactly. Satan has Protestants believing the lie that Catholics worship Mary. I wonder how Protestants can fall for this.

 

[Weatherman2020]

Exactly. Satan has Protestants believing the lie that Catholics worship Mary. I wonder how Protestants can fall for this.

Unfortunately many Catholics worship Mary. 5-5 in the Catholics I know.