Life beyond Earth has finally been found; or so it seems

[ChrisL]

In general, it depends on no factors. More life = better. And if we talk about quality of life, there's an even more stark difference between now and, say, 200 years ago.

More life = better.

What exactly do you mean by that?

The longer life, the better, in general. Well, if you like being alive, that is.

A longer life does not equal a better life. No way, no how. Longevity has nothing to do with quality when it comes to life.

 

[gtopa1]

Life beyond Earth has finally been found; or so it seems
There is a moon circling Saturn that has a warm core, covered in ice and spewing geysers. With a green hew around the geyser points.


View attachment 157184

View attachment 157190

View attachment 157191

View attachment 157193

Explanation: This cylindrical projection global map is one of six new color maps of Saturn's midsized icy moons, constructed using 10 years of image data from the Cassini spacecraft. Discovered by Cassini (the astronomer) in 1684, Dione is about 1,120 kilometers across. Based on data extending from infrared to ultraviolet, the full resolution of this latest space-age map is 250 meters per pixel. The remarkable brightness difference between the tidally locked moon's lighter leading hemisphere (right) and darker trailing hemisphere clearly stands out. Like other Saturn moons orbiting within the broad E-ring, Dione's leading hemisphere is kept shiny as it picks up a coating of the faint ring's icy material. The E-ring material is constantly replenished by geysers on moon Enceladus' south pole. Lighter, younger surface fractures also appear to cross the dark, cratered trailing hemisphere.

Copper compounds possibly.

Greg

 

[watchingfromafar]

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

A longer life does not equal a better life.

And yet everyone strives for it. So, it seems we nearly all agree that longer is, objectively, better than shorter, all else being equal.

So yes, we can look at the extension of our lifespan as a positive thing.

 

[Old Rocks]

Now I laughed when the loonies tried to present this as some alien construct. However, what the scientists are now looking at are possibilities, and judging which would be the most likely target for future exploration. If Musk is successful with his BFR, then this could happen within my lifetime.

I'd hate to bust your space bubble, but Mr. Musk isn't going to Mars.

Neither he nor any consortium of private investors will be able to raise the Trillions of dollars such an effort would require.

And nations won't do it for the foreseeable future.

And what say you now? He could put a machine on that moon with his present Heavy Falcon.

 

[Old Rocks]

Fascinating news. I hope to hear more about it. Just because a form of life may exist there, doesn't mean that we could though. I highly doubt that it would be even remotely habitable for us.

I don't think that the idea is colonization, but knowledge. Should a form of life exist there, then we will gain knowledge as to the possible ways that life can come into existence.

 

[Old Rocks]

Do think the answers to your questions might be different and/or more clear 20 years from now? 50?

Probably not. It's not a matter of time, it's a matter of technology. There hasn't been an advance in rocket technology since World War II.

The trigger behind the great leap in aerospace in 1903 was the internal combustion engine. Before that, no other engine had the power to weight ratio to make an airplane feasible. No matter what kind of aircraft you designed, it would not fly without the right engine. By applying that engine to an already existing glider air frame the airplane was born. Every plane there after was a perfection of that design. A faster, stronger, greater endurance version of the original.

There isn't any significant technological difference between a Saturn V and a V2 Rocket. They use the same technology, one is significantly larger than the other.

There are technologies being pursued that could reduce that lift cost from tens of dollars to pennies per KG but none of them are being pursued seriously. Launch loop, Star Tram, Mass Driver and other maglev technologies show promise but are cargo only systems because of the massive G forces a passenger would have to endure at launch.

The Space Elevator is the most promising known alternative to rockets and would literally open up commercial and private space travel to the everyman. However, this technology would require a massive engineering project that, in the current global political climate, is not being considered.

Anti-gravity technology is a possibility, finding a way of cancelling out the space time warp that all matter generates and using it as propulsion to orbit. But, we currently don't understand the mechanism behind what causes mass to warp space time so finding out how to counteract it seems a long way away.

Once a technology is perfected that can lower launch cost from their current 'astronomical' levels, the push into space won't be measured in centuries, but in decades. Until it is, we are Leonardo DiVinci, playing with models and dreaming of flying into space. It may very well be hundreds of years before that dream is realised.

And the two boosters making perfect simultaneous landings were not a leap in technology? 90 million to launch the Falcon Heavy, versus 350 million to launch the big NASA rocket. That looks like a major leap in technology to me.

 

[Old Rocks]

Now I laughed when the loonies tried to present this as some alien construct. However, what the scientists are now looking at are possibilities, and judging which would be the most likely target for future exploration. If Musk is successful with his BFR, then this could happen within my lifetime.

I'd hate to bust your space bubble, but Mr. Musk isn't going to Mars.

Neither he nor any consortium of private investors will be able to raise the Trillions of dollars such an effort would require.

And nations won't do it for the foreseeable future.

My grandfather was 20 years old when the Wright Bros. flew at Kitty Hawk. He watched the Eagle set down on the moon. Sputnik was launched in 1957, the Eagle landed in 1969.

...And yet for all those momentous achievements and discoveries, humans are little different now than we have been for millennia. I don't know what you think about that, but looking at it in a "big picture" way, I find it somewhat disconcerting. The fact that what we can come to know so much more about ourselves and the world in which we live can change so much and we remain much the same suggests to me that we really aren't any manifoldly better as beings than are other lifeforms that we deem lesser than ourselves.

I think that as we extend our technology, that will change. At some point, mechanical evolution, computers, and the biological are going to interact. And, at that point, many things will change. We can hope for the better.

 

[sealybobo]

A longer life does not equal a better life.

And yet everyone strives for it. So, it seems we nearly all agree that longer is, objectively, better than shorter, all else being equal.

So yes, we can look at the extension of our lifespan as a positive thing.

My dog will live 15-20 great years. Like a prince really. But I wouldn’t trade 20 great years for a person who lives on minimum wage for 100 years. I’d rather live 100 years

 

[ChrisL]

A longer life does not equal a better life.

And yet everyone strives for it. So, it seems we nearly all agree that longer is, objectively, better than shorter, all else being equal.

So yes, we can look at the extension of our lifespan as a positive thing.

Not everyone. I'm sure if you were 120 years old, you would be more than ready for your dirt nap.

 

[ChrisL]

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Unless it is a planet that is EXACTLY like Earth and has undergone the exact same circumstances which were present to lead to the evolution of the human being, I doubt that there would be any life forms on other planets that would be human like unless the above conditions were met.

But why can't a water planet "Evolve" intelligent jellyfish who could build radio antennas and space ships?

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

Not everyone. I'm sure if you were 120 years old, you would be more than ready for your dirt nap.

What an odd thing to say. But up until 120 years old? Thanks for helping make my point...

why are you even arguing? Just cede.

 

[ChrisL]

Not everyone. I'm sure if you were 120 years old, you would be more than ready for your dirt nap.

What an odd thing to say. But up until 120 years old? Thanks for helping make my point...

why are you even arguing? Just cede.

Well, who said I was talking about myself? I'm just saying that not everyone would want to live to be 120 years old. Unless you are talking about some ideal fantasy candy land world or something? I don't know. Maybe we are talking about two different "realities" here. Your reality is not someone else's reality. Not everyone's life is so wonderful.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

I'm just saying that not everyone would want to live to be 120 years old.

Neither am I . i am saying, however, that we do all want to live past middle age, and the fact that we have elongated our lives can objectively be said to represent us improving our standard of living.

there is no argument to be had. Have a nice night.

 

[ChrisL]

I'm just saying that not everyone would want to live to be 120 years old.

Neither am I . i am saying, however, that we do all want to live past middle age, and the fact that we have elongated our lives can objectively be said to represent us improving our standard of living.

there is no argument to be had. Have a nice night.

Maybe, maybe not. Pretty presumptuous of you to say "we all" in any case. You don't know how people who are starving to death in Africa feel about it. You don't know anything except your own little comfort zone.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

Pretty presumptuous of you to say "we all" in any case.

Nah, it's not presumptuous in the least, it's an objective fact, supported by all of the evidence. If you wish to argue that "well, a small percentage may not agree"... fine, be my guest, you are basically ceding my point to do so...

 

[ChrisL]

Pretty presumptuous of you to say "we all" in any case.

Nah, it's not presumptuous in the least, it's an objective fact, supported by all of the evidence. If you wish to argue that "well, a small percentage may not agree"... fine, be my guest, you are basically ceding my point to do so...

Err. No. You started off arguing that the longer you live, the better off you are or the better life is. I said quantity doesn't have anything to do with quality.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

Pretty presumptuous of you to say "we all" in any case.

Nah, it's not presumptuous in the least, it's an objective fact, supported by all of the evidence. If you wish to argue that "well, a small percentage may not agree"... fine, be my guest, you are basically ceding my point to do so...

Err. No. You started off arguing that the longer you live, the better off you are or the better life is. I said quantity doesn't have anything to do with quality.

wrong. This is my comment to which you responded:

"Now, hold on a second. The human condition has improved vastly and is better overall than it has ever been in the history of the planet. Yes, I know, not for everyone. But you arent going to find many countries in the history books with 70+ year life expectancy from 200 years ago, much less 2000 years ago."

Of course, that is merely one aspect of the human condition, but it is still an objective measure of our overall well-being, across the whole.

 

[sealybobo]

Unless it is a planet that is EXACTLY like Earth and has undergone the exact same circumstances which were present to lead to the evolution of the human being, I doubt that there would be any life forms on other planets that would be human like unless the above conditions were met.

But why can't a water planet "Evolve" intelligent jellyfish who could build radio antennas and space ships?

Water and no thumbs