Let the public vote!!!!!

Discussion in 'Current Events' started by Trigg, May 16, 2006.

  1. Trigg
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    Trigg Active Member

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    SAN BERNARDINO, Calif. - A proposal that would impose sweeping restrictions on the ability of illegal immigrants to live and work in the city will be put before voters after the City Council refused to adopt it.

    The proposal would prohibit

    1. landlords from renting to undocumented people,

    2. force day laborers to prove legal residency to work.

    I thought this was a law already. Am I wrong, and if so, why do people bother to apply for work visa's????

    3. ban taxpayer-funded day-labor centers.

    Geez this just makes sense. Why would people want their tax dollars going to people in the country working illegally??????

    4. mandate that city business be in English and deny permits to businesses hiring illegal immigrants.

    I don't have a problem with signs being in Spanish. I've seen numerous signs in English when traveling out of the country and they're a huge help.
    I thought employers who hired illegals were already supposed to be subjected to fines. So, denying them permits is a great idea.

    .

    http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060516/ap_on_re_us/illegal_immigrants_initiative_2


    If the senate and the house can't get together on a REAL sollution to the illegal immigrant problem than maybe we should put it to a vote just like California. Then at least we'd know what the people REALLY want and it wouldn't be left up to a bunch of old men who are looking to be re-elected.
     
  2. dilloduck
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    dilloduck Diamond Member

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    I do---I want all signs etc etc in English only--its a waste of money and keeps people from learning English. If I yell " hey-look out for that car" in english it ain't gonna help out that non-english speaking person much. And vice versa.
     
  3. Trigg
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    Trigg Active Member

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    I do think that all legal papers, DMV, job applications, rental contracts, things like that, need to be in English and nothing else. But, since Spanish is the most spoken foreign language in America, I don't see a problem with putting Spanish signs at the airport, train station or shops.

    There are English signs all over Finland, Sweden and Italy in the more tourist areas.
     
  4. dilloduck
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    dilloduck Diamond Member

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    Illegal aliens aren't tourists
     
  5. Trigg
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    Trigg Active Member

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    Correct!!! Never said they were...see we agree. That's why I said I don't have a problem with Spanish signs in TOURIST areas, just like other countries have English signs in tourist areas.

    What do you think of the rest of the article though??
     
  6. dilloduck
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    dilloduck Diamond Member

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    People can vote on things but it doesn't mean anything is gonna happen. Lawyers and judges end up sorting everything out anyway. I'm not sure who even has juridisction.
     
  7. 1549
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    1549 Active Member

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    Passing those laws would open a very large can of worms...

    Regarding no renting to illegals...we are best off leaving that decision to the renter. If there were 12 million illegal immigrants wandering homeless that would be a total nightmare. The immigrants would not be safe and U.S. citizens would not be safe. I have never heard anyone praise the existence of homeless populations, so why support a bill forcing people to become homeless?

    Regarding day laborers providing proof of citizenship...Illegals are here, it can not be denied. They are not going back to Mexico. Doing something like this would really hurt their population. It would also create a deeper black market for labor. A lot of people in my neighborhood pick up day laborers to help mulch and shit like that. It is not the best practice, but my neighbors get cheap labor, and the workers get money to live off of. Without day labor, the illegals will go hungry, homeless, and die. Day labor must be allowed.

    banning tax-payer funded centers...meh, this issue could go either way. It is meant to make the practice safe for all involved. But I can see why people are angry.

    As for #4...Punishing companies employing illegal immigrants is something that should happen gradually over time. When you talk about use of language, who gives two shits if some signs are in spanish? If the business owner is spanish and wants every sign in that business to be posted in spanish...more power to him. Retail stores and such should use spanish and english because it helps with business. Legal documents should be provided in both. As long as the people signing are legal citizens, it is beneficial if the document is provided in the language understood best by those signing.
     
  8. 5stringJeff
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    5stringJeff Senior Member

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    If one is renting to an illegal, one is assisting him to stay in this country illegally. Therefore, I think this is a great law. And if that means that illegals will be homeless, then hopefully, that will convince illegals to go back home, and/or slow the flow of illegals coming north.

    We want to discourage illegals from coming over here. Denying them the ability to work is the best way we can do this. So again, this is a great policy.

    I'm not very familiar with these, but if taxpayer-funded work centers are providing illegals with jobs, they are wrong. See point #2.

    I absolutely disagree that legal documents should be in any language but English.
     
  9. 1549
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    1549 Active Member

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    The problem with such logic is that it does not alleviate the problems, it creates new ones. 12 million people are not going to walk back across a border that they risked their lives to pass through.

    An influx of illegal immigrants at current rates can not occurr. In a perfect world, it would not be a problem...but it is. Eventually having millions upon millions of undocumented people living here will have an impact. The solution can not be an immediate withdrawal of the illegal immigrant's life lines. Taking away the income and housing of these people is not the answer right now.

    What must be done: slow the number that come over and begin a process of legalizing those that are here. Twenty years from now, it might be possible to pass laws like those mentioned above...right now it would be a horrible mistake. The town next to mine has many illegal immigrants. As it is, they line up every day to compete for jobs. If they are lucky, they will get some work. They don't drive, they have to ride bikes or walk. Several families cram into small apartments.

    So now take away the day labor lines. Take away those small shitty apartments. What the hell are they going to do? Walk back to Mexico? (I live in New Jersey...I don't think anybody will be making that walk anytime soon)

    As Bush said in his speech, these people are human. Laws one and two in this proposal could be classified as inhumane because of the results it would have on the population.

    Imagine you have a jar full of crickets living off of some of that pet-store cricket food. (sorry for the strange analogy, but I used to feed crickets to my frog) You decide to take the food out of the jar. What will happen? If you do not replenish the food, all that will be left is a bunch of dead crickets. Take away housing and day labor...well, you see where I am going with that.
     
  10. dilloduck
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    dilloduck Diamond Member

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    You underestimate them--they can get back if they wish---they will even get free rides.
     

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