Ineffectiveness of the Church in America

Discussion in 'Religion and Ethics' started by Sweet Willy, Mar 12, 2012.

  1. Sweet Willy
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    Sweet Willy BANNED

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    Another discussion got me thinking on this and what I'd like to ask the membership here is this:

    Why has the church become so ineffective?

    Despite over 80% of Americans identifying as Christians and more than 60% attending Church weekly or monthly, how do we account for the great divide in our culture between the idea of morality in Church and the one outside Church. Why can't the Church reach us in a more effective way on issues like abortion, violence, charity and good will? How many people here, on this forum, can tell us that they are Christians? And once they do tell us that, I don't suppose we will find repeated and sustained incidents of vulgarity, profanity and ill will left here in their wake, right?

    Why do we leave our values in the pews?
     
  2. FA_Q2
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    FA_Q2 Gold Member

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    We always have. Society at large and parents are the largest effects in our morality and, to be honest, it has been a very long time since church was really an integrated part of that. People go to church but that means little. I have asked many people that call themselves one religion or another some basic details about their supposed faith. What I usually find is that they call themselves Christian and go to church not because they actually are Christians but because that's 'what they have always done' or 'my parents were Christians.' It is sad that people will go through the motions without ever actually paying attention to what they are doing. Ask some Christians to recite the ten commandments or the twelve disciples. Very few can get those correct and this is supposed to be the defining concept in their lives.
     
  3. Avatar4321
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    Avatar4321 Diamond Member Gold Supporting Member

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    Their hearts havent been changed.
     
  4. Douger
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    Douger BANNED

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    Great comment ! It's the same rationale used by the republican voting base !........my granpappy were and hiz daddie too...so I is.
     
  5. editec
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    editec Mr. Forgot-it-All

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    Materialism.

    That's the simplest answer.
     
  6. Gagafritz
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    Gagafritz Lady Germanotta Snicks

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    To the OP, what is it that you are expecting to demonstrate the effectiveness of the Church that you aren't seeing? America is one of the most generous nations in the world. We are there to help countries in times of need all over the world from tsunamis and other disasters to all kinds of things. I think that is pretty evident.
    And, as for being Christian, i think the masks are off. I think most people who embrace Christianity do so in a very real way. Understanding that Christians are sinners who have received the Grace of God and are not and never going to be perfect human beings, at least not on earth.\
    So, what is it you are expecting to see that you are not?
     
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  7. Sweet Willy
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    Sweet Willy BANNED

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    I'm not sure that I am expectant of anything, however I do note the divide between the behavior the church advocates and the behavior its flock emulates. The subject matter that brought this about was birth control, but there are plenty of other examples that aren't just momentary lapses of Christian judgement, but sustained behavior running contrary to commonly held Christian morality. The concept of forgiveness, indeed unlimited forgiveness, is all but lost. The idea of forsaking worldly possessions, lost. The love of money openly displayed in the constant public grief at it's loss. The idea of "do unto others.." is likewise, gone. At best, it has become "I will do as done to me.." at worst, "do unto others before they do to me..". Forgiveness for our enemies? Forget that. Non violence? Completely missing it would seem. It is not easy to spot Christian behavior in everyday life in much of the country. It becomes even more difficult to see in the actions of the nation as a whole. One person's answer recently, when asked how we might go about changing this and making the Church more effective, was TO START A CIVIL WAR. Really? You believe that the way to solve our crisis of values is to go to war? I was appalled, quite frankly, but I am often appalled at the callous and violent suggestions of folks that outwardly at least, claim the most Christian morality.

    I acknowledge our charitable nature that is evident in our willingness to give. But that appears to be the only evidence left, in any verifiable quantity, of wide spread Christian values in practice in America.
     
    Last edited: Mar 13, 2012
  8. Gagafritz
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    Gagafritz Lady Germanotta Snicks

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    That is a pretty broad generalization and i think untrue. I find forgiveness, charity, faith, hope , etc in many churches even in my small community. I know Christian people who are absolutely wonderful people. And, i know some Christians who are still a work in progress. If anything, i find Christianity to be more real now than it ever was. That we have actually embraced the notion that we are indeed redeemed sinners. That we do not get to Heaven through good works but only by the Grace of God. So, i disagree with your assessment on many levels.
    But, you make some good points. That many Christians have become very worldly. Not all Christians sects embrace forsaking worldy possessions and living in a tent. That is misguided in my opinion. But, you are right in that many of us could do a much better job at trying to embody the principles and beliefs we claim to subscribe too.
     
  9. FuelRod
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    FuelRod Gold Member

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    Because many times churches are about religion vs. spirituality.
     
  10. Gagafritz
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    Gagafritz Lady Germanotta Snicks

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    Sometimes non-Christians operate under the assumption that Christians are somehow going to be perfect people. That is a totally false view of Christianity. It isn't the fault of Christians but of the person looking in who is not understanding the basic nature of Christianity.
     

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