I would like to hear how teacher led prayer in public schools is constitutional

[blu]

please explain this to me because it baffles my mind

 

[rdean]

The right doesn't care about the constitution.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

The right doesn't care about the constitution.

Then please explain to me how this applies to a teacher in a school.

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof;

 

[blu]

The right doesn't care about the constitution.

Then please explain to me how this applies to a teacher in a school.

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof;

its about teacher led pray in front of a classroom or other congregation where not every kid (or their parents depending on age) gets to pick if they attend or not.

teachers are free to practice religion (pray) silently if they wish before meals or whenever else they want.

 

[Steerpike]

Well, it applies to the schools (public ones) as an arm of the local government via the 14th amendment. Before the 14 amendment and incorporation, it didn't apply to the States, much less the schools.

 

[Steerpike]

I don't think optional, teacher-led prayer, after school or during lunch or something like that is a Constitutional problem, personally.

 

[blu]

I don't think optional, teacher-led prayer, after school or during lunch or something like that is a Constitutional problem, personally.

optional is fine assuming the kids are able to make the decisions on their own or the parents make it for them if they are too young

 

[Steerpike]

I don't think optional, teacher-led prayer, after school or during lunch or something like that is a Constitutional problem, personally.

optional is fine assuming the kids are able to make the decisions on their own or the parents make it for them if they are too young

Sure. Otherwise, it wouldn't be optional.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

The right doesn't care about the constitution.

Then please explain to me how this applies to a teacher in a school.

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof;

its about teacher led pray in front of a classroom or other congregation where not every kid (or their parents depending on age) gets to pick if they attend or not.

teachers are free to practice religion (pray) silently if they wish before meals or whenever else they want.

That did not explain anything but your objection to the practice and the reasoning behind it.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Well, it applies to the schools (public ones) as an arm of the local government via the 14th amendment. Before the 14 amendment and incorporation, it didn't apply to the States, much less the schools.

Congratulations. you got the right answer, now for the tricky part.

How is a teacher, who is not empowered to make laws, violating either the 1st or the 14th amendments by praying in a classroom?

 

[Steerpike]

Well, it applies to the schools (public ones) as an arm of the local government via the 14th amendment. Before the 14 amendment and incorporation, it didn't apply to the States, much less the schools.

Congratulations. you got the right answer, now for the tricky part.

How is a teacher, who is not empowered to make laws, violating either the 1st or the 14th amendments by praying in a classroom?

The same way a police officer, who is not empowered to make law, can violate Constitutional rights. A public school teacher is a government "actor." They are constrained by the Constitution, while a private school teacher would not be.

 

[rdean]

Children have a limited amount of time a day attending school.

During that time, they need to be learning and studying so they will be prepared for what the world offers them.

Teaching mysticism and the occult is a disgraceful waste of tax payers money.

Can it be put in terms more simple than that?

 

[Bern80]

Children have a limited amount of time a day attending school.

During that time, they need to be learning and studying so they will be prepared for what the world offers them.

Teaching mysticism and the occult is a disgraceful waste of tax payers money.

Can it be put in terms more simple than that?

I would not so harshly agree. Kind of a waste of time for one thing. I imagine there is some gray area as to whether it can be considered unconstitutional. If a teacher lead a prayer at the start of every class I would think that would be unconstitutional in a public school. Kids choosing or parents allowing their kids to attend some non-class time prayer lead by a teacher, I'm not sure.

 

[rdean]

Children have a limited amount of time a day attending school.

During that time, they need to be learning and studying so they will be prepared for what the world offers them.

Teaching mysticism and the occult is a disgraceful waste of tax payers money.

Can it be put in terms more simple than that?

I would not so harshly agree. Kind of a waste of time for one thing. I imagine there is some gray area as to whether it can be considered unconstitutional. If a teacher lead a prayer at the start of every class I would think that would be unconstitutional in a public school. Kids choosing or parents allowing their kids to attend some non-class time prayer lead by a teacher, I'm not sure.

I am.

There are churches and Sunday schools. They can go there.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

please explain this to me because it baffles my mind

I would like to know how adding time to the school day so that extra breaks can be given so Muslim children can pray is not a violation of Church and State when the argument has always been that even adding a MINUTE of silence was Unconstitutional?

 

[bigrebnc1775]

The right doesn't care about the constitution.

Really?
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lgh-q4t0kzM&feature=search]YouTube - Congressman says "I don't worry about the Constitution"[/ame]

 

[bigrebnc1775]

Children have a limited amount of time a day attending school.

During that time, they need to be learning and studying so they will be prepared for what the world offers them.

Teaching mysticism and the occult is a disgraceful waste of tax payers money.

Can it be put in terms more simple than that?

Really?

Does prayer have the power to heal? Scientists have some surprising answers.
Information on the power of prayer on MedicineNet.com

 

[iamwhatiseem]

I think we have bigger problems to worry about in our schools.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

I think we have bigger problems to worry about in our schools.

Didn't really start having those problems until around the time they took prayer out of schools.

 

[Annie]

Two sources I've heard about by education legal experts:

firstamendmentcenter.org: Religious Liberty in Public Schools - topic

http://www.freedomforum.org/publications/first/teachersguide/teachersguide.pdf