"History will judge me" - Bush.....Looks like it already has!

[Superlative]

How would like to have been one of those Marines, Saliors or airmen that had fought through all the Pacific campaigns, and/or Army personnel reassigned from Europe, being told you will now invade mainland Japan and we estimate 1 million of you will die? Or we can drop this bomb, kill the enemy, and keep all of you alive.

Portraying the Japanese as victims is a joke. Obviously you know nothing of the Japanese from that period of time. They were to the person fanatically loyal to their emperor and would throw sand at you. Their concept of death was totally alien to ours. They considered it an honor and one's duty to charge hell with a bucket of water to protect their emperor and we would have been engaged in a partisan insurgency for a decade at least.

People who think as you are going to be the downfall of Western society. You're so busy trying to identify with ruthless enemies you can't seem to come up with any justification to kill them. And waiting for them to get to your door and acting in personal self-defense is TOO DAMNED LATE.

There is quite alot of proof that says they were surrendering, and we didnt need to drop the bomb.

Thats all.

 

[Shattered]

Kathianne is pure scum for saying that right call at the right time BS.. Gee, Kath, guess you didnt have family there did ya. What about 9/11 for the people that did that too us. Right call at the right time right? So easy to say since it wasnt your country that got a nuclear bomb dropped on them. The US Govt even apologized for doing it years later I thought.

People like you dont give a damn about other people. You only care about your country and that is it. Everyone else can die a slow miserable death as far as you are concerened. And you are a teacher aren't you? What a shame someone like YOU can be allowed in the public school system. Thank god you are not teaching my kid. YOU SUCK !!!!!

 

[Gunny]

There is quite alot of proof that says they were surrendering, and we didnt need to drop the bomb.

Thats all.

There is evidence that Truman demanded Japan's surrender and they refused. The A-bomb was used based on that refusal.

 

[JeffWartman]

There is evidence that Truman demanded Japan's surrender and they refused. The A-bomb was used based on that refusal.

Exactly. Hell, there's even evidence that the Japanese refused to surrender after the first bomb on Hiroshima and wouldn't surrender until after the second bomb on Nagasaki.

 

[Annie]

There is quite alot of proof that says they were surrendering, and we didnt need to drop the bomb.

Thats all.

and quite alot that says not. You might like this, discusses from several positions:

http://www-cgsc.army.mil/carl/resources/csi/Pearlman/pearlman.asp

 

[RetiredGySgt]

There is quite alot of proof that says they were surrendering, and we didnt need to drop the bomb.

Thats all.

No there is not. Even after the nuke they hesitated and the military refused to surrender, Hirohito had to intervene. The Military tried to prevent his surrender as well.

More importantly there is not one credible shred of evidence that the allies knew that anyone in Japan wanted to surrender that was in a position of power to do so.

What they did know was that plans continued for civilians to arm themselves with bamboo stakes and commit mass suicide by charging allied troops if they invaded. They knew that an invasion could see a million allied casualties and based on the actions of Saipan and Okinawa could spell the death of the Japanese race. The knew from all the previous battles that the Japanese could be ready to die rather then surrender. They knew from Okinawa that the Military could and would "help" civilians die if they didn't do it themselves.

 

[red states rule]

Even after Hirohito decided to surrender, AGAINST the wishes of the Military ( which actually ran the country) those same Generals tried to prevent the Emperor from announcing his intention.

Prior to the nukes the Japanese Military not only did not intend to surrender, they ordered those peaceful civilians to arm themselves with bamboo stakes and spears and to charge any enemy troops that landed anywhere in Japan.

Revisionist history would try and convince you otherwise but they haven't a leg to stand on.

As for the targets BOTH were legit MILITARY targets, both were command and control centers with ARMY headquarters and martialing facilities, both were being used to create armies to resist any invasion and the command staff were there as well as large troops concentrations. Not to mention production facilities for war materials and ports.

The A - Bomb

Made in America

Tested in Japan

Ended a world war

 

[Shogun]

oh looky....


RATIOANLIZING the mass killings of civilians!



indeed..


I bet there are no "extremist" muslims who know that same parlor trick too...


hey, it might just take a million soldiers in iraq too!



why not just nuke the entire mid east and save those AMERICAN LIVES since it is this easy to justify the deaths of foreign civilians?



we could even fly a 747 into the tallest building in tehran!

 

[red states rule]

oh looky....


RATIOANLIZING the mass killings of civilians!



indeed..


I bet there are no "extremist" muslims who know that same parlor trick too...


hey, it might just take a million soldiers in iraq too!



why not just nuke the entire mid east and save those AMERICAN LIVES since it is this easy to justify the deaths of foreign civilians?



we could even fly a 747 into the tallest building in tehran!

The difference is

WE ended a war THEY started



As far as the terrorists, they started a war and they can't finish what they started

 

[Shogun]

The difference is
WE ended a war THEY started
As far as the terrorists, they started a war and they can't finish what they started

as if you even need to try THAT hard to find a rationalized ecuse for your own behaviour, dude...


first off, WE havent ended shit.

second, you are sadly unfamiliar with the 20th century if that is your opinon


third, run along and find a newsmax article since I doubt you can wrap your mind around anything ive said in this thread.

 

[Superlative]

The A - Bomb

Made in America

Tested in Japan

Ended a world war

And Americans wonder why the world doesnt like US.







And dont pull out your crappy surveys and opinion polls that say america is well loved around the world, especially in India. There are alot more people in the "I dont like the US" category than the "I Love the US"

 

[red states rule]

And Americans wonder why the world doesnt like US.







And dont pull out your crappy surveys and opinion polls that say america is well loved around the world, especially in India. There are alot more people in the "I dont like the US" category than the "I Love the US"

The A bomb saved more lives then it took

You can hate Amercia all you want - that is the freedom you enjoy here

 

[Annie]

The A bomb saved more lives then it took

You can hate Amercia all you want - that is the freedom you enjoy here

At least more American lives, which is the job of a government.

 

[red states rule]

At least more American lives, which is the job of a government.

Something Truman had to do, and the guts to do it

 

[Superlative]

The A bomb saved more lives then it took

You can hate Amercia all you want - that is the freedom you enjoy here

Hindsight is 20/20.

And patience is a virtue.

I must admit, It was probably the biggest decision a man has ever had to make.

Makes me wonder how different things would be if he didnt drop it.

 

[Hamiltonian]

At least more American lives, which is the job of a government.

So you don't think that the American government should participate in world affairs, and intervene to stop human rights violations in other countries? You think we should decide that it's not worth it because some of our soldiers might die in the intervention?

 

[Edward]

Right, we should have retaken the islands without the bomb, whatever the cost. Get a life.

Be silent you spawn of Satan. Anyone with any common sense would realize that dropping the bombs was morally wrong and unnecessary. It would have cost a lot of lives to win the war but those lives would have been those of soldiers fighting in a war while those who died as a result of the bombs were innocent civilians and not soldiers. They were men, women and children and the bomb was an act of terrorism and was no different than what happened to us on 9-11. The fact that Osama bin Laden wanted to quickly win the war against us, and didn't want to take the United States without blowing up the WTC and Pentagon, whatever the cost doesn't make him any less a terrorist. You are a disgusting and should be ashamed of yourself and you should pray that God will have mercy on your soul on Judgment Day. You are arguing that the end justifies the means. I think that someone named Osama bin Laden and Timothy McVeigh would agree with you since they too feel that the cost of actually fighting us in a war is to great and instead do what all terrorists do which is target civilians. The truth is that Truman knew what he was doing and the purpose of the bombs was to terrorize the Japanese into surrendering just like the purpose of the WTC and Pentagon attacks was to terrorize us into surrendering. The difference? The only difference for you is that you are you and Osama is Osama. If you were a Muslim and agreed with Osama bin Laden you would have done what the terrorists did on 9-11 but instead you are an American so you think it is okay to do what the terrorist Truman did.

 

[Annie]

Be silent you spawn of Satan. Anyone with any common sense would realize that dropping the bombs was morally wrong and unnecessary. It would have cost a lot of lives to win the war but those lives would have been those of soldiers fighting in a war while those who died as a result of the bombs were innocent civilians and not soldiers. They were men, women and children and the bomb was an act of terrorism and was no different than what happened to us on 9-11. The fact that Osama bin Laden wanted to quickly win the war against us, and didn't want to take the United States without blowing up the WTC and Pentagon, whatever the cost doesn't make him any less a terrorist. You are a disgusting and should be ashamed of yourself and you should pray that God will have mercy on your soul on Judgment Day. You are arguing that the end justifies the means. I think that someone named Osama bin Laden and Timothy McVeigh would agree with you since they too feel that the cost of actually fighting us in a war is to great and instead do what all terrorists do which is target civilians. The truth is that Truman knew what he was doing and the purpose of the bombs was to terrorize the Japanese into surrendering just like the purpose of the WTC and Pentagon attacks was to terrorize us into surrendering. The difference? The only difference for you is that you are you and Osama is Osama. If you were a Muslim and agreed with Osama bin Laden you would have done what the terrorists did on 9-11 but instead you are an American so you think it is okay to do what the terrorist Truman did.

Usually I try to engage. Not with you.

 

[Edward]

Blame America first, rught?

Don't end a war - keep it going for another 6 months and maybe Japan would have surrenered anyway

So what if another 500,000 US troops would ahve died - better then using the bomb on the enemy

You are a sick bastard. Let's really break your argument down for you. First, so what if another 500,000 troops would have died, it isn't better than killing innocent civilians. Here is Osama bin Laden's argument, "First, so what if another 500,000 members of al-Qaeda would have died, it isn't better than killing innocent civilians." The depravity of your statement is sickening but to be expected. The entire basis of your argument is that it is okay to kill innocent civilians to bring a war to an end and that is the argument of a guy named Osama bin Laden too and in reality it is the argument of all terrorists who attempt to justify their terrorism.

 

[Edward]

Usually I try to engage. Not with you.

Do what you want because it is your choice but don't expect me to agree with you. There is no doubt in my mind that you are a terrorist just like Osama bin Laden and you just don't want to admit it because you have a rosy picture of yourself and how awesome you are. I really don't care that yo choose not to condescend to engage with those who you consider your inferiors since if you are pushed far enough you will just nuke them off the face of the earth, invade their countries, kill their women and children because America is the greatest and you are right and as for those in America who disagree with you you will just elect like minded people to rule over the rest of us and to force your opinion down our throats like the tyrant that you are. Of course we will be good little bitches and continue to vote but if we don't you will put a gun to our heads and kill us just like you would have done in Japan (except the gun won't be physical because that grants the individual freedom) You can take my sarcasm for what it is worth and choose not to have a conversation because I don't really give a damn whether a terorrist and a disgusting piece of shit like you would seek to engage because I don't want to read the insane, and immoral justifications for terrorism that you would give since they are the same that all terrorists use to justify their actions. Try engaging that!

Now take your Satanic terrorist ass and go vote for a bitch or bastard who agrees with you and engage someone who gives a shit because I for one have had enough of your shit. Now if it makes you feel powerful, run to the voting booth on election day but don't think I am going to speak to you kindly or in soft words when you are nothing more than a terrorist, and continue to justify what is immoral. This is about right and wrong and I for one want to be found on the side that is opposite to you because I find you disgusting. You and them are no different and you as individuals are terrorists, tyrants and traitors and I condemn you, your vote and your elected leaders and tell you to go to hell. Engage that!