GM is NOT losing Money on the Volt

[GHook93]

Chevy isn’t losing $49,000 on every Volt it sells, for God’s sake | Grist
I’ll let the International Business Times explain what the hell I’m talking about.
General Motors Company loses as much as $49,000 per Chevy Volt it builds, according to one news organization’s report, but the article is not as self-evidently accurate as it may first appear. …
General Motors has sold approximately 21,500 Volts since the gasoline-electric hybrid was introduced in December 2010, and development costs of the high-tech car are estimated at between $1 billion and $1.2 billion by Reuters’ calculations. Production costs for the Volt are estimated at between $20,000 and $32,000, a wide margin to be sure. The Volt retails for a base price of $39,145 (before a federal tax credit of $7,500).
The issue with Reuters’ math, though, is that it only takes into account the 21,500 Volts sold so far, as if GM would never sell another one. If that is taken to be true, then each Volt sold has cost GM around $55,000 in development costs.

Every hater basked in the Volt losing $49K per car, like there were executives of Exxon or something. However, the calculation is well overblown and misguiding. That figure takes into account the $1.2 billion invested to create the technology! Of course putting that R&D dollars used to discover the product is going to create a deficit. HOWEVER, if you take that out of the question: GM nets $7K-19K on each model sold. That is only off the base, add extras and they make more.

Most new like the cell phone, PC etc showed deficits the first year when you considered the R&D costs.

The Volt is a step in the right direction and everyone liberal and conservative should embrace it!

 

[martybegan]

Chevy isn’t losing $49,000 on every Volt it sells, for God’s sake | Grist
I’ll let the International Business Times explain what the hell I’m talking about.
General Motors Company loses as much as $49,000 per Chevy Volt it builds, according to one news organization’s report, but the article is not as self-evidently accurate as it may first appear. …
General Motors has sold approximately 21,500 Volts since the gasoline-electric hybrid was introduced in December 2010, and development costs of the high-tech car are estimated at between $1 billion and $1.2 billion by Reuters’ calculations. Production costs for the Volt are estimated at between $20,000 and $32,000, a wide margin to be sure. The Volt retails for a base price of $39,145 (before a federal tax credit of $7,500).
The issue with Reuters’ math, though, is that it only takes into account the 21,500 Volts sold so far, as if GM would never sell another one. If that is taken to be true, then each Volt sold has cost GM around $55,000 in development costs.

Every hater basked in the Volt losing $49K per car, like there were executives of Exxon or something. However, the calculation is well overblown and misguiding. That figure takes into account the $1.2 billion invested to create the technology! Of course putting that R&D dollars used to discover the product is going to create a deficit. HOWEVER, if you take that out of the question: GM nets $7K-19K on each model sold. That is only off the base, add extras and they make more.

Most new like the cell phone, PC etc showed deficits the first year when you considered the R&D costs.

The Volt is a step in the right direction and everyone liberal and conservative should embrace it!

Where is your source for a net profit of $7k to $19k per vehicle?

 

[longknife]

Certainly! An absolutely great car --- IF you don't mind driving a car where the electrical system and or battery blows up and sets the car afire.

 

[Leweman]

except they are ...

Insight: GM's Volt: The ugly math of low sales, high costs | Reuters

end thread.

 

[Leweman]

http://www.usmessageboard.com/energ...-that-they-were-losing-money-on-the-volt.html

 

[flacaltenn]

General Motors has sold approximately 21,500 Volts since the gasoline-electric hybrid was introduced in December 2010, and development costs of the high-tech car are estimated at between $1 billion and $1.2 billion by Reuters’ calculations.

Is that counting the $3Bill in Fed and State Development grants, loans, guarantees that GM recieved to develop an EV?

There is no evidence that the market wants this car.. So by ANY calculation -- GM (and the taxpayers) are gonna get hosed by the real cost of this car...

GM should have had the experience of successful SEDAN hybrid before launching into this rechargeable gimmick.. It's NOT the right direction until you can tell me why I'm being tormented to pull my 1W phone charger out of the wall and turn down my thermostat -- so that a neighbor can install a 220V 40A service to charge his 25KWhr buggy...

Which IS IT GHook? Do we all need to live like Hobbits? Or Is there PLENTY of electrical generation and delivery for a booming EV market?

 

[GHook93]

Chevy isn’t losing $49,000 on every Volt it sells, for God’s sake | Grist
I’ll let the International Business Times explain what the hell I’m talking about.
General Motors Company loses as much as $49,000 per Chevy Volt it builds, according to one news organization’s report, but the article is not as self-evidently accurate as it may first appear. …
General Motors has sold approximately 21,500 Volts since the gasoline-electric hybrid was introduced in December 2010, and development costs of the high-tech car are estimated at between $1 billion and $1.2 billion by Reuters’ calculations. Production costs for the Volt are estimated at between $20,000 and $32,000, a wide margin to be sure. The Volt retails for a base price of $39,145 (before a federal tax credit of $7,500).
The issue with Reuters’ math, though, is that it only takes into account the 21,500 Volts sold so far, as if GM would never sell another one. If that is taken to be true, then each Volt sold has cost GM around $55,000 in development costs.

Every hater basked in the Volt losing $49K per car, like there were executives of Exxon or something. However, the calculation is well overblown and misguiding. That figure takes into account the $1.2 billion invested to create the technology! Of course putting that R&D dollars used to discover the product is going to create a deficit. HOWEVER, if you take that out of the question: GM nets $7K-19K on each model sold. That is only off the base, add extras and they make more.

Most new like the cell phone, PC etc showed deficits the first year when you considered the R&D costs.

The Volt is a step in the right direction and everyone liberal and conservative should embrace it!

Where is your source for a net profit of $7k to $19k per vehicle?

Um the article I quoted!

 

[Leweman]

this thread got crushed like Obama will be on November 6

 

[GHook93]

except they are ...

Insight: GM's Volt: The ugly math of low sales, high costs | Reuters

end thread.

Read the article! They specifically address the Reuters article. Again Reuters takes into account the $1.5 bil R&D cost! If you take the production, labor and material cost to the revenue made on each car equates to a net profit on each car!

 

[CrusaderFrank]

If you don't count the costs in making our product, we'd show a huge profit

 

[CrusaderFrank]

except they are ...

Insight: GM's Volt: The ugly math of low sales, high costs | Reuters

end thread.

Read the article! They specifically address the Reuters article. Again Reuters takes into account the $1.5 bil R&D cost! If you take the production, labor and material cost to the revenue made on each car equates to a net profit on each car!

Global Crossing did their accounting like that and it cost me a small fortune

 

[iamwhatiseem]

To say R&D is not to be counted in the cost of a product is...well..insane.
Not to mention continued R&D after a product is first produced, especially something as manufactured and complicated as an automobile.
You also have to take into effect the $7,500 subsidy the gov't is giving...which BTW - has not worked.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Drug companies are making tens of billions daily (if you don't include R&D)

 

[flacaltenn]

except they are ...

Insight: GM's Volt: The ugly math of low sales, high costs | Reuters

end thread.

Read the article! They specifically address the Reuters article. Again Reuters takes into account the $1.5 bil R&D cost! If you take the production, labor and material cost to the revenue made on each car equates to a net profit on each car!

I've got sources that say that GM got a total $3Bill just in govt program money to build the Volt. That's why I asked.. Do we ADD THESE NUMBERS to get $4.5BILL in development money? Or is someone faking numbers???

And do the math -- there can't BE a profit on ANY CARS right now til that $1.5BILL or $4.5BILL is paid off.. And manufacturing (production) costs (as quoted in your article) DON'T INCLUDE marketing, sales, commission, advertising, inventory, etc....

 

[GHook93]

To say R&D is not to be counted in the cost of a product is...well..insane.
Not to mention continued R&D after a product is first produced, especially something as manufactured and complicated as an automobile.
You also have to take into effect the $7,500 subsidy the gov't is giving...which BTW - has not worked.

The R&D is a cost to the company. What a group of people that for some reason want to see the electric car fail are saying that production, labor and material costs to BUILD each car costs $50K more than they are selling it for. That is not the truth! In fact if you take what the production, labor and material cost and you come out with a handsome profit.

That $7,500 subsidy is a tax credit to the consumer who buys the car not to the business! In my opinion money well spend! Gas prices aren't coming down anytime soon. I think a CIC in Romney would get it down a little, but with the global demand for oil increasing every year, gas will still be expensive!

 

[Noah_raffi]

self centered people and nothing else.

 

[martybegan]

Every hater basked in the Volt losing $49K per car, like there were executives of Exxon or something. However, the calculation is well overblown and misguiding. That figure takes into account the $1.2 billion invested to create the technology! Of course putting that R&D dollars used to discover the product is going to create a deficit. HOWEVER, if you take that out of the question: GM nets $7K-19K on each model sold. That is only off the base, add extras and they make more.

Most new like the cell phone, PC etc showed deficits the first year when you considered the R&D costs.

The Volt is a step in the right direction and everyone liberal and conservative should embrace it!

Where is your source for a net profit of $7k to $19k per vehicle?

Um the article I quoted!

It give such a range, and only gives production costs, not counting dealer costs and others. I probably need to see the source the article writer used.

That net profit is probably not a real profit #

 

[martybegan]

except they are ...

Insight: GM's Volt: The ugly math of low sales, high costs | Reuters

end thread.

Read the article! They specifically address the Reuters article. Again Reuters takes into account the $1.5 bil R&D cost! If you take the production, labor and material cost to the revenue made on each car equates to a net profit on each car!

When it comes to development, the way you do it is you figure out the net profit on each vehicle, then determine how many vehicles you have to hit to reach "break even" This pays back the investment in R&D on the product. After that each vehicle sold is truly "profitable"


The same model is used for video games. You need to sell X number of units to pay for making the game, and after x units is reached each game is pure profit.

 

[GHook93]

except they are ...

Insight: GM's Volt: The ugly math of low sales, high costs | Reuters

end thread.

Read the article! They specifically address the Reuters article. Again Reuters takes into account the $1.5 bil R&D cost! If you take the production, labor and material cost to the revenue made on each car equates to a net profit on each car!

When it comes to development, the way you do it is you figure out the net profit on each vehicle, then determine how many vehicles you have to hit to reach "break even" This pays back the investment in R&D on the product. After that each vehicle sold is truly "profitable"


The same model is used for video games. You need to sell X number of units to pay for making the game, and after x units is reached each game is pure profit.

Video games are developed technology with a twist! The electric car is not.

 

[Old Rocks]

EV's are a developed technology. Batteries are not. EV's can be powered with fuel cells, also. And many are working on battery tech, as a breakthrough there would be many fortunes for the company that produced that breakthrough.