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- #41
Ok, you're on the other side now with me.
So please explain how they are equal to being a POW.
FYI....we tortured terrorists under Bush and it is ok. Torturing scum to their death would be better than giving them some show trial for their followers.
You are the fucking idiot.
We did not torture anyone. We used enhanced interrogation. Big difference... except it idiotic, overly hysterical left wingers who think dropping water on someone's face is inflicting excessive pain.
You are being overly emotional. That's fine, but it tends to make you look silly. I prefer measured, rational thought.
Whens the last time you were water boarded? Was it pleasant? Would you want to go through it again?
any act by which severe pain or suffering, whether physical or mental, is intentionally inflicted on a person for such purposes as obtaining from him, or a third person, information or a confession, punishing him for an act he or a third person has committed or is suspected of having committed, or intimidating or coercing him or a third person, or for any reason based on discrimination of any kind, when such pain or suffering is inflicted by or at the instigation of or with the consent or acquiescence of a public official or other person acting in an official capacity. It does not include pain or suffering arising only from, inherent in, or incidental to, lawful sanctions. --UN Convention Against Torture
http://www.un.org/millennium/law/iv-9.htm
We agreed to the convention. UNTC
therefore using waterboarding, a form of torture, is unlawful.
Now check out the video on the bottom of this page:
HowStuffWorks "What is water boarding?"
and thats not even water boarding. Thats MILD and they couldnt last long at all. They all gave up.
lets look at actual water boarding now.
and this one, conservative talkshow host ManCow gets waterboarded after saying repeatedly that waterboarding IS NOT TORTURE:
water boarding - Bing Videos
and thats for demonstating purposes. In a safe enviorment. where NO ONE is actually trying to get information out of him. Six seconds, it took him to go from its not torture to it IS torture.
Water boarding is TORTURE. Period.
I agree completely that Water Boarding is Torture, so then that begs the question, what then is planning, carrying out, and engaging in the deaths of thousands of of innocent lives by all means, that often times result in horrible injuries to those who survive these attacks? If then if we are to conclude that these individuals are accorded the protections offered them under the Geneva Convention, then as a result one could argue that the following is also true.
Common Article 3
In the case of armed conflict not of an international character occurring in the territory of one of the High Contracting Parties, each Party to the conflict shall be bound to apply, as a minimum, the following provisions:
(d) the passing of sentences and the carrying out of executions without previous judgment pronounced by a regularly constituted court, affording all the judicial guarantees which are recognized as indispensable by civilized peoples.
So then the question is a Military trial consistant with this article ? One can argue that the trials at Nuremburg as well those conducted by Allied Powers in the Pacific on Japanese POW's would say yes. If no, then my suggestion to this would be the following, accord these people rights under the Geneva convention and as such release them when Terrorism is at an end? Which both you and I know will never happen. So then it becomes a life sentence anyway. Water Boarding is and of itself an irresponsible method by wich one gains or seeks to gain information that is often times not reliable and runs contrary to the Field Manual as it relates to the treatment of those captured on the battlefield as well as it gives a reason for those Americans who may find themselves in a similar situation for their captors to do the same to them. However Water Boarding is not an excuse for the the clear reasons why these men find themselves at Gitmo and before a Court.