Gate of the Sun in Palestine

[P F Tinmore]

Conspiracy theory or fact?

It comes from a reliable source. Somebody who was there.

Elvis!!!

OK, you just lost this debate.

 

[Hossfly]

It comes from a reliable source. Somebody who was there.

Elvis!!!

OK, you just lost this debate.

Oh well, any conspiracy theory is a hog stupid debate. You won, Porky.

 

[P F Tinmore]

 

[georgephillip]

The pussy boy on his knees appears to be you, Georgie Boy, since you were afraid to be in the military, not even the SeaBees where you would have learned some kind of a trade that you could have taken back in your civilian life to get yourself a decent job. In fact, I can imagine how you must shake just leaving your little apartment and have to go out on the streets in your neighborhood. Meanwhile, there are other sites on the Internet (and you have all the time in the world to search for them since you have nothing else to do in your life) which exposes the nonsense you are posting about the WTC.

"Let’s consider the evidence:
Speed of Collapse
As documented by video footage, Building 7 collapsed at free-fall acceleration for a distance of more than 100 feet – equal to at least eight stories."

It's only nonsense to chicken-shits who are too timid to look.

Building 7 Implosion: The Smoking Gun of 9/11

Georgie Boy, you can pull up all the sites you want to, but I will reiterate that there are sites that don't agree with your sites. Meanwhile, why in the world are you even pulling this up. We know you hate the U.S. and want to blame things on this country, but the WTC event was over 10 years ago, and it has been talked about so much on these forums. I think people can realize that you would be one of those conspiracy nuts; and if I thought you actually had the money to pay for your Internet use, I would think you were one of those on a forum set up right after this event for people to talk about it, who were blaming the U.S., Israel, and/or Mossad for doing this before the dust even had a chance to settle. It's a shame we can't throw little old you into the cell with the Muslim terrorist who admitted that they were responsible. He is so proud of bringing American down on its knees for a while (just like you would love to do as long as you still get your benefits and subsidized apartment) that he would show you how angry he is for trying to take credit for what he and his fellow Muslims were responsible. Just be happy that they didn't have enough time to do the same to your city or who knows where you would be living now as the taxpayers in your city would be picking up the bill to rebuild and wouldn't be too happy also subsidizing rents.

The reason I'm calling for a full public independent investigation into how two planes collapsed three steel-framed skyscrapers is the same reason I want Israel to explain to the world why she murdered 34 US service members aboard the USS Liberty in 1967.

Some Americans, including many with the physical courage to risk their lives in combat, are badly deformed spiritually. Their cognitive dissonance either prevents them from challenging their government's blatant lies regarding "national defense" or they subscribe to the fascist doctrine of "my country right or wrong."

I'll ask you the same question Rocco ignored: If elected Republicans AND Democrats in DC and elsewhere allowed the events of 911 to occur and even enhanced the destructiveness of the attacks, what is the greater crime, killing thousands of innocent Americans or covering up the treason?

 

[georgephillip]

Oh, you also want to blame it on others instead of your Muslim friends, Tinnie? I'm not in the mood to go search for the sites, especially since this happened over ten years ago and I have already read the sites which would disagree with anything you bring up. I don't even know why this was even brought up unless Georgie Boy felt he had to say something at the moment and 9/11 popped into his mind.. Meanwhile, your friends have taken credit for what happened, and they are only sorry they couldn't carry out all that they planned to do. Read the book Masterminds of Terror to learn how they went about it. Are you disappointed that they didn't ask you to be their contact point here in the U.S. the way you are for Hamas? Maybe you feel that you would have been the one to be able to work it out better for them so that they could have hit the places they planned to hit besides NYC.. In fact, Tinnie probably would have set up a flying school and a runway right on his own property to facilitate their training and there would be no questions afterward.

In fact, Tinnie probably would have set up a flying school and a runway right on his own property to facilitate their training and there would be no questions afterward.

No, they were already being trained at flight schools under the watchful eye of the local FBI. When the locals sent a request to headquarters for a warrant for deeper investigation their request was changed so they could not get that warrant.

Why would that happen?

Conspiracy theory or fact?

Why are you afraid of a full public, independent investigation that would provide an answer to your question? For the same reason you don't support survivors' calls for a similar investigation into Israel's deliberate attack on the USS Liberty?

 

[Hossfly]

No, they were already being trained at flight schools under the watchful eye of the local FBI. When the locals sent a request to headquarters for a warrant for deeper investigation their request was changed so they could not get that warrant.

Why would that happen?

Conspiracy theory or fact?

Why are you afraid of a full public, independent investigation that would provide an answer to your question? For the same reason you don't support survivors' calls for a similar investigation into Israel's deliberate attack on the USS Liberty?

No matter how many investigations are made regarding the Liberty incident, Georgie and company will never be satisfied. Isn't it strange, Georgie Boy, that those who retired from the Navy and were around at the time of the Liberty incident regard it as an accident, the same way they think of other accidents which happen during wartime? As far as 9/11, what is your problem, Georgie Boy? The Muslims who planned and had 9/11 carried out have admitted it and are very proud of what they accomplished. No doubt you believe that nonsense that all the Jews were told to stay home that day, when many Jewish people happened to have died on 9/11 and many more were injured. The agencies here were anticipating that something would happen but they weren't sure what it was. I have a feeling that if the planners wanted to have a place to flop in the Los Angeles area while they checked out things, you would have volunteered your apartment. For all we know, you are disappointed that the Intelligence Agencies have been on the ball and have since picked up many Muslim terrorists before they were able to commit another atrocity. Now why not tell us why you felt that you had to bring up 9/11 when it happened a long time ago. Were you running out of things to whine about?

 

[georgephillip]

Conspiracy theory or fact?

Why are you afraid of a full public, independent investigation that would provide an answer to your question? For the same reason you don't support survivors' calls for a similar investigation into Israel's deliberate attack on the USS Liberty?

No matter how many investigations are made regarding the Liberty incident, Georgie and company will never be satisfied. Isn't it strange, Georgie Boy, that those who retired from the Navy and were around at the time of the Liberty incident regard it as an accident, the same way they think of other accidents which happen during wartime? As far as 9/11, what is your problem, Georgie Boy? The Muslims who planned and had 9/11 carried out have admitted it and are very proud of what they accomplished. No doubt you believe that nonsense that all the Jews were told to stay home that day, when many Jewish people happened to have died on 9/11 and many more were injured. The agencies here were anticipating that something would happen but they weren't sure what it was. I have a feeling that if the planners wanted to have a place to flop in the Los Angeles area while they checked out things, you would have volunteered your apartment. For all we know, you are disappointed that the Intelligence Agencies have been on the ball and have since picked up many Muslim terrorists before they were able to commit another atrocity. Now why not tell us why you felt that you had to bring up 9/11 when it happened a long time ago. Were you running out of things to whine about?

Every single eyewitness survivor of Israel's deliberate assault on Liberty does not regard the attack as accidental. Are you calling all of those Navy retirees liars? Liberty remains the only incident of its kind which has never been investigated by the full US Congress. Likewise, there has never been a fully independent and public investigation into events leading to 911. It's strange, to say the least, that so many "patriotic" Americans continue to deny the need for both inquiries. What are you afraid of, the possibility that those in control of your country are just plain ol' evil?

 

[Hossfly]

Why are you afraid of a full public, independent investigation that would provide an answer to your question? For the same reason you don't support survivors' calls for a similar investigation into Israel's deliberate attack on the USS Liberty?

No matter how many investigations are made regarding the Liberty incident, Georgie and company will never be satisfied. Isn't it strange, Georgie Boy, that those who retired from the Navy and were around at the time of the Liberty incident regard it as an accident, the same way they think of other accidents which happen during wartime? As far as 9/11, what is your problem, Georgie Boy? The Muslims who planned and had 9/11 carried out have admitted it and are very proud of what they accomplished. No doubt you believe that nonsense that all the Jews were told to stay home that day, when many Jewish people happened to have died on 9/11 and many more were injured. The agencies here were anticipating that something would happen but they weren't sure what it was. I have a feeling that if the planners wanted to have a place to flop in the Los Angeles area while they checked out things, you would have volunteered your apartment. For all we know, you are disappointed that the Intelligence Agencies have been on the ball and have since picked up many Muslim terrorists before they were able to commit another atrocity. Now why not tell us why you felt that you had to bring up 9/11 when it happened a long time ago. Were you running out of things to whine about?

Every single eyewitness survivor of Israel's deliberate assault on Liberty does not regard the attack as accidental. Are you calling all of those Navy retirees liars? Liberty remains the only incident of its kind which has never been investigated by the full US Congress. Likewise, there has never been a fully independent and public investigation into events leading to 911. It's strange, to say the least, that so many "patriotic" Americans continue to deny the need for both inquiries. What are you afraid of, the possibility that those in control of your country are just plain ol' evil?

Had to start your day real early, Georgie Boy, to run around to different forums? Meanwhile, Georgie Boy can always attempt to get someone to drive him to Naval Base Ventura and ask the retirees going in what they think about the Liberty incident. Nobody is stopping him. By the way, so much is happening in the world today so why is Georgie Boy even dragging up the Liberty and 9/11? Doesn't he think these incidents have been dragged up time and time again by those with his mind set? Maybe to give Georgie Boy something else to do, he should go to the CARECEN building outside of his local Home Depot in the Pico-Union area and ask for some work. Surely he should be at least able to do some light work for someone looking for help, and he can make a minimum of $10.00 an hour, thus giving him some extra cash to spend on the movies, a concert, a good meal out, etc. instead of spending his days rolling out of bed and running around to different forums.

 

[georgephillip]

Why on earth would I make a trip to Ventura to find Liberty testimony?

"DECLARATION OF JAMES PATRICK KAVANAGH
I, JAMES PATRICK KAVANAGH, DO DECLARE UNDER PENALTY OF PERJURY THAT THE FOLLOWING STATEMENT IS TRUE AND COMPLETE, AND BASED ENTIRELY UPON MY PERSONAL KNOWLEDGE GAINED THROUGH
DIRECT OBSERVATON, UNLESS SPECIFICALLY STATED OTHERWISE..."

"While at my emergency station in the research spaces, the torpedo hit and
shrapnel tore into my legs and feet. I observed seeing daylight a few seconds
after the hit from inside the ship three decks below.

"11. Seconds after the torpedo hit, it was pitch black with just a small light from the
torpedo hole to guide me towards the ladder and up to the next level. Although
there were many who died around us, there was no way to see anything at that
time.

"However, as I made my way along the ceiling pipes and towards the ladder I could here many screams from shipmates who were in pain and seemed as
disoriented as I was.

"Making it to the hatch I was pulled out by a few shipmates
stationed there helping others get out of the small escape hatch. A few made it
out behind me and then the water started to gush out of the hatch.

"I remember
a marine going back down to try to rescue others.

"They called for him, and
called for him. The hatch had to be secured in order to save the ship. A minute
or two later there were noises coming from inside the hatch. After a brief argument, the hatch remained secured. The noises stopped."

http://www.gtr5.com/Witnesses/kavanaugh.pdf

 

[Hossfly]

Why on earth would I make a trip to Ventura to find Liberty testimony?

"DECLARATION OF JAMES PATRICK KAVANAGH
I, JAMES PATRICK KAVANAGH, DO DECLARE UNDER PENALTY OF PERJURY THAT THE FOLLOWING STATEMENT IS TRUE AND COMPLETE, AND BASED ENTIRELY UPON MY PERSONAL KNOWLEDGE GAINED THROUGH
DIRECT OBSERVATON, UNLESS SPECIFICALLY STATED OTHERWISE..."

"While at my emergency station in the research spaces, the torpedo hit and
shrapnel tore into my legs and feet. I observed seeing daylight a few seconds
after the hit from inside the ship three decks below.

"11. Seconds after the torpedo hit, it was pitch black with just a small light from the
torpedo hole to guide me towards the ladder and up to the next level. Although
there were many who died around us, there was no way to see anything at that
time.

"However, as I made my way along the ceiling pipes and towards the ladder I could here many screams from shipmates who were in pain and seemed as
disoriented as I was.

"Making it to the hatch I was pulled out by a few shipmates
stationed there helping others get out of the small escape hatch. A few made it
out behind me and then the water started to gush out of the hatch.

"I remember
a marine going back down to try to rescue others.

"They called for him, and
called for him. The hatch had to be secured in order to save the ship. A minute
or two later there were noises coming from inside the hatch. After a brief argument, the hatch remained secured. The noises stopped."

http://www.gtr5.com/Witnesses/kavanaugh.pdf

I am not even going to bother to read what you wrote since it really is a waste of time. The Liberty incident has been brought up again and again over the years. Why you felt you had to bring it up again shows that you really are not paying attention to what is happening all around the world but your needle is stuck on just certain things -- to either bash Israel or the U.S. If these boards are still going on ten years from now, your needle would still be stuck on the same things. At Naval Base Ventura you will find retirees who were serving at the time of the Liberty incident, and they will tell you that they consider it another accident of war, just like other accidents have happened, and that Israel should have been told that an U.S. intelligence ship was operating in the area. Tell you what, Georgie Boy. See if you can rustle up some funds to take scuba diving lessons. When you become an expert, head over to South Korea. From there find someone to take you off the coast of North Korea where you can set some bombs off to sink the U.S.S. Pueblo since the North Koreans have kept that ship as a slap in the face to America.

 

[georgephillip]

Funny you should mention the Pueblo:

"As we know now, if the rescue aircraft from U.S. carriers had not been recalled, they would have arrived at the Liberty before the torpedo attack, reducing the death toll by 25.

"The torpedo boat commanders could not be certain that Sixth Fleet aircraft were not on the way and this might have led to their breaking off the attack after 40 minutes rather than remaining to send the Liberty and its crew of 294 to the bottom.

"Congress to this day has failed to hold formal hearings for the record on the Liberty affair.

"This is unprecedented and a national disgrace.

"I spent hours on the Hill giving testimony after the USS Pueblo, a sister ship to the Liberty, was seized by North Korea. I was asked every imaginable question, including why a carrier in the area failed to dispatch aircraft to aid the Pueblo.

"In the Liberty case, fighters were put in the air not once, but twice. They were ordered to stand down by Secretary of Defense McNamara and President Johnson for reasons the American public deserves to know."

Surely you've noticed the difference between North Korea and Israel?

Admiral Thomas Moorer Rejects Israeli's Excuse

 

[Hossfly]

Funny you should mention the Pueblo:

"As we know now, if the rescue aircraft from U.S. carriers had not been recalled, they would have arrived at the Liberty before the torpedo attack, reducing the death toll by 25.

"The torpedo boat commanders could not be certain that Sixth Fleet aircraft were not on the way and this might have led to their breaking off the attack after 40 minutes rather than remaining to send the Liberty and its crew of 294 to the bottom.

"Congress to this day has failed to hold formal hearings for the record on the Liberty affair.

"This is unprecedented and a national disgrace.

"I spent hours on the Hill giving testimony after the USS Pueblo, a sister ship to the Liberty, was seized by North Korea. I was asked every imaginable question, including why a carrier in the area failed to dispatch aircraft to aid the Pueblo.

"In the Liberty case, fighters were put in the air not once, but twice. They were ordered to stand down by Secretary of Defense McNamara and President Johnson for reasons the American public deserves to know."

Surely you've noticed the difference between North Korea and Israel?

Admiral Thomas Moorer Rejects Israeli's Excuse

Well it certainly was a change from you blabbering about the Liberty incident. I felt your needle was so stuck on the Liberty that you had to push it a little and think about something else. However, I see that like some Robot who repeats his same message ad nauseam you are back to the Liberty again. Why not tell us why you even had to bring it up again? Don't you feel that you have brought it up enough over the years and probably on all the other forums you are on? Do you really have so little that you must keep on talking about the Liberty (even though so many other things have happened and are still happening around the world)? No matter if there were 1000 inquiries and it was found to be an accident, you still would not be satisfied. By the way, I was surprised to see you posting yesterday. I would have thought that being that you were lucky enough to have gotten a subsidized apartment you would have volunteered to count the homeless in Los Angeles County like other volunteers were doing. Were your forums more important to you?

 

[georgephillip]

"After two weeks in the hospital aboard the USS America, I was flown to Naples,
Italy for another needed operation. After this operation, I was informed that two
NSA personnel were going to debrief me.

"They arrived and were left alone with
me at my bedside.

"They asked me what happened and I told them everything I
knew.

"They told me that I was never to speak of the attack to anyone and not
to provide details about the attack to anyone. They also told me that if I committed a breach of this agreement that I would spend many years in Leavenworth. I was 18 years old and was very intimidated by this visit.

"I spoke to no one
after that.

"I believe this visit took place during the last week of June 1967.

"I neither asked to testify before the Court of Inquiry, nor was I asked to testify.
I spent 4 months in various hospitals and was eventually released back to duty.

http://www.gtr5.com/Witnesses/kavanaugh.pdf

 

[Hossfly]

"After two weeks in the hospital aboard the USS America, I was flown to Naples,
Italy for another needed operation. After this operation, I was informed that two
NSA personnel were going to debrief me.

"They arrived and were left alone with
me at my bedside.

"They asked me what happened and I told them everything I
knew.

"They told me that I was never to speak of the attack to anyone and not
to provide details about the attack to anyone. They also told me that if I committed a breach of this agreement that I would spend many years in Leavenworth. I was 18 years old and was very intimidated by this visit.

"I spoke to no one
after that.

"I believe this visit took place during the last week of June 1967.

"I neither asked to testify before the Court of Inquiry, nor was I asked to testify.
I spent 4 months in various hospitals and was eventually released back to duty.

http://www.gtr5.com/Witnesses/kavanaugh.pdf

It certainly looks like someone has to shove in a new tape in the Robot known as Georgie Boy. This Robot is stuck on the Liberty incident as if nothing else has happened in the world since then. Naturally we have read all the things Georgie Boy is pulling up since people like him have posted the same stuff over the years time and time again. Of course, the Robot would never listen to the opinion of men who spent 20 years or more in the military whose views happen to differ from his and who consider the Liberty incident an accident that happened in the fog of war.. By the way, Georgie Boy, do you think you can scrounge up some money to take lessons so that you will become an expert in diving and eventually place charges on the USS Pueblo to blow that ship up so that the North Koreans can;t use it anymore as a slap in the face of Americans. We know you can do that if you put in some effort. Just sit on Wilshire or Olympic Blvd. with a little pail and a sign saying you need to collect money to take diving lessons so you can fly over and blow up the USS Pueblo. No doubt you can take the time away from all your forums to do that, Georgie Boy.

 

[georgephillip]

"Between 1000 and 1100 hours, I observed what appeared to be a maritime reconnaissance aircraft at approximately 500 feet, move slowly from starboard to
port making a half moon circle from bow to stern. It then moved away toward
the shore.

"This aircraft flew directly over our ship and I observed that it was
marked with a Military Star of David.

"The aircraft flew so close to us that we
waved to the pilot as he looked down at us while banking the aircraft."

http://www.gtr5.com/Witnesses/kavanaugh.pdf

 

[Hossfly]

"Between 1000 and 1100 hours, I observed what appeared to be a maritime reconnaissance aircraft at approximately 500 feet, move slowly from starboard to
port making a half moon circle from bow to stern. It then moved away toward
the shore.

"This aircraft flew directly over our ship and I observed that it was
marked with a Military Star of David.

"The aircraft flew so close to us that we
waved to the pilot as he looked down at us while banking the aircraft."

http://www.gtr5.com/Witnesses/kavanaugh.pdf

Here's Georgie Boy making his run around forums bringing up the Liberty incident once again, as if this incident has not been dragged up by others just like Georgie year in and year out. Meanwhile, Georgie Boy, who wants us to believe that he really cares about people, instead of running around to forums all day could actually be doing something beneficial that would help people in his own city. I wonder if instead of running around to forums basically bringing up the same old stuff if he ever considered volunteering at one of the hospitals in his area and helping out such as wheeling people out after they are discharged or visiting some elderly people in the hospitals who have no relatives. He could also visit one of the schools in his neighborhood where the Hispanic children need a little tutoring in English and help them out. And, since he wants us to think he actually cares about the sailors on the Liberty, what is stopping him from visiting Veterans' Hospitals in the Los Angeles area. Surely Georgie Boy can get on a bus and go to the hospital in West Los Angeles and visit veterans there. I think many are quite aware that Georgie Boy wouldn't put himself out toward helping anyone. He would rather sit in his subsidized apartment running around the Internet posting the same old, same old. I guess this is what makes him feel important in life since it appears he has nothing else. Meanwhile, the stuff he is so busy running around posting has no doubt been seen many times before by the readers of this forum. It's a shame that Georgie Boy couldn't emulate Pamela Murphy to prove that he really cares about veterans. Naturally Georgie Boy is not interested in anything like that. No doubt he will be pulling up something else about the Liberty incident, something that once again the readers have already seen.
Dennis McCarthy: Pam Murphy, widow of actor Audie Murphy, was veterans' friend and advocate - LA Daily News

 

[georgephillip]

Tell us all about your volunteer efforts, Troll.

 

[Hossfly]

Tell us all about your volunteer efforts, Troll.

I guess Georgie Boy feels embarrassed that he never visited veterans in the hospitals in his own area instead of running around trolling several forums dragging up the same old stuff, faking it that he really cares about veterans. By the way, Georgie Boy, I have already posted what I do. Unlike you, I don't run around to several forums being a troll constantly dragging up events that happened years and years ago because you want to place the blame on those you hate. Now here's the address of one VA hospital where you can take a bus from your neighborhood. Try to take some time away from all the forums you are on to keep some of these guys company once in a while.
VA Medical Ctr-Los Angeles
11301 Wilshire Blvd, Los Angeles, CA 90073 » Map (310) 478-3711

 

[georgephillip]

How many forums am I on, Troll?

 

[irosie91]

I give up----how many?