Founding fathers on Healthcare

Discussion in 'Politics' started by Navy1960, Aug 2, 2009.

  1. Navy1960
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    Navy1960 Senior Member

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    "If Congress can employ money indefinitely to the general welfare,
    and are the sole and supreme judges of the general welfare,
    they may take the care of religion into their own hands;
    they may appoint teachers in every State, county and parish
    and pay them out of their public treasury;
    they may take into their own hands the education of children,
    establishing in like manner schools throughout the Union;
    they may assume the provision of the poor;
    they may undertake the regulation of all roads other than post-roads;
    in short, every thing, from the highest object of state legislation
    down to the most minute object of police,
    would be thrown under the power of Congress.... Were the power
    of Congress to be established in the latitude contended for,
    it would subvert the very foundations, and transmute the very nature
    of the limited Government established by the people of America."

    James Madison


    I just thought some of you might enjoy what one of the our founders thought of the idea of a Govt. that people looked to for all it's needs.
     
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  2. BasicGreatGuy
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    BasicGreatGuy Aut libertas aut mors

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    It would have been much easier to state that federal healthcare is not one of the enumerated powers of Congress per Article 1, Section 8, of the Constitution.

    So many people are spending all their time going through the proposed legislation looking for this health program and that health program, when they need to be about denouncing based on the aforementioned principle, in my opinion.
     
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  3. Navy1960
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    Navy1960 Senior Member

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    Meyer v Nebraska (1923), Rights of Privacy

    "While this court has not attempted to define with exactness the liberty thus guaranteed, the term has received much consideration and some of the included things have been definitely stated. Without doubt, it denotes not merely freedom from bodily restraint but also the right of the individual to contract, to engage in any of the common occupations of life, to acquire useful knowledge, to marry, establish a home and bring up children, to worship God according to the dictates of his own conscience, and generally to enjoy those privileges long recognized at common law as essential to the orderly pursuit of happiness by free men."

    Justice McReynolds

    "Manfully maintain our good old principle of cherishing and fortifying the rights and authorities of the people in opposition to those who fear them, who wish to take all power from them and to transfer all to Washington." --Thomas Jefferson to Nathaniel Macon, 1826. FE 10:378

    The men that founded this nation understood that the people were the best owners of their destiny and that liberty that is given over to a Govt. for personal comfort is not liberty but will eventually lead to corruption and slavery. These wise men understood this basic fact of Govt. very well and made sure that in our constitution that " The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people."
     
  4. JenT
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    JenT God lead our troops

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    WAIT a second! when did you get here?

    (*(*(*(*(BasicGreatGuy)*)*)*)*)*) Good to see you!
     
  5. Fatality
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    Fatality SunCrackedSoul

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    people who love big government and no freedom would love to have lived in the dark ages. they would make most excellant peasents.
     
  6. Navy1960
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    Navy1960 Senior Member

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    But a Constitution of Government once changed from Freedom, can never be restored. Liberty, once lost, is lost forever.

    John Adams, letter to Abigail Adams, July 17, 1775

    Each individual of the society has a right to be protected by it in the enjoyment of his life, liberty, and property, according to standing laws. He is obliged, consequently, to contribute his share to the expense of this protection; and to give his personal service, or an equivalent, when necessary. But no part of the property of any individual can, with justice, be taken from him, or applied to public uses, without his own consent, or that of the representative body of the people. In fine, the people of this commonwealth are not controllable by any other laws than those to which their constitutional representative body have given their consent.

    John Adams, Thoughts on Government, 1776


    As I stated earlier these men who founded this nation understood that the best place to find find good Govt. was in the hearts and minds of the people. Further, the best place for people to make a life for themselves was in their own homes and their own decisions and Govt. was to empower them and not act as the source for those needs.
     
  7. PoliticalChic
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    PoliticalChic Diamond Member

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    And a related story:

    Today is the aniversary, 1846, of a statement by the 11th President of the United States, under whose guidance the country grew more than any other President, and whose views were consistent with those of Madison, and the others.

    President Polk vetoed the Rivers and Harbors Bill, which included 40 projects, noting that many were of a local character far beyond what could be considered essential to national commerce, thus not covered by any constitutional power to construct works of internal improvements within the states. Polk stated: “Should this bill become law, the principle which it establishes will inevitably lead to large and annually increasing appropriations and drains upon the Treasury.”

    Ironically, party of Jefferson, Jackson and Polk, with its opposition to federally funded internal improvements, would become the party of FDR (the New Deal) and LBJ (the Great Society).

    He, also, understood the Constitution.
     
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  8. Navy1960
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    Navy1960 Senior Member

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    The latter presidents you mentioned especially FDR even questioned the constitutionality of the (New Deal) especially social security. Thus the reason for his Supreme Court fiasco. There are many examples of FDR and his administration expressing concern of this issue. However the court cast aside all of Madison and other founders ideals on the constitution all for a narrow view put forth by Hamilton. Since that time we hav lived under this narrow view put up by Hamilton under Article 1 section 8 *General Welfare * meant that congress had the power to basically use this clause to do as they pleased. Which seems as Madison and others expressed was completly in conflict with our constitution and the ideas of limited Govt.
     
  9. Oscar Wao
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    Oscar Wao Victory is Mine

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    To the "General Welfare" abusers, it basically means EVERYTHING is a so-called "right."
     
  10. Fatality
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    Fatality SunCrackedSoul

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    promoting the general welfare means staying the fuck off of our back
     

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