Feedback please

[loosecannon]

Read this: http://www.nytimes.com/2010/09/27/opinion/27krugman.html?ref=paulkrugman and then consider this question:

If we are locked into debasement as a strategy to weaken the dollar and improve our trade deficit, AND locked into deep unemployment gridlock, doesn't it begin to make sense to start direct stimulus measures based not on deficits but on debasement practices?

The fed could, for example, lend directly to US consumers at zero interest sparking small business investment and even a whole range of personal infrastructure improvements like weatherizing your home, installing solar panels, buying that electric auto, blah blah.

The point is that wouldn't debasement dollars be best spent directly generating demand in the USA? So what if the default rate was high? The money would be spent and the economy would realize a benefit, without increasing federal deficits.

Is it time for the "helicopter Bernanke" approach?

 

[uscitizen]

I have said all along that the USA would have benefitted more if the stimulus money was devided up and given to the citizens.

 

[Bill Angel]

If the fed loaned money at zero interest to Americans to buy electric automobiles, would the autos that they bought be manufactured in the USA or in Japan? Would the autos be produced by General Motors, or would they be Japanese models produced by Nissan or Toyota?

 

[loosecannon]

I'd like to say made in the USA!

 

[william the wie]

This idea needs some work. I think the question is worded wrong for your purposes, how about:

"What's the best way to use currency debasement to grow the US economy?"

 

[loosecannon]

This idea needs some work. I think the question is worded wrong for your purposes, how about:

"What's the best way to use currency debasement to grow the US economy?"

only because the operative question these days is how to create jobs, spark demand and reduce unemployment.

The secret to fixing the economy is simple, full employment, managable wage stability.

But you are right the key is how to use debasement money to do that.

Debasement is a printing press. So why not send that money where it will do some good instead of using it to buy other currencies? Or 10 year bonds etc.

 

[loosecannon]

JP Morgan just weighed in with their own version of the same:

J.P. Morgan’s $1.5 Trillion Bailout of America
By ROBERT LENZNER

The $1.5 trillion plan according to J.P. Morgan Private Bank is entitled ” By Any Means Necessary,”– a quote from Malcolm X. (inappropriate) the radical Afro-American leader assassinated in Harlem many years ago.

* Fed buys $1.5 trillion long term Treasuries and FNMA, agency debt; ($100 billion a month) This means Fed balance sheet balloons once more to nearly $4 trillion

*This QE (quantitative easing) encourages investors to increase common stock holdings which pushed up stock market. (seems a pipe dream)

*Another 1% drop in mortgage rates to under 3% would enable 90% all mortgages to be refinanced-.

*This boosts disposable income by tens of billions a year.

*Bails out the 40% all mortgages that are underwater.(if banks willing to extend the credit, doubtful at the moment)

* Extend the Bush tax cuts permanently for middle class in exchange for 1-2 year extension tax cuts for the wealthy. This would prevent drag on disposable income of about $100 billion a year.

J.P. Morgan’s opinion of this “ALL-IN” game; “it might work, but if it doesn’t, you’ve got a problem…. A debasement of cash, government bonds and the dollar, as well as further erosion of U.S. public sector finances via high deficits, is not the way we wanted to get there.”

This pipe dream is out of frustration by a Wall Street that has seen; caused by

1. outflows by retail investors from US equity mutual funds for 19 of the past 20 weeks.

2.lowest equity weights pension funds since the mid 1990s

JP MORGAN Private Bank Holdings”

34% US and emerging market stocks

16% cash and bonds, private and public

50% commodities including gold, commercial real estate, hedge funds

J.P. Morgan’s $1.5 Trillion Bailout of America - Robert Lenzner - The Bottom Line - Forbes

I liked my plan better! Fuck the banks, bypass the banks and lend direct to citizens! They won't lend, they are most of the problem. They can't even manage the paperwork.

 

[Neubarth]

Because of our present treaties, our government can not offer a stimulus to the American people unless we are ensuring that it can be used to buy foreign product also.

Elect me President, and I will declare all treaties null and void. If Congress disagrees, I will declare Congress to be null and void. If the Supreme court disagrees, they will also be declared Null and Void.

Probably a good idea not to elect me.

 

[Dis]

Because of our present treaties, our government can not offer a stimulus to the American people unless we are ensuring that it can be used to buy foreign product also.

Elect me President, and I will declare all treaties null and void. If Congress disagrees, I will declare Congress to be null and void. If the Supreme court disagrees, they will also be declared Null and Void.

Probably a good idea not to elect me.

Well, at least you've put some friggen clothes on, thank God.

 

[Paulie]

This idea needs some work. I think the question is worded wrong for your purposes, how about:

"What's the best way to use currency debasement to grow the US economy?"

only because the operative question these days is how to create jobs, spark demand and reduce unemployment.

The secret to fixing the economy is simple, full employment, managable wage stability.

But you are right the key is how to use debasement money to do that.

Debasement is a printing press. So why not send that money where it will do some good instead of using it to buy other currencies? Or 10 year bonds etc.

Because the Fed doesn't give a fucking horse's nutsack about the citizens.

I hope you realize that.

 

[Neubarth]

Because of our present treaties, our government can not offer a stimulus to the American people unless we are ensuring that it can be used to buy foreign product also.

Elect me President, and I will declare all treaties null and void. If Congress disagrees, I will declare Congress to be null and void. If the Supreme court disagrees, they will also be declared Null and Void.

Probably a good idea not to elect me.

Well, at least you've put some friggen clothes on, thank God.

I had clothes on. Now, if you wanted to see me without clothes on, come on down to the Padres Nudist Cheering Section. We do the Wave very well..... (We are right behind the catcher who is a homophobe and really seems paranoid that we might attack him.)

 

[Neubarth]

Because the Fed doesn't give a fucking horse's nutsack about the citizens.

I hope you realize that.

The FED's charter is to serve the Government of the United States. That is the reason why it is the Greatest imaginary bank in the history of the world. We (The People) can borrow infinitely from them without ever having to pay the interest on the debt. Hence, the money is totally free.

Uneducated Foolish Ignoramuses like you will never understand why it is free, but it is.

 

[loosecannon]

We (The People) can borrow infinitely from them without ever having to pay the interest on the debt. Hence, the money is totally free.

gobbledegook

 

[Paulie]

We (The People) can borrow infinitely from them without ever having to pay the interest on the debt. Hence, the money is totally free.

gobbledegook

You'd be smart not to listen to Neubarth about Federal Reserve matters. He's proven himself retarded on that issue many times over around here.

 

[loosecannon]

This idea needs some work. I think the question is worded wrong for your purposes, how about:

"What's the best way to use currency debasement to grow the US economy?"

only because the operative question these days is how to create jobs, spark demand and reduce unemployment.

The secret to fixing the economy is simple, full employment, managable wage stability.

But you are right the key is how to use debasement money to do that.

Debasement is a printing press. So why not send that money where it will do some good instead of using it to buy other currencies? Or 10 year bonds etc.

Because the Fed doesn't give a fucking horse's nutsack about the citizens.

I hope you realize that.

During the 1970s the Federal Reserve Act was amended to require the Board and the FOMC "to promote effectively the goals of maximum employment, stable prices, and moderate long-term interest rates" (Section 2A). Also in that decade the Act was amended so that the member governor (who each have 14 year terms ending every two years) selected by the President to be Chairman would have a four year term as such and be confirmed by the Senate (Section 10), and to appear before Congress at semi-annual hearings to report on the conduct of monetary policy, on economic development, and on the prospects for the future (Section 2B).

The Federal Reserve Act has been amended by some 200 subsequent laws of Congress, and continues to be one of the principal banking laws of the United States.

Federal Reserve Act - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Paulie]

only because the operative question these days is how to create jobs, spark demand and reduce unemployment.

The secret to fixing the economy is simple, full employment, managable wage stability.

But you are right the key is how to use debasement money to do that.

Debasement is a printing press. So why not send that money where it will do some good instead of using it to buy other currencies? Or 10 year bonds etc.

Because the Fed doesn't give a fucking horse's nutsack about the citizens.

I hope you realize that.

During the 1970s the Federal Reserve Act was amended to require the Board and the FOMC "to promote effectively the goals of maximum employment, stable prices, and moderate long-term interest rates" (Section 2A). Also in that decade the Act was amended so that the member governor (who each have 14 year terms ending every two years) selected by the President to be Chairman would have a four year term as such and be confirmed by the Senate (Section 10), and to appear before Congress at semi-annual hearings to report on the conduct of monetary policy, on economic development, and on the prospects for the future (Section 2B).

The Federal Reserve Act has been amended by some 200 subsequent laws of Congress, and continues to be one of the principal banking laws of the United States.

Federal Reserve Act - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Oh, well I'M sold

 

[Neubarth]

We (The People) can borrow infinitely from them without ever having to pay the interest on the debt. Hence, the money is totally free.

gobbledegook

Why do you always pretend to be stupid? We effectively do not pay interest on the bonds and notes the FED owns. If we do not pay interest, dufus, what is the effective interest rate.

I have explained this on this forum a hundred times and still you low IQ idiots do not understand. The FED is what has made the United States great. If we actually had to borrow that money from a foreign bank, we would have to pay interest. What is the difference on not having to pay interest on Seven Trillion dollars and having to pay Six Percent interest on Seven Trillion Dollars. Can you do the math, or are you too stupid?

 

[Neubarth]

7 Trillion Dollars = $7,000,000,000,000 times 1% = $70,000,000,000 = 70 Billion Dollars.

7 Trillion Dollars = $7,000,000,000,000 times 0% = $0.00 = Nothing = Zip = Nada = Nothing!


Now, Dufus, what happens if we have the FED buy that 7 Trilllion that we are paying interest on? That is right, we are paying ZERO Interest on 14 Trillion Dollars.

If you are paying ZERO interest how long before you can not afford to make the interest payments when you owe nothing?

Now, if the President orders the FED to destroy all of those bonds, how much money do we owe to the FED? If we owe nothing, do we have to pay it back? The FED got the money out of nowhere and to nowhere the debt can be cast.

 

[loosecannon]

we pay interest on our debt at the rate of T bonds yields.

Feel free to believe that we aren't servicing our debt if you wish.

 

[loosecannon]

Oh, well I'M sold

I knew you would be.