EMDrive works? What is it and why is it going to change the world?

[2aguy]

So..I just saw this article on the EMdrive...and apparently it is revolutionary...and it working is unexpected in the scientific community....

So...science types....why is this important and how does it change the world....explain it to a non science types in a way that doesn't confuse us....

Leaked NASA Paper Shows the 'Impossible' EM Drive Really Does Work

The results of NASA's tests on the 'impossible' EM Drive have been leaked, and they reveal that the controversial propulsion system really does work, and is capable of generating impressive thrust in a vacuum, even after error measurements have been accounted for.

The EM Drive has made headlines over the past year, because it offers the incredible possibility of a fuel-free propulsion system that could potentially get us to Mars in just 70 days. But there's one major problem: according to the current laws of physics, it shouldn't work.

 

[2aguy]

i often thought that our energy problems would r ach the next level by means of something no one had thought of...is this it...?

 

[waltky]

If it works inna vacuum...

... it oughta work in space.

 

[JoeMoma]

Sounds like science fiction to me. Will skeptically await more information.

 

[emilynghiem]

Hey 2aguy If it works, maybe we can use that to send all crazed Trump Voters to Mars, all Obama voters to Venus, all Clintonites to Pluto.

The Greens can stay and clean up planet Earth. While all the crazies can move to the moon or their own planets who'd rather "fight politically over global warming and carbon credits" instead of actually reducing pollution and investing in cleaner energy and efficiency.

The Libertarians can take over Australia, the Communists can move to China and Socialists to Russia.

BLM can take back Africa.

We will all have plenty of work to do, by delegating to like minded groups, and won't have time or resources to waste fighting when we are too busy developing our own means of effective self govt organized group by group.

So how long do we have before we can send whole groups to other planets? ??
How much fundraising will it take?
Is there a gofundme page for this??

 

[Andylusion]

NASA has a history of providing excellent research in key high-funded areas, and producing crap, in the 'side show' areas.

So while I would not doubt the hard work of their core research, and the validity of their conclusion... this is more of the side show.

NASA has the same cancer spreading through it, that the rest of the scientific community in America does.... namely the money incentive. Research that doesn't show a result, isn't funded by government grants. Just like research that doesn't show a man-made climate change effect isn't funded. Those that do, are funded.

This makes me hesitant to give validity to, until it's proven more widely.

In evaluating the fundamental science behind the claim of the paper.... nearly everything I read, violated fundamental laws of physics. They attempt to side-step this issue, by diving into quantum physics, which is inherently more nebulous.

However, even there, the use of quantum physics doesn't conform to the conventional understanding of how it works.

This again makes me hesitate, because it's like Bernie Madoff and people saying it's unlikely he can guarantee 10% returns year over year, and having people say "but he's proven it on paper!".

If it seems to violate everything you know, then it likely isn't true.

To add insult to the injury, the paper isn't verified, and most certainly is not peer-reviewed. The data has not been released for validation, and no one outside of NASA has examined anything.

Additionally the paper itself doesn't show any review process internal to NASA.

If that isn't enough, there have been a number of well-funded tests, to attempt the exact same results, based on exactly the process outlined in this paper. All of them showed nothing. Absolutely nothing.

So my advice, I would avoid jumping to the conclusion that this is now proven science. It could be.... it might be.... and it may also be junk.

All that said.... if we assumed everything was true, hypothetically what does it mean for us...

Answer.... Nothing.

What a let down, huh? I was looking at the amount of power output from this 'engine', and the result was horrific.

A 70 horse power Honda Civic, produces 100 Newtons of force. This paper showed they created 1.2 millinewtons, or 0.0012 Newtons of thrust. That's not enough to blow a sheet of paper off your desk.

Moreover, while the 'engine' in the paper doesn't consume fuel, like rocket fuel... it does require power.

The amount of power required to produce that tiny thrust, was 1 kilowatt. To put that in perspective, the average home used 30 kilowatts of power each day, last year.

We're talking a ton of power, to produce an almost undetectable amount of thrust.

In order to get this engine to produce the same amount of thrust as one 1.6 liter Honda Civic, it would require an 84 MegaWatt power plant, dedicated to powering this one engine.

To have enough power to equal a nice car, would require a nuclear power plant.

Now of course this isn't nearly as much of a problem when this is attached to a space vehicle, which doesn't have gravity and wind resistance slowing it down. Even then, in order to get a space ship large enough for even a single human, to move fast enough to make interplanetary travel practical, it would still take millions of kilowatts of power. The Tesla automobile, has a 100 kWh battery. That wouldn't produce enough power to get you out of Earth's orbit.

Short of another break through, this is not going to be practical for anything any time soon.

And of course, it will have zero application to civilian life. The amount of electricity we use in a day, would end up being how much we use in a minute, trying adapt this technology to civilian use.

If it turns out to be true, perhaps in 50 to 100 years, we'll have something to talk about. Right now, it's geeky and interesting, but more of a circus side show, than anything useful today.

 

[xband]

So..I just saw this article on the EMdrive...and apparently it is revolutionary...and it working is unexpected in the scientific community....

So...science types....why is this important and how does it change the world....explain it to a non science types in a way that doesn't confuse us....

Leaked NASA Paper Shows the 'Impossible' EM Drive Really Does Work

The results of NASA's tests on the 'impossible' EM Drive have been leaked, and they reveal that the controversial propulsion system really does work, and is capable of generating impressive thrust in a vacuum, even after error measurements have been accounted for.

The EM Drive has made headlines over the past year, because it offers the incredible possibility of a fuel-free propulsion system that could potentially get us to Mars in just 70 days. But there's one major problem: according to the current laws of physics, it shouldn't work.

EM Drives won't change the world and will have no impact for motion devices. The magnetron is the key part of an EM Drive and a magnetron produces massless microwave photons. The second key feature of an EM Drive is a cone. Some 'scientists' have claimed to measure one nano-Newton from an EM Drive but that violates Conservation of Energy.

 

[Old Rocks]

Kinda like cold fusion. Too much talk before any real research.

 

[westwall]

Here's the paper if you want to read it for yourselves.

Q-Thruster In-Vacuum Fall 2015 Test Report.pdf

 

[Damaged Eagle]

It has to be operating at the quantum level to obtain the type of physical reaction without ejecting reactive mass.

If so it might be a long time before we have a thorough explanation.

*****CHUCKLE*****

 

[Damaged Eagle]

Abstract


A new principle of electric propulsion for spacecraft is introduced, using microwave technology to achieve direct conversion of d.c. power to thrust without the need for propellant.


A simplified illustrative description of the principles of operation is given, followed by the derivation, from first principles, of an equation for the thrust from such a device. The implications of the law of conservation of energy are examined for both static and dynamic operation of the device. A summary of the experimental work, that has been carried out to verify the theory, is then given...

https://www.newscientist.com/data/images/ns/av/shawyertheory.pdf

^^^^^Interesting article. Well worth review.^^^^^

*****CHUCKLE*****

 

[Damaged Eagle]

So..I just saw this article on the EMdrive...and apparently it is revolutionary...and it working is unexpected in the scientific community....

So...science types....why is this important and how does it change the world....explain it to a non science types in a way that doesn't confuse us....

Leaked NASA Paper Shows the 'Impossible' EM Drive Really Does Work

The results of NASA's tests on the 'impossible' EM Drive have been leaked, and they reveal that the controversial propulsion system really does work, and is capable of generating impressive thrust in a vacuum, even after error measurements have been accounted for.

The EM Drive has made headlines over the past year, because it offers the incredible possibility of a fuel-free propulsion system that could potentially get us to Mars in just 70 days. But there's one major problem: according to the current laws of physics, it shouldn't work.

FYI. There are a few other advances in physics that are at the theoretical level and being tested, or contemplated for feasibility, at this time...

Alcubierre drive

*****SMILE*****