desantis says some slaves may have been taught to be a blacksmith...a good thing!

[forkup]

Did you read the curriculum outline? It traces the change in slaves form being de facto beasts of burden to learning valuable skills. The benefit was to the owners of the slaves, imo. Once slavery was abolished, the skills belonged to the former slaves. This fact doesn't justify slavery or claim it is a good institution. It is just an relevant consideration in the rebuilding of lives post slavery.

I actually did. I tend to read-up when things like this break into the public discussion, because outrage sometimes clouds judgements. So, I know that the curriculum itself, does not portray slavery as a "good thing".

The point to me is that what you call a "relevant consideration" is first off not all that relevant IMO. After emancipation slaves were just as capable of picking up skills so I'm hazy as to why you would tie attaining skills to slavery. Second, I don't think that an average 12 year-old ( I say average because of course there are exceptions) is mature enough to fully grasp the nuances of something being both horrendous and somehow still to the benefit of the victims. Third, and this is something I know because I'm a history buff. "Educating the uncivilized" being it Aztecs, Colonial Indians, or in this case black slaves in the US have been used as a justification for doing the oppressing since the dawn of time. No matter what context provided, it makes me very uneasy as a part of any lesson plan.

 

[JimH52]

Only to people with defective logic circuits.

Go ahead and vote for him. It is your board now.

 

[pknopp]

She took a tiny, tiny mention out of the entire curriculum........so she essentially lied about what the curriculum teaches.......

This is a brazen lie. It’s an astonishing lie. It’s an evil lie. It is so untrue — so deliberately and cynically misleading — that, in a sensible political culture, Harris would be obligated to issue an apology. Instead, NBC confirms that she will repeat the lie today during a speech in Jacksonville.
---
I have been trying to work out how best to illustrate the sheer scale of Harris’s falsehood, and I’ve come to the conclusion that the only way to achieve it is to list in one place all the relevant parts of the course about which she is complaining. So, below, I have copied and pasted every single reference to slavery, slaves, abolitionism, civil rights, and African Americans that is in the document. For those interested, the full curriculum (along with the curriculum for the teaching of the Holocaust) is here.
------
There is simply no way of perusing this course and concluding that it “gaslights” people or whitewashes slavery. Among many, many other things, it includes sections on “the conditions for Africans during their passage to America”; “the living conditions of slaves in British North American colonies, the Caribbean, Central America and South America, including infant mortality rates”; “the harsh conditions and their consequences on British American plantations (e.g., undernourishment, climate conditions, infant and child mortality rates of the enslaved vs. the free)”; “the harsh conditions in the Caribbean plantations (i.e., poor nutrition, rigorous labor, disease)”; “how the South tried to prevent slaves from escaping and their efforts to end the Underground Railroad”; the “overwhelming death rates” caused by the practice; the many ways in which “Africans resisted slavery”; “the ramifications of prejudice, racism and stereotyping on individual freedoms”; and “the struggles faced by African American women in the 19th century as it relates to issues of suffrage, business and access to education.” Many of these modules apply to Florida specifically.

Here’s the list. It’s 191 items strong. It contains the word “slave” 96 times, “slaves” 23 times, and “slavery” 45 times. I’ve pulled each line out in the order in which they appear, which is largely chronological. It starts with “the earliest slaves” and ends with “the integration of the University of Florida”:

http://[URL='https://www.nationalre...enly-lying-about-floridas-slavery-curriculum/

[/URL]

What she said is factual and a pretty disgusting thing to be teaching kids.

 

[pknopp]

And now the truth....

As its full text confirms, the program establishes “the harsh conditions and their consequences on British American plantations (e.g., undernourishment, climate conditions, infant and child mortality rates of the enslaved vs. the free)”; highlights “the harsh conditions in the Caribbean plantations (i.e., poor nutrition, rigorous labor, disease)”; notes the “overwhelming death rates” that were caused by the practice; records that there were many ways in which “Africans resisted slavery”; and reports that Florida, like the entire “South[,] tried to prevent slaves from escaping.” There is not a person in America who, when trying to convince children that a given practice was good, lists “harsh conditions,” “undernourishment,” “mortality,” “poor nutrition,” “disease,” or “overwhelming death rates” as its consequences. The idea is absurd.

Asked why the course contains the one line that has been cherry-picked by critics, one of its architects, Professor William B. Allen — a black man who was born into segregation in Florida — offered up an observation that, in any other context, would be unobjectionable: While America’s millions of slaves were most certainly victims of the most abhorrent violence, domination, sexual assault, and more, they were not onlyvictims, but people. Is this controversial now? At Oxford, I had a professor who liked to say that “Abraham Lincoln wasn’t the only man alive who had agency, you know.” His exhortation — always — was to remember that, however subjugated a man might be, he remained an individual rather than an automaton, and that to acknowledge that is not to endorse the disastrous circumstances in which he has been forced to struggle, but to recognize his humanity.

The War on Context Comes for Florida’s History Curriculum | National Review

Led by Vice President Harris, an army of dissimulators is making a hash both of the historical record and of what the state is actually teaching.

www.nationalreview.com

Trying to deflect guilt,

As its full text confirms, the program establishes “the harsh conditions and their consequences on British American plantations

No, they were American Plantations.

 

[boedicca]

I actually did. I tend to read-up when things like this break into the public discussion, because outrage sometimes clouds judgements. So, I know that the curriculum itself, does not portray slavery as a "good thing".

The point to me is that what you call a "relevant consideration" is first off not all that relevant IMO. After emancipation slaves were just as capable of picking up skills so I'm hazy as to why you would tie attaining skills to slavery. Second, I don't think that an average 12 year-old ( I say average because of course there are exceptions) is mature enough to fully grasp the nuances of something being both horrendous and somehow still to the benefit of the victims. Third, and this is something I know because I'm a history buff. "Educating the uncivilized" being it Aztecs, Colonial Indians, or in this case black slaves in the US have been used as a justification for doing the oppressing since the dawn of time. No matter what context provided, it makes me very uneasy as a part of any lesson plan.

We'll have to agree to disagree. The fact that slaves were not all "beasts of burden" is relevant to what happened when they were freed.

 

[OKTexas]

DeSantis says Black people benefited from slavery by learning skills like 'being a blacksmith'

Ron DeSantis defended Florida's new curriculum teaching about the benefits of slavery, saying students will probably learn slaves were blacksmiths.

www.businessinsider.com

Of course, he may have lost his children when they were sold to another plantation master? But at least he was taught a trade that kept him happy...when he wasn't thinking about the children he lost. But, he should be happy that he can now shoe a horse and stoke a bellows to keep the fire going.

When are you motherfuckers going to stop lying. First DeSantis didn't include that one item in more than 200 items included in the curriculum, that was done by a panel of black academics. Second it is a historical FACT! But hey, facts never stopped you fucking commies from cherry picking .5% of anything and propagandizing it to keep the country divided. FOAD ya commie bitch.

.

 

[boedicca]

Go ahead and vote for him. It is your board now.

What a non sequitur.

Here's the truth, if you care to open whatever you substitute for a functioning mind:

 

[busybee01]

I'm always here to help educate the goldfish.

Who is Dr. William B. Allen? He's taking on Kamala Harris over Florida Black history curriculum

Who is William B. Allen and how did he play a part in approving the new controversial African American history curriculum for Florida?

www.jacksonville.com

Goldfish are smarter than you.

 

[busybee01]

This story was totally debunked yesterday.

That’s not what DeSantis ever said.

The material was written and approved by a black scholar. He said the slaves learned skills and used them, never that slavery was good.

Yet another hit piece by the lying left.

That is very clearly the implication. There was nothing beneficial about slavery.

 

[busybee01]

When are you motherfuckers going to stop lying. First DeSantis didn't include that one item in more than 200 items included in the curriculum, that was done by a panel of black academics. Second it is a historical FACT! But hey, facts never stopped you fucking commies from cherry picking .5% of anything and propagandizing it to keep the country divided. FOAD ya commie bitch.

.

“The attempt to feature the personal benefits of slavery is wrong & needs to be adjusted,” Rep. Byron Donalds (R-Fla.), a sophomore Republican and former state representative, wrote in a tweet on Wednesday.

MSN

Is he lying? He is a radical rightwinger.

 

[JimH52]

What a non sequitur.

Here's the truth, if you care to open whatever you substitute for a functioning mind:

Let's look at the real purpose of the curriculum. Gotta assure the hite middle school parents that their kids are not guilty due to their racist ancestors. That is the objective of little Ronnie.

 

[boedicca]

Let's look at the real purpose of the curriculum. Gotta assure the hite middle school parents that their kids are not guilty due to their racist ancestors. That is the objective of little Ronnie.

Only in your feverish lower brain steam, bub.

 

[JimH52]

Only in your feverish lower brain steam, bub.

Go get off on your trumpy bear.

 

[forkup]

We'll have to agree to disagree. The fact that slaves were not all "beasts of burden" is relevant to what happened when they were freed.

They were all "beast of burden" just what "burden" they were required to carry by their masters changed.

This is the problem with this discussion. Especially when conducting it in middle school like it is intended to. You are now trying to argue that slavery didn't cause everybody to become a beast of burden, something that is a defense of the institution of slavery.

As for it being relevant. That is an argument stating that slavery gave them useful skills. The implication being that those skills wouldn't have been available to them without slavery.

I know that this is probably not what you mean to say but it is what you're saying.

 

[BothWings]

Pro Slavery
Pro Poootin
Pro Trump

Makes sense to me!

Good Nazi. Good. Such an easy sell. Repeat that Democrat mantra once more.

Seig!?

 

[OKTexas]

“The attempt to feature the personal benefits of slavery is wrong & needs to be adjusted,” Rep. Byron Donalds (R-Fla.), a sophomore Republican and former state representative, wrote in a tweet on Wednesday.

MSN

Is he lying? He is a radical rightwinger.

Nope, just mistaken and uninformed. He needs to speak with the black academics that developed the curriculum or at least watch the interviews they've participated in. In the interview I saw, the guy (I can't remember his name), pointed out many became skilled cobblers, tailors, blacksmiths and much more. Many slaves were also taught to read, Fredrick Douglas being one of the most notable.

But hey, if you commies actually bothered to read the complete curriculum you know that slavery is taught accurately and completely in FL schools.

.

 

[OKTexas]

Let's look at the real purpose of the curriculum. Gotta assure the hite middle school parents that their kids are not guilty due to their racist ancestors. That is the objective of little Ronnie.

Once again, ya fucking idiot, DeSantis didn't write the curriculum. And why would the kids feel guilty about what their ancestors might have done. The vast majority of those ancestors never owned a slave, and even if they did, in this country, corruption by blood is unconstitutional. So I repeat myself, take your commie propaganda and shove it.

.

 

[OKTexas]

They were all "beast of burden" just what "burden" they were required to carry by their masters changed.

This is the problem with this discussion. Especially when conducting it in middle school like it is intended to. You are now trying to argue that slavery didn't cause everybody to become a beast of burden, something that is a defense of the institution of slavery.

As for it being relevant. That is an argument stating that slavery gave them useful skills. The implication being that those skills wouldn't have been available to them without slavery.

I know that this is probably not what you mean to say but it is what you're saying.

Hey dumb ass, they wouldn't have been here, how many of those skills were available in the African bush?

.

 

[Arlette]

Hey dumb ass, they wouldn't have been here, how many of those skills were available in the African bush?

.

If a skill wasn't learned in the African bush then it was a skill unnecessary for survival in the African bush.

Like, seal hunting skills are good for where there are seals, but not really anywhere else.

 

[OKTexas]

If a skill wasn't learned in the African bush then it was a skill unnecessary for survival in the African bush.

Like, seal hunting skills are good for where there are seals, but not really anywhere else.

And your point would be....

.