China to land first moon probe: state media

[daveman]

originally posted by daveman
43 years and 12 days since the united states landed men on the moon.

The United States of Germany

Wernher Magnus Maximilian, Freiherr von Braun.

German-born rocket scientist, one of the leading figures in the development of rocket technology in Nazi Germany during World War II and, subsequently, the United States.

Wernher von Braun and his team of german rocket scientists in the fall of 1959. At the time, von Braun and his associates worked for the Army Ballistic Missile Agency in Huntsville, Alabama.​

List of German rocket scientists in the United States

Rudolph 'Rolf' Ammann
Rudi Beichel [4]
Werner Dahm [5]
Konrad Dannenberg
Kurt H. Debus
Casper van Diën
Ernst R. G. Eckert
Krafft Arnold Ehricke
Ernst Geissler
Dieter Grau
Walter Häussermann
Karl Heimburg
Otto Hirschler[6]
Helmut Hoelzer
Hans Hueter
Wilhelm Jungert
Georg ("George") Emil Knausenberger [7]
Heinz-Hermann Koelle
Hermann H. Kurzweg [8]
Hans Maus
Fritz Mueller [9]
Willy Mrazek
Erich W. Neubert
Theodor A. Poppel
Eberhard Rees
Gerhard Reisig [10]
Georg Rickhey[11]
Werner Rosinski [12]
Ludwig Roth
Arthur Rudolph
Harry Ruppe
Friedrich von Saurma
August Schulze
Walter Schwidetzky
Ernst Stuhlinger
Bernhard Tessmann
Adolf Thiel
Wernher von Braun
Albert Zeiler
Theodor Karl Otto Vowe
Georg von Tiesenhausen

Walter Dornberger
Hermann Oberth
Jesco von Puttkamer
Guenter Wendt

List of German rocket scientists in the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

That's not the German flag, Skippy.

 

[daveman]

Just curious: How many of you who are cheering on the Chinese laughed at Gingrich for calling for the development of a lunar colony?

 

[ScienceRocks]

Just curious: How many of you who are cheering on the Chinese laughed at Gingrich for calling for the development of a lunar colony?

I was a huge supporter of Gingrich and his plan. It makes logical sense as small steps assure that we stay in space this time...A small step would be developing a ferry that can cheaply go back and forth from the moon and building an outpost there. As cheaply and economically as possible is part of the reasoning. Mars will be the same thing as the moon landing if not.

Now Russia, China and possibly India are planning to send men to the moon within the next 10-12 years. We're losing our advantage.

I'm rooting for China because at least someone has the Nads to do the do.

 

[Moonglow]

We gave it up and didn't develop the resources as any intelligent nation would of. Now countries like China and Russia are going to take that next step. Who cares if we had a photo op 43 years ago. LOL.


Knowing China they will be mining it within 15 years. Once that occurs we will be number two within a few years.

What resources is that?

Titanium On The Moon: Resources To Spark New Space Race?
Titanium On The Moon: Resources To Spark New Space Race? | HULIQ

Titanium has been discovered on the moon in abundance. Since it is a rare element on Earth, lighter and more durable than steel, could the demand for it possibly spark a renewed interest in getting to and even establishing bases on the moon?


Some insist that there should be a reason -- or several reasons -- to spend millions upon millions of dollars to send men to the moon other than to simply explore, plant a flag, and claim that it had been done. According to AFP, findings from data captured by the US Lunar Reconnaissance Orbiter and presented at an international conference in Nantes, France, may have presented governments good reason to fund further space exploration and lunar trips: Titanium.

Titanium, which is stronger and lighter than steel, making it a more desirable -- and more expensive -- construction metal, has been discovered in abundance on the moon. Using data gathered from moon rocks brought back by Apollo 17 in 1972, scientists knew what to look for on the lunar surface. By scanning the moon's surface in seven different wavelengths, the Orbiter was able to send back data that was poured over in search of variations from ultra-violet to visible light. Such jumps in the data allowed scientists to see a colorful picture of the moon, red in some places, blue in others.

“Although subtle, these colour variations tell us important things about the chemistry and evolution of the lunar surface," Mark Robinson of Arizona State University explained. He, along with Brett Denevi of Johns Hopkins University in Baltimore, presented the results of their work sifting through the data gathered by the Orbiter. "They indicate the titanium and iron abundance, as well as the maturity of a lunar soil.”

Titanium is rare on Earth, which makes it even more expensive given the demand for it.

The find undoubtedly generates hope of obtaining funding for further expeditions to the moon, especially for NASA, whose manned space exploratory program has been put on hold due to economic conditions and the grounding of space shuttle fleet, which saw its last mission in July. Coupled with the discovery of water in the form of ice on the lunar surface in 2009, the viability of space stations and/or lunar bases on the moon became more than just a far-off dream hampered by the logistics of supplying water to those manning the outposts. Finding a resource much in demand on Earth -- and apparently in abundance on the moon -- might have provided economic incentive as well.

Robinson noted: “Future miners living and working on the Moon could break down ilmenite" -- the compound made up of titanium, iron, and oxygen within which titanium is generally found -- "to liberate these elements."

“In addition," he said, "Apollo data shows that titanium-rich minerals are more efficient at retaining particles from the solar wind, such as helium and hydrogen. These gases would also provide a vital resource for future human inhabitants of lunar colonies.”

Helium, it was announced last year, is a non-renewable gas that is fast reaching a point of depletion on Earth where it will soon become virtually nonexistent.

Sending astronauts to the moon for bragging rights may be a thing of the past and a more practical approach to extending America's reach further out into the Solar System might be necessary to justify expenditures of the kind space exploration demands. In that regard, presenting exploration as an adjunct of operations -- such as mining -- geared toward economic gain, industrial advancement, and/or of benefit to Earth (or America) in some way could be what reenergizes the now dormant American manned space program.

Like the lure of gold brought miners to California and Alaska and silver brought them to Nevada, titanium could see competing mining expeditions headed to the moon. Corporations as well as nations might entertain the idea of staking claims and setting up mining operations. Where the sense of wonder and exploring for exploring's sake might not work, the demand for an element so rare and durable just might be what sparks a new space race.

Titanium On The Moon: Resources To Spark New Space Race? | HULIQ

Believe me, I think exploring and scientific research is far better than spending trillions of dollars in a third world shit hole spilling the blood of our sons...But this is topping on the cake.

Well I believe that also, which is why Obama wants commercial interests to mine the moon and not the US govt.

 

[Moonglow]

I was fortunate in the Army to attend the USMMSC in Huntsville, Alabama. Home of the rocket race where Von Braun developed the US missle program. The Space Camp was there until moved and as a military member we got to go for free. It was great to be part of the TOW/Dragon missle sytems tech. division.

 

[Sallow]

China returning humankind to the moon is exciting. I look forward to their success in this endeavor.

Hopefully SOMEONE puts a base on the Moon.

 

[Sallow]

We are way late!!

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EMEZuaguuCU&noredirect=1]Space 1999 Intro - YouTube[/ame]

 

[daveman]

Just curious: How many of you who are cheering on the Chinese laughed at Gingrich for calling for the development of a lunar colony?

I was a huge supporter of Gingrich and his plan. It makes logical sense as small steps assure that we stay in space this time...A small step would be developing a ferry that can cheaply go back and forth from the moon and building an outpost there. As cheaply and economically as possible is part of the reasoning. Mars will be the same thing as the moon landing if not.

Now Russia, China and possibly India are planning to send men to the moon within the next 10-12 years. We're losing our advantage.

I'm rooting for China because at least someone has the Nads to do the do.

And I agree with all that. But Obama has decided our space agency is supposed to be a community service organization aimed at Muslims.

 

[hortysir]

True. True. Besides, the thought of staying at a hotel on the moon before the end of my lifetime. Goodness. And you know the Chinese....they will do it.

According to my old middle school science teacher we should have already colonized the moon by now

 

[ScienceRocks]

True. True. Besides, the thought of staying at a hotel on the moon before the end of my lifetime. Goodness. And you know the Chinese....they will do it.

According to my old middle school science teacher we should have already colonized the moon by now

The only reason we didn't is we don't have the WILL. Wouldn't surprise me that 15 years from now that happens, but it is full of Chinese.

 

[Moonglow]

NASA decided that a re-entry vehicle was needed to build a space station. Now NASA has plans for a new shuttle type craft that will carry heavy payloads and have re-entry capability. I can't understand why you would want the US to try and mine the Moon, it is just not feasable, can you imagine re-entry into the atmosphere carrying a 200 tone payload?

 

[Moonglow]

True. True. Besides, the thought of staying at a hotel on the moon before the end of my lifetime. Goodness. And you know the Chinese....they will do it.

According to my old middle school science teacher we should have already colonized the moon by now

where is my flying car?

 

[ScienceRocks]

NASA decided that a re-entry vehicle was needed to build a space station. Now NASA has plans for a new shuttle type craft that will carry heavy payloads and have re-entry capability. I can't understand why you would want the US to try and mine the Moon, it is just not feasable, can you imagine re-entry into the atmosphere carrying a 200 tone payload?

Well, if private corporations are going to mine the Asteroids. We're certainly going to have to figure that one out. Saturn 5 was 110 ton+ payload into space...We just have to figure out a system that can get material from orbit to the surface. You really don't know unless you try!

Sounds like something that is worth our time unlike the war in the middle east.

I'm happy that Obama is bringing back something like the Saturn 5. A idea that should of never been done away with.

 

[ScienceRocks]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skylon_(spacecraft)

Now this would make surface to orbit much more economical.

 

[hortysir]

True. True. Besides, the thought of staying at a hotel on the moon before the end of my lifetime. Goodness. And you know the Chinese....they will do it.

According to my old middle school science teacher we should have already colonized the moon by now

where is my flying car?

Right?!


She's probably dead by now or I'd find her and ask




Saw you talking about the re-entry vehicle.....

Did you see that dude's record-breaking free-fall dive the other day?
NASA was watching it closely to get some contingency ideas for our astronauts.

 

[ScienceRocks]

What would be cool is something like this to get into orbit. Reaction Engines A2 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Taking people up to a space ferry that has ion hall engines that can go back and forth from the moon.

Hall effect thruster - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ion_engines

Now within my mind this woud be the best way of doing it.

 

[daveman]

NASA decided that a re-entry vehicle was needed to build a space station. Now NASA has plans for a new shuttle type craft that will carry heavy payloads and have re-entry capability. I can't understand why you would want the US to try and mine the Moon, it is just not feasable, can you imagine re-entry into the atmosphere carrying a 200 tone payload?

You're right -- a reentry vehicle capable of carrying 200 tons is not practical.

But a mass driver is. It would be ideal for sending refined materials from the moon to Earth.

It was a central part of the Heinlein novel The Moon is a Harsh Mistress.

 

[ScienceRocks]

For moon ferry that can be turned into a mars mission ship! Of course this is only a general idea.

What I'm thinking of is a ion engine drive with enough space to carry about 30-50 people.

Another idea

or

 

[hortysir]

For moon ferry that can be turned into a mars mission ship! Of course this is only a general idea.

What I'm thinking of is a ion engine drive with enough space to carry about 30-50 people.

Another idea

or

Looks like TDM's toy box

 

[ScienceRocks]

For moon ferry that can be turned into a mars mission ship! Of course this is only a general idea.

What I'm thinking of is a ion engine drive with enough space to carry about 30-50 people.

Another idea

or

Looks like TDM's toy box

Hopefully our government starts getting interested in full scale toys just like these!