LEMON: So starting Tuesday in New York City, Dunkin Donuts will put the sugar in your coffee if it's a medium. But if your order large coffee, you have to put it in yourself.
OK, Jerry, I mean do you find this ridiculous?
JERRY DOYLE, SYNDICATED RADIO TALK SHOW HOST: I find it ridiculous that Mayor Bloomberg -- if you remember back in 2010, they put out the healthy heroin brochure. I think they spent like $35,000 for 70,000 brochures and there were 16 steps that they told you, you needed to take in order to be healthy when you're doing heroin. And Bloomberg said, look, if you're going to do certain things, you might as well do them as healthy as possible.
I would have to think the same would apply to a sugary beverage as it would to heroin or in reverse, don't do sugary beverages, don't do heroin. So I find it a little odd that the mayor decided to take a firm stand on soda and not heroin.
LEMON: David, listen, we know sugar isn't bad, we know that it's not bad for you. After all, your book is called "the nanny state." I mean, is the mayor looking out for us or for people who can't look out for themselves?
DAVID HARSANYI, EDITOR, HUMAN EVENTS: You know, I'm sure his intentions are good. But you know, first of all, they're ineffective laws. What they do though, they reflect how government thinks they have a right to involve themselves in your life in every aspect. So, it reflects something larger, I think, that's corroding our government because they are busy trying to tell us what to drink rather than taking care of real problems almost everywhere across the country.
LEMON: OK. Wendy, you're the human behavior --
WENDY WALSH, PSYCHOLOGIST: Can I get in there, Don?
LEMON: Yes.
WALSH: Ok.
LEMON: Maybe people need to be saved. Go ahead, Wendy.
WALSH: OK. Here's what you should know. In our anthropological past, there were some trace nutrients -- they were sugar, salt and fat. And we have an unfettered desire and craving for these things that many of us actually can't control.
But modern capitalist America has capitalized on that and made sure that they put large dose of that in everything they give us. So how can we be making free choice when we're addicted? We are addicted to everything from sex and gambling to salt, sugar and fat.
Unless, you think this is a nanny state, what this is, is finally consumer protection. Remember, we don't have socialism here. We have neo-capital - sorry, neo-futilism. We are about 20 grams --
(CROSSTALK)
LEMON: Who is that? I don't know if it was David or Jerry -- someone went -- who was that?
DOYLE: Both of us, I think.
HARSANYI: I think it was both of us.
LEMON: Go ahead, David, why?
HARSANYI: So, essentially what she's arguing is that you can coerce people now on any level because essentially we're addicted to everything, including sex. Well, if we are addicted to sex, as you just said, why don't we dictate promiscuity? Why are we allowed to do whatever we want in the bedroom? I mean, you know, there is no end to this. It's a slippery slope that has no end if we buy the idea that we can't control our choices and our behavior.
LEMON: Jerry --
WALSH: So, why not start somewhere?
LEMON: Before I let Jerry respond, I want to play devil's advocate here.
And Wendy, I'm going to be on your side here. A guy like Bloomberg, I mean maybe he's raising awareness. Remember Giuliani ten years ago, a lot of people thought the smoking ban went too far. Nowadays, a lot of New Yorkers seem to like it. So, maybe the soft drink thing, they'll like it and maybe will like the sugary -- maybe, they will like it and they'll realize this is good for me. I'm healthier now. Maybe their weight will go down and their health will get better.
Go ahead, Jerry.
DOYLE: It's I call the creeping incrementalism. It's easy to go after cigarettes, tobacco, gambling and drinking because that's the low-hanging fruit. But eventually they want to worm their way into every nook and cranny of your English muffin light.
Look. I smoke cigarette. It is really stupid. When you light something on fire and you breathe it in and your first reaction is to cough and shoot your eyeballs across the room it's probably not good for you. I pay a premium on my health insurance for that. I'm going to die sooner than I should. My life expectancy tables -- I actually cull myself from the herd and save the system money. It's my right to smoke a legal FDA-approved product. It's my right to drink soda. It's my right to eat fatty foods. It's my right to gamble. It's my right. It's my life. And if we start to take away the individual's ownership of their own lives, what, down the line, in creeping incrementalism does the government then say, they have the right to regulate?
LEMON: But, doesn't that affect other people? I mean.
WALSH: You guys are paranoid.
LEMON: Go ahead.
WALSH: Paranoid. OK. You are absolutely scared and paranoid. This is consumer protectionism. That's all this is.
DOYLE: Oh, come on.
WALSH: Let's protect children. Let's make sure that if you give a McDonald's toy, that there's enough vegetables and fruit in there. Let's figure out what are the reward systems that are biology craves and let's be careful that it's not exploited by corporations. That's all.
