classic example of an electorate voting with their emotions

[thereisnospoon]

N.J. voters approve increasing minimum wage - NorthJersey.com
Not only did the voters hwo bothered to turn out ( less than 20% of registered voters) use their brains when they voted for this, they are now stuck with it as the election was to add this to the State Constitution. So if there is ever hyperinflation like there was during the Nixon and Carter years, the min wage will skyrocket. This will put small businesses at a huge disadvantage. Makes me glad I have left NJ, never to return.
Oh I cannot wait. On my yearly visit to a bakery I used to patronize, instead of the two dozen Italian cookies being $12 it will be $18...

 

[auditor0007]

N.J. voters approve increasing minimum wage - NorthJersey.com
Not only did the voters hwo bothered to turn out ( less than 20% of registered voters) use their brains when they voted for this, they are now stuck with it as the election was to add this to the State Constitution. So if there is ever hyperinflation like there was during the Nixon and Carter years, the min wage will skyrocket. This will put small businesses at a huge disadvantage. Makes me glad I have left NJ, never to return.
Oh I cannot wait. On my yearly visit to a bakery I used to patronize, instead of the two dozen Italian cookies being $12 it will be $18...

A bakery worker can make five sets of two dozen cookies per hour that cost $12 for two dozen. The baker receives a raise of $1 per hour, so the cost comes out to an additional $.20 per two dozen cookies, but now the bakery has to raise the price of the cookies from $12 to $18. Where in the world did you go to school?

 

[Jackson]

Another result of the increase of the minimum wage may be enticing people presently on welfare to get a job in lieu of taking welfare checks.

If the government would, at the same time reduce the amount on welfare checks, food stamps or WIC, the government would no longer be the enabler of keeping people ;poor, but getting people in the workforce where they can climb the ladder, making raises and starting careers.

Just a thought

 

[Steven_R]

N.J. voters approve increasing minimum wage - NorthJersey.com
Not only did the voters hwo bothered to turn out ( less than 20% of registered voters) use their brains when they voted for this, they are now stuck with it as the election was to add this to the State Constitution. So if there is ever hyperinflation like there was during the Nixon and Carter years, the min wage will skyrocket. This will put small businesses at a huge disadvantage. Makes me glad I have left NJ, never to return.
Oh I cannot wait. On my yearly visit to a bakery I used to patronize, instead of the two dozen Italian cookies being $12 it will be $18...

A bakery worker can make five sets of two dozen cookies per hour that cost $12 for two dozen. The baker receives a raise of $1 per hour, so the cost comes out to an additional $.20 per two dozen cookies, but now the bakery has to raise the price of the cookies from $12 to $18. Where in the world did you go to school?

They guy at the flour processing plant gets a wage increase and so their costs go up. So does the guy at the gas station and the driver of the trucks and the people at the bakery supply store. Every link in the chain now has greater employee wage overhead and passes that increase onto the next link in the chain, ultimately at the consumer.

Now guess who didn't get a wage increase? That's right. Everyone who was making more than minimum wage. So now that things cost more, but middle class people aren't being paid more, what's the end result? Their money is actually worth less because it now has less buying power.

This is covered in any Intro to Microeconomics class.

 

[Jackson]

N.J. voters approve increasing minimum wage - NorthJersey.com
Not only did the voters hwo bothered to turn out ( less than 20% of registered voters) use their brains when they voted for this, they are now stuck with it as the election was to add this to the State Constitution. So if there is ever hyperinflation like there was during the Nixon and Carter years, the min wage will skyrocket. This will put small businesses at a huge disadvantage. Makes me glad I have left NJ, never to return.
Oh I cannot wait. On my yearly visit to a bakery I used to patronize, instead of the two dozen Italian cookies being $12 it will be $18...

A bakery worker can make five sets of two dozen cookies per hour that cost $12 for two dozen. The baker receives a raise of $1 per hour, so the cost comes out to an additional $.20 per two dozen cookies, but now the bakery has to raise the price of the cookies from $12 to $18. Where in the world did you go to school?

They guy at the flour processing plant gets a wage increase and so their costs go up. So does the guy at the gas station and the driver of the trucks and the people at the bakery supply store. Every link in the chain now has greater employee wage overhead and passes that increase onto the next link in the chain, ultimately at the consumer.

Now guess who didn't get a wage increase? That's right. Everyone who was making more than minimum wage. So now that things cost more, but middle class people aren't being paid more, what's the end result? Their money is actually worth less because it now has less buying power.

This is covered in any Intro to Microeconomics class.

Umm, guess that's a class I missed.

 

[Steven_R]

It's right there in the textbook.

Believe it or not, but my econ professor is a democrat who said unions outlived their usefulness and that minimum wage laws were counterproductive for helping the poor along the lines of rent control and that regulations strangle industry. Go figure.

 

[auditor0007]

N.J. voters approve increasing minimum wage - NorthJersey.com
Not only did the voters hwo bothered to turn out ( less than 20% of registered voters) use their brains when they voted for this, they are now stuck with it as the election was to add this to the State Constitution. So if there is ever hyperinflation like there was during the Nixon and Carter years, the min wage will skyrocket. This will put small businesses at a huge disadvantage. Makes me glad I have left NJ, never to return.
Oh I cannot wait. On my yearly visit to a bakery I used to patronize, instead of the two dozen Italian cookies being $12 it will be $18...

A bakery worker can make five sets of two dozen cookies per hour that cost $12 for two dozen. The baker receives a raise of $1 per hour, so the cost comes out to an additional $.20 per two dozen cookies, but now the bakery has to raise the price of the cookies from $12 to $18. Where in the world did you go to school?

They guy at the flour processing plant gets a wage increase and so their costs go up. So does the guy at the gas station and the driver of the trucks and the people at the bakery supply store. Every link in the chain now has greater employee wage overhead and passes that increase onto the next link in the chain, ultimately at the consumer.

Now guess who didn't get a wage increase? That's right. Everyone who was making more than minimum wage. So now that things cost more, but middle class people aren't being paid more, what's the end result? Their money is actually worth less because it now has less buying power.

This is covered in any Intro to Microeconomics class.

Raising the pay at the bottom end always increases pay to those above, and never since we have instituted the minimum wage has increasing it led to any real inflation. But please, make sure you come back with your rebuttal about how we should just raise the minimum wage to $100 per hour then, because that is what you guys do.

Giving lower income earners more money is what makes the economy grow. Rich people having more and more money does not grow the economy because they don't spend it. Lower income earners and those in the middle class spend most of what they earn. They are the driving force in the economy, but you guys still haven't figured that one out.

 

[KGB]

A bakery worker can make five sets of two dozen cookies per hour that cost $12 for two dozen. The baker receives a raise of $1 per hour, so the cost comes out to an additional $.20 per two dozen cookies, but now the bakery has to raise the price of the cookies from $12 to $18. Where in the world did you go to school?

They guy at the flour processing plant gets a wage increase and so their costs go up. So does the guy at the gas station and the driver of the trucks and the people at the bakery supply store. Every link in the chain now has greater employee wage overhead and passes that increase onto the next link in the chain, ultimately at the consumer.

Now guess who didn't get a wage increase? That's right. Everyone who was making more than minimum wage. So now that things cost more, but middle class people aren't being paid more, what's the end result? Their money is actually worth less because it now has less buying power.

This is covered in any Intro to Microeconomics class.

Raising the pay at the bottom end always increases pay to those above, and never since we have instituted the minimum wage has increasing it led to any real inflation. But please, make sure you come back with your rebuttal about how we should just raise the minimum wage to $100 per hour then, because that is what you guys do.

Giving lower income earners more money is what makes the economy grow. Rich people having more and more money does not grow the economy because they don't spend it. Lower income earners and those in the middle class spend most of what they earn. They are the driving force in the economy, but you guys still haven't figured that one out.

Classic liberal error again.....Businesses will usually cut back hours, people or both knowing their costs just rose. One thing impacts the other. That means in real buying power, those who would have benefited actually lose out more. I have no issue with lower income earners getting ahead, but dong so because of government fiat vs maximizing their talents isn't the way to go.

 

[The Rabbi]

Another result of the increase of the minimum wage may be enticing people presently on welfare to get a job in lieu of taking welfare checks.

If the government would, at the same time reduce the amount on welfare checks, food stamps or WIC, the government would no longer be the enabler of keeping people ;poor, but getting people in the workforce where they can climb the ladder, making raises and starting careers.

Just a thought

There would have to be jobs for that to happen. There arent. There will be fewer jobs,not more.
This is like basic Econ 101, a subject most libs slept through. If they even heard of it.

 

[The Rabbi]

A bakery worker can make five sets of two dozen cookies per hour that cost $12 for two dozen. The baker receives a raise of $1 per hour, so the cost comes out to an additional $.20 per two dozen cookies, but now the bakery has to raise the price of the cookies from $12 to $18. Where in the world did you go to school?

They guy at the flour processing plant gets a wage increase and so their costs go up. So does the guy at the gas station and the driver of the trucks and the people at the bakery supply store. Every link in the chain now has greater employee wage overhead and passes that increase onto the next link in the chain, ultimately at the consumer.

Now guess who didn't get a wage increase? That's right. Everyone who was making more than minimum wage. So now that things cost more, but middle class people aren't being paid more, what's the end result? Their money is actually worth less because it now has less buying power.

This is covered in any Intro to Microeconomics class.

Raising the pay at the bottom end always increases pay to those above, and never since we have instituted the minimum wage has increasing it led to any real inflation. But please, make sure you come back with your rebuttal about how we should just raise the minimum wage to $100 per hour then, because that is what you guys do.

Giving lower income earners more money is what makes the economy grow. Rich people having more and more money does not grow the economy because they don't spend it. Lower income earners and those in the middle class spend most of what they earn. They are the driving force in the economy, but you guys still haven't figured that one out.

So you admit he is right and then ignore your own conclusion?
And yet another moron who thinks "money in the hands of people who spend it drives the economy." This has been disproven so many times one wonders why people still believe it.

 

[Mad_Cabbie]

How are States doing that already have an increased minimum wage? Did they all go belly up?

Seattle has the nations highest minimum wage at $9.19.

Seattle-area economy rated third in U.S.

The Seattle area has the nation's third-strongest local economy, according to a new report looking at performance over an extended period.

Only Washington, D.C., and Des Moines, Iowa, were higher in research firm Policom Corp.'s annual ranking of 366 metropolitan areas. The study measures 23 different economic factors over 20 years (1991 to 2010, in this case).

"The top rated areas have had rapid, consistent growth in both size and quality for an extended period of time," Policom President William Fruth said in a news release. "The rankings do not reflect the latest 'hotspot' or boom town, but the areas which have the best economic foundation. While most communities have slowed or declined during this recession, the strongest areas have been able to weather the storm."

The Seattle area is King, Pierce and Snohomish counties. It finished third last year and first in 2010. The next-highest rated Washington area was the Tri-Cities, in 13th place, up from 35th in 2011, 70th in 2010 and 125th in 2009.

Seattle-area economy rated third in U.S. - seattlepi.com

 

[Mad_Cabbie]

The guy at the flour processing plant gets a wage increase and so their costs go up. So does the guy at the gas station and the driver of the trucks and the people at the bakery supply store. Every link in the chain now has greater employee wage overhead and passes that increase onto the next link in the chain, ultimately at the consumer.

Now guess who didn't get a wage increase? That's right. Everyone who was making more than minimum wage. So now that things cost more, but middle class people aren't being paid more, what's the end result? Their money is actually worth less because it now has less buying power.

This is covered in any Intro to Microeconomics class.

Not at all, whenever company's feel the crunch, cuts first come from the dead weight - namly, bonuses that the higher-ups voted for themselves.

Rasing the min also brings in more revinue in the form of more income tax.

Raising the min increases inflation? Where would you find proof of that in America? Did we try this at some point and it failed?

 

[candycorn]

The guy at the flour processing plant gets a wage increase and so their costs go up. So does the guy at the gas station and the driver of the trucks and the people at the bakery supply store. Every link in the chain now has greater employee wage overhead and passes that increase onto the next link in the chain, ultimately at the consumer.

Now guess who didn't get a wage increase? That's right. Everyone who was making more than minimum wage. So now that things cost more, but middle class people aren't being paid more, what's the end result? Their money is actually worth less because it now has less buying power.

This is covered in any Intro to Microeconomics class.

Not at all, whenever company's feel the crunch, cuts first come from the dead weight - namly, bonuses that the higher-ups voted for themselves.

Rasing the min also brings in more revinue in the form of more income tax.

Raising the min increases inflation? Where would you find proof of that in America? Did we try this at some point and it failed?

I took microeconomics; I don't recall plant workers making minimum wages. Neither do truck drivers (some make more than I do!!!).

 

[Mad_Cabbie]

I took microeconomics; I don't recall plant workers making minimum wages. Neither do truck drivers (some make more than I do!!!).

I was a truck driver - our warehouse was full of min wage workers.

Most drivers really do not make that much, you might want to switch to something more lucrative.

 

[thereisnospoon]

N.J. voters approve increasing minimum wage - NorthJersey.com
Not only did the voters hwo bothered to turn out ( less than 20% of registered voters) use their brains when they voted for this, they are now stuck with it as the election was to add this to the State Constitution. So if there is ever hyperinflation like there was during the Nixon and Carter years, the min wage will skyrocket. This will put small businesses at a huge disadvantage. Makes me glad I have left NJ, never to return.
Oh I cannot wait. On my yearly visit to a bakery I used to patronize, instead of the two dozen Italian cookies being $12 it will be $18...

A bakery worker can make five sets of two dozen cookies per hour that cost $12 for two dozen. The baker receives a raise of $1 per hour, so the cost comes out to an additional $.20 per two dozen cookies, but now the bakery has to raise the price of the cookies from $12 to $18. Where in the world did you go to school?

First, let us establish one fact, you have never operated a business.
Now, the wage increases are arbitrary.
So let's say the typical worker in this store which is in an affluent area of Northern NJ...
In this area, the typical retail worker averages over $10 per hour. Many businesses in order to be competitive in the labor market, must provide at least some benefits.
With taxes and mandated contributions such as Social Security, medicare taxes, disability taxes and worker's comp insurance are all indexed to the wage of each worker.
That $10 per hour worker may cost the employer as much as $20 per hour.
It is logical to assume that an increase in min wage will trigger higher wages for most entry level or low skilled workers, as these wages are indexed to the min wage.
These costs are either absorbed by the business ( unlikely) or passed along, at least in part to the end user
So yes, in order to maintain the present profit margin, prices will rise accordingly.
You argument unwittingly presumes the bakery( a small business, not a factory) has just one employee. For each worker, a $1 increase could equal $1 per man hour.
So if on a busy day, there are 5 workers, that store owner is actually spending $5 more per hour.
Most businesses will resist raising prices too dramatically. So they may cut the hours of the low level workers. They may switch these workers to part time status which will eliminate any benefits they may receive. Or they may hire more part time workers and eliminate all full time hours.
One way or another, this and all other arbitrary unfunded government mandates wind up hurting the very people that intended to benefit.
Once again, government( this time the voters) have ignored the law of unintended consequences.
There is no 'magic wand' that can be waived to change economic conditions. The marketplace cannot be manipulated without causing a myriad of problems.

 

[thereisnospoon]

Another result of the increase of the minimum wage may be enticing people presently on welfare to get a job in lieu of taking welfare checks.

If the government would, at the same time reduce the amount on welfare checks, food stamps or WIC, the government would no longer be the enabler of keeping people ;poor, but getting people in the workforce where they can climb the ladder, making raises and starting careers.

Just a thought

Never happen. Democrat politicians need as many people as possible on the public dole to maintain their voter base.

 

[thereisnospoon]

A bakery worker can make five sets of two dozen cookies per hour that cost $12 for two dozen. The baker receives a raise of $1 per hour, so the cost comes out to an additional $.20 per two dozen cookies, but now the bakery has to raise the price of the cookies from $12 to $18. Where in the world did you go to school?

They guy at the flour processing plant gets a wage increase and so their costs go up. So does the guy at the gas station and the driver of the trucks and the people at the bakery supply store. Every link in the chain now has greater employee wage overhead and passes that increase onto the next link in the chain, ultimately at the consumer.

Now guess who didn't get a wage increase? That's right. Everyone who was making more than minimum wage. So now that things cost more, but middle class people aren't being paid more, what's the end result? Their money is actually worth less because it now has less buying power.

This is covered in any Intro to Microeconomics class.

Raising the pay at the bottom end always increases pay to those above, and never since we have instituted the minimum wage has increasing it led to any real inflation. But please, make sure you come back with your rebuttal about how we should just raise the minimum wage to $100 per hour then, because that is what you guys do.

Giving lower income earners more money is what makes the economy grow. Rich people having more and more money does not grow the economy because they don't spend it. Lower income earners and those in the middle class spend most of what they earn. They are the driving force in the economy, but you guys still haven't figured that one out.

Once again, this pattern is typical of those who know little or nothing about operating a business.
Genius, the money HAS TO COME FROM SOMEWHERE..
I am well aware of the belief of those on the left that states 'all business owners are profit first minded people. They live in big expansive houses far from the great unwashed masses. They sit in their walnut paneled study at night counting their money and once through counting, grab a pen and paper. They write down every idea that pops into their head that says "screw the little guy"...
You people sit in your arrogance and say " well they could pay more if they'd just keep their car one more year". "They could take one less vacation".
Here's the rub......It is THEIR money. Which means if they wish to save spend it, invest it or shove it between the box spring and mattress, that is THEIR right.
The other more important issue is this. The employee has no skin in the game. They can leave the job whenever they wish and find another. If the business fails, the owner of that business absorbs the debt. The business owner takes ALL of the risk.

 

[boilermaker55]

Sure! Some more talking points from the plutocratic society.
Nice try.

It's right there in the textbook.

Believe it or not, but my econ professor is a democrat who said unions outlived their usefulness and that minimum wage laws were counterproductive for helping the poor along the lines of rent control and that regulations strangle industry. Go figure.

 

[boilermaker55]

Typical response. No one else has anything to do with the building of a company. Right.
No one but the owner.

They guy at the flour processing plant gets a wage increase and so their costs go up. So does the guy at the gas station and the driver of the trucks and the people at the bakery supply store. Every link in the chain now has greater employee wage overhead and passes that increase onto the next link in the chain, ultimately at the consumer.

Now guess who didn't get a wage increase? That's right. Everyone who was making more than minimum wage. So now that things cost more, but middle class people aren't being paid more, what's the end result? Their money is actually worth less because it now has less buying power.

This is covered in any Intro to Microeconomics class.

Raising the pay at the bottom end always increases pay to those above, and never since we have instituted the minimum wage has increasing it led to any real inflation. But please, make sure you come back with your rebuttal about how we should just raise the minimum wage to $100 per hour then, because that is what you guys do.

Giving lower income earners more money is what makes the economy grow. Rich people having more and more money does not grow the economy because they don't spend it. Lower income earners and those in the middle class spend most of what they earn. They are the driving force in the economy, but you guys still haven't figured that one out.

Once again, this pattern is typical of those who know little or nothing about operating a business.
Genius, the money HAS TO COME FROM SOMEWHERE..
I am well aware of the belief of those on the left that states 'all business owners are profit first minded people. They live in big expansive houses far from the great unwashed masses. They sit in their walnut paneled study at night counting their money and once through counting, grab a pen and paper. They write down every idea that pops into their head that says "screw the little guy"...
You people sit in your arrogance and say " well they could pay more if they'd just keep their car one more year". "They could take one less vacation".
Here's the rub......It is THEIR money. Which means if they wish to save spend it, invest it or shove it between the box spring and mattress, that is THEIR right.
The other more important issue is this. The employee has no skin in the game. They can leave the job whenever they wish and find another. If the business fails, the owner of that business absorbs the debt. The business owner takes ALL of the risk.

 

[thereisnospoon]

How are States doing that already have an increased minimum wage? Did they all go belly up?

Seattle has the nations highest minimum wage at $9.19.

Seattle-area economy rated third in U.S.

The Seattle area has the nation's third-strongest local economy, according to a new report looking at performance over an extended period.

Only Washington, D.C., and Des Moines, Iowa, were higher in research firm Policom Corp.'s annual ranking of 366 metropolitan areas. The study measures 23 different economic factors over 20 years (1991 to 2010, in this case).

"The top rated areas have had rapid, consistent growth in both size and quality for an extended period of time," Policom President William Fruth said in a news release. "The rankings do not reflect the latest 'hotspot' or boom town, but the areas which have the best economic foundation. While most communities have slowed or declined during this recession, the strongest areas have been able to weather the storm."

The Seattle area is King, Pierce and Snohomish counties. It finished third last year and first in 2010. The next-highest rated Washington area was the Tri-Cities, in 13th place, up from 35th in 2011, 70th in 2010 and 125th in 2009.

Seattle-area economy rated third in U.S. - seattlepi.com

Yer kidding right? Seattle also happens to be home of some of the nation's largest companies. Including Microsoft and Boeing. The labor market in the Sea-Tac area is skewed higher than 90% of the MSA's in the US.
Here's the other side of the equation. Sea-Tac also has a very high cost of living. most middle level workers are forced to live in the far flung suburbs due to the cost of housing.