Can Someone Explain?

[MJB12741]

I learned from the Palestinian supporters that "Israel is stealing (or occupying) 'Palestinian' land." I detest land thieves & will always join the side against them. So will someone please tell me --- when did Israel's land since antiquity become this Palestinian land that Israel is stealing?

 

[RoccoR]

MJB12741, et al,

There are three or four variants to this general claim.

I learned from the Palestinian supporters that "Israel is stealing (or occupying) 'Palestinian' land." I detest land thieves & will always join the side against them. So will someone please tell me --- when did Israel's land since antiquity become this Palestinian land that Israel is stealing?

(COMMENT)

Example Variants:

• The first is that the entire State of Israel was really Palestinian, so any territory claimed by the State of Palestine is really an admission to holding stolen property.

• The second variant is that immediately before and during the period 1947, thru to the Armistice of 1949, the Jewish/Israelis pushed, evicted or coerced the Arab/Palestinians to evacuate their homes and abandon their property --- leaving it to the public domain.

• The third variant is that during the Six Day War, the IDF advancing towards Arab Forces massing for an attack, overran Arab/Palestinian property and placed it under occupation as enemy held territory for rear area protection purposes.

• There are the general Armistice lines between Israel and Lebanon and Syria; and, there are the Treaties establishing borders with Egypt and Jordan. The claim is that these do not constitute borders because the treaty did not include Arab/Palestinian participation with the Arab/Palestinians.

Each one of the above variants also has variants, depending on which voice you are engaged with. The Arab/Palestinians do not speak with one voice. So some say that no initial country of Israel was established because the UN Resolution was never implemented; even though the Permanent Observer to the UN claims it does. This is important because the Arab/Palestinian claims the territory was then taken by force. In fact, each time the military solution to the Palestinian Issue is discussed, the claim that Israeli held territory by military conquest is illegal. They do not recognize the counter-claim that Israel was in hot pursuit of hostile enemy forces.

And there are several variation on the theme that entangle the right of self-determination and foreign occupation, foreign interference, and other such claims.

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[HistoryBefore67]

It became "Palestinian land", retroactively, when the PLO decided that they needed to create the fiction that they are a distinct people.

 

[Bloodrock44]

I learned from the Palestinian supporters that "Israel is stealing (or occupying) 'Palestinian' land." I detest land thieves & will always join the side against them. So will someone please tell me --- when did Israel's land since antiquity become this Palestinian land that Israel is stealing?

I can explain. It's all Israel's fault. They were instructed 3500 years ago to kick them out or they would be a prick in their eye and a thorn in their side as long as they were in the land. They failed to kick them out and look what we have today...a bunch of pricks being a pain in the arse, claiming the land is theirs. And look what cowards they are. They send their kids out to murder Israeli children, they hide behind their women's skirts and whine like babies when Israel gives them a good bitchslappin'.

 

[MJB12741]

Well, one thing for certain it became "Palestinian land" just after Israel turned the wasteland into a thriving metropolis. Golly gee, is it actually possible the Palestinians" are stealing or occupying Israel's land?

It became "Palestinian land", retroactively, when the PLO decided that they needed to create the fiction that they are a distinct people.

 

[dilloduck]

Ottomans owned it at one time. What's this antiquity shit ?

 

[MJB12741]

LOL! The Ottomans never owned Israel. Just a few pieces of land within Israel. And the Ottomans were of the 15th & 16th century AD & not even a part of antiquity. Fact is all Muslim lands are stolen lands.

Go back on your meds & call me in the morning if your insanity still remains.

Ottomans owned it at one time. What's this antiquity shit ?

 

[MJB12741]

There were no Muslims at all until the 7th century AD.

LOL! The Ottomans never owned Israel. Just a few pieces of land within Israel. And the Ottomans were of the 15th & 16th century AD & not even a part of antiquity. Fact is all Muslim lands are stolen lands.

Go back on your meds & call me in the morning if your insanity still remains.

Ottomans owned it at one time. What's this antiquity shit ?

 

[Hossfly]

There were no Muslims at all until the 7th century AD.

LOL! The Ottomans never owned Israel. Just a few pieces of land within Israel. And the Ottomans were of the 15th & 16th century AD & not even a part of antiquity. Fact is all Muslim lands are stolen lands.

Go back on your meds & call me in the morning if your insanity still remains.

Ottomans owned it at one time. What's this antiquity shit ?

You might want to research that. According to Tinmore, Adam was a Palestinian.

 

[rdean]

Because this land still belongs to American Indians.

 

[SFC Ollie]

Show me one map that was made before 1700 with the country of Palestine on it.........

 

[Ropey]

XXXX

So did the Armenians march. Well, they were herded.

Haven't you heard.

Check again, and yes, there's always some who help herd their own. It's a characteristic of humanity.

 

[RoccoR]

SFC Ollie, et al,

Yes, this is one of those "appeal to ancient ties" discussions. I agree with you.

Show me one map that was made before 1700 with the country of Palestine on it.........

(COMMENT)

Anyone can look-up the history of Palestine and see that it was a region of the that has been controlled by one empire of another, going back to a time before the Fall of the Roman Empire.

The modern day Palestinian is an aberration. It is a phantom legacy that a dysfunctional culture latched-onto; --- around which, they have built a cult of believers to a sovereignty that never existed.

The Ottoman Empire never even established the boundaries for the region. When they relinquished control, they left it up to the Allied Power to establish the lines. It was a nebulas term use to describe the demographics in the Levant, that wasn't Syria and wasn't Mesopotamia.

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[Sweet_Caroline]

There were no Muslims at all until the 7th century AD.

LOL! The Ottomans never owned Israel. Just a few pieces of land within Israel. And the Ottomans were of the 15th & 16th century AD & not even a part of antiquity. Fact is all Muslim lands are stolen lands.

Go back on your meds & call me in the morning if your insanity still remains.

You might want to research that. According to Tinmore, Adam was a Palestinian.

Even more ridiculous there are Imams preaching the Jesus was a Muslim.


.

 

[RoccoR]

José, et al,

This is wrong on so many levels.

If you are going to use this kind of disrespectful logic, at least try to get it right.

Hard as they try, Palestinians still can't hold a candle to european jews in terms of sheer cowardice.

Last time I checked, Israel's founders marched to the gas chambers like cattle to the slaughterhouse.

(COMMENT)

Most people don't know the difference between cowardice, heroism, and chivalry. So I'll let that slide; chalking it up to your inexperience with any heroism and chivalry.

But the uncalled-fore "gas chambers" comment, ended in 1945. The founders of Israel were still around in 1948.

If you are going to make such outrageous statements, at least get some part of the statement correct. Otherwise you just lose all your credibility.

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[Bloodrock44]

Originally posted by Bloodrock
And look what cowards they are. They send their kids out to murder Israeli children, they hide behind their women's skirts and whine like babies when Israel gives them a good bitchslappin'.

Hard as they try, Palestinians still can't hold a candle to european jews in terms of sheer cowardice.

Last time I checked, Israel's founders marched to the gas chambers like cattle to the slaughterhouse.

You call that cowardice, Yusef? As if they were well armed to defend themselves. I do agree with you that Palestinians try very hard to be cowards.

 

[José]

Rocco, I typed the following message to Ropey, an old friend of mine, before I had the chance to read your post and believe it or not I had already included all the references to your person, so please consider it a reply directed to you also : )

 

[José]

Originally posted by Bloodrock
And look what cowards they are. They send their kids out to murder Israeli children, they hide behind their women's skirts and whine like babies when Israel gives them a good bitchslappin'.

Hard as they try, Palestinians still can't hold a candle to european jews in terms of sheer cowardice.

Last time I checked, Israel's founders marched to the gas chambers like cattle to the slaughterhouse.

So did the Armenians march. Well, they were herded.

Haven't you heard.

Check again, and yes, there's always some who help herd their own. It's a characteristic of humanity.

Ropey,

Don't give me (too much) shit over that post because anybody with half a brain can see I was not speaking seriously, just responding to a provocation (and I know you have an entire brain).

When I saw that total idiot mocking, taunting a third world people with a couple of rockets and machine guns, living under the boot of a racial dictatorship I just couldn't resist the urge to reply.

I feel bad whenever I post this kind of "retaliatory" messages that do not represent my true opinions, positions. I try to avoid them like Hell.

The "José" I'm really proud of is the one who engaged toastman and Rocco in a fantastic, historic, devastating, earth-shattering debate a couple of days ago that you can find here if you are interested:

http://www.usmessageboard.com/israel-and-palestine/300602-want-peace-end-the-occupation-6.html

The "José" I really like is the one who talked to you 100% seriously a couple of times in the past and the one who posted this thread on the creation of Israel also recently:

http://www.usmessageboard.com/usmb-badlands/298782-was-the-creation-of-the-jewish-racial-dictatorship-a-good-idea.html

If I were Mr. Spock from Star Trek, a form of life totally devoided of emotions, sentiments, 100% guided by reason and formal logic I could easily ignore that moron, but I'm not.

I appologize to you, Ropey, for not being a Vulcan, just a human being.

Should I be a better human being and just ignore the childish provocations of a poster who clearly shows signs of a fairly low intellectual level, a poster who can't really add anything valuable to the debate?

You bet I should!! To tell the truth this is the second time I was led to reply to his posts in the last 4 days.

In an ideal world Message Boards would be populated only by people like Rocco, Auteur and so many others who are here to debate only but sadly they are not. And part of the problem are posters like myself who lack the necessary self control to simply ignore this shit.

Shame on him, first and foremost, for starting the whole crap, but shame on me too.

 

[MJB12741]

Let us admit Tinmore has come a long way in his education of the Middle East. I am so impressed that even he of all people knew that the indigenous Palestinians WERE JEWS.

There were no Muslims at all until the 7th century AD.

LOL! The Ottomans never owned Israel. Just a few pieces of land within Israel. And the Ottomans were of the 15th & 16th century AD & not even a part of antiquity. Fact is all Muslim lands are stolen lands.

Go back on your meds & call me in the morning if your insanity still remains.

You might want to research that. According to Tinmore, Adam was a Palestinian.

 

[SFC Ollie]

SFC Ollie, et al,

Yes, this is one of those "appeal to ancient ties" discussions. I agree with you.

Show me one map that was made before 1700 with the country of Palestine on it.........

(COMMENT)

Anyone can look-up the history of Palestine and see that it was a region of the that has been controlled by one empire of another, going back to a time before the Fall of the Roman Empire.

The modern day Palestinian is an aberration. It is a phantom legacy that a dysfunctional culture latched-onto; --- around which, they have built a cult of believers to a sovereignty that never existed.

The Ottoman Empire never even established the boundaries for the region. When they relinquished control, they left it up to the Allied Power to establish the lines. It was a nebulas term use to describe the demographics in the Levant, that wasn't Syria and wasn't Mesopotamia.

Most Respectfully,
R

Truth is that a few years ago I did a very in dept search for such a map...

The closest thing I could find was an area where Syria is today that was called Syria-Palistinia.