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Right. So instead of blaming the US for slavery, blame the bloody Spanish who were first here with slaves. The bastards!So it was not the American's fault, right?Slave traders --- which existed everywhere --- in Africa, were still not cramming their human commodities into vessels to send them to another continent where the victims would have no connection with the land or the culture. What you're trying to refer to here without saying it, because it's inconvenient, is TransAtlantic slave traders. That --- the bold part --- was what made this particular slavery different from all others. That, and the concept of "slave for life" by simple virtue of one's race. NONE of that was present in previous slavery systems in Africa, Asia, Europe or Native America.
To be transported in chains to a foreign shore that may as well have been another planet, utterly unfamiliar in climate, culture, language, etc, was the ultimate control-freak subjugation of human chattel. Slavery over the millennia of human history derived from the spoils of war, not from cockamamie ideas of "race". That latter idea began with Columbus (who tried to enslave Indians and sent them back to Europe as "specimens") and left the launchpad of reason with the Spanish, French, British and Portuguese merchants dealing in human lives --- in other words, it derives from the greed of profit.
And by the way this part here:
>> This August marked 400 years since the first documented enslaved Africans arrived in the U.S. In 1619, a ship reached the Jamestown settlement in the colony of Virginia, carrying “some 20 and odd Negroes” who were kidnapped from their villages in present-day Angola. <<
... is off by 93 years. The first enslaved Africans were brought to (what is now) the US, South Carolina specifically, in 1526. The happy ending is that this particular group revolted and escaped to live among the Native Americans. Needless to say, the US did not exist in 1526 or 1619, so it's erroneous on that basis as well.
wrong again POGOID ----the slave trade monopolized by Arab slave traders for
MILLENNIA supplied chattel slaves THRUOUT north Africa, and ASIA ---and parts of Europe for MILLENNIA -------true the slaves were rarely kidnapped---but MOSTLY they were purchased from African chieftains FOR MILLENNIA ----some slaves were non Africans------kidnapped by arab slave traders on the high seas or even from the BALKANS-----learn some history-------CHATTEL SLAVES -----with
-----very few if any rights at all-------and SKIN COLOR was a big issue thruout
it was not America's invention. Those people who ENGAGED in the barbaric
use of slavery -----did the barbaric thing that they did
"America", depending on what you mean by that, didn't even exist. The American continents of course did, but land masses don't come up with ideas. Again the TransAtlantic slave trade was capitalism gone wild, treating human beings as commodities and inventing the whole "inferior race" song and dance as justification for it. Such justification was sorely needed, as conscientious contemporaries voiced objections to the practice all the way back to Bartholomé de las Casas in the 1400s.
As in anything else, the fable was invented to excuse away the inhumanity. There were riches to be made in the then-new continents of America, and unscrupulous merchants were more than ready to line their own pockets. Simple as that.
Of course if by "America" we mean "The United States of...." that didn't even come into being until TransAtlantic African slavery was an established institution on the continents for almost three hundred years.
Half of African countries still practice slavery even today
Okay, but some else posted this:If the Spanish did it first, its on them. The Brits were not in America till the 1600's.So the Spanish started this whole mess here. Let them pay somebody something.Somehow all the Revisionist history has been about how bad us 'White Colonialists' were.
Nothing about untold Milennia of genocide and slavery in Africa.
Sorry but can't post whole artilce. Alas No exception is made for subscription sites either.
When the Slave Traders Were African
Those whose ancestors sold slaves to Europeans now struggle to come to terms with a painful legacy
By Adaobi Tricia Nwaubani
Sept. 20, 2019 - Wall Street Journal
When the Slave Traders Were African
This August marked 400 years since the first documented enslaved Africans arrived in the U.S. In 1619, a ship reached the Jamestown settlement in the colony of Virginia, carrying “some 20 and odd Negroes” who were kidnapped from their villages in present-day Angola. The anniversary coincides with a controversial debate in the U.S. about whether the country owes reparations to the descendants of slaves as compensation for centuries of injustice and inequality. It is a moment for posing questions of historic guilt and responsibility.
...Africans are now also reckoning with their own complicated legacy in the slave trade, and the infamous “Middle Passage” often looks different from across the Atlantic......The organization of the slave trade was structured to have the Europeans stay along the coast lines, relying on African middlemen and merchants to bring the slaves to them,” said Toyin Falola, a Nigerian professor of African studies at the University of Texas at Austin. “The Europeans couldn’t have gone into the interior to get the slaves themselves.”
The anguished debate over slavery in the U.S. is often silent on the role that Africans played. That silence is echoed in many African countries, where there is hardly any national discussion or acknowledgment of the issue. From nursery school through university in Nigeria, I was taught about great African cultures and conquerors of times past but not about African involvement in the slave trade. In an attempt to reclaim some of the dignity that we lost during colonialism, Africans have tended to magnify stories of a glorious past of rich traditions and brave achievement..... But there are other, less discussed chapters of our history. When I was growing up, my father Chukwuma Nwaubani spoke glowingly of my great-grandfather, Nwaubani Ogogo Oriaku, a chief among our Igbo ethnic group who sold slaves in the 19th century. “He was respected by everyone around,” he said. “Even the white people respected him.” From the 16th to the 19th centuries, an estimated 1.4 million Igbo people were transported across the Atlantic as slaves.
Some families have chosen to hide similar histories. “We speak of it in whispers,”....
[.....]
[.....]
Slave traders --- which existed everywhere --- in Africa, were still not cramming their human commodities into vessels to send them to another continent where the victims would have no connection with the land or the culture. What you're trying to refer to here without saying it, because it's inconvenient, is TransAtlantic slave traders. That --- the bold part --- was what made this particular slavery different from all others. That, and the concept of "slave for life" by simple virtue of one's race. NONE of that was present in previous slavery systems in Africa, Asia, Europe or Native America.
To be transported in chains to a foreign shore that may as well have been another planet, utterly unfamiliar in climate, culture, language, etc, was the ultimate control-freak subjugation of human chattel. Slavery over the millennia of human history derived from the spoils of war, not from cockamamie ideas of "race". That latter idea began with Columbus (who tried to enslave Indians and sent them back to Europe as "specimens") and left the launchpad of reason with the Spanish, French, British and Portuguese merchants dealing in human lives --- in other words, it derives from the greed of profit.
And by the way this part here:
>> This August marked 400 years since the first documented enslaved Africans arrived in the U.S. In 1619, a ship reached the Jamestown settlement in the colony of Virginia, carrying “some 20 and odd Negroes” who were kidnapped from their villages in present-day Angola. <<
... is off by 93 years. The first enslaved Africans were brought to (what is now) the US, South Carolina specifically, in 1526. The happy ending is that this particular group revolted and escaped to live among the Native Americans. Needless to say, the US did not exist in 1526 or 1619, so it's erroneous on that basis as well.
Not "the Spanish" but that particular event was a Spanish excursion which was defying orders. Most of the slave trade was operated by British and Portuguese traders (who combined for about 70% of it), the latter mostly with Brazil, which the Pope had "awarded" them in 1500 when he carved up South America more or less equally between Spain and Portugal. A relatively small amount hailed from smaller and less colonial nations such as Denmark. But whether the trader was Spanish, British, French, Dutch, Portuguese or a privateer, what was always behind it was capitalistic greed --- not a nationality.
But no, a single guy commandeering a couple of ships in defiance of his orders does not constitute "the Spanish". That's a Composition Fallacy.
Once AGAIN ---- ONE GUY taking it on himself to bolt up to Carolina to try slaving does not make "the Spanish". It makes ONE GUY. One equals one. There is no "them" in "one".
British slaving began in 1562, with John Hawkins, in Hispaniola. Fun fact: 1562 was before the 1600s.
>> As the British American colonies demanded African slaves, the role of the African companies changed to supply them. From 1660, the British Crown passed various acts and granted charters to enable companies to settle, administer and exploit British interests on the West Coast of Africa and to supply slaves to the American colonies. The African companies were granted a monopoly to trade in slaves. This monopoly was criticised by other traders, and planters complained about restricted rights, limited supplies and high prices. This encouraged illegal traders (commonly called interlopers), many of whom were from other nations, especially the Dutch. Opposition from planters, traders and manufacturers was so strong that in 1698 the monopoly was removed.
Intense rivalry, illegal traders and the loss of monopoly meant that the African settlements were not as successful as they could be. The British government intervened on several occasions to grant new charters, pass acts to improve trade, subsidise the company and eventually take over the settlements. In addition to the African companies, other companies set up under Royal charters were involved in the slave trade. For example, the East India Company was involved in the East African slave trade but also collected slaves from the West Coast of Africa for its settlements in South and East Africa and in India and Asia. << --- National Archives (UK)
Also once again, British and Portuguese slave ships accounted for the vast majority of African slaving, almost three-quarters of the total, and Portugal's was almost exclusively confined to Brazil. Not that any of this nationality minutiae means jack shit.
Then why are libs demanding the US pay reparations and no one else?Right. So instead of blaming the US for slavery, blame the bloody Spanish who were first here with slaves. The bastards!So it was not the American's fault, right?wrong again POGOID ----the slave trade monopolized by Arab slave traders for
MILLENNIA supplied chattel slaves THRUOUT north Africa, and ASIA ---and parts of Europe for MILLENNIA -------true the slaves were rarely kidnapped---but MOSTLY they were purchased from African chieftains FOR MILLENNIA ----some slaves were non Africans------kidnapped by arab slave traders on the high seas or even from the BALKANS-----learn some history-------CHATTEL SLAVES -----with
-----very few if any rights at all-------and SKIN COLOR was a big issue thruout
it was not America's invention. Those people who ENGAGED in the barbaric
use of slavery -----did the barbaric thing that they did
"America", depending on what you mean by that, didn't even exist. The American continents of course did, but land masses don't come up with ideas. Again the TransAtlantic slave trade was capitalism gone wild, treating human beings as commodities and inventing the whole "inferior race" song and dance as justification for it. Such justification was sorely needed, as conscientious contemporaries voiced objections to the practice all the way back to Bartholomé de las Casas in the 1400s.
As in anything else, the fable was invented to excuse away the inhumanity. There were riches to be made in the then-new continents of America, and unscrupulous merchants were more than ready to line their own pockets. Simple as that.
Of course if by "America" we mean "The United States of...." that didn't even come into being until TransAtlantic African slavery was an established institution on the continents for almost three hundred years.
And AGAIN once again AGAIN --- the US did not exist when transAtlantic slaving established. It didn't exist in the 16th century. It didn't exist in the 17th century. It didn't exist until the END of the 18th century. Linear time therefore dictates that the US could not have started the slave trade. Maybe that's why NOBODY CLAIMED IT DID.
JESUS CHRIST ON A BICYCLE
I respect your opinion BUT, I believe everyone is responsible for themselves, whether it is your child at 21 or your parents. I will help if I want or feel it is deserved, but don't tell me I owe somebody I NEVER MET. So in my opinion, we are NOT responsible for the actions-not debts- of our country when it was formed.I hope we can all agree that slavery is bad, and just because someone else did it first, or more, or any other aspect of it, that doesn't absolve us from participating. We, as a country condoned slavery, and that caused great harm that is still being felt by the descendants of slavery today. We need to acknowledge what our country did and try to remedy that harm as much as we can, and not try to blame it all on what somebody else did. Nobody alive today had anything to do with the slave trade when our country was formed, but we are the ones in charge of our country now, and we are responsible for the debts our country made back then.
I respect your opinion BUT, I believe everyone is responsible for themselves, whether it is your child at 21 or your parents. I will help if I want or feel it is deserved, but don't tell me I owe somebody I NEVER MET. So in my opinion, we are NOT responsible for the actions-not debts- of our country when it was formed.I hope we can all agree that slavery is bad, and just because someone else did it first, or more, or any other aspect of it, that doesn't absolve us from participating. We, as a country condoned slavery, and that caused great harm that is still being felt by the descendants of slavery today. We need to acknowledge what our country did and try to remedy that harm as much as we can, and not try to blame it all on what somebody else did. Nobody alive today had anything to do with the slave trade when our country was formed, but we are the ones in charge of our country now, and we are responsible for the debts our country made back then.
Are you saying that it was a kinder, gentler, slavery before they came to America? Remarkable.Somehow all the Revisionist history has been about how bad us 'White Colonialists' were.
Nothing about untold Milennia of genocide and slavery in Africa.
Sorry but can't post whole artilce. Alas No exception is made for subscription sites either.
When the Slave Traders Were African
Those whose ancestors sold slaves to Europeans now struggle to come to terms with a painful legacy
By Adaobi Tricia Nwaubani
Sept. 20, 2019 - Wall Street Journal
When the Slave Traders Were African
This August marked 400 years since the first documented enslaved Africans arrived in the U.S. In 1619, a ship reached the Jamestown settlement in the colony of Virginia, carrying “some 20 and odd Negroes” who were kidnapped from their villages in present-day Angola. The anniversary coincides with a controversial debate in the U.S. about whether the country owes reparations to the descendants of slaves as compensation for centuries of injustice and inequality. It is a moment for posing questions of historic guilt and responsibility.
...Africans are now also reckoning with their own complicated legacy in the slave trade, and the infamous “Middle Passage” often looks different from across the Atlantic......The organization of the slave trade was structured to have the Europeans stay along the coast lines, relying on African middlemen and merchants to bring the slaves to them,” said Toyin Falola, a Nigerian professor of African studies at the University of Texas at Austin. “The Europeans couldn’t have gone into the interior to get the slaves themselves.”
The anguished debate over slavery in the U.S. is often silent on the role that Africans played. That silence is echoed in many African countries, where there is hardly any national discussion or acknowledgment of the issue. From nursery school through university in Nigeria, I was taught about great African cultures and conquerors of times past but not about African involvement in the slave trade. In an attempt to reclaim some of the dignity that we lost during colonialism, Africans have tended to magnify stories of a glorious past of rich traditions and brave achievement..... But there are other, less discussed chapters of our history. When I was growing up, my father Chukwuma Nwaubani spoke glowingly of my great-grandfather, Nwaubani Ogogo Oriaku, a chief among our Igbo ethnic group who sold slaves in the 19th century. “He was respected by everyone around,” he said. “Even the white people respected him.” From the 16th to the 19th centuries, an estimated 1.4 million Igbo people were transported across the Atlantic as slaves.
Some families have chosen to hide similar histories. “We speak of it in whispers,”....
[.....]
[.....]
Slave traders --- which existed everywhere --- in Africa, were still not cramming their human commodities into vessels to send them to another continent where the victims would have no connection with the land or the culture. What you're trying to refer to here without saying it, because it's inconvenient, is TransAtlantic slave traders. That --- the bold part --- was what made this particular slavery different from all others. That, and the concept of "slave for life" by simple virtue of one's race. NONE of that was present in previous slavery systems in Africa, Asia, Europe or Native America.
To be transported in chains to a foreign shore that may as well have been another planet, utterly unfamiliar in climate, culture, language, etc, was the ultimate control-freak subjugation of human chattel. Slavery over the millennia of human history derived from the spoils of war, not from cockamamie ideas of "race". That latter idea began with Columbus (who tried to enslave Indians and sent them back to Europe as "specimens") and left the launchpad of reason with the Spanish, French, British and Portuguese merchants dealing in human lives --- in other words, it derives from the greed of profit.
And by the way this part here:
>> This August marked 400 years since the first documented enslaved Africans arrived in the U.S. In 1619, a ship reached the Jamestown settlement in the colony of Virginia, carrying “some 20 and odd Negroes” who were kidnapped from their villages in present-day Angola. <<
... is off by 93 years. The first enslaved Africans were brought to (what is now) the US, South Carolina specifically, in 1526. The happy ending is that this particular group revolted and escaped to live among the Native Americans. Needless to say, the US did not exist in 1526 or 1619, so it's erroneous on that basis as well.
If the debts were in the form of a written contract.I respect your opinion BUT, I believe everyone is responsible for themselves, whether it is your child at 21 or your parents. I will help if I want or feel it is deserved, but don't tell me I owe somebody I NEVER MET. So in my opinion, we are NOT responsible for the actions-not debts- of our country when it was formed.I hope we can all agree that slavery is bad, and just because someone else did it first, or more, or any other aspect of it, that doesn't absolve us from participating. We, as a country condoned slavery, and that caused great harm that is still being felt by the descendants of slavery today. We need to acknowledge what our country did and try to remedy that harm as much as we can, and not try to blame it all on what somebody else did. Nobody alive today had anything to do with the slave trade when our country was formed, but we are the ones in charge of our country now, and we are responsible for the debts our country made back then.
Do you think our country should pay it's debts, even if it is years past the time those debts were originally made?
If the debts were in the form of a written contract.I respect your opinion BUT, I believe everyone is responsible for themselves, whether it is your child at 21 or your parents. I will help if I want or feel it is deserved, but don't tell me I owe somebody I NEVER MET. So in my opinion, we are NOT responsible for the actions-not debts- of our country when it was formed.I hope we can all agree that slavery is bad, and just because someone else did it first, or more, or any other aspect of it, that doesn't absolve us from participating. We, as a country condoned slavery, and that caused great harm that is still being felt by the descendants of slavery today. We need to acknowledge what our country did and try to remedy that harm as much as we can, and not try to blame it all on what somebody else did. Nobody alive today had anything to do with the slave trade when our country was formed, but we are the ones in charge of our country now, and we are responsible for the debts our country made back then.
Do you think our country should pay it's debts, even if it is years past the time those debts were originally made?
No-look at the due process missing from the Kavanaugh caper-so much for morality there. Our country is/was great because we had more lifters than leaners-people willing to sacrifice or give for the common good-charities, community events, barn raising, boy scout good deeds. With the selfishness I see now, yes, I WANT to see the paperwork!If the debts were in the form of a written contract.I respect your opinion BUT, I believe everyone is responsible for themselves, whether it is your child at 21 or your parents. I will help if I want or feel it is deserved, but don't tell me I owe somebody I NEVER MET. So in my opinion, we are NOT responsible for the actions-not debts- of our country when it was formed.I hope we can all agree that slavery is bad, and just because someone else did it first, or more, or any other aspect of it, that doesn't absolve us from participating. We, as a country condoned slavery, and that caused great harm that is still being felt by the descendants of slavery today. We need to acknowledge what our country did and try to remedy that harm as much as we can, and not try to blame it all on what somebody else did. Nobody alive today had anything to do with the slave trade when our country was formed, but we are the ones in charge of our country now, and we are responsible for the debts our country made back then.
Do you think our country should pay it's debts, even if it is years past the time those debts were originally made?
So screw em if they don't have the paperwork? Sorry, but I believe our country is great because we have historically done what was the moral thing to do. I guess that doesn't apply any more.
Then why are libs demanding the US pay reparations and no one else?Right. So instead of blaming the US for slavery, blame the bloody Spanish who were first here with slaves. The bastards!So it was not the American's fault, right?
it was not America's invention. Those people who ENGAGED in the barbaric
use of slavery -----did the barbaric thing that they did
"America", depending on what you mean by that, didn't even exist. The American continents of course did, but land masses don't come up with ideas. Again the TransAtlantic slave trade was capitalism gone wild, treating human beings as commodities and inventing the whole "inferior race" song and dance as justification for it. Such justification was sorely needed, as conscientious contemporaries voiced objections to the practice all the way back to Bartholomé de las Casas in the 1400s.
As in anything else, the fable was invented to excuse away the inhumanity. There were riches to be made in the then-new continents of America, and unscrupulous merchants were more than ready to line their own pockets. Simple as that.
Of course if by "America" we mean "The United States of...." that didn't even come into being until TransAtlantic African slavery was an established institution on the continents for almost three hundred years.
And AGAIN once again AGAIN --- the US did not exist when transAtlantic slaving established. It didn't exist in the 16th century. It didn't exist in the 17th century. It didn't exist until the END of the 18th century. Linear time therefore dictates that the US could not have started the slave trade. Maybe that's why NOBODY CLAIMED IT DID.
JESUS CHRIST ON A BICYCLE
Are you saying that it was a kinder, gentler, slavery before they came to America? Remarkable.Somehow all the Revisionist history has been about how bad us 'White Colonialists' were.
Nothing about untold Milennia of genocide and slavery in Africa.
Sorry but can't post whole artilce. Alas No exception is made for subscription sites either.
When the Slave Traders Were African
Those whose ancestors sold slaves to Europeans now struggle to come to terms with a painful legacy
By Adaobi Tricia Nwaubani
Sept. 20, 2019 - Wall Street Journal
When the Slave Traders Were African
This August marked 400 years since the first documented enslaved Africans arrived in the U.S. In 1619, a ship reached the Jamestown settlement in the colony of Virginia, carrying “some 20 and odd Negroes” who were kidnapped from their villages in present-day Angola. The anniversary coincides with a controversial debate in the U.S. about whether the country owes reparations to the descendants of slaves as compensation for centuries of injustice and inequality. It is a moment for posing questions of historic guilt and responsibility.
...Africans are now also reckoning with their own complicated legacy in the slave trade, and the infamous “Middle Passage” often looks different from across the Atlantic......The organization of the slave trade was structured to have the Europeans stay along the coast lines, relying on African middlemen and merchants to bring the slaves to them,” said Toyin Falola, a Nigerian professor of African studies at the University of Texas at Austin. “The Europeans couldn’t have gone into the interior to get the slaves themselves.”
The anguished debate over slavery in the U.S. is often silent on the role that Africans played. That silence is echoed in many African countries, where there is hardly any national discussion or acknowledgment of the issue. From nursery school through university in Nigeria, I was taught about great African cultures and conquerors of times past but not about African involvement in the slave trade. In an attempt to reclaim some of the dignity that we lost during colonialism, Africans have tended to magnify stories of a glorious past of rich traditions and brave achievement..... But there are other, less discussed chapters of our history. When I was growing up, my father Chukwuma Nwaubani spoke glowingly of my great-grandfather, Nwaubani Ogogo Oriaku, a chief among our Igbo ethnic group who sold slaves in the 19th century. “He was respected by everyone around,” he said. “Even the white people respected him.” From the 16th to the 19th centuries, an estimated 1.4 million Igbo people were transported across the Atlantic as slaves.
Some families have chosen to hide similar histories. “We speak of it in whispers,”....
[.....]
[.....]
Slave traders --- which existed everywhere --- in Africa, were still not cramming their human commodities into vessels to send them to another continent where the victims would have no connection with the land or the culture. What you're trying to refer to here without saying it, because it's inconvenient, is TransAtlantic slave traders. That --- the bold part --- was what made this particular slavery different from all others. That, and the concept of "slave for life" by simple virtue of one's race. NONE of that was present in previous slavery systems in Africa, Asia, Europe or Native America.
To be transported in chains to a foreign shore that may as well have been another planet, utterly unfamiliar in climate, culture, language, etc, was the ultimate control-freak subjugation of human chattel. Slavery over the millennia of human history derived from the spoils of war, not from cockamamie ideas of "race". That latter idea began with Columbus (who tried to enslave Indians and sent them back to Europe as "specimens") and left the launchpad of reason with the Spanish, French, British and Portuguese merchants dealing in human lives --- in other words, it derives from the greed of profit.
And by the way this part here:
>> This August marked 400 years since the first documented enslaved Africans arrived in the U.S. In 1619, a ship reached the Jamestown settlement in the colony of Virginia, carrying “some 20 and odd Negroes” who were kidnapped from their villages in present-day Angola. <<
... is off by 93 years. The first enslaved Africans were brought to (what is now) the US, South Carolina specifically, in 1526. The happy ending is that this particular group revolted and escaped to live among the Native Americans. Needless to say, the US did not exist in 1526 or 1619, so it's erroneous on that basis as well.
Okay, but some else posted this:If the Spanish did it first, its on them. The Brits were not in America till the 1600's.So the Spanish started this whole mess here. Let them pay somebody something.Slave traders --- which existed everywhere --- in Africa, were still not cramming their human commodities into vessels to send them to another continent where the victims would have no connection with the land or the culture. What you're trying to refer to here without saying it, because it's inconvenient, is TransAtlantic slave traders. That --- the bold part --- was what made this particular slavery different from all others. That, and the concept of "slave for life" by simple virtue of one's race. NONE of that was present in previous slavery systems in Africa, Asia, Europe or Native America.
To be transported in chains to a foreign shore that may as well have been another planet, utterly unfamiliar in climate, culture, language, etc, was the ultimate control-freak subjugation of human chattel. Slavery over the millennia of human history derived from the spoils of war, not from cockamamie ideas of "race". That latter idea began with Columbus (who tried to enslave Indians and sent them back to Europe as "specimens") and left the launchpad of reason with the Spanish, French, British and Portuguese merchants dealing in human lives --- in other words, it derives from the greed of profit.
And by the way this part here:
>> This August marked 400 years since the first documented enslaved Africans arrived in the U.S. In 1619, a ship reached the Jamestown settlement in the colony of Virginia, carrying “some 20 and odd Negroes” who were kidnapped from their villages in present-day Angola. <<
... is off by 93 years. The first enslaved Africans were brought to (what is now) the US, South Carolina specifically, in 1526. The happy ending is that this particular group revolted and escaped to live among the Native Americans. Needless to say, the US did not exist in 1526 or 1619, so it's erroneous on that basis as well.
Not "the Spanish" but that particular event was a Spanish excursion which was defying orders. Most of the slave trade was operated by British and Portuguese traders (who combined for about 70% of it), the latter mostly with Brazil, which the Pope had "awarded" them in 1500 when he carved up South America more or less equally between Spain and Portugal. A relatively small amount hailed from smaller and less colonial nations such as Denmark. But whether the trader was Spanish, British, French, Dutch, Portuguese or a privateer, what was always behind it was capitalistic greed --- not a nationality.
But no, a single guy commandeering a couple of ships in defiance of his orders does not constitute "the Spanish". That's a Composition Fallacy.
Once AGAIN ---- ONE GUY taking it on himself to bolt up to Carolina to try slaving does not make "the Spanish". It makes ONE GUY. One equals one. There is no "them" in "one".
British slaving began in 1562, with John Hawkins, in Hispaniola. Fun fact: 1562 was before the 1600s.
>> As the British American colonies demanded African slaves, the role of the African companies changed to supply them. From 1660, the British Crown passed various acts and granted charters to enable companies to settle, administer and exploit British interests on the West Coast of Africa and to supply slaves to the American colonies. The African companies were granted a monopoly to trade in slaves. This monopoly was criticised by other traders, and planters complained about restricted rights, limited supplies and high prices. This encouraged illegal traders (commonly called interlopers), many of whom were from other nations, especially the Dutch. Opposition from planters, traders and manufacturers was so strong that in 1698 the monopoly was removed.
Intense rivalry, illegal traders and the loss of monopoly meant that the African settlements were not as successful as they could be. The British government intervened on several occasions to grant new charters, pass acts to improve trade, subsidise the company and eventually take over the settlements. In addition to the African companies, other companies set up under Royal charters were involved in the slave trade. For example, the East India Company was involved in the East African slave trade but also collected slaves from the West Coast of Africa for its settlements in South and East Africa and in India and Asia. << --- National Archives (UK)
Also once again, British and Portuguese slave ships accounted for the vast majority of African slaving, almost three-quarters of the total, and Portugal's was almost exclusively confined to Brazil. Not that any of this nationality minutiae means jack shit.
.. is off by 93 years. The first enslaved Africans were brought to (what is now) the US, South Carolina specifically, in 1526. The happy ending is that this particular group revolted and escaped to live among the Native Americans. Needless to say, the US did not exist in 1526 or 1619, so it's erroneous on that basis as well.
So the Spanish started this whole mess here. Let them pay somebody something.
1526 is before 1562, so the Spanish DID it first! Leave the British and Americans out of this!
Are you saying that it was a kinder, gentler, slavery before they came to America? Remarkable.Somehow all the Revisionist history has been about how bad us 'White Colonialists' were.
Nothing about untold Milennia of genocide and slavery in Africa.
Sorry but can't post whole artilce. Alas No exception is made for subscription sites either.
When the Slave Traders Were African
Those whose ancestors sold slaves to Europeans now struggle to come to terms with a painful legacy
By Adaobi Tricia Nwaubani
Sept. 20, 2019 - Wall Street Journal
When the Slave Traders Were African
This August marked 400 years since the first documented enslaved Africans arrived in the U.S. In 1619, a ship reached the Jamestown settlement in the colony of Virginia, carrying “some 20 and odd Negroes” who were kidnapped from their villages in present-day Angola. The anniversary coincides with a controversial debate in the U.S. about whether the country owes reparations to the descendants of slaves as compensation for centuries of injustice and inequality. It is a moment for posing questions of historic guilt and responsibility.
...Africans are now also reckoning with their own complicated legacy in the slave trade, and the infamous “Middle Passage” often looks different from across the Atlantic......The organization of the slave trade was structured to have the Europeans stay along the coast lines, relying on African middlemen and merchants to bring the slaves to them,” said Toyin Falola, a Nigerian professor of African studies at the University of Texas at Austin. “The Europeans couldn’t have gone into the interior to get the slaves themselves.”
The anguished debate over slavery in the U.S. is often silent on the role that Africans played. That silence is echoed in many African countries, where there is hardly any national discussion or acknowledgment of the issue. From nursery school through university in Nigeria, I was taught about great African cultures and conquerors of times past but not about African involvement in the slave trade. In an attempt to reclaim some of the dignity that we lost during colonialism, Africans have tended to magnify stories of a glorious past of rich traditions and brave achievement..... But there are other, less discussed chapters of our history. When I was growing up, my father Chukwuma Nwaubani spoke glowingly of my great-grandfather, Nwaubani Ogogo Oriaku, a chief among our Igbo ethnic group who sold slaves in the 19th century. “He was respected by everyone around,” he said. “Even the white people respected him.” From the 16th to the 19th centuries, an estimated 1.4 million Igbo people were transported across the Atlantic as slaves.
Some families have chosen to hide similar histories. “We speak of it in whispers,”....
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Slave traders --- which existed everywhere --- in Africa, were still not cramming their human commodities into vessels to send them to another continent where the victims would have no connection with the land or the culture. What you're trying to refer to here without saying it, because it's inconvenient, is TransAtlantic slave traders. That --- the bold part --- was what made this particular slavery different from all others. That, and the concept of "slave for life" by simple virtue of one's race. NONE of that was present in previous slavery systems in Africa, Asia, Europe or Native America.
To be transported in chains to a foreign shore that may as well have been another planet, utterly unfamiliar in climate, culture, language, etc, was the ultimate control-freak subjugation of human chattel. Slavery over the millennia of human history derived from the spoils of war, not from cockamamie ideas of "race". That latter idea began with Columbus (who tried to enslave Indians and sent them back to Europe as "specimens") and left the launchpad of reason with the Spanish, French, British and Portuguese merchants dealing in human lives --- in other words, it derives from the greed of profit.
And by the way this part here:
>> This August marked 400 years since the first documented enslaved Africans arrived in the U.S. In 1619, a ship reached the Jamestown settlement in the colony of Virginia, carrying “some 20 and odd Negroes” who were kidnapped from their villages in present-day Angola. <<
... is off by 93 years. The first enslaved Africans were brought to (what is now) the US, South Carolina specifically, in 1526. The happy ending is that this particular group revolted and escaped to live among the Native Americans. Needless to say, the US did not exist in 1526 or 1619, so it's erroneous on that basis as well.
Feel free to refute anything I posted there. Until then, it stands.
Don't deflect-modern day Americans are not responsible for reparations perThen why are libs demanding the US pay reparations and no one else?Right. So instead of blaming the US for slavery, blame the bloody Spanish who were first here with slaves. The bastards!it was not America's invention. Those people who ENGAGED in the barbaric
use of slavery -----did the barbaric thing that they did
"America", depending on what you mean by that, didn't even exist. The American continents of course did, but land masses don't come up with ideas. Again the TransAtlantic slave trade was capitalism gone wild, treating human beings as commodities and inventing the whole "inferior race" song and dance as justification for it. Such justification was sorely needed, as conscientious contemporaries voiced objections to the practice all the way back to Bartholomé de las Casas in the 1400s.
As in anything else, the fable was invented to excuse away the inhumanity. There were riches to be made in the then-new continents of America, and unscrupulous merchants were more than ready to line their own pockets. Simple as that.
Of course if by "America" we mean "The United States of...." that didn't even come into being until TransAtlantic African slavery was an established institution on the continents for almost three hundred years.
And AGAIN once again AGAIN --- the US did not exist when transAtlantic slaving established. It didn't exist in the 16th century. It didn't exist in the 17th century. It didn't exist until the END of the 18th century. Linear time therefore dictates that the US could not have started the slave trade. Maybe that's why NOBODY CLAIMED IT DID.
JESUS CHRIST ON A BICYCLE
Then why are you selling strawmen?
You have no clue in the world what a Composition Fallacy is, do you.
Then why are libs demanding the US pay reparations and no one else?Right. So instead of blaming the US for slavery, blame the bloody Spanish who were first here with slaves. The bastards!it was not America's invention. Those people who ENGAGED in the barbaric
use of slavery -----did the barbaric thing that they did
"America", depending on what you mean by that, didn't even exist. The American continents of course did, but land masses don't come up with ideas. Again the TransAtlantic slave trade was capitalism gone wild, treating human beings as commodities and inventing the whole "inferior race" song and dance as justification for it. Such justification was sorely needed, as conscientious contemporaries voiced objections to the practice all the way back to Bartholomé de las Casas in the 1400s.
As in anything else, the fable was invented to excuse away the inhumanity. There were riches to be made in the then-new continents of America, and unscrupulous merchants were more than ready to line their own pockets. Simple as that.
Of course if by "America" we mean "The United States of...." that didn't even come into being until TransAtlantic African slavery was an established institution on the continents for almost three hundred years.
And AGAIN once again AGAIN --- the US did not exist when transAtlantic slaving established. It didn't exist in the 16th century. It didn't exist in the 17th century. It didn't exist until the END of the 18th century. Linear time therefore dictates that the US could not have started the slave trade. Maybe that's why NOBODY CLAIMED IT DID.
JESUS CHRIST ON A BICYCLE
Then why are you selling strawmen?
You have no clue in the world what a Composition Fallacy is, do you.
You would have to be open to a real discussion.Are you saying that it was a kinder, gentler, slavery before they came to America? Remarkable.Somehow all the Revisionist history has been about how bad us 'White Colonialists' were.
Nothing about untold Milennia of genocide and slavery in Africa.
Sorry but can't post whole artilce. Alas No exception is made for subscription sites either.
When the Slave Traders Were African
Those whose ancestors sold slaves to Europeans now struggle to come to terms with a painful legacy
By Adaobi Tricia Nwaubani
Sept. 20, 2019 - Wall Street Journal
When the Slave Traders Were African
This August marked 400 years since the first documented enslaved Africans arrived in the U.S. In 1619, a ship reached the Jamestown settlement in the colony of Virginia, carrying “some 20 and odd Negroes” who were kidnapped from their villages in present-day Angola. The anniversary coincides with a controversial debate in the U.S. about whether the country owes reparations to the descendants of slaves as compensation for centuries of injustice and inequality. It is a moment for posing questions of historic guilt and responsibility.
...Africans are now also reckoning with their own complicated legacy in the slave trade, and the infamous “Middle Passage” often looks different from across the Atlantic......The organization of the slave trade was structured to have the Europeans stay along the coast lines, relying on African middlemen and merchants to bring the slaves to them,” said Toyin Falola, a Nigerian professor of African studies at the University of Texas at Austin. “The Europeans couldn’t have gone into the interior to get the slaves themselves.”
The anguished debate over slavery in the U.S. is often silent on the role that Africans played. That silence is echoed in many African countries, where there is hardly any national discussion or acknowledgment of the issue. From nursery school through university in Nigeria, I was taught about great African cultures and conquerors of times past but not about African involvement in the slave trade. In an attempt to reclaim some of the dignity that we lost during colonialism, Africans have tended to magnify stories of a glorious past of rich traditions and brave achievement..... But there are other, less discussed chapters of our history. When I was growing up, my father Chukwuma Nwaubani spoke glowingly of my great-grandfather, Nwaubani Ogogo Oriaku, a chief among our Igbo ethnic group who sold slaves in the 19th century. “He was respected by everyone around,” he said. “Even the white people respected him.” From the 16th to the 19th centuries, an estimated 1.4 million Igbo people were transported across the Atlantic as slaves.
Some families have chosen to hide similar histories. “We speak of it in whispers,”....
[.....]
[.....]
Slave traders --- which existed everywhere --- in Africa, were still not cramming their human commodities into vessels to send them to another continent where the victims would have no connection with the land or the culture. What you're trying to refer to here without saying it, because it's inconvenient, is TransAtlantic slave traders. That --- the bold part --- was what made this particular slavery different from all others. That, and the concept of "slave for life" by simple virtue of one's race. NONE of that was present in previous slavery systems in Africa, Asia, Europe or Native America.
To be transported in chains to a foreign shore that may as well have been another planet, utterly unfamiliar in climate, culture, language, etc, was the ultimate control-freak subjugation of human chattel. Slavery over the millennia of human history derived from the spoils of war, not from cockamamie ideas of "race". That latter idea began with Columbus (who tried to enslave Indians and sent them back to Europe as "specimens") and left the launchpad of reason with the Spanish, French, British and Portuguese merchants dealing in human lives --- in other words, it derives from the greed of profit.
And by the way this part here:
>> This August marked 400 years since the first documented enslaved Africans arrived in the U.S. In 1619, a ship reached the Jamestown settlement in the colony of Virginia, carrying “some 20 and odd Negroes” who were kidnapped from their villages in present-day Angola. <<
... is off by 93 years. The first enslaved Africans were brought to (what is now) the US, South Carolina specifically, in 1526. The happy ending is that this particular group revolted and escaped to live among the Native Americans. Needless to say, the US did not exist in 1526 or 1619, so it's erroneous on that basis as well.
Feel free to refute anything I posted there. Until then, it stands.
Are you saying that it was a kinder, gentler, slavery before they came to America? Remarkable.Somehow all the Revisionist history has been about how bad us 'White Colonialists' were.
Nothing about untold Milennia of genocide and slavery in Africa.
Sorry but can't post whole artilce. Alas No exception is made for subscription sites either.
When the Slave Traders Were African
Those whose ancestors sold slaves to Europeans now struggle to come to terms with a painful legacy
By Adaobi Tricia Nwaubani
Sept. 20, 2019 - Wall Street Journal
When the Slave Traders Were African
This August marked 400 years since the first documented enslaved Africans arrived in the U.S. In 1619, a ship reached the Jamestown settlement in the colony of Virginia, carrying “some 20 and odd Negroes” who were kidnapped from their villages in present-day Angola. The anniversary coincides with a controversial debate in the U.S. about whether the country owes reparations to the descendants of slaves as compensation for centuries of injustice and inequality. It is a moment for posing questions of historic guilt and responsibility.
...Africans are now also reckoning with their own complicated legacy in the slave trade, and the infamous “Middle Passage” often looks different from across the Atlantic......The organization of the slave trade was structured to have the Europeans stay along the coast lines, relying on African middlemen and merchants to bring the slaves to them,” said Toyin Falola, a Nigerian professor of African studies at the University of Texas at Austin. “The Europeans couldn’t have gone into the interior to get the slaves themselves.”
The anguished debate over slavery in the U.S. is often silent on the role that Africans played. That silence is echoed in many African countries, where there is hardly any national discussion or acknowledgment of the issue. From nursery school through university in Nigeria, I was taught about great African cultures and conquerors of times past but not about African involvement in the slave trade. In an attempt to reclaim some of the dignity that we lost during colonialism, Africans have tended to magnify stories of a glorious past of rich traditions and brave achievement..... But there are other, less discussed chapters of our history. When I was growing up, my father Chukwuma Nwaubani spoke glowingly of my great-grandfather, Nwaubani Ogogo Oriaku, a chief among our Igbo ethnic group who sold slaves in the 19th century. “He was respected by everyone around,” he said. “Even the white people respected him.” From the 16th to the 19th centuries, an estimated 1.4 million Igbo people were transported across the Atlantic as slaves.
Some families have chosen to hide similar histories. “We speak of it in whispers,”....
[.....]
[.....]
Slave traders --- which existed everywhere --- in Africa, were still not cramming their human commodities into vessels to send them to another continent where the victims would have no connection with the land or the culture. What you're trying to refer to here without saying it, because it's inconvenient, is TransAtlantic slave traders. That --- the bold part --- was what made this particular slavery different from all others. That, and the concept of "slave for life" by simple virtue of one's race. NONE of that was present in previous slavery systems in Africa, Asia, Europe or Native America.
To be transported in chains to a foreign shore that may as well have been another planet, utterly unfamiliar in climate, culture, language, etc, was the ultimate control-freak subjugation of human chattel. Slavery over the millennia of human history derived from the spoils of war, not from cockamamie ideas of "race". That latter idea began with Columbus (who tried to enslave Indians and sent them back to Europe as "specimens") and left the launchpad of reason with the Spanish, French, British and Portuguese merchants dealing in human lives --- in other words, it derives from the greed of profit.
And by the way this part here:
>> This August marked 400 years since the first documented enslaved Africans arrived in the U.S. In 1619, a ship reached the Jamestown settlement in the colony of Virginia, carrying “some 20 and odd Negroes” who were kidnapped from their villages in present-day Angola. <<
... is off by 93 years. The first enslaved Africans were brought to (what is now) the US, South Carolina specifically, in 1526. The happy ending is that this particular group revolted and escaped to live among the Native Americans. Needless to say, the US did not exist in 1526 or 1619, so it's erroneous on that basis as well.
Feel free to refute anything I posted there. Until then, it stands.
yeah pogoid You claimed that the Americas "INVENTED THE "INFERIOR RACE" thing------BS!!!!!
Don't deflect-modern day Americans are not responsible for reparations perThen why are libs demanding the US pay reparations and no one else?Right. So instead of blaming the US for slavery, blame the bloody Spanish who were first here with slaves. The bastards!"America", depending on what you mean by that, didn't even exist. The American continents of course did, but land masses don't come up with ideas. Again the TransAtlantic slave trade was capitalism gone wild, treating human beings as commodities and inventing the whole "inferior race" song and dance as justification for it. Such justification was sorely needed, as conscientious contemporaries voiced objections to the practice all the way back to Bartholomé de las Casas in the 1400s.
As in anything else, the fable was invented to excuse away the inhumanity. There were riches to be made in the then-new continents of America, and unscrupulous merchants were more than ready to line their own pockets. Simple as that.
Of course if by "America" we mean "The United States of...." that didn't even come into being until TransAtlantic African slavery was an established institution on the continents for almost three hundred years.
And AGAIN once again AGAIN --- the US did not exist when transAtlantic slaving established. It didn't exist in the 16th century. It didn't exist in the 17th century. It didn't exist until the END of the 18th century. Linear time therefore dictates that the US could not have started the slave trade. Maybe that's why NOBODY CLAIMED IT DID.
JESUS CHRIST ON A BICYCLE
Then why are you selling strawmen?
You have no clue in the world what a Composition Fallacy is, do you.
Then why are libs demanding the US pay reparations and no one else?Right. So instead of blaming the US for slavery, blame the bloody Spanish who were first here with slaves. The bastards!"America", depending on what you mean by that, didn't even exist. The American continents of course did, but land masses don't come up with ideas. Again the TransAtlantic slave trade was capitalism gone wild, treating human beings as commodities and inventing the whole "inferior race" song and dance as justification for it. Such justification was sorely needed, as conscientious contemporaries voiced objections to the practice all the way back to Bartholomé de las Casas in the 1400s.
As in anything else, the fable was invented to excuse away the inhumanity. There were riches to be made in the then-new continents of America, and unscrupulous merchants were more than ready to line their own pockets. Simple as that.
Of course if by "America" we mean "The United States of...." that didn't even come into being until TransAtlantic African slavery was an established institution on the continents for almost three hundred years.
And AGAIN once again AGAIN --- the US did not exist when transAtlantic slaving established. It didn't exist in the 16th century. It didn't exist in the 17th century. It didn't exist until the END of the 18th century. Linear time therefore dictates that the US could not have started the slave trade. Maybe that's why NOBODY CLAIMED IT DID.
JESUS CHRIST ON A BICYCLE
Then why are you selling strawmen?
You have no clue in the world what a Composition Fallacy is, do you.
WSJ: When the Slave Traders Were African- that's the OP
Modern day Americans should not pay reparations for slavery-period- because slave traders were African too-got it? And your foray into logical hocus pocus doesn't impress.
