'Would the Tea Party Exist....'

[midcan5]

"Actually, there is no alienation that a little power will not cure." Eric Hoffer

Would the tea party exist if McCain had won? No, it would not. Even a leading tea party organizer admitted that aspect of the organization on Chris Matthews. So why? If you ask a tea party sympathizer they would tell you because McCain would be different. Of course he would be different, he would be a republican. Is that the only difference. The tea partier would of course say no.

So we know there would be no tea party if the republicans had won. That much is clear. If the tea party were a legitimate grass roots organization concerned with government and debt they would have attacked George W. Bush. They did not. So then next question, how is Obama different from Bush Jr? Well, he is not different in any fundamental way. Obama's policies so far differ nada with Bush Jr. OK then, why and whither the tea party?

Some would argue there are big differences between Obama and Bush, but a comparison so far is minimal. The difference is not real but created by the right after the loss of the presidency. Why? A simple reply would be if you think your ideology the right one, any change conflicts and confuses. Defining that ideology would be a challenge.

Jump back in that way-back machine for a moment to William Jefferson Clinton's election. Does anything seem the same? What is different? Hillary and Bill met the same anguished and resolute opposition, they were accused of the same socialism. Hillary was pilloried as beyond evil, often as the devil herself. Why? And what has changed. Eight more years of republican governance and power. Add more corporate money for think tanks, books, and other various propaganda and you have the makings of today.

Then there is the complex issue of race. Racists run from the label racist, only the skinheads actually admit their racism. Of course they will tell you they are protecting their race. For the tea party, racism exists at the fringes, but common foes always provide for an assorted group of odd bedfellows.

A great irony of the tea party is fact they appear mainstream and basically comfortable with their perks as baby boomers, social security recipients, and medicare participants. All the so called socialism they presumably are against provides them great comfort.

So who is their Marx, their Mao, because all movements of this sort have leaders. This is a question that deserves a study in mass movements. I would surely name Rush Limbaugh, Ann Coulter and many conservative and corporate think tanks, web sites, and blogs as their leader, or at least instigator. The run-up to the election was filled with the worst vitriol, and had the republicans under Bush not failed so badly, or even selected a change candidate - is that possible - the election may have been different.

Would the tea party exist if the republicans had won? The human mind often lives a narrative that is pure fantasy. Conservative media provided and provides that fantasy. If only things were different all would be well. If only someone else was in charge. It is the power of mass movements and mass hypnosis that motivates the tea party today. But it is the loss of power that motivates its leaders as it always has.


"Propaganda does not deceive people; it merely helps them to deceive themselves." Eric Hoffer

 

[CrusaderFrank]

The only reason I was glad Obama won was because it takes an incredible fuck up to get the Right interested and motivated to act in politics, and Lord knows, Obama, Pelosi and Reid are the biggest fuck ups we've ever had.

There was unorganized push back against Juan McCain and Dubya Illegal Immigration Plan in 2007, but Obama did galvanize us

 

[Stephanie]

Boy oh boy, all of a sudden a LOT of people are worried about the Tea Party.

you have to wonder why?

could it be the PROGRESSIVES are seeing their Lose of Power happening with election after election.?

Goodbye to ya Progressive freaks, wouldn't want to be ya.

 

[Oddball]

 

[editec]

Valid argument, I think.

Had McCain been elected we'd still be in Iraq and afghanistan, the banks WOULD have been bailed out, we'd still be spending way more than the government takes in, too.

But there'd be no teaparty movement, because the TP movement is a republican animal without doubt.

Instead, has McCain been elected, we'd have CODE PINK to laugh at like many of us now laugh at the idiots in the TP movement.

 

[Oddball]

Nobody can say that because the clock can't be turned back.

The OP is nothing more than poorly disguised race baiting, cowering behind a navel gazing "if only X had happened" fallacy.

 

[peach174]

What part of Tea Party are you all not getting? They are the silent majority of voters. They are made up of Repubs, Dems, and independents. They are sick and tired of both parties.
They want to get back to the republic form of government. Where it is a government repesentaion of the people by the people and not the special interests and only the special interests aka lobbyist's!!!!!

 

[Truthmatters]

What part of Tea Party are you all not getting? They are the silent majority of voters. They are made up of Repubs, Dems, and independents. They are sick and tired of both parties.
They want to get back to the republic form of government. Where it is a government repesentaion of the people by the people and not the special interests and only the special interests aka lobbyist's!!!!!

Bullshit.

They are NOT a majority.

They are a right wing fringe group.

 

[midcan5]

Valid argument, I think.

Had McCain been elected we'd still be in Iraq and afghanistan, the banks WOULD have been bailed out, we'd still be spending way more than the government takes in, too.

But there'd be no teaparty movement, because the TP movement is a republican animal without doubt.

Instead, has McCain been elected, we'd have CODE PINK to laugh at like many of us now laugh at the idiots in the TP movement.

Yes. Some get it, others hide their heads in the ground.

 

[California Girl]

Valid argument, I think.

Had McCain been elected we'd still be in Iraq and afghanistan, the banks WOULD have been bailed out, we'd still be spending way more than the government takes in, too.

But there'd be no teaparty movement, because the TP movement is a republican animal without doubt.

Instead, has McCain been elected, we'd have CODE PINK to laugh at like many of us now laugh at the idiots in the TP movement.

It's only a 'Republican animal' if you don't know the difference between Republican and Conservative. It's a Conservative movement.... and now the GOP are jumpin' all over it. Just like a bunch of politicians. Fucking assholes.

 

[Truthmatters]

hahahahahah


it was stolen as a platfrom from the Ron Paul crowd.

It is a libertarian creation.

Now its a right wing fringe nut palace

 

[midcan5]

It's only a 'Republican animal' if you don't know the difference between Republican and Conservative. It's a Conservative movement.... and now the GOP are jumpin' all over it. Just like a bunch of politicians. Fucking assholes.

Please tell us the difference, be specific, if you see and understand this difference, it should be easy to outline in enough detail that it contains some real meat so those of us who see not one difference can see.

 

[Immanuel]

What part of Tea Party are you all not getting? They are the silent majority of voters. They are made up of Repubs, Dems, and independents. They are sick and tired of both parties.
They want to get back to the republic form of government. Where it is a government repesentaion of the people by the people and not the special interests and only the special interests aka lobbyist's!!!!!

First, let me welcome you to USMB.

I have to disagree with you. Everything I have seen to date says that the only thing the Tea Party really cares about is electing Republicans.

California Girl has told me before (I think it was CG, if not I apologize to her and whoever it was that said it) that they only welcome Republicans that have "come over to their way of thinking". Well, I guess I haven't seen any Republicans that have not "come over to their way of thinking" because I sure have not seen a Republican that the Tea Party doesn't seem to like.

I'd also have to say that anyone in the Tea Party that actually believes that any Republican has actually "come over to their way of thinking" is an absolute fool. If a Republican politician seems to support the Tea Party, it is not because they have changed philosophies, it is because they think being seen with the tea party will bring them more votes than it costs them.

Immie

 

[jeffrockit]

What part of Tea Party are you all not getting? They are the silent majority of voters. They are made up of Repubs, Dems, and independents. They are sick and tired of both parties.
They want to get back to the republic form of government. Where it is a government repesentaion of the people by the people and not the special interests and only the special interests aka lobbyist's!!!!!

They are only getting the Tea Party that MSNBC and Chris Matthews and Rachel Maddow and Olberman show. They show the fringe freaks only, that every group has. They never show or interview the actual well read and researched members as it makes for a slow media day. If the left demonizes the party, they can get a few mindless followers over to the "Hope and Change" side. They won't really tell you how that is working out though.

 

[Tom Clancy]

Does that Card allow Unlimited Spending?

 

[Tom Clancy]

Valid argument, I think.

Had McCain been elected we'd still be in Iraq and afghanistan, the banks WOULD have been bailed out, we'd still be spending way more than the government takes in, too.

But there'd be no teaparty movement, because the TP movement is a republican animal without doubt.

Instead, has McCain been elected, we'd have CODE PINK to laugh at like many of us now laugh at the idiots in the TP movement.

It's only a 'Republican animal' if you don't know the difference between Republican and Conservative. It's a Conservative movement.... and now the GOP are jumpin' all over it. Just like a bunch of politicians. Fucking assholes.

In all Fairness CG, If it were a Conservative Movement they wouldn't be supporting Palin or any other Nut job out there..

But if your talking about what it Stands for then yes, you're right.

 

[Foxfyre]

It is difficult to say what would have transpired if McCain had won because none of us know for sure what McCain would have done. But I don't think there would have been a stimulus package. I don't think there would be a massive healthcare overhaul. I don't think that TARP would have been converted to a giant petty cash fund. I'm not sure what he would be doing re presumed global warming but cap and trade would be a bit less scary. I don't think the government would be the major stockholder in General Motors and we wouldn't be showing extreme favoritism to favored unions. We wouldn't have a West Wing full of unvetted and unapproved czars doing God knows what.

Iraq and Afghanistan have not been on the Tea Partier's 'to do' list so I'm thinking they don't have any big quarrels with the current Administration on that one. Would McCain have done things differently. No way to know.

I think there WOULD have been a big push to deregulate as much as possible, at least temporarily, to roll back taxes or make the Bush tax cuts permanent as much as possible to stimulate the economy. We wouldn't have had a trillion dollars of pork poured into it and called a stimulus package.

If I'm wrong about that, then yes, I think the Tea Parties would have emerged just the same because they are not political but motivated by principles, values, and ideals. And I don't think they give a tinkers dam which party comes through for them on that score.

 

[Old Rocks]

Ah yes, motivated by principles. "Keep Government out of my Medicare!" LOL.

The Teabaggers do perform a real service, in that they bring into daylight the lunitic fringe, and expose the ideas of the Conservatives for what they are. Conservatives, with a capital C, not to be confused with conservatives.

Another service they are performing is making sure that Democrats will be elected by replacing mainstream Republicans in the primaries with real fruitcakes. Amusing, and you have my full support.

 

[Foxfyre]

Then again, maybe the Tea Partiers would have emerged anyway just to keep the conservatives honest and to demand that government be restored to some reasonable and principled concepts. And as long as folks like Old Rocks think people who support those concepts are the 'lunatic fringe' we will need the Tea Party movement.

 

[Si modo]

The left sure is focused on race.

Hmmmm.