Discussion in 'Economy' started by KMAN, Jul 11, 2008.
1.) Income Tax
2.) Consumption Tax (VAT) - Sales Tax
Income Tax. I don't pay sales tax. I'm in Oregon. I do however get back way more in refunds with income tax than I put in.
A reasonable INCOME Tax. Contrary to popular belief poor people will get harder hit with sales tax then rich people.
Yup. I know it will hit my household harder.
Currently we get anywhere from $4500-6500 a year back in income taxes. We put in about $400-600.
The poor in our country are actually at a negative tax rate. They take out of government far more than they put in.
The Fair tax will liberate this country and create wealth.
The Fair Tax does this in many ways. Right now we have a tax code that punishes you for doing better. There is no incentive to climb the ladder. In Fact, you may be better off making less money.
You can't argue with more money in your hands. A National sales tax will benefit everyone as a while. It will also strengthen the dollar and bring down the price of OIL.
I'd have to spend a few pages explaining this but our poor people would not be poor anymore if we'd implement this new code.
If you want a vibrant economy and you want a future for your kids and grand kids, I suggest you really examine the FAIR TAX fairly.
Money is freedom, freedom is power. I want all of my freedom back.
I'm off to buy a cheeseburger before it's illegal to do so.
The "fair tax" is the let's help the Forbes family keep their money tax.....
Loved your sig but too early for attractive women even when they are drawings.
Consumption, aka fair tax is another oxymoron, 15% of poverty is lot more than 15% of weathiness. You have to have something to spend to buy, I'm always amazed that old economic nonsense has entered the heads of the social darwinist wingnuts in a society of a few haves and mostly have littles, each of us do less well when everyone doesn't have the opportunity to spend. A flourishing middle class and opportunity are the bedrock of a stable society.
It is impossible to really know without knowing what the VAT rate will be.
I see the number 23% used, but critics claim that the even that rate is fraudulent and the real rate is about 30%. (apparently it's a semantics issue...see FairTax - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia)
I believe that the "Fair Tax" will create wonderful career opportunities for the in the emerging black markets that will inevitably spring up in every hamlet, village, town and city in America.
I also believe that the overall market for used stuff would eventually become larger than the markets of new stuff.
OTOH, can that system be any worse that the wholesale fraud that our income tax system already is?
Of course it could.
Things, bad as they are, can always get worse.
So the question is who will this system benefit and who will it screw?
Critics say the poor will benefit (or at worse, it will be neutral), the middle class and upper middle classes will get screwed, and the better off will benefit tremendously.
We really have to see the numbers (and the assumptions behind those numbers, too) to really know.
A consumption tax is problematic because of the difficulty in calculating it and where to apply it. Does the farmer who buys the seed, fertilizer, and pays the cost of watering, cultivating, and harvesting the cotton pays it? Does the gin who buys the cotton from the farmer pay it? Does the mill who buys the ginned cotton to weave into cloth pay it? Does the clothing manufacturer who buys the cloth pay it? Does the wholesaler who buys it from the clothing manufacturer pay it? Does the retailer who buys it from the wholesaler pay it before they sell it to you who pays it again?
There is the problem of incremental creep. Any of us who pay property taxes and/or sales taxes know how easy it is to add that quarter cent to pay for this or that. It doesn't seem realy significant at the time, but put enough of those quarter cents together and it becomes a big deal.
Somebody pointed out that a sales/consumption tax is the most regressive of all taxes and does impact the poor most.
And finally there is the problem of getting one started. We have all already paid income taxes on the cash in our bank accounts. It would be tough to have to pay that much tax again when we spend it.
I would prefer a flat income tax with everybody, poor, middle class, and rich paying the same percentage with no exceptions--go to Ross Perot's idea of filing your income tax return on a post card. Even here we would have to think through the process very carefully to avoid counter productive consequences re property values, charitable contributions, etc.
There has to be a better way to do it than what we have now. But the devil is always in the details and few things worth doing are ever as simple as they first may seem.
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