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[JIHADTHIS]

Why jihadist's and their apologizers are a grave threat to the world:


Beyond Munich – The Spirit of Eurabia
By Bat Ye’or
FrontPageMagazine.com | July 2, 2004

The following presentation by Bat Ye'or was delivered at a seminar in the French Senate in Paris three weeks ago - The Editors.

*


Allow me first to make a preliminary observation about the title of this session: the ‘return of the spirit of Munich’ – a title which I find somewhat optimistic. At Munich, in 1938, France and England, exhausted by the death toll of the Great War, abandoned Czechoslovakia to the Nazi beast, in the hope that by doing so they would avoid another conflict. The “spirit of Munich” thus refers to a policy of states and of peoples who refuse to confront a threat, and attempt to obtain peace and security through conciliation and appeasement, or even, for some, an active collaboration with the criminals.



For my own part, I would say that we have gone beyond the spirit of Munich, and the present situation should be seen not in the context of the Second World War, but in the present jihadist context.



In fact, for the past 30 years France and Europe are living in a situation of passive self-defense against terrorism. This began with Palestinian terrorism, then Islamic terrorism, not to speak of the local European terrorism, including the Basques in Spain, the Baader-Meinhof group in Germany, and the Red Brigades of Italy of the 1980s.



One need only look at our cities, airports, and streets, at the schools with their security guards, even the systems of public transportation, not to mention the embassies, and the synagogues – to see the whole astonishing array of police and security services. The fact that the authorities everywhere refuse to name the evil does not negate that evil. Yet we know perfectly well that we have been under threat for a long time; one has only to open one’s eyes and our authorities know it better than any of us, because it is they who have ordered these very security measures.

Keep Reading:

http://www.frontpagemagazine.com/Articles/ReadArticle.asp?ID=14050

 

[Annie]

They are repeating history, the author is correct:

posted originally by Jihadthis

At Munich, in 1938, France and England, exhausted by the death toll of the Great War, abandoned Czechoslovakia to the Nazi beast, in the hope that by doing so they would avoid another conflict. The “spirit of Munich” thus refers to a policy of states and of peoples who refuse to confront a threat, and attempt to obtain peace and security through conciliation and appeasement, or even, for some, an active collaboration with the criminals.

Again, this is correct and something most Americans are unaware of or have forgotten:

In fact, for the past 30 years France and Europe are living in a situation of passive self-defense against terrorism. This began with Palestinian terrorism, then Islamic terrorism, not to speak of the local European terrorism, including the Basques in Spain, the Baader-Meinhof group in Germany, and the Red Brigades of Italy of the 1980s.

Europe needs to wake up and smell the :cof: Great post! :clap1:

 

[NATO AIR]

i think it is sad that many in europe are forgetting the lesson in fire the innocent civilians of Madrid recieved on 3/11. europe has gotten so used to annual terrorist attacks of small magnitude that it has lulled them into a false sense of security. they've gotten used to terrorism. i can't blame them for that, but after what happened on 3/11, i can't excuse them for not waking up and smelling the burning bodies that were strewn across train tracks and stations in madrid. their police forces are doing very well fighting terrorism, but their militaries (which aren't as bad as some would make it out, they can't compete with the US but that doesn't make them worthless) aren't doing nearly enough. and there will be more 9/11's and more 3/11's with that kind of attitude and negligence.

 

[Annie]

Originally posted by NATO AIR
i think it is sad that many in europe are forgetting the lesson in fire the innocent civilians of Madrid recieved on 3/11. europe has gotten so used to annual terrorist attacks of small magnitude that it has lulled them into a false sense of security. they've gotten used to terrorism. i can't blame them for that, but after what happened on 3/11, i can't excuse them for not waking up and smelling the burning bodies that were strewn across train tracks and stations in madrid. their police forces are doing very well fighting terrorism, but their militaries (which aren't as bad as some would make it out, they can't compete with the US but that doesn't make them worthless) aren't doing nearly enough. and there will be more 9/11's and more 3/11's with that kind of attitude and negligence.

They DO NOT feel 'secure', they are hoping they will be the last eaten...

 

[NATO AIR]

i think that's a sad viewpoint.. there are many bad apples over there, but not that many.

they have been experiencing terrorism on a regular scale for decades... that is a reasonable reason to get lulled into a false sense of normalcy. the europeans fight off the domestic terror groups, then the PLO starts bombing. they stop the PLO, then the islamists start. who next? that's what they seem to think.

the US on the other hand only really experienced 9/11, a cataclysmic event for America that shocked the world. america is not used to terrorism, it does not happen on an ordinary basis. europe is. 3/11 should have been their 9/11, and i think for their police and intelligence services, it was. their militaries and overall populaces however, are still lulled into a sense of normalcy.

it takes time.

 

[Annie]

Originally posted by NATO AIR
i think that's a sad viewpoint.. there are many bad apples over there, but not that many.

they have been experiencing terrorism on a regular scale for decades... that is a reasonable reason to get lulled into a false sense of normalcy. the europeans fight off the domestic terror groups, then the PLO starts bombing. they stop the PLO, then the islamists start. who next? that's what they seem to think.

the US on the other hand only really experienced 9/11, a cataclysmic event for America that shocked the world. america is not used to terrorism, it does not happen on an ordinary basis. europe is. 3/11 should have been their 9/11, and i think for their police and intelligence services, it was. their militaries and overall populaces however, are still lulled into a sense of normalcy.

it takes time.

Problem is, they don't HAVE TIME!

 

[NATO AIR]

we all do. we just don't know how much. i could say we've been out of time, but that would have to do with 15 years of incompetence from our national leadership on not securing russia's nuclear, chemical and biological arsenals.

they'll come around, who knows when? i'm not going to turn them away when they finally do wake up. we need all the help we can get. think its bad now? just wait till saudi arabia falls apart and pakistan's gov't gets overthrown.

that's why we need to put the afterburner in our speed to secure better relations with india and to help the iranian people themselves overthrew their rulers, along with helping Turkey into the EU.

 

[Annie]

Originally posted by NATO AIR
we all do. we just don't know how much. i could say we've been out of time, but that would have to do with 15 years of incompetence from our national leadership on not securing russia's nuclear, chemical and biological arsenals.

they'll come around, who knows when? i'm not going to turn them away when they finally do wake up. we need all the help we can get. think its bad now? just wait till saudi arabia falls apart and pakistan's gov't gets overthrown.

that's why we need to put the afterburner in our speed to secure better relations with india and to help the iranian people themselves overthrew their rulers, along with helping Turkey into the EU.

UMmm, the US couldn't have secured Russia's weapons, they are soverign state, communist or not. That was silly.

It's not US turning from Europe, at least not at first, though waving away the NATO offer was a bit of a slap. It's not Europe that is against the US, but rather France, Germany, and European intellectuals and writers. The governments in most of Europe are behind the US, though the people are not, which is why Schroeder ran as anti-American. It's confusing, but bridges are falling and others being built. Nothing stays static, I believe we are living through a paradigm making era, which we won't know, until they are formed.

 

[NATO AIR]

you're right about europe

about russia and its WMD, they've been asking for our help for 15 years with this. they don't have enough money, which is why Sen. Nunn (ret.) and Sen. Lugar, among many other senators, have worked so hard to help the Russians secure those weapons.

russia doesn't want to get rid of all its WMD, just a lot of it that they can't use or don't want, and that which they cannot guard anymore.

 

[Annie]

Originally posted by NATO AIR
you're right about europe

about russia and its WMD, they've been asking for our help for 15 years with this. they don't have enough money, which is why Sen. Nunn (ret.) and Sen. Lugar, among many other senators, have worked so hard to help the Russians secure those weapons.

russia doesn't want to get rid of all its WMD, just a lot of it that they can't use or don't want, and that which they cannot guard anymore.

Ok on the Russian thing, we did drop the ball on helping them out. I thought so at the time, especially with investment money. You know Stalin turned down Marshall Plan aid, I figured we should have renewed the offer when it all came tumbling down. Problem was, there was history of US investment in Russia for 2 centuries, every time investments made, the state took it and the people had to run for their lives, some not making it. So there you go. Ecologically and militarily they have a big problem. Seems to me that we should help out, but wouldn't you think that EU should also be addressing?

 

[NATO AIR]

yea the EU should work the economic/environmental part, we should work the WMD part.

one day hopefully Russia will be part of a renewed, improved NATO and EU.

 

[Annie]

Originally posted by NATO AIR
yea the EU should work the economic/environmental part, we should work the WMD part.

one day hopefully Russia will be part of a renewed, improved NATO and EU.

One day soon Russia can take our place in NATO, turning it into a European defense, bought and paid for by EU, and their rightful place in EU.

 

[NATO AIR]

well i wouldn't say all that but

who knows?

i would like to see a world defense organization filled with our NATO allies (save France probably), Japan, India, Nigeria, Brazil, Jordan, Israel, Iraq, Russia, Singapore, Australia and a few other nations.

doubt it would happen, but India, Singapore and Brazil will all be important allies in the future that we are not cultivating enough right now.

 

[Annie]

Originally posted by NATO AIR
well i wouldn't say all that but

who knows?

i would like to see a world defense organization filled with our NATO allies (save France probably), Japan, India, Nigeria, Brazil, Jordan, Israel, Iraq, Russia, Singapore, Australia and a few other nations.

doubt it would happen, but India, Singapore and Brazil will all be important allies in the future that we are not cultivating enough right now.

It's back to the paradigm again, we can't see who is going to end up on the bridges and which bridges will come down. It's a very unsettled time.

 

[NATO AIR]

how long till the dust settles?

2-3 years? 5? 10? 20?

 

[Annie]

Originally posted by NATO AIR
how long till the dust settles?

2-3 years? 5? 10? 20?

I'd say that we'll have to watch what happens with the elections and the WOT. If we stop, the whole shebang goes on hold while the networks rebuild and they will rebuild. Then we'll pick it up once again.

If we press on, it's hard to tell, but staff report #15 of the 911 Commission says that al queda is no longer able to mount an attack on the US, at his time. So, will it turn into a religious war, which I fear? Will it be beaten back to their own hinterlands? Time will tell...

 

[NATO AIR]

yep

and what happens with saudi arabia and pakistan?

will iran be free before the decade ends?


etc
etc

 

[Annie]

Originally posted by NATO AIR
yep

and what happens with saudi arabia and pakistan?

will iran be free before the decade ends?


etc
etc

I think SA is going to fall, I think perhaps along the lines of the French Revolution, with swords instead of guillotine.

Pakistan is a ? Right now my thinking is the government IS really reforming, but their people don't want it, that's NOT going to work.

Iran, the mullahs are heavily armed and ruthless, they control the military, see British sailors held. No, I don't think the young are going to be able to overthrow, but would not be surprised to see young bailing as refugees.* This could change rapidly if US or Israel moves here.*

 

[NATO AIR]

i see the revolution happening with both pakistan and saudi

i do hold out hope for iran though, their rulers are so discredited among their own people, and as the baby boom there continues until about 2015, that means only more and more young people sick and tired of theocracy and watching satellite images of America and Europe's democracy

 

[Annie]

Originally posted by NATO AIR
i see the revolution happening with both pakistan and saudi

i do hold out hope for iran though, their rulers are so discredited among their own people, and as the baby boom there continues until about 2015, that means only more and more young people sick and tired of theocracy and watching satellite images of America and Europe's democracy

I thought the same about Iran during the summer 2001, when that was extinquished, I changed my mind. Hope I'm wrong. As I said though, if US or Israel moves on in here, things could change rapidly and I think there is a good chance of that, if the WOT continues....