Tax incentives are mandates

Discussion in 'Law and Justice System' started by dblack, Jun 29, 2012.

  1. dblack
    Offline

    dblack Gold Member

    Joined:
    May 21, 2011
    Messages:
    21,518
    Thanks Received:
    2,079
    Trophy Points:
    245
    Ratings:
    +4,272
    One of the things I've been railing about for years (and been roundly ignored on for years :D) is the insidious practice of using various form of tax rebates (deductions, credits, etc..) as a means of manipulating society. They are the functional equivalent of mandates that carry a financial penalty.

    If there is a silver lining to the travesty of the ACA, it's that it has highlighted this equivalency in all it's ugliness. Those of you opposed to the individual mandate, who defend tax policies like the home mortgage deduction, need to think long and hard about what's going on. They are essentially the same thing.

    The insurance mandate tells us we must buy insurance, or pay more taxes. The home mortgage deduction says that we must commit to home debt, or pay more taxes. Same thing. All income tax deductions that aren't legitimately part of calculating net income, indulge the same corrupt practice. It allows congress to enact laws that dictate behavior (and punish those who do not comply) in ways that would never be tolerated if they were enacted honestly as straightforward laws. They're using the power to tax far, far beyond it's intent as a backdoor tool to legislate broadly.

    This is what we're up against.
     
    • Thank You! Thank You! x 1
    Last edited: Jun 29, 2012
  2. Mr. H.
    Offline

    Mr. H. Diamond Member

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2009
    Messages:
    44,174
    Thanks Received:
    9,279
    Trophy Points:
    2,030
    Location:
    A warm place with no memory.
    Ratings:
    +15,481
    We've only been roundly ignoring you for one year.

    Other than that, nice post.
     
  3. onecut39
    Offline

    onecut39 VIP Member

    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2008
    Messages:
    1,524
    Thanks Received:
    140
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Ratings:
    +150
    You act as if you have discovered something new. Any fee charged by government is essentially a tax. The word tax, like "liberal", has been demonized into a political cuss word.

    It is the political way of dealing with an ignorant electorate. A whore becomes more acceptable when called an "escort".
     
  4. dblack
    Offline

    dblack Gold Member

    Joined:
    May 21, 2011
    Messages:
    21,518
    Thanks Received:
    2,079
    Trophy Points:
    245
    Ratings:
    +4,272
    I certainly didn't mean to give the impression there's anything "new" going on. But I do find that most people don't connect the dots. They fall for the psychological trick used to sell us on tax incentives and see them as positive bonuses rather than the overreaching mandates that they are.

    The travesty of the ACA, specifically the individual mandate, is an opportunity for people, those who still have some respect for freedom and limited government, to see things as they are; To recognize that discriminatory taxation - using targeted tax policy to dictate behavior - is an abuse of the taxation power. It's an end run around limited government and has been used by Congress to expand its power far beyond what the Constitution authorizes.
     
  5. Ravi
    Offline

    Ravi Diamond Member

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2008
    Messages:
    84,773
    Thanks Received:
    13,152
    Trophy Points:
    2,205
    Location:
    Hating Hatters
    Ratings:
    +34,789
    This is all very true which makes the current "conservative" meltdown all the more amusing. I've been pointing out for years that the mortgage deduction is just as much of a handout as food stamps but "conservatives" always strenuously disagree.

    Fact is, people like THEIR handouts but not anyone else's.
     
  6. C_Clayton_Jones
    Offline

    C_Clayton_Jones Diamond Member

    Joined:
    Apr 28, 2011
    Messages:
    41,840
    Thanks Received:
    9,024
    Trophy Points:
    2,030
    Location:
    In a Republic, actually
    Ratings:
    +24,454
    In your personal, subjective, unsubstantiated opinion.

    It has nothing to do with ‘we,’ but you’re up against the fact there is no case law in support of your position.

    Yes, we know, the courts are just as culpable as legislative entities in ‘raping’ the Constitution. But case law is the only language possible to debate such issues, as it’s the sole language of the Constitution, and if one refuses to speak the language, debate is impossible.
     
  7. dblack
    Offline

    dblack Gold Member

    Joined:
    May 21, 2011
    Messages:
    21,518
    Thanks Received:
    2,079
    Trophy Points:
    245
    Ratings:
    +4,272
    *sigh*

    Listen man, I don't give a rat's ass about your 'case law'. I'm talking about right and wrong. I'm talking about the principles of equal protection and limited government and how discriminatory taxation is a gross violation of those principles. I'm talking to people who care about these issues. I know that you don't, so I don't expect you to agree.
     
  8. Leweman
    Offline

    Leweman Gold Member

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2010
    Messages:
    4,270
    Thanks Received:
    514
    Trophy Points:
    155
    Ratings:
    +957
    deductions are just a way of complicating the tax code to employ more bureaucratic dickheads and for the govt to hold more power over citizens
     
  9. dblack
    Offline

    dblack Gold Member

    Joined:
    May 21, 2011
    Messages:
    21,518
    Thanks Received:
    2,079
    Trophy Points:
    245
    Ratings:
    +4,272
    They're more than that. They are backdoor legislation dictating our behavior in ways that Congress could never get away with via real laws.

    If Congress passed laws requiring us to have children, to take out home loans, to "buy green", to go to college, to buy hybrid cars, etc... or be penalized for refusing, then it would be more obvious to all of us what a gross abuse of state power these incentive games really are. But re-framing it in that way wouldn't change the effective nature of the "incentives" one bit.

    Tax incentives are mandates. And they've been snuck in on us as we slept to massively expand the power of government.
     
  10. TruthSeeker56
    Offline

    TruthSeeker56 Silver Member

    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2011
    Messages:
    2,899
    Thanks Received:
    484
    Trophy Points:
    98
    Location:
    New Hampshire
    Ratings:
    +503
    You are comparing, and confusing, a "penalty" with a "tax".

    Of course, to most liberals, a tax and a penalty are the same thing, so I fully understand your "logic".

    Liberals believe that people should be PENALIZED for earning money.

    Liberals believe that people should be PENALIZED for spending the money they have earned.

    Liberals believe that people should be PENALIZED for driving a motor vehicle.

    Liberals believe that people should be PENALIZED for owning a home.

    Liberals believe that people should be PENALIZED for owning a business.

    Liberals believe that people should be PENALIZED for being SUCCESSFUL, period.
     

Share This Page