Stockton, Ca., largest city....so far to file BK

[Meister]

Stockton bankruptcy can move forward, judge rules

The $900 million Stockton owes to the California Public Employees Retirement System to cover pensions is its biggest debt -– as is the case with many cities in California.

Stockton slashed its police and fire departments, halted bond payments, cut employee benefits and adopted an emergency spending plan that cut many city services. But the city continues to pay into the state pension
http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-ln-stockton-bankrupt-20130401,0,7979388.story

Seems they have their priorities intact.
Perhaps "Moonbeam" Brown can give a speech on how well things are going in Ca.

 

[martybegan]

Stockton bankruptcy can move forward, judge rules

The $900 million Stockton owes to the California Public Employees Retirement System to cover pensions is its biggest debt -– as is the case with many cities in California.

Stockton slashed its police and fire departments, halted bond payments, cut employee benefits and adopted an emergency spending plan that cut many city services. But the city continues to pay into the state pension
Stockton bankruptcy can move forward, judge rules - latimes.com

Seems they have their priorities intact.
Perhaps "Moonbeam" Brown can give a speech on how well things are going in Ca.

California in general is so, so boned.

 

[HereWeGoAgain]

All you can do is shake your head. I dont understand how a whole state can be so blind as to not see whats coming.
They trot out more and more social programs and wonder why they're broke.
The shits criminal.

 

[Meister]

All you can do is shake your head. I dont understand how a whole state can be so blind as to not see whats coming.
They trot out more and more social programs and wonder why they're broke.
The shits criminal.

The government should take note on what is happening to Stockton, and exactly what and how the city got to this point....and learn from it. Somehow, I don't think there is a politician that is smart enough to care, it's more, party trumps the American people.

 

[freedombecki]

I'm sorry to hear of Stockton's fiscal ills.

 

[WillowTree]

Stockton bankruptcy can move forward, judge rules

The $900 million Stockton owes to the California Public Employees Retirement System to cover pensions is its biggest debt -– as is the case with many cities in California.

Stockton slashed its police and fire departments, halted bond payments, cut employee benefits and adopted an emergency spending plan that cut many city services. But the city continues to pay into the state pension
Stockton bankruptcy can move forward, judge rules - latimes.com

Seems they have their priorities intact.
Perhaps "Moonbeam" Brown can give a speech on how well things are going in Ca.

does this mean they get to re negotiate all their union contracts?

 

[Meister]

Stockton bankruptcy can move forward, judge rules

The $900 million Stockton owes to the California Public Employees Retirement System to cover pensions is its biggest debt -– as is the case with many cities in California.

Stockton slashed its police and fire departments, halted bond payments, cut employee benefits and adopted an emergency spending plan that cut many city services. But the city continues to pay into the state pension
Stockton bankruptcy can move forward, judge rules - latimes.com

Seems they have their priorities intact.
Perhaps "Moonbeam" Brown can give a speech on how well things are going in Ca.

does this mean they get to re negotiate all their union contracts?

They could, I'm sure if they wanted to...but, they are still paying the pensions, sooooo......

 

[Trajan]

they are going to stiff in the end the 2 companies that guarantee the bonds they bought between say 2000 and 2008.... (Assured Guaranty and National Public Finance Guarantee).

a) the city council who supervised all this spending, the run up in Police and FD salaries and benefits (and authorized NON voted 'supra' benefits like a 9% pay bump for any city employees handling canines etc. ) should be those that carry 90% of the blame....but shit, whats to do?

b) the folks who took those jobs in/for the city, or where there already when the 'good' times started well, hey they took what they were offered or could get....


c) the public sector, hell, they won't get to keep it, or get paid out, not in the long run.
math is math, BSing & actuarial trix can get you only so far, there just aint enough money and enough productivity to foot the bill long term period, no matter who they stiff now.

d) by stiffing the bond agencies and cutting Principal on the debt. ( by almost 80%) hello, not interest, Principal, ( that is those that the bond agencies paid to insure them) , this will cost at least a quarter point for every other muni. west of the Mississippi down the road to make up the loss as those 2 companies are about the only ones standing that guarantee debt that big and chancy.

e) its amazing to me, that any gov. would borrow ahead like that, that is secure a deal for $$$ now, to pay current benefits while at the same time you are short changing the future retirees by not honoring in full and, at the same time, borrowing to make the deposits you have to make into Calpers for the future pensioners too....smh..

 

[Trajan]

Stockton bankruptcy can move forward, judge rules

The $900 million Stockton owes to the California Public Employees Retirement System to cover pensions is its biggest debt -– as is the case with many cities in California.

Stockton slashed its police and fire departments, halted bond payments, cut employee benefits and adopted an emergency spending plan that cut many city services. But the city continues to pay into the state pension
Stockton bankruptcy can move forward, judge rules - latimes.com

Seems they have their priorities intact.
Perhaps "Moonbeam" Brown can give a speech on how well things are going in Ca.

does this mean they get to re negotiate all their union contracts?

nope, the unions gave up some shit around the edges , special bonuses the canine pay, other perks......won't matter.

Calpers also told them , you don't pay the pensions fund ( that is-Calpers) they would take them into court and tie up their funds for a decade.....

 

[RoadVirus]

All you can do is shake your head. I dont understand how a whole state can be so blind as to not see whats coming.

The government is run by Liberals. That says it all.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Frances Piven is smiling

 

[Wonky Pundit]

Typical California thread here. No one so far has the first clue about why the state has so many fiscal troubles now. It's the state's Constitution, and the abuse thereof. Neither the right or the left is interested in stopping it.

 

[PoliticalChic]

All you can do is shake your head. I dont understand how a whole state can be so blind as to not see whats coming.
They trot out more and more social programs and wonder why they're broke.
The shits criminal.

Politicians.

Of all stripes....


From a review of Sowell's book:
Dr. Thomas Sowell, in “Applied Economics: Thinking Beyond Stage One,” challenges individuals to analyze not only their short term (Stage One) impact but to also think ahead to their long term (Stage Two, Three, etc) impact. Politicians do not think beyond Stage One because they will be praised (and elected) for the short term benefits but will not be held accountable much later when the long term consequences appear.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Stockton bankruptcy can move forward, judge rules

The $900 million Stockton owes to the California Public Employees Retirement System to cover pensions is its biggest debt -– as is the case with many cities in California.

Stockton slashed its police and fire departments, halted bond payments, cut employee benefits and adopted an emergency spending plan that cut many city services. But the city continues to pay into the state pension
Stockton bankruptcy can move forward, judge rules - latimes.com

Seems they have their priorities intact.
Perhaps "Moonbeam" Brown can give a speech on how well things are going in Ca.

does this mean they get to re negotiate all their union contracts?

They could, I'm sure if they wanted to...but, they are still paying the pensions, sooooo......

1.[State and municipal] outstanding debt has soared to $2.2 trillion today from $1.4 trillion in 2000. State and local borrowing as a percentage of the country's GDP has risen to an all-time high of 22% [$3.2 trillion] in 2010 from 15%, with projections that it will reach 24% [$4 trillion] by 2012. Steven Malanga: America's Municipal Debt Racket - WSJ.com

a. Unfunded liabilities of state and local pensions total $3.8 trillion

 

[Mad Scientist]

I read an article in WSJ back in 07 or 08 that detailed how CalPers was going broke.
I called my Sister who is a City Employee (Not Stockton) and is depending entirely upon CalPers for her retirement and the convo went like this:

Me: "Hey Sis, can you change your retirement account to something else"?
Her: "No".
Me: "Can you take a loan out against it to invest somewhere else?"
Her: "No".

I then told her about the article and while she got really upset. Not about the Problem itself, be ME for telling her about it!

But that's ok, California is gonna' go broke and do a "Cypris" on anyone who has a Bank account there. I guarantee it.

 

[Trajan]

Typical California thread here. No one so far has the first clue about why the state has so many fiscal troubles now. It's the state's Constitution, and the abuse thereof. Neither the right or the left is interested in stopping it.

oh, let me guess- prop 13?



if so;
your answer would be to lift the property tax cap so they could soaks everyone, and I mean everyone.....low middle and upper class, becasue thats what happens in states minus one, like Illinois, new jersey etc...it solves dick, if we had never had prop 13 we'd be right here anyway with an even larger past present and future out migration to deal with.

 

[Trajan]

I read an article in WSJ back in 07 or 08 that detailed how CalPers was going broke.
I called my Sister who is a City Employee (Not Stockton) and is depending entirely upon CalPers for her retirement and the convo went like this:

Me: "Hey Sis, can you change your retirement account to something else"?
Her: "No".
Me: "Can you take a loan out against it to invest somewhere else?"
Her: "No".

I then told her about the article and while she got really upset. Not about the Problem itself, be ME for telling her about it!

But that's ok, California is gonna' go broke and do a "Cypris" on anyone who has a Bank account there. I guarantee it.

I am pretty sure the sate cannot suborn federal guarantees ala the FDIC. Now, I am not saying something similar won't happen.

Argentina took over all pensions all of its national and state(district) pension funds.....I wonder if the state could take over Calpers?

 

[thereisnospoon]

All you can do is shake your head. I dont understand how a whole state can be so blind as to not see whats coming.
They trot out more and more social programs and wonder why they're broke.
The shits criminal.

It is not just the social spending which is funded by the state. Stockton has a very lucrative pension and benefit package for the municipal employees. So lucrative it is the finest in the state. The other issue is Stockton is $900 million in arrears for it's share of the State pension fund.
Stockton, Calif. to Enter Bankruptcy, Largest City To Date | TheBlaze.com
And of course guess who is screaming the loudest? The fucking public worker unions....

 

[thereisnospoon]

Stockton bankruptcy can move forward, judge rules

The $900 million Stockton owes to the California Public Employees Retirement System to cover pensions is its biggest debt -– as is the case with many cities in California.

Stockton slashed its police and fire departments, halted bond payments, cut employee benefits and adopted an emergency spending plan that cut many city services. But the city continues to pay into the state pension
Stockton bankruptcy can move forward, judge rules - latimes.com

Seems they have their priorities intact.
Perhaps "Moonbeam" Brown can give a speech on how well things are going in Ca.

does this mean they get to re negotiate all their union contracts?

Yes.

 

[thereisnospoon]

Stockton bankruptcy can move forward, judge rules

The $900 million Stockton owes to the California Public Employees Retirement System to cover pensions is its biggest debt -– as is the case with many cities in California.

Stockton slashed its police and fire departments, halted bond payments, cut employee benefits and adopted an emergency spending plan that cut many city services. But the city continues to pay into the state pension
Stockton bankruptcy can move forward, judge rules - latimes.com

Seems they have their priorities intact.
Perhaps "Moonbeam" Brown can give a speech on how well things are going in Ca.

does this mean they get to re negotiate all their union contracts?

They could, I'm sure if they wanted to...but, they are still paying the pensions, sooooo......

The city may be forced to stop the pension altogether in order to preserve capital to fund essential services. Or it can compel the workers to dramatically increase their contributions.
Either way, the method by which Stockton's municipal workers are compensated will change dramatically.
Some pretty high wages here....Even for unskilled or low skilled positions...I like this one...."graffiti abatement technician"....In other words, Stockton pays people $50k per year to wash spray paint from walls.