Poland and czech republic ban germany’s green energy

Discussion in 'Environment' started by daveman, Dec 29, 2012.

  1. daveman
    Offline

    daveman Diamond Member

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2010
    Messages:
    51,299
    Thanks Received:
    5,692
    Trophy Points:
    1,775
    Location:
    On the way to the Dark Tower.
    Ratings:
    +5,758
    POLAND AND CZECH REPUBLIC BAN GERMANY’S GREEN ENERGY

    In order to boost Germany’s ‘ecological wonder’ of its green energy transition, the Federal Republic has used power grids of neighboring countries – without asking permission. For this short-sighted policy, the German government is now being punished.

    Germany considers itself the environmental conscience of the world: with its nuclear phase-out and the green energy transition, the federal government wanted to give the world a model to follow. However, blinded by its own halo Germany overlooked that others have to pay for this green image boost and are suffering as a result.

    For example, Germany’s ‘eco-miracle’ simply used the power grids of neighboring countries not only without asking permission but also without paying for it. Now Poland and the Czech Republic have pulled the plug and are building a huge switch-off at their borders with Germany to block the uninvited import of green energy from Germany which is destabalising their grids and are thus risking blackouts.

    --

    Germany’s federal government made the nuclear phase-out decision without any consultation with their European patrens and irrespüective of any implications for partner countries. The green decision was rushed through without regard to transport capacity. For their short-sighted, self-centered actionistic energy policy the German government is now paying the price​
     
    • Thank You! Thank You! x 1
  2. Trakar
    Offline

    Trakar VIP Member

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2011
    Messages:
    1,699
    Thanks Received:
    73
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Ratings:
    +73


    And yet, when you read the actual german tabloid ("Die Welt") that this story originally can from, it talks about the reason the Czech and Polish governments are complaining is because the cheaper Germany renewable energies mean that Czech and Polish power companies are preferentially buying the cheaper imported German renewable power over the more expensively produced domestic hydrocarbon and nuclear power. IOW, the tiff is more than what meets the eye: Cheaper green electricity from Germany pushes its neighbors out of the market – and the Central Europeans thus want to block it, by force if necessary.

    Figures, first the US conservidiots want to copy the same types of austerity measures that pushed their Eastern European idols into a double dip recession, and now they want to emulate their ideological lockstep path in rejecting domestic, clean, cheaper and abundant renewable energy.

    the Germans are pushing back. The Central Europeans are trying to justify their reliance on antiquated nuclear reactors, the German authorities say, as well as their plans to build more in the near future. Prague hopes to increase its nuclear generation capacity share to 55% of its national supply by 2040 (It is currently at 35%.) The Poles want their very first reactor and running by 2020. By blocking the German access to their grid, they prevent Germany companies from selling their electricity, which is cheaper than that of the Central Europeans, to Austria and other Eastern european nations that are clamoring for cheap German renewable electricity.

    Rainer Baake, director of the think tank Agora Energiewende explains "Germany's increase in clean energy has led to Germany's wholesale electricity prices becoming cheaper and cheaper. Now it's less expensive to import electricity from Germany than to produce it in coal fired power plants in Eastern Europe – let alone to build new nuclear power plants."

    According to many German energy experts, the naysayers couldn't envision how the new energy economy would work. Rainer Baake, who brokered the original plan to phase out nuclear, said the critics didn't understand that while a single source of renewable energy can't match the constant power of a coal or nuclear plant, a mix of renewable sources can achieve a similar result. For example, solar power produces a predictable range of energy during the day, while winds blow primarily at night. Getting the mix right isn't easy. But so far, Baake argued, Germany's experience suggests that it is possible.
    (Germany Abandons Nuclear Power and Lives to Talk About It - Businessweek)

    Personally, I think there is an important and strong role for nuclear power in the US energy system, but defending andpromoting that role doesn't require me to lie or distort the roles of other energy sources.
     
    • Thank You! Thank You! x 1
  3. Old Rocks
    Offline

    Old Rocks Diamond Member

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2008
    Messages:
    46,470
    Thanks Received:
    5,416
    Trophy Points:
    1,840
    Location:
    Portland, Ore.
    Ratings:
    +10,313
    So, now we see another 'Conservative' taking point shown for the lie it contains. Poor Germans, paying less for their energy than their neighbors,. How are they ever going to get over it.
     
  4. emptystep
    Offline

    emptystep VIP Member

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2012
    Messages:
    3,654
    Thanks Received:
    220
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Ratings:
    +221
    I side note. When I was stationed in Germany just outside a small town in Norddeutschland there was a wind turbine right side my barracks window. I always thought it was cool going around around in silence. It was like a giant silent alchemist turning the flow of wind into the flow of electrons. When ran the back roads for training I practically ran right underneath it. That was in 1989. Renewable energy is not new to Germany.
     
  5. daveman
    Offline

    daveman Diamond Member

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2010
    Messages:
    51,299
    Thanks Received:
    5,692
    Trophy Points:
    1,775
    Location:
    On the way to the Dark Tower.
    Ratings:
    +5,758
    So, you guys have no problem with enviro-nuts dictating to other people and stealing:
    For example, Germany’s ‘eco-miracle’ simply used the power grids of neighboring countries not only without asking permission but also without paying for it.​
    Not at all surprising, really.
     
  6. Trakar
    Offline

    Trakar VIP Member

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2011
    Messages:
    1,699
    Thanks Received:
    73
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Ratings:
    +73
    Assertions require compelling support.

    Please cite and reference any reliable and objective source detailing and illustrating "enviro-nuts" have anything to do with this issue, and outlining the specifics about anything being "stolen" from anyone.
     
    • Thank You! Thank You! x 1
  7. Old Rocks
    Offline

    Old Rocks Diamond Member

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2008
    Messages:
    46,470
    Thanks Received:
    5,416
    Trophy Points:
    1,840
    Location:
    Portland, Ore.
    Ratings:
    +10,313
    Sheesh. So selling less costly electricity to a neighboring country is stealing. Only a 'Conservative' would come up with that.
     
  8. daveman
    Offline

    daveman Diamond Member

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2010
    Messages:
    51,299
    Thanks Received:
    5,692
    Trophy Points:
    1,775
    Location:
    On the way to the Dark Tower.
    Ratings:
    +5,758
    This from a 9/11 troofer?

    :lmao:

    Priceless.
     
  9. daveman
    Offline

    daveman Diamond Member

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2010
    Messages:
    51,299
    Thanks Received:
    5,692
    Trophy Points:
    1,775
    Location:
    On the way to the Dark Tower.
    Ratings:
    +5,758
    So you wouldn't mind if your neighbor used your car without asking permission first? After all, it's not stealing, is it?
     
  10. Trakar
    Offline

    Trakar VIP Member

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2011
    Messages:
    1,699
    Thanks Received:
    73
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Ratings:
    +73
    The community I lived in during my years in Alaska did not have the crime of "auto theft" in its laws. It was a small community, there were only 20 miles of paved roads on the island, and everyone left their keys in their car in case someone became stranded and needed emergency transportation. It was not uncommon to find that your vehicle had been borrowed, custom dictated that fuel, money or food would be left in exchange for the temporary borrowing of your vehicle... not that this has anything to do with your absurd analogy, but it just goes to show that laws bend to custom in typical applications.

    You seem to be arguing that other people should be able to dump their trash and sewage in your house windows so I'm not sure why you are concerned about someone borrowing someone else's car?

    Ultimately, however, this is all ridiculous until you can demonstrate how and where germany was "stealing access" to another nation's grid lines. Something you have been repeatedly challenged to support, and something you have steadfastly neglected to provide compelling support for.
     

Share This Page