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- #21
Originally posted by Manu
i can have pride in my nation and my family and not kill beacuse of it
This sounds good in theory, Manu: a community of countries living side by side in peace.
The problem is that the theory of nationalism (just like communist theory) and its practice are two very different things.
In practice, the moment you divide mankind into, lets say, 120 different countries, you immediately create an equal number of different national interests.
Many of these interests will be not only different but also conflicting with the interests of other countries. And when these conflicting interests cannot be solved through dialogue they are solved by force. This is what our species has been doing since prehistoric times.
Some people have a cynical view of the tremendous human and material costs imposed on the human race by its own tribalism. They say wars is a way to control overpopulation (sick).
But even this cynical individuals should pay attention to the following development I believe every civilization eventually goes through:
Sooner or later, any rational species able to develop a scientific/technological civilization is bound to discover element 92 of the periodic table (uranium).
If the discovery is made during its infancy/adolescence (marked by nationalism), there is the very real possibility that the enormous kinetic energy liberated during nuclear fission will be used to settle old grudges and jelousies once and for all.
We are no longer talking about precious resources being diverted to the military industry instead of being used to advance science and technology, we are not even talking about scores of lives lost anymore, we are talking about the wholesale destruction of their entire civilization. Even the cynicals must now recognise that the stakes inherent to nationalism are now pretty higher.
Just like teenagers who die from overdose and other childish behaviours, it is possible that the universe is filled with the remains of young, immature civilizations that fell victim of their own insane territorialism. Ok, its a wild speculation but one that cannot be entirely dismissed.
When you divide humans in different tribes you start a chain reaction with unforeseen consequences. A chain reaction you cannot control anymore.
You create countries, countries create conflicting national interests, conflicting national interests create wars, wars plus uranium create the ever present danger of the destruction of our civilization.
This is an inherent trait of all kinds of tribalism, nationalism included.
Your vision of a pacifist nationalism deserves applause, Manu. Its a pitty it only exists on the minds of well intentioned nationalists like you.
Originally posted by Manu
it is human nature to bond and belong to a group.....
I agree Manu... I only wish this group were our own species.
I have no doubt in my mind the end of nationalism would be extremely benefitial to our species.
What I cannot assure you, without making an absolutely irresponsible statement, is that it will really happen.
Maybe it is indeed human nature to bond and belong to groups smaller than the whole species, as you and Joyce claim.
I doubt it but I cant discard it completely either.
As I said, only History will settle this debate once and for all.
Too bad we will not be around anymore to pick on the losers : )