How much wealth did GWB tax rates add to your bottom line?

[Toddsterpatriot]

Someone help me with the math. We know the number of Americans working is about 150,000,000.
Say 2/3rds of those work "under the table" and only 50,000,000 actually pay taxes.
Say the tax breaks totaled 2,800,000,000,000. Did I get enough zero's?
So if that were spread out to every person, wouldn't it be about 56,000 a person? Yet how many only got 8 grand over 10 years?
And didn't someone else say that the rich only got about 600 billion?
Somehow the numbers aren't adding up. And how come these millionaires say they are getting "millions"? Somethings fishy.

Why would you say 2/3rds are working under the table?

 

[8537]

That was the savings in 2011. The numbers were higher at the start.
And why are we only discussing singles with no children?

Which numbers were "higher at the start"?

And we're discussing singles with no children because (A) they pay the most and (B) the person making the claims about 75K of income has stated that he is single with no children - If I'm wrong about that, JRK, I apologize.

The tax saved on $75k of income is higher in 2003 than the tax saved on $75K of income in 2011.

Oh, I see what you're saying. Point taken.

Your site was easy to use, but without the math behind the calculator, I'm not sure their work is correct.

Well, I have a lot of trouble believing that the Tax Foundation got it wrong. They're not exactly a politically biased group of hacks.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Which numbers were "higher at the start"?

And we're discussing singles with no children because (A) they pay the most and (B) the person making the claims about 75K of income has stated that he is single with no children - If I'm wrong about that, JRK, I apologize.

The tax saved on $75k of income is higher in 2003 than the tax saved on $75K of income in 2011.

Oh, I see what you're saying. Point taken.

Your site was easy to use, but without the math behind the calculator, I'm not sure their work is correct.

Well, I have a lot of trouble believing that the Tax Foundation got it wrong. They're not exactly a politically biased group of hacks.

I don't know what they are.
I'm not saying their calculator is wrong.
I'd just like to see the tables they're using for the "Bush cuts expired" calculations.
Trust but verify.

 

[JRK]

The tax saved on $75k of income is higher in 2003 than the tax saved on $75K of income in 2011.

Oh, I see what you're saying. Point taken.

Your site was easy to use, but without the math behind the calculator, I'm not sure their work is correct.

Well, I have a lot of trouble believing that the Tax Foundation got it wrong. They're not exactly a politically biased group of hacks.

I don't know what they are.
I'm not saying their calculator is wrong.
I'd just like to see the tables they're using for the "Bush cuts expired" calculations.
Trust but verify.

I have supplied this thread tables directly from the IRS tax table
t is so simple
IRS tax table 2000
IRS tax table 2008
Straight from the horses mouth

 

[JRK]

Looking back, it saved me about $1400 a year for six years. A total of about $8400. However the real estate crash and stock market crash under Bush cost me around $70,000

Thankfully, under Obama, I have recouped around $50,000 of that

How did it cost you $1400 a year for six years?

Learn to read

"saved me about $1400 a year..."

There you go again
DID GWB tell you what to invest in?
did GWB tell you to hold on to your investments when the return was much greater than it is now?
What did BHO do to "recoup" your 50K
What did GWB do to cause you to lose it?

 

[Douger]

The left has never been for the little guy. Only special interests that claim they speak for everyone else.

OpenSecrets.org Unveils 2010 'Big Picture' Analysis - OpenSecrets Blog | OpenSecrets

. I especially love how the government can now legally rob your 401 k

Dump it and start an offshore IRA.

 

[JRK]

OpenSecrets.org Unveils 2010 'Big Picture' Analysis - OpenSecrets Blog | OpenSecrets

. I especially love how the government can now legally rob your 401 k

Dump it and start an offshore IRA.

You put an added exclamation mark to my thread above
choices
An off shore IRA for me would lose what my employer contributes

 

[KissMy]

If we want to talk about bottom line...

Nobody made more money than they did under Bill Clinton. The stock market was obscene

Under Bush...the market was at 10,750 when he came in and 8,150 when he left. A lost decade for investing

Under Obama, the market bottomed out at 6600 and is now at 12500 . Not too shabby

My 401K lost me $80 under Bill Clinton. The fund manager managed to miss all of those obscene gains because he had us invested in oil & commodities until 1999. Then he invested our money into tech & dot com stocks in time to catch all of the the bubble burst & missed the crude oil rise.

My employer would not let me manage my own 401k or transfer the money out. I left that job & took my 401k away from them mainly because of that. They lost me more 401k money than I made working in 2000.

I manage my own money now & have managed to gain a lot instead of loose it like they did.

 

[rdean]

Someone help me with the math. We know the number of Americans working is about 150,000,000.
Say 2/3rds of those work "under the table" and only 50,000,000 actually pay taxes.
Say the tax breaks totaled 2,800,000,000,000. Did I get enough zero's?
So if that were spread out to every person, wouldn't it be about 56,000 a person? Yet how many only got 8 grand over 10 years?
And didn't someone else say that the rich only got about 600 billion?
Somehow the numbers aren't adding up. And how come these millionaires say they are getting "millions"? Somethings fishy.

Why would you say 2/3rds are working under the table?

Because a lot of American do work under the table. But if you divide 56 by three, then you would get less than 20,000 and millionaires getting millions would make it even worse.

For many, 8,000 over ten years is one months rent per year. And yet you have millionaires saying they bought yachts and new mansions. That sure helps America. Oh, that's right. Helping America is "socialism". Why even have a military. What are we protecting if helping each other is "bad"?

 

[JRK]

Someone help me with the math. We know the number of Americans working is about 150,000,000.
Say 2/3rds of those work "under the table" and only 50,000,000 actually pay taxes.
Say the tax breaks totaled 2,800,000,000,000. Did I get enough zero's?
So if that were spread out to every person, wouldn't it be about 56,000 a person? Yet how many only got 8 grand over 10 years?
And didn't someone else say that the rich only got about 600 billion?
Somehow the numbers aren't adding up. And how come these millionaires say they are getting "millions"? Somethings fishy.

Why would you say 2/3rds are working under the table?

Because a lot of American do work under the table. But if you divide 56 by three, then you would get less than 20,000 and millionaires getting millions would make it even worse.

For many, 8,000 over ten years is one months rent per year. And yet you have millionaires saying they bought yachts and new mansions. That sure helps America. Oh, that's right. Helping America is "socialism". Why even have a military. What are we protecting if helping each other is "bad"?

rdean what are you talking about
Really
what are you talking about?
are you trying to say 67% of the people in this country are working under the table?

 

[JRK]

If we want to talk about bottom line...

Nobody made more money than they did under Bill Clinton. The stock market was obscene

Under Bush...the market was at 10,750 when he came in and 8,150 when he left. A lost decade for investing

Under Obama, the market bottomed out at 6600 and is now at 12500 . Not too shabby

My 401K lost me $80 under Bill Clinton. The fund manager managed to miss all of those obscene gains because he had us invested in oil & commodities until 1999. Then he invested our money into tech & dot com stocks in time to catch all of the the bubble burst & missed the crude oil rise.

My employer would not let me manage my own 401k or transfer the money out. I left that job & took my 401k away from them mainly because of that. They lost me more 401k money than I made working in 2000.

I manage my own money now & have managed to gain a lot instead of loose it like they did.

I do 50-50
My company puts to much in mine and I have chosen super blue chips (aaple, google etc..)
wit about the same amount I sort of "day trade"" with

To be honest I day trade the same blue chips I have in my 401K
Sense 08 everything else is to scary

 

[JRK]

If we want to talk about bottom line...

Nobody made more money than they did under Bill Clinton. The stock market was obscene

Under Bush...the market was at 10,750 when he came in and 8,150 when he left. A lost decade for investing

Under Obama, the market bottomed out at 6600 and is now at 12500 . Not too shabby

right winger to start with what did BHO do to fix the stock market?
Tarp?
oh thats right, GWB did that with tax payers welath, that un like the UAW bailout
we got back
you want to talk about lost wealth?
GWB took 250 billion and stopped the stock market crash
BHO as taken over 1 trillion dollars and we have lost 6 million jobs sense 08

And you talk about lost welath?
the market was

 

[rightwinger]

How did it cost you $1400 a year for six years?

Learn to read

"saved me about $1400 a year..."

There you go again
DID GWB tell you what to invest in?
did GWB tell you to hold on to your investments when the return was much greater than it is now?
What did BHO do to "recoup" your 50K
What did GWB do to cause you to lose it?

You were the one who brought up personal wealth and bottom line. It is your thread

If you check with most Americans, you would find that

Personal wealth skyrocketed under Clinton
Personal wealth crashed under Bush
Personal wealth has recovered under Obama

Now, as a loyal republican, you are free to argue that it was not Bush's fault that personal wealth dropped $17 trillion while he was President. You can also argue that Clinton and Obama were just lucky

But nobody will believe you

 

[KissMy]

If we want to talk about bottom line...

Nobody made more money than they did under Bill Clinton. The stock market was obscene

Under Bush...the market was at 10,750 when he came in and 8,150 when he left. A lost decade for investing

Under Obama, the market bottomed out at 6600 and is now at 12500 . Not too shabby

My 401K lost me $80 under Bill Clinton. The fund manager managed to miss all of those obscene gains because he had us invested in oil & commodities until 1999. Then he invested our money into tech & dot com stocks in time to catch all of the the bubble burst & missed the crude oil rise.

My employer would not let me manage my own 401k or transfer the money out. I left that job & took my 401k away from them mainly because of that. They lost me more 401k money than I made working in 2000.

I manage my own money now & have managed to gain a lot instead of loose it like they did.

I do 50-50
My company puts to much in mine and I have chosen super blue chips (aaple, google etc..)
wit about the same amount I sort of "day trade"" with

To be honest I day trade the same blue chips I have in my 401K
Sense 08 everything else is to scary

Gold is not scary. I have been in farm land, oil & commodities for 10 years & they have been rocking. I bought gold at $715 & silver at $9.50 days after Obama got elected.

I have beat the pants off of most stock investments. I bought apple in January 2009 & sold in January 2011 since Steve Jobs illness took a bad turn. Apple may have some run left but it is getting serious competition & will peter out unless their TV thing hits a home run. I am not taking that Apple TV gamble when betting that the government debt will continue to expand is a sure thing. Betting against the US dollar is a winner every time.

 

[8537]

My 401K lost me $80 under Bill Clinton. The fund manager managed to miss all of those obscene gains because he had us invested in oil & commodities until 1999. Then he invested our money into tech & dot com stocks in time to catch all of the the bubble burst & missed the crude oil rise.

My employer would not let me manage my own 401k or transfer the money out. I left that job & took my 401k away from them mainly because of that. They lost me more 401k money than I made working in 2000.

Wow! I hope that fund manager lost his job. Unfortunate that you had to pay the price for his incompetence.

 

[rightwinger]

My 401K lost me $80 under Bill Clinton. The fund manager managed to miss all of those obscene gains because he had us invested in oil & commodities until 1999. Then he invested our money into tech & dot com stocks in time to catch all of the the bubble burst & missed the crude oil rise.

My employer would not let me manage my own 401k or transfer the money out. I left that job & took my 401k away from them mainly because of that. They lost me more 401k money than I made working in 2000.

Wow! I hope that fund manager lost his job. Unfortunate that you had to pay the price for his incompetence.

That is an amazing story. Back in those years it seemed wherever you put your money you made big profits. Everyone thought they were a genius at picking stocks, everyone was a paper millionaire......half the office was planning to retire at 45

Then the bubble burst

 

[PLYMCO_PILGRIM]

Mine was 3-5% savings
I avg about 75k
10 years
4%
75k

Thats 30,000 I have put back into the economy that under Clinton's rate the federal govt has
and not me

And the left is for the working man?
think about it

He let me keep an additional 3% of what I earn on my salary which is a little less than yours.

 

[rightwinger]

If we want to talk about bottom line...

Nobody made more money than they did under Bill Clinton. The stock market was obscene

Under Bush...the market was at 10,750 when he came in and 8,150 when he left. A lost decade for investing

Under Obama, the market bottomed out at 6600 and is now at 12500 . Not too shabby

right winger to start with what did BHO do to fix the stock market?
Tarp?
oh thats right, GWB did that with tax payers welath, that un like the UAW bailout
we got back
you want to talk about lost wealth?
GWB took 250 billion and stopped the stock market crash
BHO as taken over 1 trillion dollars and we have lost 6 million jobs sense 08

And you talk about lost welath?
the market was

What did Obama do?

Thanks for asking. The stock market dropped from a high of 14,000 to a low of 6600. The market was in a panic and everyone was bailing out. The financial sector and the automotive industry were on the verge of collapse and we were on the verge of a depression. Nobody and I mean nobody was willing to step in and prop up the collapsing market. Only the US Government had the resources to stop the collapse.

I give credit to Bush for finally waking up, telling the right wing to go fuck itself and start TARP. What Bush did wrong was he just threw money at them. Three months later they were asking for more money. Obama started a second round of TARP and this time he demanded changes in management structure and organization as a condition of accepting money.

Nobody was willing to put money into our failing economy. We were losing jobs at 700,000 a month, The Stimulus bill put $800 billion into our economy. It was an attempt to prime the pump and get the economy moving again

The result was immediate as the economy reversed within weeks of passing TARP/Stimulus. The GDP went positive again and the market reversed and went from a low of 6600 to 12500 today

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Oh, I see what you're saying. Point taken.



Well, I have a lot of trouble believing that the Tax Foundation got it wrong. They're not exactly a politically biased group of hacks.

I don't know what they are.
I'm not saying their calculator is wrong.
I'd just like to see the tables they're using for the "Bush cuts expired" calculations.
Trust but verify.

I have supplied this thread tables directly from the IRS tax table
t is so simple
IRS tax table 2000
IRS tax table 2008
Straight from the horses mouth

Yeah I saw that.
Neither of those show the tax table if the Bush cuts expire.

 

[JRK]

If we want to talk about bottom line...

Nobody made more money than they did under Bill Clinton. The stock market was obscene

Under Bush...the market was at 10,750 when he came in and 8,150 when he left. A lost decade for investing

Under Obama, the market bottomed out at 6600 and is now at 12500 . Not too shabby

right winger to start with what did BHO do to fix the stock market?
Tarp?
oh thats right, GWB did that with tax payers welath, that un like the UAW bailout
we got back
you want to talk about lost wealth?
GWB took 250 billion and stopped the stock market crash
BHO as taken over 1 trillion dollars and we have lost 6 million jobs sense 08

And you talk about lost welath?
the market was

What did Obama do?

Thanks for asking. The stock market dropped from a high of 14,000 to a low of 6600. The market was in a panic and everyone was bailing out. The financial sector and the automotive industry were on the verge of collapse and we were on the verge of a depression. Nobody and I mean nobody was willing to step in and prop up the collapsing market. Only the US Government had the resources to stop the collapse.

I give credit to Bush for finally waking up, telling the right wing to go fuck itself and start TARP. What Bush did wrong was he just threw money at them. Three months later they were asking for more money. Obama started a second round of TARP and this time he demanded changes in management structure and organization as a condition of accepting money.

Nobody was willing to put money into our failing economy. We were losing jobs at 700,000 a month, The Stimulus bill put $800 billion into our economy. It was an attempt to prime the pump and get the economy moving again

The result was immediate as the economy reversed within weeks of passing TARP/Stimulus. The GDP went positive again and the market reversed and went from a low of 6600 to 12500 today

Demanded changes in MGMT structure
that really helped the situation alot
Besides whether you like it or not, Wall street was as much a victim of those worthless securities as we were
Difference was they got bailed out (which bailed out many peoples investments also)
Stimulus?
Can you point to me where the money from the stimulus helped Exxon?
Apple?
Google?
INCY?

Maybe here?

Outdoors, Indian reservations and the arts
$10,950
$10,545
Labor and volunteering, healthcare and social services, education, social security
$72,564
$71,271

Food and farming
$26,466
$26,431
Commerce, justice and science
$15,920
$15,810
Defense
$4,555
$4,531
Energy and the environment
$50,825
$50,775
Government
$6,858
$6,707
Homeland security
$2,755
$2,744
Outdoors, Indian reservations and the arts
$10,950
$10,545
Labor and volunteering, healthcare and social services, education, social security
$72,564
$71,271
Oversight*
$25
$25
Military and veterans
$4,281
$4,246
Foreign relations
$602
$602
Transportation and housing
$61,795
$61,051
Aid to states
$53,600
$53,600
Tax cuts
$301,278
$288,482
Individual aid
$45,788
$58,143
Individual healthcare aid
$24,749
$24,677
Health IT
$17,559
$17,559
Aid to states for Medicaid
$90,044
$90,042
$790,614
$787,241