Greece crisis: What now for the euro project?

[Ringel05]

The single European currency is facing its biggest crisis since it was launched more than a decade ago.

The severe debt problems facing one of its members, Greece, has intensified the debate about the future of the euro, which binds together 17 members with some very different economic policies.

Will it survive, and if it does, what changes might have to be made to the currency pact?

While interest rates are set at a European level, taxes and spending are decided nationally.

Some have called for tough action by governments to make member economies more alike - so-called convergence.

Others say that eventually the eurozone will need to resemble more closely the US, with richer countries sometimes paying the bills of poorer ones through fiscal transfers.

BBC News - Greece crisis: What now for the euro project?

 

[Granny]

And some people want one big happy world where everything and everybody is happy and equal in all aspects? Countries, people, customs are different - as they should be. If they can't manage to have one big happy financial system, why do people think one ruling body will work for the entire world?

The richer countries should support the poorer countries? There would be no incentive for the poorer countries to work toward creation of a better economy if they knew the richer countries would constantly bail them out.

History doesn't appear to be a very good teacher ... or maybe it's just that the students from one generation to the next aren't paying attention in class.

 

[martybegan]

The fatal flaw in the euro is the seperation of who prints the money and who decides how much money to spend. A government that controls its own currency can just start the presses. While this causes inflation and ruins the buying power of both the people and the government, it allows the government to meet its debt obligations.

When someone else controls the mint, you cant get out of overspending in the old way, and you actually can default. Granted hyperinflation is effectively default, but in an economically "safe" way.

 

[Colin]

The fatal flaw in the euro is the seperation of who prints the money and who decides how much money to spend. A government that controls its own currency can just start the presses. While this causes inflation and ruins the buying power of both the people and the government, it allows the government to meet its debt obligations.

When someone else controls the mint, you cant get out of overspending in the old way, and you actually can default. Granted hyperinflation is effectively default, but in an economically "safe" way.

The fatal flaw with the euro is that it was implemented for political reasons rather than financial ones. Trying to introduce a one-cap-fits-all monetary system to several countries at widely differing stages of economic development was always going to produce problems. Having only one interest rate was not sensible when dealing with a diverse range of economies and economic circumstances Financial experts constantly sounded warnings during the run up to monetary union, but the EU mandarins were not listening. Monetary union was their means to achieve deeper political integration of Europe and nothing was going to stop them.

Europe has tried monetary union before. It didn't work then and it won't work now. At least we in Britain had the good sense to stay out of it.

 

[Colin]

Greece is in the trouble it is because it is a nation of cheats, frauds and lazy bastards! Most cheat on their tax returns. They earn over-inflated wages for a short day's work and they expect to retire at 50 on a pension that is 95% of their final year's salary! Now the country is bankrupt and the public are rioting because they don't agree with the austerity measures needed to pull the country out of trouble. Well. FUCK the Greeks! Let the over-bloated lazy slugs go to the wall. Let them live in the real world!

http://www.mailonsunday.co.uk/news/...lture-greed-tax-evasion-scandalous-waste.html

 

[Ropey]

Greece is in the trouble it is because it is a nation of cheats, frauds and lazy bastards! Most cheat on their tax returns. They earn over-inflated wages for a short day's work and they expect to retire at 50 on a pension that is 95% of their final year's salary! Now the country is bankrupt and the public are rioting because they don't agree with the austerity measures needed to pull the country out of trouble. Well. FUCK the Greeks! Let the over-bloated lazy slugs go to the wall. Let them live in the real world!

The Big Fat Greek Gravy Train: A special investigation into the EU-funded culture of greed, tax evasion and scandalous waste | Mail Online

They extended themselves far too much.

 

[Colin]

The wailing wall in Jerusalem

The wailing wall in Greece

 

[Ropey]

ROFLMAO

+2 x for that little one.

 

[iamwhatiseem]

Greece is in the trouble it is because it is a nation of cheats, frauds and lazy bastards! Most cheat on their tax returns. They earn over-inflated wages for a short day's work and they expect to retire at 50 on a pension that is 95% of their final year's salary! Now the country is bankrupt and the public are rioting because they don't agree with the austerity measures needed to pull the country out of trouble. Well. FUCK the Greeks! Let the over-bloated lazy slugs go to the wall. Let them live in the real world!

http://www.mailonsunday.co.uk/news/...lture-greed-tax-evasion-scandalous-waste.html

It is not the Greek people who will be bailed out by you and I.
Rather, it is the corrupt and irresponsible European banks who loaned the Greek government it's money on bloated interest rates that they got very wealthy off of.
And, just like in America, the banks will get your money just as sure as it is taken out of your pay check. The American government, one way or another, through one obscure channel or another - we will bail out the European banks....again.
And that is going to happen regardless if Obama is President or not, regardless of what party controls either house.

 

[Colin]

A Greek man went to his bank manager and said: ‘I’d like to start a small business.
How do I go about it?’

‘Simple,’ said the bank manager. ‘Buy a big one and wait.’

 

[Colin]

Greece is in the trouble it is because it is a nation of cheats, frauds and lazy bastards! Most cheat on their tax returns. They earn over-inflated wages for a short day's work and they expect to retire at 50 on a pension that is 95% of their final year's salary! Now the country is bankrupt and the public are rioting because they don't agree with the austerity measures needed to pull the country out of trouble. Well. FUCK the Greeks! Let the over-bloated lazy slugs go to the wall. Let them live in the real world!

The Big Fat Greek Gravy Train: A special investigation into the EU-funded culture of greed, tax evasion and scandalous waste | Mail Online

It is not the Greek people who will be bailed out by you and I.
Rather, it is the corrupt and irresponsible European banks who loaned the Greek government it's money on bloated interest rates that they got very wealthy off of.
And, just like in America, the banks will get your money just as sure as it is taken out of your pay check. The American government, one way or another, through one obscure channel or another - we will bail out the European banks....again.
And that is going to happen regardless if Obama is President or not, regardless of what party controls either house.

The Greek people are even more corrupt and irresponsible than the banks. Clearly you didn't read the link I provided.

 

[Colin]

Greece is in the trouble it is because it is a nation of cheats, frauds and lazy bastards! Most cheat on their tax returns. They earn over-inflated wages for a short day's work and they expect to retire at 50 on a pension that is 95% of their final year's salary! Now the country is bankrupt and the public are rioting because they don't agree with the austerity measures needed to pull the country out of trouble. Well. FUCK the Greeks! Let the over-bloated lazy slugs go to the wall. Let them live in the real world!

The Big Fat Greek Gravy Train: A special investigation into the EU-funded culture of greed, tax evasion and scandalous waste | Mail Online

It is not the Greek people who will be bailed out by you and I.
Rather, it is the corrupt and irresponsible European banks who loaned the Greek government it's money on bloated interest rates that they got very wealthy off of.
And, just like in America, the banks will get your money just as sure as it is taken out of your pay check. The American government, one way or another, through one obscure channel or another - we will bail out the European banks....again.
And that is going to happen regardless if Obama is President or not, regardless of what party controls either house.

By the way, you mention European banks as the cause...where did this fucking disaster start? I guess you've forgotten already!

 

[strollingbones]

*hands out bitcoins*

 

[tobindax]

FUCK the Greeks! Let the over-bloated lazy slugs go to the wall

Hello, I'm Greek. My family have been working 8 hours a day 6 days a week for as long as I can remember. Generalizing whole countries like that is quite stupid.

 

[iamwhatiseem]

Greece is in the trouble it is because it is a nation of cheats, frauds and lazy bastards! Most cheat on their tax returns. They earn over-inflated wages for a short day's work and they expect to retire at 50 on a pension that is 95% of their final year's salary! Now the country is bankrupt and the public are rioting because they don't agree with the austerity measures needed to pull the country out of trouble. Well. FUCK the Greeks! Let the over-bloated lazy slugs go to the wall. Let them live in the real world!

The Big Fat Greek Gravy Train: A special investigation into the EU-funded culture of greed, tax evasion and scandalous waste | Mail Online

It is not the Greek people who will be bailed out by you and I.
Rather, it is the corrupt and irresponsible European banks who loaned the Greek government it's money on bloated interest rates that they got very wealthy off of.
And, just like in America, the banks will get your money just as sure as it is taken out of your pay check. The American government, one way or another, through one obscure channel or another - we will bail out the European banks....again.
And that is going to happen regardless if Obama is President or not, regardless of what party controls either house.

The Greek people are even more corrupt and irresponsible than the banks. Clearly you didn't read the link I provided.

I never said they wasn't.
It is all in the conditioning. Greece has such a ridiculous taxation system that is as high as 21% on a purchase. So...Greeks started a black market, and as most know Greece's underground economy is actually LARGER than their reported economy. At the same time Greece places businesses in shackles by making excess benefits law. In Greece, it is mandatory for the company you work for to not only give you two weeks vacation - but they have to PAY for the vacation as well.
The irresponsible liberal government in Greece conditioned the population to become a nation of entitlements. A nation where working hard is strongly discouraged.

 

[Colin]

It is not the Greek people who will be bailed out by you and I.
Rather, it is the corrupt and irresponsible European banks who loaned the Greek government it's money on bloated interest rates that they got very wealthy off of.
And, just like in America, the banks will get your money just as sure as it is taken out of your pay check. The American government, one way or another, through one obscure channel or another - we will bail out the European banks....again.
And that is going to happen regardless if Obama is President or not, regardless of what party controls either house.

The Greek people are even more corrupt and irresponsible than the banks. Clearly you didn't read the link I provided.

I never said they wasn't.
It is all in the conditioning. Greece has such a ridiculous taxation system that is as high as 21% on a purchase. So...Greeks started a black market, and as most know Greece's underground economy is actually LARGER than their reported economy. At the same time Greece places businesses in shackles by making excess benefits law. In Greece, it is mandatory for the company you work for to not only give you two weeks vacation - but they have to PAY for the vacation as well.
The irresponsible liberal government in Greece conditioned the population to become a nation of entitlements. A nation where working hard is strongly discouraged.

21% VAT and two weeks paid vacation! So what. That is no different to any other country in Europe. The problem is the Greeks don't do a full day's work. They expect to retire at 50. They dodge paying taxes and they expect the rest of Europe to bail them out whilst they continue to be the parasites of the EU.

If you had read the article you would have got an indication of how dishonest most Greeks are, look no further than the Athens underground rail system...a state of the art rail service paid for by the EU. Passengers are supposed to validate their tickets at honesty machines before travelling. Few do, but no surprise. Fiddling is endemic in Greece! And what other country pays their railway workers an average of £60,000 per annum (USD90,000)!!!!

It also shows how the overground rail network is as big a racket as the underground. Its annual income is only £80 million from ticket sales, the wage bill is more than £500m a year ...and the Greeks wonder why they're going down the tubes! And what will they do to help themselves? Well, if the government agrees on Tuesday to the austerity
measures for the next financial handout to the Greeks, you'll find them rioting on the streets in an effort to maintain their parasitic lifestyle!

Greece braces for the toughest week in its euro history - Telegraph

 

[Colin]

FUCK the Greeks! Let the over-bloated lazy slugs go to the wall

Hello, I'm Greek. My family have been working 8 hours a day 6 days a week for as long as I can remember. Generalizing whole countries like that is quite stupid.

I'm sure there are some hard working Greeks and all credit to your family. Unfortunately it seems they are in the minority. I still say fuck the Greeks. Why should the EU and the IMF keep ploughing money into a country where the people are not prepared to help their own economy by getting off their butts and joining the real world!

 

[iamwhatiseem]

The Greek people are even more corrupt and irresponsible than the banks. Clearly you didn't read the link I provided.

I never said they wasn't.
It is all in the conditioning. Greece has such a ridiculous taxation system that is as high as 21% on a purchase. So...Greeks started a black market, and as most know Greece's underground economy is actually LARGER than their reported economy. At the same time Greece places businesses in shackles by making excess benefits law. In Greece, it is mandatory for the company you work for to not only give you two weeks vacation - but they have to PAY for the vacation as well.
The irresponsible liberal government in Greece conditioned the population to become a nation of entitlements. A nation where working hard is strongly discouraged.

21% VAT and two weeks paid vacation! So what. That is no different to any other country in Europe.

Umm...I mean PAID vacation...as in companies also had to pay for the trips they took while on vacation.

 

[tobindax]

FUCK the Greeks! Let the over-bloated lazy slugs go to the wall

Hello, I'm Greek. My family have been working 8 hours a day 6 days a week for as long as I can remember. Generalizing whole countries like that is quite stupid.

I still say fuck the Greeks.

Well fuck you. Not all your people. You specifically.

 

[Colin]

Hello, I'm Greek. My family have been working 8 hours a day 6 days a week for as long as I can remember. Generalizing whole countries like that is quite stupid.

I still say fuck the Greeks.

Well fuck you. Not all your people. You specifically.

Hahahahaha! And you too! Pity you edited out the rest of my post!