Footprint find on Crete may push back date humans began to walk upright

[Fort Fun Indiana]

Stop wasting everyone's time. If you honestly cared, you would go educate yourself, instead of demanding layman strangers attempt to educate you.

 

[MarkDuffy]

Amazing discovery.

The footprints older than feet

HUMAN-like footprints have been found stamped into an ancient sea shore fossilised beneath the Mediterranean island of Crete.

They shouldn’t be there.

Testing puts the rock’s age at 5.7 million years.

That’s a time when palaeontologists believe our human ancestors had only apelike feet.

And they lived in Africa.

<more>

'human-like', there are a million ways to get odd footprints in mud. This isn't going to push back 'modern humans' to 6 million years ago, that is when the first fossils of something not an ape and something of human characteristics have been found. Evolution cannot be short circuited by millions of years on the scale of change involved with these species. Just as we will never find a T-rex fossil in the Triassic, or a footprint of one.

Stories like the OP are interesting though.

I disagree. Evolution is very poorly understood, we know it happens, but we don't know the rate at which it happens, or the percentage of beneficial mutations. The fossil record is so incomplete that the holes that we could drive trucks through and not ever find a thing are legion.

Utterly ridiculous. Evolution is very well understood it is only layman that think it isn't. It's like saying 'we don't know what caused the big bang so physicists are entirely in the dark about the universe'. I find people that have a religious bent tend to try to cast scientific facts and theories as 'well we just really don't know' if there is some area that research is still taking place while at the same time they believe in something for which there is no physical evidence. Don't know who is religious here it is a general statement.

It's like when they were still filling in the periodic table of the elements. 'Well there are still many elements that they 'think' are out there but they haven't found them so the entire table of the elements is just guessing and we don't really know, the whole thing could be wrong'. Sorry that isn't how it works. Go to ANY local college and talk to a biologist and ask them if footprints that are 'human-like' from 6 million years ago could be human. They'll laugh and then explain why it's impossible.

But fantasy has it's fans.

It is? Describe how it works then. Use your own words, not a cut and paste job.

Evolution is random mutation and other processes acted upon by non-random selection giving rise to new genotype frequencies in a population gene pool.

Whar's mah prize?

 

[westwall]

Amazing discovery.

The footprints older than feet

HUMAN-like footprints have been found stamped into an ancient sea shore fossilised beneath the Mediterranean island of Crete.

They shouldn’t be there.

Testing puts the rock’s age at 5.7 million years.

That’s a time when palaeontologists believe our human ancestors had only apelike feet.

And they lived in Africa.

<more>

'human-like', there are a million ways to get odd footprints in mud. This isn't going to push back 'modern humans' to 6 million years ago, that is when the first fossils of something not an ape and something of human characteristics have been found. Evolution cannot be short circuited by millions of years on the scale of change involved with these species. Just as we will never find a T-rex fossil in the Triassic, or a footprint of one.

Stories like the OP are interesting though.

I disagree. Evolution is very poorly understood, we know it happens, but we don't know the rate at which it happens, or the percentage of beneficial mutations. The fossil record is so incomplete that the holes that we could drive trucks through and not ever find a thing are legion.

Utterly ridiculous. Evolution is very well understood it is only layman that think it isn't. It's like saying 'we don't know what caused the big bang so physicists are entirely in the dark about the universe'. I find people that have a religious bent tend to try to cast scientific facts and theories as 'well we just really don't know' if there is some area that research is still taking place while at the same time they believe in something for which there is no physical evidence. Don't know who is religious here it is a general statement.

It's like when they were still filling in the periodic table of the elements. 'Well there are still many elements that they 'think' are out there but they haven't found them so the entire table of the elements is just guessing and we don't really know, the whole thing could be wrong'. Sorry that isn't how it works. Go to ANY local college and talk to a biologist and ask them if footprints that are 'human-like' from 6 million years ago could be human. They'll laugh and then explain why it's impossible.

But fantasy has it's fans.

It is? Describe how it works then. Use your own words, not a cut and paste job.

Evolution is random mutation and other processes acted upon by non-random selection giving rise to new genotype frequencies in a population gene pool.

Whar's mah prize?

What causes the mutations? What are the "other processes"? Describe them in detail. Define non random selection and how it specifically applies to evolutionary theory.

So far you get nothing.

 

[westwall]

Stop wasting everyone's time. If you honestly cared, you would go educate yourself, instead of demanding layman strangers attempt to educate you.

Actually it is you who are wasting everyone's time. I asked for specific, detailed, analysis to determine if any of you even have a clue what you're talking about. So far all I am getting are silly little cut and pastes, which tells me that none of you have the slightest idea what you are talking about.

But thanks for making that obvious for all to see.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

'human-like', there are a million ways to get odd footprints in mud. This isn't going to push back 'modern humans' to 6 million years ago, that is when the first fossils of something not an ape and something of human characteristics have been found. Evolution cannot be short circuited by millions of years on the scale of change involved with these species. Just as we will never find a T-rex fossil in the Triassic, or a footprint of one.

Stories like the OP are interesting though.

I disagree. Evolution is very poorly understood, we know it happens, but we don't know the rate at which it happens, or the percentage of beneficial mutations. The fossil record is so incomplete that the holes that we could drive trucks through and not ever find a thing are legion.

Utterly ridiculous. Evolution is very well understood it is only layman that think it isn't. It's like saying 'we don't know what caused the big bang so physicists are entirely in the dark about the universe'. I find people that have a religious bent tend to try to cast scientific facts and theories as 'well we just really don't know' if there is some area that research is still taking place while at the same time they believe in something for which there is no physical evidence. Don't know who is religious here it is a general statement.

It's like when they were still filling in the periodic table of the elements. 'Well there are still many elements that they 'think' are out there but they haven't found them so the entire table of the elements is just guessing and we don't really know, the whole thing could be wrong'. Sorry that isn't how it works. Go to ANY local college and talk to a biologist and ask them if footprints that are 'human-like' from 6 million years ago could be human. They'll laugh and then explain why it's impossible.

But fantasy has it's fans.

It is? Describe how it works then. Use your own words, not a cut and paste job.

Evolution is random mutation and other processes acted upon by non-random selection giving rise to new genotype frequencies in a population gene pool.

Whar's mah prize?

What causes the mutations? What are the "other processes"? Describe them in detail. Define non random selection and how it specifically applies to evolutionary theory.

So far you get nothing.

If you honestly wanted to be educated about these topics, you would do your own research, or take a class. You are being quite dishonest, amd I sincerely hope nobody is gullible enough to waste their time trying to educate you on these topics.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

Stop wasting everyone's time. If you honestly cared, you would go educate yourself, instead of demanding layman strangers attempt to educate you.

Actually it is you who are wasting everyone's time. I asked for specific, detailed, analysis to determine if any of you even have a clue what you're talking about. So far all I am getting are silly little cut and pastes, which tells me that none of you have the slightest idea what you are talking about.

But thanks for making that obvious for all to see.

Haha.... What a self-soothing bit of pap that was. As if testing the knowledge of strangers and laymen refutes or makes any point you have on the topic.

 

[westwall]

I disagree. Evolution is very poorly understood, we know it happens, but we don't know the rate at which it happens, or the percentage of beneficial mutations. The fossil record is so incomplete that the holes that we could drive trucks through and not ever find a thing are legion.

Utterly ridiculous. Evolution is very well understood it is only layman that think it isn't. It's like saying 'we don't know what caused the big bang so physicists are entirely in the dark about the universe'. I find people that have a religious bent tend to try to cast scientific facts and theories as 'well we just really don't know' if there is some area that research is still taking place while at the same time they believe in something for which there is no physical evidence. Don't know who is religious here it is a general statement.

It's like when they were still filling in the periodic table of the elements. 'Well there are still many elements that they 'think' are out there but they haven't found them so the entire table of the elements is just guessing and we don't really know, the whole thing could be wrong'. Sorry that isn't how it works. Go to ANY local college and talk to a biologist and ask them if footprints that are 'human-like' from 6 million years ago could be human. They'll laugh and then explain why it's impossible.

But fantasy has it's fans.

It is? Describe how it works then. Use your own words, not a cut and paste job.

Evolution is random mutation and other processes acted upon by non-random selection giving rise to new genotype frequencies in a population gene pool.

Whar's mah prize?

What causes the mutations? What are the "other processes"? Describe them in detail. Define non random selection and how it specifically applies to evolutionary theory.

So far you get nothing.

If you honestly wanted to be educated about these topics, you would do your own research, or take a class. You are being quite dishonest, amd I sincerely hope nobody is gullible enough to waste their time trying to educate you on these topics.

I already have, that's the point. That's why when people make incredibly asinine statements, as your buddy isaac did, i am compelled to call them on it. And, as usual, you resort to insult, but fail to answer any of the questions. So, i suggest you take your own advice and get an education.

 

[IsaacNewton]

Utterly ridiculous. Evolution is very well understood it is only layman that think it isn't. It's like saying 'we don't know what caused the big bang so physicists are entirely in the dark about the universe'. I find people that have a religious bent tend to try to cast scientific facts and theories as 'well we just really don't know' if there is some area that research is still taking place while at the same time they believe in something for which there is no physical evidence. Don't know who is religious here it is a general statement.

It's like when they were still filling in the periodic table of the elements. 'Well there are still many elements that they 'think' are out there but they haven't found them so the entire table of the elements is just guessing and we don't really know, the whole thing could be wrong'. Sorry that isn't how it works. Go to ANY local college and talk to a biologist and ask them if footprints that are 'human-like' from 6 million years ago could be human. They'll laugh and then explain why it's impossible.

But fantasy has it's fans.

It is? Describe how it works then. Use your own words, not a cut and paste job.

Evolution is random mutation and other processes acted upon by non-random selection giving rise to new genotype frequencies in a population gene pool.

Whar's mah prize?

What causes the mutations? What are the "other processes"? Describe them in detail. Define non random selection and how it specifically applies to evolutionary theory.

So far you get nothing.

If you honestly wanted to be educated about these topics, you would do your own research, or take a class. You are being quite dishonest, amd I sincerely hope nobody is gullible enough to waste their time trying to educate you on these topics.

I already have, that's the point. That's why when people make incredibly asinine statements, as your buddy isaac did, i am compelled to call them on it. And, as usual, you resort to insult, but fail to answer any of the questions. So, i suggest you take your own advice and get an education.

You really expect people on a message board to educate you on the vastness and complexities of the details evolution. You don't want to believe in it, that's fine. But don't pretend it then doesn't exist or that nobody understands it to fit your worldview.

You apparently need a starting point so go spend a week reading up on telomeres and the relationship to human evolution 200,000 years ago. If 'book lernin' just ain't yer thing then go spend some time in the religion forum. Science and technology aren't for you.

 

[Political Junky]

Stop wasting everyone's time. If you honestly cared, you would go educate yourself, instead of demanding layman strangers attempt to educate you.

Actually it is you who are wasting everyone's time. I asked for specific, detailed, analysis to determine if any of you even have a clue what you're talking about. So far all I am getting are silly little cut and pastes, which tells me that none of you have the slightest idea what you are talking about.

But thanks for making that obvious for all to see.

OK, now you explain how God created everything. Who created God?

 

[westwall]

It is? Describe how it works then. Use your own words, not a cut and paste job.

Evolution is random mutation and other processes acted upon by non-random selection giving rise to new genotype frequencies in a population gene pool.

Whar's mah prize?

What causes the mutations? What are the "other processes"? Describe them in detail. Define non random selection and how it specifically applies to evolutionary theory.

So far you get nothing.

If you honestly wanted to be educated about these topics, you would do your own research, or take a class. You are being quite dishonest, amd I sincerely hope nobody is gullible enough to waste their time trying to educate you on these topics.

I already have, that's the point. That's why when people make incredibly asinine statements, as your buddy isaac did, i am compelled to call them on it. And, as usual, you resort to insult, but fail to answer any of the questions. So, i suggest you take your own advice and get an education.

You really expect people on a message board to educate you on the vastness and complexities of the details evolution. You don't want to believe in it, that's fine. But don't pretend it then doesn't exist or that nobody understands it to fit your worldview.

You apparently need a starting point so go spend a week reading up on telomeres and the relationship to human evolution 200,000 years ago. If 'book lernin' just ain't yer thing then go spend some time in the religion forum. Science and technology aren't for you.

That's the problem with you faux intellectuals, when you can't answer the questions you resort to insults. Here's a clue, I am not religious. I'm an agnostic. My wife is Wiccan, your silly attacks are just stupid. I am a firm supporter of evolution, I am also however a scientist, so unlike you, I have actually studied the subject and understand its limitations.

 

[westwall]

Stop wasting everyone's time. If you honestly cared, you would go educate yourself, instead of demanding layman strangers attempt to educate you.

Actually it is you who are wasting everyone's time. I asked for specific, detailed, analysis to determine if any of you even have a clue what you're talking about. So far all I am getting are silly little cut and pastes, which tells me that none of you have the slightest idea what you are talking about.

But thanks for making that obvious for all to see.

OK, now you explain how God created everything. Who created God?

I don't believe in God. You'll have to ask one of your religious nutter agw friends.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

Evolution is random mutation and other processes acted upon by non-random selection giving rise to new genotype frequencies in a population gene pool.

Whar's mah prize?

What causes the mutations? What are the "other processes"? Describe them in detail. Define non random selection and how it specifically applies to evolutionary theory.

So far you get nothing.

If you honestly wanted to be educated about these topics, you would do your own research, or take a class. You are being quite dishonest, amd I sincerely hope nobody is gullible enough to waste their time trying to educate you on these topics.

I already have, that's the point. That's why when people make incredibly asinine statements, as your buddy isaac did, i am compelled to call them on it. And, as usual, you resort to insult, but fail to answer any of the questions. So, i suggest you take your own advice and get an education.

You really expect people on a message board to educate you on the vastness and complexities of the details evolution. You don't want to believe in it, that's fine. But don't pretend it then doesn't exist or that nobody understands it to fit your worldview.

You apparently need a starting point so go spend a week reading up on telomeres and the relationship to human evolution 200,000 years ago. If 'book lernin' just ain't yer thing then go spend some time in the religion forum. Science and technology aren't for you.

That's the problem with you faux intellectuals, when you can't answer the questions you resort to insults. Here's a clue, I am not religious. I'm an agnostic. My wife is Wiccan, your silly attacks are just stupid. I am a firm supporter of evolution, I am also however a scientist, so unlike you, I have actually studied the subject and understand its limitations.

"I am a firm supporter of evolution, I am also however a scientist, so unlike you, I have actually studied the subject and understand its limitations"

Then why is it the scientific community at large doesn't share this understanding with you? Have they not also studied evolution? Yes, they have...in fact, the experts are the ones who discovered everything you studied.

This reminds me if you claiming authority on the climate by saying you are a geologist, yet having an opinion at odds with the scientific consensus endorsed by every major geological society in the world.

In either case, I have yet to understand what makes you so special, and how you think claiming this authority is any substitute for the consensus or for published science.

 

[Old Rocks]

'human-like', there are a million ways to get odd footprints in mud. This isn't going to push back 'modern humans' to 6 million years ago, that is when the first fossils of something not an ape and something of human characteristics have been found. Evolution cannot be short circuited by millions of years on the scale of change involved with these species. Just as we will never find a T-rex fossil in the Triassic, or a footprint of one.

Stories like the OP are interesting though.

I disagree. Evolution is very poorly understood, we know it happens, but we don't know the rate at which it happens, or the percentage of beneficial mutations. The fossil record is so incomplete that the holes that we could drive trucks through and not ever find a thing are legion.

Utterly ridiculous. Evolution is very well understood it is only layman that think it isn't. It's like saying 'we don't know what caused the big bang so physicists are entirely in the dark about the universe'. I find people that have a religious bent tend to try to cast scientific facts and theories as 'well we just really don't know' if there is some area that research is still taking place while at the same time they believe in something for which there is no physical evidence. Don't know who is religious here it is a general statement.

It's like when they were still filling in the periodic table of the elements. 'Well there are still many elements that they 'think' are out there but they haven't found them so the entire table of the elements is just guessing and we don't really know, the whole thing could be wrong'. Sorry that isn't how it works. Go to ANY local college and talk to a biologist and ask them if footprints that are 'human-like' from 6 million years ago could be human. They'll laugh and then explain why it's impossible.

But fantasy has it's fans.

It is? Describe how it works then. Use your own words, not a cut and paste job.

Evolution is random mutation and other processes acted upon by non-random selection giving rise to new genotype frequencies in a population gene pool.

Whar's mah prize?

What causes the mutations? What are the "other processes"? Describe them in detail. Define non random selection and how it specifically applies to evolutionary theory.

So far you get nothing.

Ah shit, is ol' Mr. Westwall a creationist? LOL A Phd Geologist that is a creationist. Now that is a cartoon charactor. Of course, one can go to Google Scholar and find thousands of articles on this subject. Evolution happened, is happening, and will continue to happen as long as there is life.

 

[Old Rocks]

Evolution is random mutation and other processes acted upon by non-random selection giving rise to new genotype frequencies in a population gene pool.

Whar's mah prize?

What causes the mutations? What are the "other processes"? Describe them in detail. Define non random selection and how it specifically applies to evolutionary theory.

So far you get nothing.

If you honestly wanted to be educated about these topics, you would do your own research, or take a class. You are being quite dishonest, amd I sincerely hope nobody is gullible enough to waste their time trying to educate you on these topics.

I already have, that's the point. That's why when people make incredibly asinine statements, as your buddy isaac did, i am compelled to call them on it. And, as usual, you resort to insult, but fail to answer any of the questions. So, i suggest you take your own advice and get an education.

You really expect people on a message board to educate you on the vastness and complexities of the details evolution. You don't want to believe in it, that's fine. But don't pretend it then doesn't exist or that nobody understands it to fit your worldview.

You apparently need a starting point so go spend a week reading up on telomeres and the relationship to human evolution 200,000 years ago. If 'book lernin' just ain't yer thing then go spend some time in the religion forum. Science and technology aren't for you.

That's the problem with you faux intellectuals, when you can't answer the questions you resort to insults. Here's a clue, I am not religious. I'm an agnostic. My wife is Wiccan, your silly attacks are just stupid. I am a firm supporter of evolution, I am also however a scientist, so unlike you, I have actually studied the subject and understand its limitations.

You are a goddamned fraud. Your posts on this board have proven that beyond doubt. You are repeatedly shown your disdain for science and real scientists.

 

[Old Rocks]

Stop wasting everyone's time. If you honestly cared, you would go educate yourself, instead of demanding layman strangers attempt to educate you.

Actually it is you who are wasting everyone's time. I asked for specific, detailed, analysis to determine if any of you even have a clue what you're talking about. So far all I am getting are silly little cut and pastes, which tells me that none of you have the slightest idea what you are talking about.

But thanks for making that obvious for all to see.

OK, now you explain how God created everything. Who created God?

I don't believe in God. You'll have to ask one of your religious nutter agw friends.

I don't believe in a God, I don't believe there not being a God. I don't have enough information to make a judgement on the subject. But I definately don't believe in most of the thoughts on a Diety expressed by most formal religions.

 

[westwall]

What causes the mutations? What are the "other processes"? Describe them in detail. Define non random selection and how it specifically applies to evolutionary theory.

So far you get nothing.

If you honestly wanted to be educated about these topics, you would do your own research, or take a class. You are being quite dishonest, amd I sincerely hope nobody is gullible enough to waste their time trying to educate you on these topics.

I already have, that's the point. That's why when people make incredibly asinine statements, as your buddy isaac did, i am compelled to call them on it. And, as usual, you resort to insult, but fail to answer any of the questions. So, i suggest you take your own advice and get an education.

You really expect people on a message board to educate you on the vastness and complexities of the details evolution. You don't want to believe in it, that's fine. But don't pretend it then doesn't exist or that nobody understands it to fit your worldview.

You apparently need a starting point so go spend a week reading up on telomeres and the relationship to human evolution 200,000 years ago. If 'book lernin' just ain't yer thing then go spend some time in the religion forum. Science and technology aren't for you.

That's the problem with you faux intellectuals, when you can't answer the questions you resort to insults. Here's a clue, I am not religious. I'm an agnostic. My wife is Wiccan, your silly attacks are just stupid. I am a firm supporter of evolution, I am also however a scientist, so unlike you, I have actually studied the subject and understand its limitations.

You are a goddamned fraud. Your posts on this board have proven that beyond doubt. You are repeatedly shown your disdain for science and real scientists.

I don't consider scientists who engage in academic fraud to be "real scientists". I consider them to be criminals. Face it clown boy, every time you trot one of their tall tales out it is easily refuted by real observed data. The only fraud is you and your fellow travelers.

 

[westwall]

I disagree. Evolution is very poorly understood, we know it happens, but we don't know the rate at which it happens, or the percentage of beneficial mutations. The fossil record is so incomplete that the holes that we could drive trucks through and not ever find a thing are legion.

Utterly ridiculous. Evolution is very well understood it is only layman that think it isn't. It's like saying 'we don't know what caused the big bang so physicists are entirely in the dark about the universe'. I find people that have a religious bent tend to try to cast scientific facts and theories as 'well we just really don't know' if there is some area that research is still taking place while at the same time they believe in something for which there is no physical evidence. Don't know who is religious here it is a general statement.

It's like when they were still filling in the periodic table of the elements. 'Well there are still many elements that they 'think' are out there but they haven't found them so the entire table of the elements is just guessing and we don't really know, the whole thing could be wrong'. Sorry that isn't how it works. Go to ANY local college and talk to a biologist and ask them if footprints that are 'human-like' from 6 million years ago could be human. They'll laugh and then explain why it's impossible.

But fantasy has it's fans.

It is? Describe how it works then. Use your own words, not a cut and paste job.

Evolution is random mutation and other processes acted upon by non-random selection giving rise to new genotype frequencies in a population gene pool.

Whar's mah prize?

What causes the mutations? What are the "other processes"? Describe them in detail. Define non random selection and how it specifically applies to evolutionary theory.

So far you get nothing.

Ah shit, is ol' Mr. Westwall a creationist? LOL A Phd Geologist that is a creationist. Now that is a cartoon charactor. Of course, one can go to Google Scholar and find thousands of articles on this subject. Evolution happened, is happening, and will continue to happen as long as there is life.

Lying is your shtick olfraud. Of that there is no doubt. I am agnostic, I hold no creationist views and think they are silly in the best case, and retarded in the worst case. Kind of like you.

 

[westwall]

What causes the mutations? What are the "other processes"? Describe them in detail. Define non random selection and how it specifically applies to evolutionary theory.

So far you get nothing.

If you honestly wanted to be educated about these topics, you would do your own research, or take a class. You are being quite dishonest, amd I sincerely hope nobody is gullible enough to waste their time trying to educate you on these topics.

I already have, that's the point. That's why when people make incredibly asinine statements, as your buddy isaac did, i am compelled to call them on it. And, as usual, you resort to insult, but fail to answer any of the questions. So, i suggest you take your own advice and get an education.

You really expect people on a message board to educate you on the vastness and complexities of the details evolution. You don't want to believe in it, that's fine. But don't pretend it then doesn't exist or that nobody understands it to fit your worldview.

You apparently need a starting point so go spend a week reading up on telomeres and the relationship to human evolution 200,000 years ago. If 'book lernin' just ain't yer thing then go spend some time in the religion forum. Science and technology aren't for you.

That's the problem with you faux intellectuals, when you can't answer the questions you resort to insults. Here's a clue, I am not religious. I'm an agnostic. My wife is Wiccan, your silly attacks are just stupid. I am a firm supporter of evolution, I am also however a scientist, so unlike you, I have actually studied the subject and understand its limitations.

"I am a firm supporter of evolution, I am also however a scientist, so unlike you, I have actually studied the subject and understand its limitations"

Then why is it the scientific community at large doesn't share this understanding with you? Have they not also studied evolution? Yes, they have...in fact, the experts are the ones who discovered everything you studied.

This reminds me if you claiming authority on the climate by saying you are a geologist, yet having an opinion at odds with the scientific consensus endorsed by every major geological society in the world.

In either case, I have yet to understand what makes you so special, and how you think claiming this authority is any substitute for the consensus or for published science.

Ahhhhh, but they do. We all agree that evolution is a "thing". But there are huge arguments going on about how it comes about. First there was evolutionary theory, then "phyletic gradualism, then there was "punctuated equilibrium", in other words there are MULTIPLE lines of thought on how evolution occurs, but simple people, like you, don't even understand the basics.

Well understood my ass, they are arguing over the processes involved all of the time!


Does evolutionary theory need a rethink?

• Kevin Laland,
• Tobias Uller,
• Marc Feldman,
• Kim Sterelny,
• Gerd B. Müller,
• Armin Moczek,
• Eva Jablonka,
• John Odling-Smee,
• Gregory A. Wray,
• Hopi E. Hoekstra,
• Douglas J. Futuyma,
• Richard E. Lenski,
• Trudy F. C. Mackay,
• Dolph Schluter
• & Joan E. Strassmann

08 October 2014
Researchers are divided over what processes should be considered fundamental.
Does evolutionary theory need a rethink? Yes, urgently
Without an extended evolutionary framework, the theory neglects key processes, say Kevin Laland and colleagues.

Charles Darwin conceived of evolution by natural selection without knowing that genes exist. Now mainstream evolutionary theory has come to focus almost exclusively on genetic inheritance and processes that change gene frequencies.

Yet new data pouring out of adjacent fields are starting to undermine this narrow stance. An alternative vision of evolution is beginning to crystallize, in which the processes by which organisms grow and develop are recognized as causes of evolution.

Does evolutionary theory need a rethink?

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

If you honestly wanted to be educated about these topics, you would do your own research, or take a class. You are being quite dishonest, amd I sincerely hope nobody is gullible enough to waste their time trying to educate you on these topics.

I already have, that's the point. That's why when people make incredibly asinine statements, as your buddy isaac did, i am compelled to call them on it. And, as usual, you resort to insult, but fail to answer any of the questions. So, i suggest you take your own advice and get an education.

You really expect people on a message board to educate you on the vastness and complexities of the details evolution. You don't want to believe in it, that's fine. But don't pretend it then doesn't exist or that nobody understands it to fit your worldview.

You apparently need a starting point so go spend a week reading up on telomeres and the relationship to human evolution 200,000 years ago. If 'book lernin' just ain't yer thing then go spend some time in the religion forum. Science and technology aren't for you.

That's the problem with you faux intellectuals, when you can't answer the questions you resort to insults. Here's a clue, I am not religious. I'm an agnostic. My wife is Wiccan, your silly attacks are just stupid. I am a firm supporter of evolution, I am also however a scientist, so unlike you, I have actually studied the subject and understand its limitations.

You are a goddamned fraud. Your posts on this board have proven that beyond doubt. You are repeatedly shown your disdain for science and real scientists.

"I don't consider scientists who engage in academic fraud to be "real scientists". "










I don't consider scientists who engage in academic fraud to be "real scientists". I consider them to be criminals. Face it clown boy, every time you trot one of their tall tales out it is easily refuted by real observed data. The only fraud is you and your fellow travelers.

"I don't consider scientists who engage in academic fraud to be "real scientists". "


And there it is... "They're all liars, I'm the one telling the truth"



Applause for honesty. Yes, it's an absurd idea, but you actually believe it and you had the guts to say it. None of this "dog whistle" bullshit we are inundated with. No sir...westwall will suck it up and come right out and say they're all lying.

Can I put you on TV? I mean that. I would like people to see you make this claim. Far and wide.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

If you honestly wanted to be educated about these topics, you would do your own research, or take a class. You are being quite dishonest, amd I sincerely hope nobody is gullible enough to waste their time trying to educate you on these topics.

I already have, that's the point. That's why when people make incredibly asinine statements, as your buddy isaac did, i am compelled to call them on it. And, as usual, you resort to insult, but fail to answer any of the questions. So, i suggest you take your own advice and get an education.

You really expect people on a message board to educate you on the vastness and complexities of the details evolution. You don't want to believe in it, that's fine. But don't pretend it then doesn't exist or that nobody understands it to fit your worldview.

You apparently need a starting point so go spend a week reading up on telomeres and the relationship to human evolution 200,000 years ago. If 'book lernin' just ain't yer thing then go spend some time in the religion forum. Science and technology aren't for you.

That's the problem with you faux intellectuals, when you can't answer the questions you resort to insults. Here's a clue, I am not religious. I'm an agnostic. My wife is Wiccan, your silly attacks are just stupid. I am a firm supporter of evolution, I am also however a scientist, so unlike you, I have actually studied the subject and understand its limitations.

"I am a firm supporter of evolution, I am also however a scientist, so unlike you, I have actually studied the subject and understand its limitations"

Then why is it the scientific community at large doesn't share this understanding with you? Have they not also studied evolution? Yes, they have...in fact, the experts are the ones who discovered everything you studied.

This reminds me if you claiming authority on the climate by saying you are a geologist, yet having an opinion at odds with the scientific consensus endorsed by every major geological society in the world.

In either case, I have yet to understand what makes you so special, and how you think claiming this authority is any substitute for the consensus or for published science.

Ahhhhh, but they do. We all agree that evolution is a "thing". But there are huge arguments going on about how it comes about. First there was evolutionary theory, then "phyletic gradualism, then there was "punctuated equilibrium", in other words there are MULTIPLE lines of thought on how evolution occurs, but simple people, like you, don't even understand the basics.

Well understood my ass, they are arguing over the processes involved all of the time!


Does evolutionary theory need a rethink?

• Kevin Laland,
• Tobias Uller,
• Marc Feldman,
• Kim Sterelny,
• Gerd B. Müller,
• Armin Moczek,
• Eva Jablonka,
• John Odling-Smee,
• Gregory A. Wray,
• Hopi E. Hoekstra,
• Douglas J. Futuyma,
• Richard E. Lenski,
• Trudy F. C. Mackay,
• Dolph Schluter
• & Joan E. Strassmann

08 October 2014
Researchers are divided over what processes should be considered fundamental.
Does evolutionary theory need a rethink? Yes, urgently
Without an extended evolutionary framework, the theory neglects key processes, say Kevin Laland and colleagues.

Charles Darwin conceived of evolution by natural selection without knowing that genes exist. Now mainstream evolutionary theory has come to focus almost exclusively on genetic inheritance and processes that change gene frequencies.

Yet new data pouring out of adjacent fields are starting to undermine this narrow stance. An alternative vision of evolution is beginning to crystallize, in which the processes by which organisms grow and develop are recognized as causes of evolution.

Does evolutionary theory need a rethink?

"We all agree that evolution is a "thing". "

No, the consensus is that evolution is the reason every species, including us, has ever lived, and that we all have a common ancestor (one individual, in fact). If you don't agree with this, you don't agree with evolutionary theory. And it is clear that you do not. Spare me the equivocation.


No, you do not get to misappropriate the theory of evolution into your completely opposed viewpoint buy putting it in air quotes. You are diametrically opposed to it, and that is the position you have chosen. Own it.