Euro-pean on America

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Lumpy 1, Jan 1, 2010.

  1. Lumpy 1
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    Lumpy 1 Diamond Member Supporting Member

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    In my opinion, America should remain distinctly different from the rest of the world.

    This drive by Democrats to force feed us the European style health care, cap & trade, more government control and restrictions, high unemployment, loss of State sovereignty, etc., just sucks in my opinion..

    It's fine for them if they like it...
     
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    Last edited: Jan 1, 2010
  2. antagon
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    antagon The Man

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    my history has the US leading europe on those same topics.
     
  3. Lumpy 1
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    Lumpy 1 Diamond Member Supporting Member

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    Explain please...:confused:
     
  4. xotoxi
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    xotoxi Platinum Member

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    Why?

    If you are referring to the use of soaps and deodorants, I agree with you wholeheartedly.
     
  5. Polk
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    Polk Classic

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    Since when is cap-and-trade a European idea?
     
  6. Lumpy 1
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    Lumpy 1 Diamond Member Supporting Member

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  7. Polk
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    Polk Classic

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    A conservative think tank has a problem with cap-and-trade and talks about one firm to make their case.

    Also, you never answered how it was a European idea. I'm guessing that's because you already know the answer. It isn't. The earliest example of emissions trading is from right here in the United States. The Acid Rain Program program established by the Clean Air Act of 1990.
     
  8. Lumpy 1
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    Lumpy 1 Diamond Member Supporting Member

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    :clap2:..you got me....

    (actually who cares, their doing it first) Hows that working out for them..?
     
  9. Polk
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    Polk Classic

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    They're not doing it first. We did it first with SO2 emissions.

    As for how its working out, it's still in the early stages. The Phase I caps were not particular successful because too many permits were issued (meaning that while a cap existed on paper, it didn't exist in practice). Even so, there are some studies suggesting it did influence behavior (if you'd like to read more: Fondazione Eni Enrico Mattei Working Papers).

    Also, that article you linked to earlier? It's built on a false premise. It's saying that firm is having a problem due to increased electricity costs. The problem? Power producers are exempt from the bidding process and receive their permits for free. The result is that the system doesn't increase their costs at all. If it did, you would have seen energy costs increase across the EU. That's not what happened. Most of the increase occurred in nations which have deregulated their energy sectors.
     
  10. Lumpy 1
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    Lumpy 1 Diamond Member Supporting Member

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    Well I'll admit it, you have me at a disadvantage, I haven't researched European cap & trade or potential U.S. cap & trade enough. I will... then we can dance with the issue. Of course, if you prefer, I could pick the personal insult option.

    Mainly.. my post dealt with retaining America's uniqueness and the drive to use Europe as the standard to strive for..
     
    Last edited: Jan 2, 2010

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