'Dydd Gŵyl Dewi Hapus.'

[Tommy Tainant]

Happy St Davids Day to all my friends on USMB.

Here is a short video which explains Wales to the world. The singers are not a choir. Its the audience at an Eisteddfod* amusing themselves whilst waiting for the judges to announce the winner.
I think it is rather beautiful.




* Eisteddfod - is a festival of music and poetry that celebrates Welsh culture.

 

[Ringel05]

I think this explains the Welsh rather succinctly......

 

[ESay]

I always thought that the Welsh were completely assimilated and lost their culture. But recently I learnt that among their Celtic neighbors - the Irish and Scots - they preserved their language the most.

Something like 50 percent use their native language in everyday life, while only several percent of the Irish and Scots do the same.

But unlike Scots they dont have strong national movement. I wonder why.

 

[Tommy Tainant]

I always thought that the Welsh were completely assimilated and lost their culture. But recently I learnt that among their Celtic neighbors - the Irish and Scots - they preserved their language the most.

Something like 50 percent use their native language in everyday life, while only several percent of the Irish and Scots do the same.

But unlike Scots they dont have strong national movement. I wonder why.

Its a great question and I have been canvassing opinions from my friends on this.


Several reasons have been given but seem to boil down to the following.


History. Wales is a conquered nation and has been treated as a colony since the Welsh discovered America.Scotland was never conquered and joined England in the Act of Union.

Colonization - The country is split between North and South. All the main roads in Wales flow from West to East and into England. There are no major roads from North Wales to South Wales . Similarly there is no direct rail service linking North and South. You have to travel through England to get from the North to Cardiff in the South. I live in the North and it is quicker for me to drive to Liverpool and fly to Paris than to drive to Cardiff.

1. For centuries being “English” was seen as the path to prosperity. So our brightest and best saw London as the end of the yellow brick road. Being Welsh was frowned upon and speaking Welsh was discouraged in schools. Kids caught speaking Welsh were punished by being made to wear a sign called the “Welsh Not” . I lived in a welsh pit village called Ponciau. But if you look at the headstones in the graveyards it is spelled Ponkey which is an anglicised version of the Welsh name.
   
   
2. Media - Scotland and Ireland have a national media so it is possible to have a national conversation. There is no national media in Wales. The Western Mail covers the South and the Daily Post covers the North. Both are owned by the same English corporation. MGN. BBC Wales is seen as unionis in that it is run by the same people influenced by #3. They are not going to allow any independence nonsense to upset their cosy love in with their paymasters in London. TV progs set in Wales were few and far between. Ive seen Black Americans talk about the times they saw black folks on the TV and how they were excited. We are the Black folks of the UK. I dont think there have been more than a dozen films made with a Welsh theme.
   
   
3. Ireland was brutalized by the English on many occasions. (see Black and Tans) That has not happened in Wales for centuries and so the anger subsides. There is no Welsh IRA any more.
   
   
4. Education. I have a degree in History. I started school in Ysgol Cefn Mawr in 66 and finished my degree 17 years later. My whole educational life spent in Wales. Not once did I learn any Welsh history. Not one episode.We were taught British history which was shorthand for English history. Our world view was formed by an anglo unionist curriculum and we were invited to share the glory of English achievement. We conquered the world and made it better doncha know. It was only when I did my degree that I started to uncover my own history. When you can detach a people from its language and history you have pretty much nailed it.
   
   
5. The Welsh people themselves are the biggest problem. We have low expectations and look to England for advancement. We arent going to rise up and revolt. And if I am honest I would not want to see a drop of English blood spilled to gain Welsh independence. Welsh people can pump themselves up to beat the “Saes” once a year but after that they go back into their shell. See the vid at the end and try to understand why all that passion goes nowhere.
   

There is a lot more to it than that but these are the basic reasons we agreed on.

NB There is a welsh nationalist movement but it is generally centered on the Welsh heartlands.

 

[harmonica]

whenever I hear about Wales, I think of How Green Was My Valley
...I can't believe we would've been able to read- [ effectively ] the original version as written because when I look at it now, it almost looks like another language

 

[Tommy Tainant]

whenever I hear about Wales, I think of How Green Was My Valley
...I can't believe we would've been able to read- [ effectively ] the original version as written because when I look at it now, it almost looks like another language

Its a mixed reception in Wales. The BBC did its own version in the 70s and it is a lot better than the film. The author was an anglo but he got so many things right. It is probably only one of two Welsh films most people know.
You can get all of the BBC series on this.

 

[harmonica]

whenever I hear about Wales, I think of How Green Was My Valley
...I can't believe we would've been able to read- [ effectively ] the original version as written because when I look at it now, it almost looks like another language

Its a mixed reception in Wales. The BBC did its own version in the 70s and it is a lot better than the film. The author was an anglo but he got so many things right. It is probably only one of two Welsh films most people know.
You can get all of the BBC series on this.

......it was one of the books we had to read in high school .....I enjoyed the novels we had to read......of course I can't remember much of it --it was so long ago

 

[harmonica]

..I always ask of foreigners = what's your main food dish over there?

 

[Tommy Tainant]

Have a look at the bbc version. Its fantastic.

 

[fncceo]

I still find it interesting, and a bit incomprehensible, that a Welshman would hate Jews.

 

[fncceo]

The divide between working class families and their children has always been a staple of British literature

 

[Dogmaphobe]

You have friends at usmb?

 

[Darkwind]

whenever I hear about Wales, I think of How Green Was My Valley
...I can't believe we would've been able to read- [ effectively ] the original version as written because when I look at it now, it almost looks like another language

When I think of Wales, this is the image that comes to mind...

She was one of the most beautiful women on the planet.

 

[Tommy Tainant]

 

[Tommy Tainant]

I still find it interesting, and a bit incomprehensible, that a Welshman would hate Jews.

That isnt the case.

 

[harmonica]

whenever I hear about Wales, I think of How Green Was My Valley
...I can't believe we would've been able to read- [ effectively ] the original version as written because when I look at it now, it almost looks like another language

When I think of Wales, this is the image that comes to mind...

She was one of the most beautiful women on the planet.

I never knew--THANK YOU !!
.....goddang-- I was just thinking about how the UK/Australia have left their mark on the world and all the celebrities/entertainers from there!!! I am very impressed with the UK and Australia

 

[ESay]

I always thought that the Welsh were completely assimilated and lost their culture. But recently I learnt that among their Celtic neighbors - the Irish and Scots - they preserved their language the most.

Something like 50 percent use their native language in everyday life, while only several percent of the Irish and Scots do the same.

But unlike Scots they dont have strong national movement. I wonder why.

Its a great question and I have been canvassing opinions from my friends on this.


Several reasons have been given but seem to boil down to the following.


History. Wales is a conquered nation and has been treated as a colony since the Welsh discovered America.Scotland was never conquered and joined England in the Act of Union.

Colonization - The country is split between North and South. All the main roads in Wales flow from West to East and into England. There are no major roads from North Wales to South Wales . Similarly there is no direct rail service linking North and South. You have to travel through England to get from the North to Cardiff in the South. I live in the North and it is quicker for me to drive to Liverpool and fly to Paris than to drive to Cardiff.

1. For centuries being “English” was seen as the path to prosperity. So our brightest and best saw London as the end of the yellow brick road. Being Welsh was frowned upon and speaking Welsh was discouraged in schools. Kids caught speaking Welsh were punished by being made to wear a sign called the “Welsh Not” . I lived in a welsh pit village called Ponciau. But if you look at the headstones in the graveyards it is spelled Ponkey which is an anglicised version of the Welsh name.
   
   
2. Media - Scotland and Ireland have a national media so it is possible to have a national conversation. There is no national media in Wales. The Western Mail covers the South and the Daily Post covers the North. Both are owned by the same English corporation. MGN. BBC Wales is seen as unionis in that it is run by the same people influenced by #3. They are not going to allow any independence nonsense to upset their cosy love in with their paymasters in London. TV progs set in Wales were few and far between. Ive seen Black Americans talk about the times they saw black folks on the TV and how they were excited. We are the Black folks of the UK. I dont think there have been more than a dozen films made with a Welsh theme.
   
   
3. Ireland was brutalized by the English on many occasions. (see Black and Tans) That has not happened in Wales for centuries and so the anger subsides. There is no Welsh IRA any more.
   
   
4. Education. I have a degree in History. I started school in Ysgol Cefn Mawr in 66 and finished my degree 17 years later. My whole educational life spent in Wales. Not once did I learn any Welsh history. Not one episode.We were taught British history which was shorthand for English history. Our world view was formed by an anglo unionist curriculum and we were invited to share the glory of English achievement. We conquered the world and made it better doncha know. It was only when I did my degree that I started to uncover my own history. When you can detach a people from its language and history you have pretty much nailed it.
   
   
5. The Welsh people themselves are the biggest problem. We have low expectations and look to England for advancement. We arent going to rise up and revolt. And if I am honest I would not want to see a drop of English blood spilled to gain Welsh independence. Welsh people can pump themselves up to beat the “Saes” once a year but after that they go back into their shell. See the vid at the end and try to understand why all that passion goes nowhere.

There is a lot more to it than that but these are the basic reasons we agreed on.

NB There is a welsh nationalist movement but it is generally centered on the Welsh heartlands.

Thanks. That was a great answer.