Dominionists run for highest office in US

[RetiredGySgt]

In order for a law, measure, or policy to not violate the Establishment Clause of the First Amendment, it must not conflict with one of he three prongs of the test developed in Lemon v. Kurtzman, 91 S. Ct. 2105 (1971):

1) the government action must have a secular purpose;
2) its primary purpose must not be to inhibit or to advance religion;
3) there must be no excessive entanglement between government and religion.

See also: County of Allegheny v. American Civil Liberties Union, Greater Pittsburgh Chapter

Don't bother with facts, Sky is off on one of her "I hate Christian " rants. Already pointed out to her that in order for the US to become a theocracy it would require several Amendments. Something a President has nothing to do with. She has yet to explain to us how electing Perry or Bachmann would equal 218 congresspeople, 51 Senators and majority of voters in 37 States.

 

[freedombecki]

Hate crime is different from other kinds of violent crime. Mulageta Seraw, was an Ethiopian immigrant who was brutally murdered by skinheads. He was targeted because he was black. That crime sent waves of fear throughout the black community in Portland. An organized group in Portland had been delivering

James Byrd is another example. He was dragged by a truck to his death by two white supremacists and then decapitated. Matthew Shepard is another example.

Recently, an African lesbian activist was gang raped, brutally beaten and then stabbed 25 times. The men were sending a message to the gay community, not just murdering a woman.

Three white men in New Mexico are charged with a hate crime for branding a developmentally disabled Native American man with a swastika.

I know what "hate crimes" are. Hate crime legislation DEMANDS abolishment of First Amendment rights. How could you?

Bull. How could I support hate crime legislation? I care about hate crime, that's how I could. Hate crimes are more likely to exacerbate tensions in the community. They affect not only the victim. They can lead to wide scale violence.

Cross burning is not simple arson.

It is not bull.

Begosh and begorra, you ain't getting my free speech madam. YOU ARE NOT FOOLING ME. YOU CAN NOT TAKE AWAY THE FREE SPEECH MY DAD SPENT A PAINFUL 40 YEARS HURTING FROM SHRAPNEL FROM CREEPS OVER THERE WHO WANTED AMERICA TO BOW TO THEIR EMPEROR AND JUST STFU.

NO WAY AM I GIVING AWAY THE PRIVILEGES HE WAS HARMED FOR AND SUFFERED FOR THE REST OF HIS LIFE TO GIVE ME FREE SPEECH.

YOU GOT IT?????

You wanna spend your life partying with your galpal?

Fine.

You want me to give up my free speech?

Hell no.

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[Sky Dancer]

I know what "hate crimes" are. Hate crime legislation DEMANDS abolishment of First Amendment rights. How could you?

Bull. How could I support hate crime legislation? I care about hate crime, that's how I could. Hate crimes are more likely to exacerbate tensions in the community. They affect not only the victim. They can lead to wide scale violence.

Cross burning is not simple arson.

It is not bull.

Begosh and begorra, you ain't getting my free speech madam. YOU ARE NOT FOOLING ME. YOU CAN NOT TAKE AWAY THE FREE SPEECH MY DAD SPENT A PAINFUL 40 YEARS HURTING FROM SHRAPNEL FROM CREEPS OVER THERE WHO WANTED AMERICA TO BOW TO THEIR EMPEROR AND JUST STFU.

NO WAY AM I GIVING AWAY THE PRIVILEGES HE WAS HARMED FOR AND SUFFERED FOR THE REST OF HIS LIFE TO GIVE ME FREE SPEECH.

YOU GOT IT?????

You wanna spend your life partying with your galpal?

Fine.

You want me to give up my free speech?

Hell no.

FREE SPEECH!! FREE SPEECH!! FREE SPEECH!! FREE SPEECH!! FREE SPEECH!! FREE SPEECH!! FREE SPEECH!! FREE SPEECH!! FREE SPEECH!! FREE SPEECH!! FREE SPEECH!! FREE SPEECH!! FREE SPEECH!! FREE SPEECH!! FREE SPEECH!! FREE SPEECH!! FREE SPEECH!! FREE SPEECH!!
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You're kind of nutty.

 

[freedombecki]

Bull. How could I support hate crime legislation? I care about hate crime, that's how I could. Hate crimes are more likely to exacerbate tensions in the community. They affect not only the victim. They can lead to wide scale violence.

Cross burning is not simple arson.

It is not bull.

Begosh and begorra, you ain't getting my free speech madam. YOU ARE NOT FOOLING ME. YOU CAN NOT TAKE AWAY THE FREE SPEECH MY DAD SPENT A PAINFUL 40 YEARS HURTING FROM SHRAPNEL FROM CREEPS OVER THERE WHO WANTED AMERICA TO BOW TO THEIR EMPEROR AND JUST STFU.

NO WAY AM I GIVING AWAY THE PRIVILEGES HE WAS HARMED FOR AND SUFFERED FOR THE REST OF HIS LIFE TO GIVE ME FREE SPEECH.

YOU GOT IT?????

You wanna spend your life partying with your galpal?

Fine.

You want me to give up my free speech?

Hell no.

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You're kind of nutty.

I'm kind of right.

 

[Sky Dancer]

It is not bull.

Begosh and begorra, you ain't getting my free speech madam. YOU ARE NOT FOOLING ME. YOU CAN NOT TAKE AWAY THE FREE SPEECH MY DAD SPENT A PAINFUL 40 YEARS HURTING FROM SHRAPNEL FROM CREEPS OVER THERE WHO WANTED AMERICA TO BOW TO THEIR EMPEROR AND JUST STFU.

NO WAY AM I GIVING AWAY THE PRIVILEGES HE WAS HARMED FOR AND SUFFERED FOR THE REST OF HIS LIFE TO GIVE ME FREE SPEECH.

YOU GOT IT?????

You wanna spend your life partying with your galpal?

Fine.

You want me to give up my free speech?

Hell no.

FREE SPEECH!! FREE SPEECH!! FREE SPEECH!! FREE SPEECH!! FREE SPEECH!! FREE SPEECH!! FREE SPEECH!! FREE SPEECH!! FREE SPEECH!! FREE SPEECH!! FREE SPEECH!! FREE SPEECH!! FREE SPEECH!! FREE SPEECH!! FREE SPEECH!! FREE SPEECH!! FREE SPEECH!! FREE SPEECH!!
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You're kind of nutty.

I'm kind of right.

You're definitely right leaning.

 

[Neotrotsky]

In order for a law, measure, or policy to not violate the Establishment Clause of the First Amendment, it must not conflict with one of he three prongs of the test developed in Lemon v. Kurtzman, 91 S. Ct. 2105 (1971):

1) the government action must have a secular purpose;
2) its primary purpose must not be to inhibit or to advance religion;
3) there must be no excessive entanglement between government and religion.

See also: County of Allegheny v. American Civil Liberties Union, Greater Pittsburgh Chapter

Don't bother with facts, Sky is off on one of her "I hate Christian " rants. Already pointed out to her that in order for the US to become a theocracy it would require several Amendments. Something a President has nothing to do with. She has yet to explain to us how electing Perry or Bachmann would equal 218 congresspeople, 51 Senators and majority of voters in 37 States.

You think they would run on Papa Obama's record

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Jake, I'm convinced you haven't cracked a book nor read much on George Washington.

General Washington's prayer was witnessed by a man who owned property near where his troops were camped. He saw Washington and told other townspeople about his praying out in the open.

Most modern scholars believe the Snowden story was wishful thinking. Nice try, though.

Those who are well informed, well read on this subject, and have no axe to grind generally believe that Snowden story is a myth. The painting we see based on it is a graphic myth.

People have no axe to grind generally admit that the story is questionable. People who have an axe to grind call it a myth.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Liberals don't seem to be able to get it in their heads that our Constitution is to limit government powers.
Government is not suppose to make any laws in establishing any religion or prohibiting their free exercise of it.
No Christian has ever said that we were or ever was a Theocracy. Nor are they doing it now.
Government can not go into religion but religion can go into our government.
This is why we have opening prayer in the House, Senate and The Supreme Court every morning before the opening of business.

Organized religion cannot go into government. The government certainly can prohibit the free exercise of religion; check Reynolds v. U.S. 1879 for such an example, or Warren Jeffs v. State of Texas.

However, religious values of people do inform how government works, such as the House, the Senate, and SCOTUS. That does not mean the government gets to tell kids how and when and what to pray to in public schools.

Reynolds v US does not block the free exercise of religion, it blocks people from marrying more than one person. As for your second supposed citation, it would be Texas v Jeffs, it it existed. It has even less to do with religion than Reynolds.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Organized religion cannot go into government. The government certainly can prohibit the free exercise of religion; check Reynolds v. U.S. 1879 for such an example, or Warren Jeffs v. State of Texas.

However, religious values of people do inform how government works, such as the House, the Senate, and SCOTUS. That does not mean the government gets to tell kids how and when and what to pray to in public schools.

It did before atheists got neutral prayer out of schools.
Government never told kids how and when and what to pray.
When we had neutral prayer it never indoctrinated any religion. Your parents had the right to teach you if there was a God or not. And that you had the right to not say the prayer.
Now it has become, you don't have the right to bring your religion into school or public expression, or government.
That is a direct violation of our constitutional rights.
Because of this we have not able to teach very much about US History because too much religion was interwoven into it.
We were a Christian nation at the beginning and we are Christian nation now.
We have the right to celebrate Christmas in our schools, on our government buildings on our city streets and in our stores.
The minority has now ruled over the majority and that is completely unconstitutional.
Jesus is the reason for the season and the minority of atheists and a few others are trying to shut it up.
It is prohibiting the free exercise (unconstituioal)

There is no such thing as "neutral prayer", except silence. Where did this alleged "neutral" prayer come from? Christianity. Your rights are in no way endangered if we don't allow teachers to lead Christian prayers in public school classrooms.
If prayer in school is THAT necessary, you ought to homeschool your kids or send them to Christian schools.

NO one is stopping Christmas. That "culture war" was invented by the right wing. God forbid you might say "Happy Hannukah" to a Jew, or "Season's Greetings" to an atheist. You don't have the right to place RELIGIOUS symbols in government buildings. There are non-religious ways to honor the season.

There is separation of church and state. Recognize that YOUR religious freedom is actually protected by that premise.

What non religious ways are there to honor the Day of Atonement? Easter? Ramadan? (By the way, is Obama holding a Ramadan dinner in the White House a violation of the 1st Amendment?)

 

[freedombecki]

You're kind of nutty.

I'm kind of right.

You're definitely right leaning.

Not so much as you think. I'm dead center. And I'm not going to take crap from either side.

I am correct. You are not going to take away my freedom of speech. I'll fight you to the death if you ever even consider trying that shit on me by passing legislation that will start the erosion process on freedoms of the American people. You will only be sorry if you succeed, because you will wake up not only the sleeping giant, you will wake up the angry sleeping giant.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

I'm not surprised you think that.

You have yet to answer how a President is a danger to creating a Theocracy. The President has ZERO power to do so. I have pointed out what needs to happen for your supposed fear to be real.

GW Bush created the "faith based" initiatives. One step toward eroding the separation of church and state. It gives tax dollars to religious organizations.

Tax dollars have been going to religious organizations for decades.

 

[freedombecki]

I'm not surprised you think that.

You have yet to answer how a President is a danger to creating a Theocracy. The President has ZERO power to do so. I have pointed out what needs to happen for your supposed fear to be real.

GW Bush created the "faith based" initiatives. One step toward eroding the separation of church and state. It gives tax dollars to religious organizations.

President Bush defended the Constitution. Separation of church and state is not an erosion of the Constitution because IT IS NOT IN THE CONSTITUTION.

You are coming across as a very confused person on matters of the state.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Hate crime is different, Becky. It's a crime that is designed to terrorize a group of people, not just the crime victim. It's a crime that sends a message that "your kind" are not wanted.

Do you oppose hate crime legislation?

My definition of crime is an act that stems from hate against another person. Why rewrite every law and stick the word "hate" in it when it is already on the books, understood by persons of good conscience.

The problem with wording laws with marking groups of persons as more worthy of receiving better justice than anyone else is against the concept of equality and it smacks of unequal justice for one group as opposed to another.

You've pushed this point twice. I'm done telling you things twice.

Hate crime is different from other kinds of violent crime. Mulageta Seraw, was an Ethiopian immigrant who was brutally murdered by skinheads. He was targeted because he was black. That crime sent waves of fear throughout the black community in Portland. An organized group in Portland had been delivering

James Byrd is another example. He was dragged by a truck to his death by two white supremacists and then decapitated. Matthew Shepard is another example.

Recently, an African lesbian activist was gang raped, brutally beaten and then stabbed 25 times. The men were sending a message to the gay community, not just murdering a woman.

Three white men in New Mexico are charged with a hate crime for branding a developmentally disabled Native American man with a swastika.

Violent crime is violent crime. Arguing that the motivation of a crime somehow gives the state the right to punish an action, which is the only thing governments can punish, is the first step to giving them the power to punish you for not agreeing with the people in power.

By the way, if you prosecute someone for murder, and then call it a hate crime, can you kill him twice?

 

[Neotrotsky]

My definition of crime is an act that stems from hate against another person. Why rewrite every law and stick the word "hate" in it when it is already on the books, understood by persons of good conscience.

The problem with wording laws with marking groups of persons as more worthy of receiving better justice than anyone else is against the concept of equality and it smacks of unequal justice for one group as opposed to another.

You've pushed this point twice. I'm done telling you things twice.

Hate crime is different from other kinds of violent crime. Mulageta Seraw, was an Ethiopian immigrant who was brutally murdered by skinheads. He was targeted because he was black. That crime sent waves of fear throughout the black community in Portland. An organized group in Portland had been delivering

James Byrd is another example. He was dragged by a truck to his death by two white supremacists and then decapitated. Matthew Shepard is another example.

Recently, an African lesbian activist was gang raped, brutally beaten and then stabbed 25 times. The men were sending a message to the gay community, not just murdering a woman.

Three white men in New Mexico are charged with a hate crime for branding a developmentally disabled Native American man with a swastika.

Violent crime is violent crime. Arguing that the motivation of a crime somehow gives the state the right to punish an action, which is the only thing governments can punish, is the first step to giving them the power to punish you for not agreeing with the people in power.

By the way, if you prosecute someone for murder, and then call it a hate crime, can you kill him twice?

No doubt some would try

Furthermore, the unbalanced application in their administration is very telling as well

 

[Quantum Windbag]

In order for a law, measure, or policy to not violate the Establishment Clause of the First Amendment, it must not conflict with one of he three prongs of the test developed in Lemon v. Kurtzman, 91 S. Ct. 2105 (1971):

1) the government action must have a secular purpose;
2) its primary purpose must not be to inhibit or to advance religion;
3) there must be no excessive entanglement between government and religion.

See also: County of Allegheny v. American Civil Liberties Union, Greater Pittsburgh Chapter

This is the kind of stuff that makes some people think you know what you are talking about.

What about the Sherbert test and the RFRA? SCOTUS uses the endorsement test to determine if it looks like the government is specifically endorsing, or disapproving, a religion. If the action does not pass this test it is unconstitutional. On top of that we have the coercion test. All fo these apply, not just the test you mentioned.

 

[Neotrotsky]

In order for a law, measure, or policy to not violate the Establishment Clause of the First Amendment, it must not conflict with one of he three prongs of the test developed in Lemon v. Kurtzman, 91 S. Ct. 2105 (1971):

1) the government action must have a secular purpose;
2) its primary purpose must not be to inhibit or to advance religion;
3) there must be no excessive entanglement between government and religion.

See also: County of Allegheny v. American Civil Liberties Union, Greater Pittsburgh Chapter

This is the kind of stuff that makes some people think you know what you are talking about.

What about the Sherbert test and the RFRA? SCOTUS uses the endorsement test to determine if it looks like the government is specifically endorsing, or disapproving, a religion. If the action does not pass this test it is unconstitutional. On top of that we have the coercion test. All fo these apply, not just the test you mentioned.

Of course, the question should be
why is gov't even involved in marriage, in the first place?

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Hate crime is different from other kinds of violent crime. Mulageta Seraw, was an Ethiopian immigrant who was brutally murdered by skinheads. He was targeted because he was black. That crime sent waves of fear throughout the black community in Portland. An organized group in Portland had been delivering

James Byrd is another example. He was dragged by a truck to his death by two white supremacists and then decapitated. Matthew Shepard is another example.

Recently, an African lesbian activist was gang raped, brutally beaten and then stabbed 25 times. The men were sending a message to the gay community, not just murdering a woman.

Three white men in New Mexico are charged with a hate crime for branding a developmentally disabled Native American man with a swastika.

Violent crime is violent crime. Arguing that the motivation of a crime somehow gives the state the right to punish an action, which is the only thing governments can punish, is the first step to giving them the power to punish you for not agreeing with the people in power.

By the way, if you prosecute someone for murder, and then call it a hate crime, can you kill him twice?

No doubt some would try

Furthermore, the unbalanced application in their administration is very telling as well

Can someone provide for me a link to a case where a black person was charged with a hate crime?

 

[Neotrotsky]

Violent crime is violent crime. Arguing that the motivation of a crime somehow gives the state the right to punish an action, which is the only thing governments can punish, is the first step to giving them the power to punish you for not agreeing with the people in power.

By the way, if you prosecute someone for murder, and then call it a hate crime, can you kill him twice?

No doubt some would try

Furthermore, the unbalanced application in their administration is very telling as well

Can someone provide for me a link to a case where a black person was charged with a hate crime?

there has been

just as there has been many stories where hate crimes should have been charged and were not

For example, the Duke Rape case, the media and the Left was all over that one
up until the case was dropped for being false.

In my opinion, she should have been charged with
a hate crime as well. She used their race against them knowing it would get the
most attention , shock and support from the media.

also- Murders of Channon Christian and Christopher Newsom

 

[ABikerSailor]

You have yet to answer how a President is a danger to creating a Theocracy. The President has ZERO power to do so. I have pointed out what needs to happen for your supposed fear to be real.

GW Bush created the "faith based" initiatives. One step toward eroding the separation of church and state. It gives tax dollars to religious organizations.

President Bush defended the Constitution. Separation of church and state is not an erosion of the Constitution because IT IS NOT IN THE CONSTITUTION.

You are coming across as a very confused person on matters of the state.

Jr. also put Bible verses on Iraq war briefing papers.

 

[Neotrotsky]

What's your point

Barack Obama invokes Jesus more than George W. Bush