DC Voucher Program

Annie

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Usually with a post like this, I'd go back to the beginning. The links are there and I think the discussion is valuable between Heritage and Media Matters:

Media Matters Tries but Fails to Refute the School Choice Evidence | The Foundry: Conservative Policy News.

Media Matters Tries but Fails to Refute the School Choice Evidence

Posted By Lindsey Burke On October 14, 2010 @ 6:30 pm In Education

Yesterday, Media Matters [1] tried to refute a blog post [2] in which I point out, among other things, that the impact of voucher use in the D.C. Opportunity Scholarship Program resulted in a 91 percent graduation rate compared to 70 percent in the control group. The findings are from the U.S. Department of Education’s final evaluation [3] of the voucher program, authored by Dr. Patrick Wolf.

Walid Zafar writes via Media Matters:

Where does Burke get the 91 percent figure from? Well, not this [the Department of Education’s] report. It’s hard not concluding that she made that statistic up. The report puts the graduation rate for students receiving vouchers at 82 percent.
Not so fast. The report does in fact find that the use of voucher resulted in a 91 percent graduation rate. On page 20 of the report’s executive summary, Wolf writes:

The offer of an OSP scholarship raised students’ probability of completing high school by 12 percentage points overall. The graduation rate based on parent-provided information was 82 percent for the treatment group compared to 70 percent for the control group. There was a 21 percent difference (impact) for using a scholarship to attend a participating private school. [Emphasis added]​

The 21 percentage point difference for impact means the typical student who received a voucher and actually used it to attend a private school had a graduation rate of 91 percent, compared to 70 percent for non-voucher students. Here’s exactly how the graduation rates break down:

* D.C. Public Schools graduation rate [4]: 49 percent.
* Control group (those students who applied for a voucher but did not receive one) graduation rate: 70 percent.
* Voucher recipient group (students who applied for a voucher, won the lottery to receive one, but did not necessarily use it) graduation rate: 82 percent.
* Impact of voucher use: (students who applied for, received, and actually used the voucher to attend a private school) graduation rate: 91 percent.​

Zafar also argues that the results of the study are minimized due to the increased motivation of parents who applied for a scholarship:

You can’t compare the graduation rate at DC Public Schools (which take in all who apply, regardless of learning disabilities and level of parental involvement) to a lottery based voucher system to which only the most highly motivated students (and parents) choose to apply.​

First, the D.C. Opportunity Scholarship Program does have to take all students who apply. When applications exceed scholarships, officials use a lottery to determine which students receive vouchers. In fact, because evaluators anticipated objections like Zafar’s, they controlled for the students who applied for a voucher but were ultimately not offered one. These presumably highly motivated students were evenly distributed across the treatment and control group, which is probably why the control group graduation rate of 70 percent was higher than the overall DCPS rate of 49 percent. The voucher students significantly outperformed the control group on the crucial measure of high school graduation even though the lottery ensured that both groups were equally stocked with motivated students and parents.

While it’s true that parents have to have a certain level of interest in the educational opportunities of their children in order to apply for a voucher, thousands of low-income families in the District jumped at the opportunity to do so when given the chance. In fact, there were four applicants for every available scholarship.

Finally, Zafar argues that the DCOSP had no impact on academic achievement:

In the area of student achievement, the report concludes, “Overall reading and math test scores were not significantly affected by the Program, based on our main analysis approach.” Most crucially, the report notes that “No significant impacts on achievement were detected for students” who “were lower performing academically when they applied.” In other words, the students who did well on the voucher program were those who were already doing well in public school.​

While the final evaluation did not find a statistically significant impact on academic achievement (which was not the main point of our argument), it did find that the scholarships had a positive impact on academic outcomes for some subgroups of students [5]. Moreover, Dr. Wolf, the lead researcher on the OSP study, explains in a statement from the University of Arkansas [5] that the significant positive impact on graduation rates is more important than the impact on academic achievement:

These results are important because high school graduation is strongly associated with a large number of important life outcomes such as lifetime earnings, longevity, avoiding prison and out-of-wedlock births, and marital stability. Academic achievement, in contrast, is only weakly associated with most of those outcomes.

In the area of education, how far you go is more important than how much you know, and D.C. students went farther with the assistance of a school voucher.
Facts matter, and we hope we’ve stated them clearly enough so that even Media Matters can’t deny them.
 
Thanks Annie, for posting the article: I read it with interest and found the following two points to be most curious:

1.
While it’s true that parents have to have a certain level of interest in the educational opportunities of their children in order to apply for a voucher, thousands of low-income families in the District jumped at the opportunity to do so when given the chance.

What is the author thinking here?

A. Parents must be interested in a voucher to apply for it. (obviously)

B. Many Low income parents were interested in vouchers. (again, obviously. Who else would be more interested?)

These obvious points seem to be an effort to justify comparing the graduation rate of the aggregate population (49%) and the group that applied for but did not receive vouchers (70%).

But the most obvious conclusion seems to be the one the author missed!!

The 21% difference, (70-49%) is between parents of kids that were interested enough to apply for vouchers, and the average DC kid's graduation rate.

Essentially, parental interest in their kids education, not the vouchers, had the largest impact on graduation rate.


Secondly:

Dr. Wolf, the lead researcher on the OSP study, explains in a statement from the University of Arkansas [5] that the significant positive impact on graduation rates is more important than the impact on academic achievement

How extraordinary!

Why is graduation rates more important than academic achievement?
 
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Thanks Annie, for posting the article: I read it with interest and found the following two points to be most curious:

1.
While it’s true that parents have to have a certain level of interest in the educational opportunities of their children in order to apply for a voucher, thousands of low-income families in the District jumped at the opportunity to do so when given the chance.

What is the author thinking here?

A. Parents must be interested in a voucher to apply for it. (obviously)

B. Many Low income parents were interested in vouchers. (again, obviously. Who else would be more interested?)

These obvious points seem to be an effort to justify comparing the graduation rate of the aggregate population (49%) and the group that applied for but did not receive vouchers (70%).

But the most obvious conclusion seems to be the one the author missed!!

The 21% difference, (70-49%) is between parents of kids that were interested enough to apply for vouchers, and the average DC kid's graduation rate.

Essentially, parental interest in their kids education, not the vouchers, had the largest impact on graduation rate.


Secondly:

Dr. Wolf, the lead researcher on the OSP study, explains in a statement from the University of Arkansas [5] that the significant positive impact on graduation rates is more important than the impact on academic achievement

How extraordinary!

Why is graduation rates more important than academic achievement?

Parental involvement indeed was noted, thus why they set up the control from those that applied, but didn't receive. Indeed, their children were able to succeed at much higher rate. Same types of kids, with the voucher and alternative choices, did nearly again as high as those whose parents bothered, but were not lucky enough to have been drawn.

As with most things, many factors come into play, without a doubt, parental support regarding school being the most important.
 
Thanks Annie, for posting the article: I read it with interest and found the following two points to be most curious:

1.
While it’s true that parents have to have a certain level of interest in the educational opportunities of their children in order to apply for a voucher, thousands of low-income families in the District jumped at the opportunity to do so when given the chance.

What is the author thinking here?

A. Parents must be interested in a voucher to apply for it. (obviously)

B. Many Low income parents were interested in vouchers. (again, obviously. Who else would be more interested?)

These obvious points seem to be an effort to justify comparing the graduation rate of the aggregate population (49%) and the group that applied for but did not receive vouchers (70%).

But the most obvious conclusion seems to be the one the author missed!!

The 21% difference, (70-49%) is between parents of kids that were interested enough to apply for vouchers, and the average DC kid's graduation rate.

Essentially, parental interest in their kids education, not the vouchers, had the largest impact on graduation rate.


Secondly:

Dr. Wolf, the lead researcher on the OSP study, explains in a statement from the University of Arkansas [5] that the significant positive impact on graduation rates is more important than the impact on academic achievement

How extraordinary!

Why is graduation rates more important than academic achievement?

Parental involvement indeed was noted, thus why they set up the control from those that applied, but didn't receive. Indeed, their children were able to succeed at much higher rate. Same types of kids, with the voucher and alternative choices, did nearly again as high as those whose parents bothered, but were not lucky enough to have been drawn.

As with most things, many factors come into play, without a doubt, parental support regarding school being the most important.

Yes, the difference between the control group, and those that applied, but did not receive was a 12% (82-70%) difference.

This proves that parental interest, not the voucher system, has the greatest impact on kid's education.
 
But the most obvious conclusion seems to be the one the author missed!!

The 21% difference, (70-49%) is between parents of kids that were interested enough to apply for vouchers, and the average DC kid's graduation rate.

Essentially, parental interest in their kids education, not the vouchers, had the largest impact on graduation rate.

The difference between the 70% rate of the ones who applied & the 91% rate of the ones who applied & used vouchers is also 21%. Vouchers have the exact same observed impact as parent involvement.

More astonishing is the fact that adding parental interest and vouchers did not diminish each others effect. Combining both 21% impacts actually equaled a 42% result. Since we do not have a group of dis-interested parents getting vouchers, I am going to assume that the vouchers play a larger role than the observed measurement. Because adding more stimuluses together usually results in diminishing returns especially as you approach 100%.
 
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Public schools' "magnet" schools could not survive this level of scrutiny.

Parents of students who want to do well will do well anywhere.

Who the hell is the Federal governmentn to tell them they have to stay in crime ridden schools void of any disclipline and standards?
 
But the most obvious conclusion seems to be the one the author missed!!

The 21% difference, (70-49%) is between parents of kids that were interested enough to apply for vouchers, and the average DC kid's graduation rate.

Essentially, parental interest in their kids education, not the vouchers, had the largest impact on graduation rate.

The difference between the 70% rate of the ones who applied & the 91% rate of the ones who applied & used vouchers is also 21%. Vouchers have the exact same observed impact as parent involvement.

More astonishing is the fact that adding parental interest and vouchers did not diminish each others effect. Combining both 21% impacts actually equaled a 42% result. Since we do not have a group of dis-interested parents getting vouchers, I am going to assume that the vouchers play a larger role than the observed measurement. Because adding stimuluses usually results in diminishing returns especially as you approach 100%.

No.

The 91% number is derived by the logically challenged author,

Indeed 70 + 21 = 91, but this has nothing to do with results.
 
How extraordinary!

Why is graduation rates more important than academic achievement?

because they can skew the figures, they already do. i saw a study a year or so ago that said that the graduation rates most especially in inner city and poorer school districts ( if there are any relatively anymore with federal funds and mandated apportionment) are probably jewked 10% higher, via some mechanisms the districts/ schools employ-

- social promotion by grade, i.e. promoting someone to a higher grade not based on their academic achievement, but because they have fallen 2-3 years behind and didn't rate the promotion scholastically, its a sop to the student who is not being 'socialized' among his/her peers.

-Schools offer after school study halls to wit; if a student does not have enough credits, they show up after school, 'study' and are given credit for the class short circuiting the grade point system and ion fact just giving them credit for just being there.


I saw "Waiting for Superman" this past weekend, one stat. they spoke to which I have seen before ala a studies I have read that address the "self esteem" mantra, apparently kids at the high school level, our kids have the highest 'confidence' ranking in themselves and their abilities despite ranking very low in OECD comparative studies.
 
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I don't think one can infer the 91% was because of grade inflation, nor can it be proven not to be from information published.

However, the nature of the study tends against it. The fact that the standardized scores of the voucher users didn't increase, while performance did is possible link towards the influence of school attended. The differences in scores was insignificant between the 70% control group and the 91% users. Parental support may be assumed in both groups and was.

What I'm curious about are those students who applied, received, but didn't use the vouchers. What were their rates of graduation and scores?
 

First minute or two into the video:

This is an environment that African American Males Just Don't Do Well In. Drugs and Violence just follow them around

How, extraordinary.

Its the "ENVIRONMENT's" fault?

Hasn't any money been spent to change the "environment?"

Am I to understand that, MORE Money will be the answer to the "environmental" problem?

I'll tell you what: Let's take all the African American Males in Washington DC, and have them build a road from Kabul to Bagdad. I'm certain the change in environment will do wonders.
 
I don't think one can infer the 91% was because of grade inflation, nor can it be proven not to be from information published.

However, the nature of the study tends against it. The fact that the standardized scores of the voucher users didn't increase, while performance did is possible link towards the influence of school attended. The differences in scores was insignificant between the 70% control group and the 91% users. Parental support may be assumed in both groups and was.

What I'm curious about are those students who applied, received, but didn't use the vouchers. What were their rates of graduation and scores?

The 91% is a bullshit number the author DERIVED by simply adding 70 + 21.

Read the quote in your post.

21 is the difference between 70 - 49.

This is the difference between The Graduation rate of students whose parents APPLIED for the voucher and did not receive it, and the aggregate DC student graduation rate.
 
How extraordinary!

Why is graduation rates more important than academic achievement?

because they can skew the figures, they already do. i saw a study a year or so ago that said that the graduation rates most especially in inner city and poorer school districts ( if there are any relatively anymore with federal funds and mandated apportionment) are probably jewked 10% higher, via some mechanisms the districts/ schools employ-

- social promotion by grade, i.e. promoting someone to a higher grade not based on their academic achievement, but because they have fallen 2-3 years behind and didn't rate the promotion scholastically, its a sop to the student who is not being 'socialized' among his/her peers.

-Schools offer after school study halls to wit; if a student does not have enough credits, they show up after school, 'study' and are given credit for the class short circuiting the grade point system and ion fact just giving them credit for just being there.


I saw "Waiting for Superman" this past weekend, one stat. they spoke to which I have seen before ala a studies I have read that address the "self esteem" mantra, apparently kids at the high school level, our kids have the highest 'confidence' ranking in themselves and their abilities despite ranking very low in OECD comparative studies.

I was hoping you'd say that graduation rate is more important because it allows employment opportunities.
 
How extraordinary!

Why is graduation rates more important than academic achievement?

because they can skew the figures, they already do. i saw a study a year or so ago that said that the graduation rates most especially in inner city and poorer school districts ( if there are any relatively anymore with federal funds and mandated apportionment) are probably jewked 10% higher, via some mechanisms the districts/ schools employ-

- social promotion by grade, i.e. promoting someone to a higher grade not based on their academic achievement, but because they have fallen 2-3 years behind and didn't rate the promotion scholastically, its a sop to the student who is not being 'socialized' among his/her peers.

-Schools offer after school study halls to wit; if a student does not have enough credits, they show up after school, 'study' and are given credit for the class short circuiting the grade point system and ion fact just giving them credit for just being there.


I saw "Waiting for Superman" this past weekend, one stat. they spoke to which I have seen before ala a studies I have read that address the "self esteem" mantra, apparently kids at the high school level, our kids have the highest 'confidence' ranking in themselves and their abilities despite ranking very low in OECD comparative studies.

I was hoping you'd say that graduation rate is more important because it allows employment opportunities.


I wasn't really speaking to that point...sorry, I went off on a tangent.


I think that yardstick ala a HS diploma is losing its ability to speak for itself as to the efficacy of a getting a better employee is losing its magic.( for the reason I stipulated above, there is little secret today that we are graduating kids who 20 years would not have had a hope of getting a diploma and employers are aware of that).

BUT, yes it is still a yardstick many employ, but the amalgamation taking place with more GED grads and the fact that 60% of first year college students need remedial studies to take standard first year college fare, is dissipating the aura of 'HS graduate" (and class A college ed. too).
 
because they can skew the figures, they already do. i saw a study a year or so ago that said that the graduation rates most especially in inner city and poorer school districts ( if there are any relatively anymore with federal funds and mandated apportionment) are probably jewked 10% higher, via some mechanisms the districts/ schools employ-

- social promotion by grade, i.e. promoting someone to a higher grade not based on their academic achievement, but because they have fallen 2-3 years behind and didn't rate the promotion scholastically, its a sop to the student who is not being 'socialized' among his/her peers.

-Schools offer after school study halls to wit; if a student does not have enough credits, they show up after school, 'study' and are given credit for the class short circuiting the grade point system and ion fact just giving them credit for just being there.


I saw "Waiting for Superman" this past weekend, one stat. they spoke to which I have seen before ala a studies I have read that address the "self esteem" mantra, apparently kids at the high school level, our kids have the highest 'confidence' ranking in themselves and their abilities despite ranking very low in OECD comparative studies.

I was hoping you'd say that graduation rate is more important because it allows employment opportunities.


I wasn't really speaking to that point...sorry, I went off on a tangent.


I think that yardstick ala a HS diploma is losing its ability to speak for itself as to the efficacy of a getting a better employee is losing its magic.( for the reason I stipulated above, there is little secret today that we are graduating kids who 20 years would not have had a hope of getting a diploma and employers are aware of that).

BUT, yes it is still a yardstick many employ, but the amalgamation taking place with more GED grads and the fact that 60% of first year college students need remedial studies to take standard first year college fare, is dissipating the aura of 'HS graduate" (and class A college ed. too).

I was hoping you'd address the face that 20 million illegal aliens seem to be surviving quite well outside Mexico without having US Public High School Diplomas.
 
I was hoping you'd say that graduation rate is more important because it allows employment opportunities.


I wasn't really speaking to that point...sorry, I went off on a tangent.


I think that yardstick ala a HS diploma is losing its ability to speak for itself as to the efficacy of a getting a better employee is losing its magic.( for the reason I stipulated above, there is little secret today that we are graduating kids who 20 years would not have had a hope of getting a diploma and employers are aware of that).

BUT, yes it is still a yardstick many employ, but the amalgamation taking place with more GED grads and the fact that 60% of first year college students need remedial studies to take standard first year college fare, is dissipating the aura of 'HS graduate" (and class A college ed. too).

I was hoping you'd address the face that 20 million illegal aliens seem to be surviving quite well outside Mexico without having US Public High School Diplomas.

In retrospect I think i did...:eusa_eh:
 
okay I see..is this it?


This proves that parental interest, not the voucher system, has the greatest impact on kid's education.

I agree in some much as the parents seek to enhance their child's school experience, discipline them when they don't do what they must and nurture them. However, the child spends the balance of their day IN school, I don't see 'school' as a help in that regard anymore, I see them as a detriment to most parents wishes and idea of what school should be about and what their kids should take away from school.

How to combat that? humm, well first, take the system out of the hands of the public union system. Until the tip of the spear is addressed, parents only choice is to move the kids or home school them.
 
I wasn't really speaking to that point...sorry, I went off on a tangent.


I think that yardstick ala a HS diploma is losing its ability to speak for itself as to the efficacy of a getting a better employee is losing its magic.( for the reason I stipulated above, there is little secret today that we are graduating kids who 20 years would not have had a hope of getting a diploma and employers are aware of that).

BUT, yes it is still a yardstick many employ, but the amalgamation taking place with more GED grads and the fact that 60% of first year college students need remedial studies to take standard first year college fare, is dissipating the aura of 'HS graduate" (and class A college ed. too).

I was hoping you'd address the face that 20 million illegal aliens seem to be surviving quite well outside Mexico without having US Public High School Diplomas.

In retrospect I think i did...:eusa_eh:

Did you?

Could it be possible that NIETHER a HS Diploma NOR HS Academic Achievement is necessary?

Take Washington DC's 49% HS Graduation rate: How does this effect the area's unemployment rate:

Joblessness soars for African-Americans in DC: report - Yahoo! News

But the unemployment rate for African American residents was the highest at 15.6 percent.

According to the U.S. Census, 54.4 percent of the city's residents are Black or African-American. The group represents 12.3 percent of the U.S. population.

The report also found that those who do not receive schooling beyond high school struggle the most in Washington.

The unemployment rate among residents with a high school education was 19 percent in 2009, "far higher than at any point in the last 30 years and almost as high as unemployment among residents without a high-school diploma -- 20.3 percent," according to the report.

There's really NO DIFFERENCE (ok 1.3%), between the unemployment rate of those with and without HS Diplomas......

If anything, I'm surprised that half the HS students bother staying in school to graduate.
 

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