Bernie Sanders Says He Will “Look At” Tearing Down Existing U.S/Mexico Border Wall

[pknopp]

Maybe not, but what asylum seekers did was get into the country legally to await their trial, and disappear never to be seen again. Most of them realize they don't qualify to get asylum in the US. But they came anyway hoping to have their application accepted for a court date. When their final court date came up, nowhere to be found.

Trump changed that. If you want to apply for asylum, fine. Make the application out at the US embassy in your own country. Also, Trump changed the rules that if you crossed a country to get here, and they offered you asylum and you refused, you are disqualified for US asylum.

Really did the trick.

It helped and did not cost us 8 gazillian dollar$. Much more cost effective than the wall. I am against illegal immigration, I just don't support the effectiveness of the wall over not attacking attacking the draw card for political reasons.

Well let me explain the problem and why the wall is the solution: Yes, we can put effective policies in place, but it won't have as good of a result as the wall. If Democrats get in charge of the country again, removing regulations and changing them back to their favor is less than a week process. Tearing down the wall however would be a huge process.

This is why the Democrats are so hell bent on stopping the wall; because it's not something that they can easily reverse.

Maybe not, but what asylum seekers did was get into the country legally to await their trial, and disappear never to be seen again. Most of them realize they don't qualify to get asylum in the US. But they came anyway hoping to have their application accepted for a court date. When their final court date came up, nowhere to be found.

Trump changed that. If you want to apply for asylum, fine. Make the application out at the US embassy in your own country. Also, Trump changed the rules that if you crossed a country to get here, and they offered you asylum and you refused, you are disqualified for US asylum.

Really did the trick.

It helped and did not cost us 8 gazillian dollar$. Much more cost effective than the wall. I am against illegal immigration, I just don't support the effectiveness of the wall over not attacking attacking the draw card for political reasons.

Well let me explain the problem and why the wall is the solution: Yes, we can put effective policies in place, but it won't have as good of a result as the wall. If Democrats get in charge of the country again, removing regulations and changing them back to their favor is less than a week process. Tearing down the wall however would be a huge process.

This is why the Democrats are so hell bent on stopping the wall; because it's not something that they can easily reverse.

A ladder and 15 seconds and you are over the wall.

I prefer to make them take the ladder and do the climbing. At least for those 15 seconds they make an easy target.

Jo

Not only that, but people have gotten seriously injured trying to climb over the walls we already have. Most people here have never been 30 feet in the air and had to be creative on getting down. I worked in construction earlier in my life. Let me tell you, 30 feet looks a lot higher when your up there than when you're on the ground looking up.

Ladders work on both sides of a wall.

 

[pknopp]

It helped and did not cost us 8 gazillian dollar$. Much more cost effective than the wall. I am against illegal immigration, I just don't support the effectiveness of the wall over not attacking attacking the draw card for political reasons.

Well let me explain the problem and why the wall is the solution: Yes, we can put effective policies in place, but it won't have as good of a result as the wall. If Democrats get in charge of the country again, removing regulations and changing them back to their favor is less than a week process. Tearing down the wall however would be a huge process.

This is why the Democrats are so hell bent on stopping the wall; because it's not something that they can easily reverse.

I hear you and understand, but do not think the wall is the answer. Before Trump came in, one of the absolute largest problems was student, workers, visitors coming in overstaying their welcome and joining the underground economy and still is, and unless addressed in the way i proposed always will be. Cheap labor is a valuable resource. By supporting these underground employees, possibly collecting benefits while working the underground side or not working at all, the American public is footing the bill to the benefit of employers making money on the cheap labor source, in other words externalizing the true cost of the labor to society at large. Like one of my points about the wall, I am too frugal with my money to support externalized costs of employment, I am not benefiting from.

Look at it this way: The cost of the food stamp program in 2018 was over 65 billion dollars. We spend that every year plus or minus. The cost to build a wall is about 12 billion, and we only spend that once.

In other words, for what we pay for food stamps for less than three months, we could have a wall across strategic sections of our southern border.

In our system of government, a person is considered innocent until proven guilty. When it comes to employers busted with illegal immigrants, you have to prove they knew the employees were illegal. Fake ID's and documents are a big business in this country. Even if the employer suspects the documentation if less than authentic, it's good enough to get a not guilty verdict in a court of law.

Fake ID market bypasses anti-fraud measures | TechRadar

Court Rules Illegal Aliens Can Sue over “Discriminatory Employment Policy” Requiring Green Cards - Judicial Watch

So your solution is not as easy as that. It comes with a lot of complications, especially for employers.

I've covered this many times. Wal Mart had no clue their contractors were using illegals. They still got busted.

Wal-Mart to Pay U.S. $11 Million in Lawsuit on Illegal Workers

Not that it will stop you from using the same argument in the future.

Even if it was true (it's not), Trump could be pushing for mandatory e-verify. He never even suggests it.

Nobody is calling for it. Nobody wants to stop the low wage train.

Read my first link. As it states, some of these ID"s are foolproof. As to your link, it's a paywall. I'm not joining up to read it yet alone pay it.

No they aren't foolproof and I've provided the link many times from more than one source.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Well let me explain the problem and why the wall is the solution: Yes, we can put effective policies in place, but it won't have as good of a result as the wall. If Democrats get in charge of the country again, removing regulations and changing them back to their favor is less than a week process. Tearing down the wall however would be a huge process.

This is why the Democrats are so hell bent on stopping the wall; because it's not something that they can easily reverse.

I hear you and understand, but do not think the wall is the answer. Before Trump came in, one of the absolute largest problems was student, workers, visitors coming in overstaying their welcome and joining the underground economy and still is, and unless addressed in the way i proposed always will be. Cheap labor is a valuable resource. By supporting these underground employees, possibly collecting benefits while working the underground side or not working at all, the American public is footing the bill to the benefit of employers making money on the cheap labor source, in other words externalizing the true cost of the labor to society at large. Like one of my points about the wall, I am too frugal with my money to support externalized costs of employment, I am not benefiting from.

Look at it this way: The cost of the food stamp program in 2018 was over 65 billion dollars. We spend that every year plus or minus. The cost to build a wall is about 12 billion, and we only spend that once.

In other words, for what we pay for food stamps for less than three months, we could have a wall across strategic sections of our southern border.

In our system of government, a person is considered innocent until proven guilty. When it comes to employers busted with illegal immigrants, you have to prove they knew the employees were illegal. Fake ID's and documents are a big business in this country. Even if the employer suspects the documentation if less than authentic, it's good enough to get a not guilty verdict in a court of law.

Fake ID market bypasses anti-fraud measures | TechRadar

Court Rules Illegal Aliens Can Sue over “Discriminatory Employment Policy” Requiring Green Cards - Judicial Watch

So your solution is not as easy as that. It comes with a lot of complications, especially for employers.

I've covered this many times. Wal Mart had no clue their contractors were using illegals. They still got busted.

Wal-Mart to Pay U.S. $11 Million in Lawsuit on Illegal Workers

Not that it will stop you from using the same argument in the future.

Even if it was true (it's not), Trump could be pushing for mandatory e-verify. He never even suggests it.

Nobody is calling for it. Nobody wants to stop the low wage train.

Read my first link. As it states, some of these ID"s are foolproof. As to your link, it's a paywall. I'm not joining up to read it yet alone pay it.

No they aren't foolproof and I've provided the link many times from more than one source.

If they didn't work, it would not be such an industry today. Apparently they work good enough, otherwise nobody would be using them.

 

[pknopp]

I hear you and understand, but do not think the wall is the answer. Before Trump came in, one of the absolute largest problems was student, workers, visitors coming in overstaying their welcome and joining the underground economy and still is, and unless addressed in the way i proposed always will be. Cheap labor is a valuable resource. By supporting these underground employees, possibly collecting benefits while working the underground side or not working at all, the American public is footing the bill to the benefit of employers making money on the cheap labor source, in other words externalizing the true cost of the labor to society at large. Like one of my points about the wall, I am too frugal with my money to support externalized costs of employment, I am not benefiting from.

Look at it this way: The cost of the food stamp program in 2018 was over 65 billion dollars. We spend that every year plus or minus. The cost to build a wall is about 12 billion, and we only spend that once.

In other words, for what we pay for food stamps for less than three months, we could have a wall across strategic sections of our southern border.

In our system of government, a person is considered innocent until proven guilty. When it comes to employers busted with illegal immigrants, you have to prove they knew the employees were illegal. Fake ID's and documents are a big business in this country. Even if the employer suspects the documentation if less than authentic, it's good enough to get a not guilty verdict in a court of law.

Fake ID market bypasses anti-fraud measures | TechRadar

Court Rules Illegal Aliens Can Sue over “Discriminatory Employment Policy” Requiring Green Cards - Judicial Watch

So your solution is not as easy as that. It comes with a lot of complications, especially for employers.

I've covered this many times. Wal Mart had no clue their contractors were using illegals. They still got busted.

Wal-Mart to Pay U.S. $11 Million in Lawsuit on Illegal Workers

Not that it will stop you from using the same argument in the future.

Even if it was true (it's not), Trump could be pushing for mandatory e-verify. He never even suggests it.

Nobody is calling for it. Nobody wants to stop the low wage train.

Read my first link. As it states, some of these ID"s are foolproof. As to your link, it's a paywall. I'm not joining up to read it yet alone pay it.

No they aren't foolproof and I've provided the link many times from more than one source.

If they didn't work, it would not be such an industry today. Apparently they work good enough, otherwise nobody would be using them.

It's impossible. It only works because the government (Trump's government right now) is willing to look the other way.

You can't just make up S.S. numbers. You can't simply use someone else's without it throwing up a bunch of red flags

But you know all of this already.

 

[White 6]

Asylum seekers are not those sneaking across for jobs.

Maybe not, but what asylum seekers did was get into the country legally to await their trial, and disappear never to be seen again. Most of them realize they don't qualify to get asylum in the US. But they came anyway hoping to have their application accepted for a court date. When their final court date came up, nowhere to be found.

Trump changed that. If you want to apply for asylum, fine. Make the application out at the US embassy in your own country. Also, Trump changed the rules that if you crossed a country to get here, and they offered you asylum and you refused, you are disqualified for US asylum.

Really did the trick.

It helped and did not cost us 8 gazillian dollar$. Much more cost effective than the wall. I am against illegal immigration, I just don't support the effectiveness of the wall over not attacking attacking the draw card for political reasons.

Well let me explain the problem and why the wall is the solution: Yes, we can put effective policies in place, but it won't have as good of a result as the wall. If Democrats get in charge of the country again, removing regulations and changing them back to their favor is less than a week process. Tearing down the wall however would be a huge process.

This is why the Democrats are so hell bent on stopping the wall; because it's not something that they can easily reverse.

I hear you and understand, but do not think the wall is the answer. Before Trump came in, one of the absolute largest problems was student, workers, visitors coming in overstaying their welcome and joining the underground economy and still is, and unless addressed in the way i proposed always will be. Cheap labor is a valuable resource. By supporting these underground employees, possibly collecting benefits while working the underground side or not working at all, the American public is footing the bill to the benefit of employers making money on the cheap labor source, in other words externalizing the true cost of the labor to society at large. Like one of my points about the wall, I am too frugal with my money to support externalized costs of employment, I am not benefiting from.

Look at it this way: The cost of the food stamp program in 2018 was over 65 billion dollars. We spend that every year plus or minus. The cost to build a wall is about 12 billion, and we only spend that once.

In other words, for what we pay for food stamps for less than three months, we could have a wall across strategic sections of our southern border.

In our system of government, a person is considered innocent until proven guilty. When it comes to employers busted with illegal immigrants, you have to prove they knew the employees were illegal. Fake ID's and documents are a big business in this country. Even if the employer suspects the documentation if less than authentic, it's good enough to get a not guilty verdict in a court of law.

Fake ID market bypasses anti-fraud measures | TechRadar

Court Rules Illegal Aliens Can Sue over “Discriminatory Employment Policy” Requiring Green Cards - Judicial Watch

So your solution is not as easy as that. It comes with a lot of complications, especially for employers.

What you say, could be very well true, but they haven't tried. When they did convict, fines were low and sentencing, non-existent. They have shut down whole meat processing plants, taking many illegal aliens at once, well know the company used illegal, yet light fines and no jail, certainly not lock up with horny Big Bubba. White collar corporate crime is not punished as Bubba was punished for street crime. A lot of those hard core lifers can take it. Greedy little MBA Business managers cannot handle that environment and I believe it would scare the BeJesus out of the ones that followed.

 

[White 6]

Maybe not, but what asylum seekers did was get into the country legally to await their trial, and disappear never to be seen again. Most of them realize they don't qualify to get asylum in the US. But they came anyway hoping to have their application accepted for a court date. When their final court date came up, nowhere to be found.

Trump changed that. If you want to apply for asylum, fine. Make the application out at the US embassy in your own country. Also, Trump changed the rules that if you crossed a country to get here, and they offered you asylum and you refused, you are disqualified for US asylum.

Really did the trick.

It helped and did not cost us 8 gazillian dollar$. Much more cost effective than the wall. I am against illegal immigration, I just don't support the effectiveness of the wall over not attacking attacking the draw card for political reasons.

Well let me explain the problem and why the wall is the solution: Yes, we can put effective policies in place, but it won't have as good of a result as the wall. If Democrats get in charge of the country again, removing regulations and changing them back to their favor is less than a week process. Tearing down the wall however would be a huge process.

This is why the Democrats are so hell bent on stopping the wall; because it's not something that they can easily reverse.

Maybe not, but what asylum seekers did was get into the country legally to await their trial, and disappear never to be seen again. Most of them realize they don't qualify to get asylum in the US. But they came anyway hoping to have their application accepted for a court date. When their final court date came up, nowhere to be found.

Trump changed that. If you want to apply for asylum, fine. Make the application out at the US embassy in your own country. Also, Trump changed the rules that if you crossed a country to get here, and they offered you asylum and you refused, you are disqualified for US asylum.

Really did the trick.

It helped and did not cost us 8 gazillian dollar$. Much more cost effective than the wall. I am against illegal immigration, I just don't support the effectiveness of the wall over not attacking attacking the draw card for political reasons.

Well let me explain the problem and why the wall is the solution: Yes, we can put effective policies in place, but it won't have as good of a result as the wall. If Democrats get in charge of the country again, removing regulations and changing them back to their favor is less than a week process. Tearing down the wall however would be a huge process.

This is why the Democrats are so hell bent on stopping the wall; because it's not something that they can easily reverse.

A ladder and 15 seconds and you are over the wall.

I prefer to make them take the ladder and do the climbing. At least for those 15 seconds they make an easy target.

Jo

Not only that, but people have gotten seriously injured trying to climb over the walls we already have. Most people here have never been 30 feet in the air and had to be creative on getting down. I worked in construction earlier in my life. Let me tell you, 30 feet looks a lot higher when your up there than when you're on the ground looking up.

Once you climb and repel the Great Stone Door in Tennessee or the Black Canyon of the Gunnison in CO, it becomes hard to understand. I will say, there are many places way above my competence even in my younger days I would never attempt, but 30 feet over sand truly is child's play. Besides, they still find tunnels under boarder in California with lighting and I have heard ventilation.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

It helped and did not cost us 8 gazillian dollar$. Much more cost effective than the wall. I am against illegal immigration, I just don't support the effectiveness of the wall over not attacking attacking the draw card for political reasons.

Well let me explain the problem and why the wall is the solution: Yes, we can put effective policies in place, but it won't have as good of a result as the wall. If Democrats get in charge of the country again, removing regulations and changing them back to their favor is less than a week process. Tearing down the wall however would be a huge process.

This is why the Democrats are so hell bent on stopping the wall; because it's not something that they can easily reverse.

It helped and did not cost us 8 gazillian dollar$. Much more cost effective than the wall. I am against illegal immigration, I just don't support the effectiveness of the wall over not attacking attacking the draw card for political reasons.

Well let me explain the problem and why the wall is the solution: Yes, we can put effective policies in place, but it won't have as good of a result as the wall. If Democrats get in charge of the country again, removing regulations and changing them back to their favor is less than a week process. Tearing down the wall however would be a huge process.

This is why the Democrats are so hell bent on stopping the wall; because it's not something that they can easily reverse.

A ladder and 15 seconds and you are over the wall.

I prefer to make them take the ladder and do the climbing. At least for those 15 seconds they make an easy target.

Jo

Not only that, but people have gotten seriously injured trying to climb over the walls we already have. Most people here have never been 30 feet in the air and had to be creative on getting down. I worked in construction earlier in my life. Let me tell you, 30 feet looks a lot higher when your up there than when you're on the ground looking up.

Ladders work on both sides of a wall.

Ridiculous. Have you ever climbed up a ladder that high before? It's not for everybody, let me assure you.

When Trump introduced the model of wall he wanted to use, the border patrol didn't like it because they couldn't see through it. The model the patrol chose was a see through model. So here is what would take place.

The people planning to cross the wall would have to come with a 30 foot ladder, which costs about 300 bucks. They would have to approach the wall with this ladder first, set it up, stabilize it, and then climb up. Once up, they would have to pull the ladder up, and it's not light I can assure you. Now they have to lower it down on the American side, and try to stabilize it from up there, which is really difficult to do. Then they would have to climb down the ladder, taking a chance that the pads of the ladder are not in mud, or on a rock, or anything that would cause one if the legs to go down. Once the first person is down, he can better secure the ladder.

To approach this see through wall with a ladder, set it up, pull it up, set it back down, and climb down it will take a considerable amount of time; time enough for a drone to see it, a sensor to go off, a border patrol in that area to spot the problem.

It's not as easy as you see in the movies.

 

[pknopp]

Well let me explain the problem and why the wall is the solution: Yes, we can put effective policies in place, but it won't have as good of a result as the wall. If Democrats get in charge of the country again, removing regulations and changing them back to their favor is less than a week process. Tearing down the wall however would be a huge process.

This is why the Democrats are so hell bent on stopping the wall; because it's not something that they can easily reverse.

Well let me explain the problem and why the wall is the solution: Yes, we can put effective policies in place, but it won't have as good of a result as the wall. If Democrats get in charge of the country again, removing regulations and changing them back to their favor is less than a week process. Tearing down the wall however would be a huge process.

This is why the Democrats are so hell bent on stopping the wall; because it's not something that they can easily reverse.

A ladder and 15 seconds and you are over the wall.

I prefer to make them take the ladder and do the climbing. At least for those 15 seconds they make an easy target.

Jo

Not only that, but people have gotten seriously injured trying to climb over the walls we already have. Most people here have never been 30 feet in the air and had to be creative on getting down. I worked in construction earlier in my life. Let me tell you, 30 feet looks a lot higher when your up there than when you're on the ground looking up.

Ladders work on both sides of a wall.

Ridiculous. Have you ever climbed up a ladder that high before? It's not for everybody, let me assure you.

When Trump introduced the model of wall he wanted to use, the border patrol didn't like it because they couldn't see through it. The model the patrol chose was a see through model. So here is what would take place.

The people planning to cross the wall would have to come with a 30 foot ladder, which costs about 300 bucks. They would have to approach the wall with this ladder first, set it up, stabilize it, and then climb up. Once up, they would have to pull the ladder up, and it's not light I can assure you. Now they have to lower it down on the American side, and try to stabilize it from up there, which is really difficult to do. Then they would have to climb down the ladder, taking a chance that the pads of the ladder are not in mud, or on a rock, or anything that would cause one if the legs to go down. Once the first person is down, he can better secure the ladder.

To approach this see through wall with a ladder, set it up, pull it up, set it back down, and climb down it will take a considerable amount of time; time enough for a drone to see it, a sensor to go off, a border patrol in that area to spot the problem.

It's not as easy as you see in the movies.

Lol....always with the excuses. A Mexican could make a ladder for a few bucks.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

It helped and did not cost us 8 gazillian dollar$. Much more cost effective than the wall. I am against illegal immigration, I just don't support the effectiveness of the wall over not attacking attacking the draw card for political reasons.

Well let me explain the problem and why the wall is the solution: Yes, we can put effective policies in place, but it won't have as good of a result as the wall. If Democrats get in charge of the country again, removing regulations and changing them back to their favor is less than a week process. Tearing down the wall however would be a huge process.

This is why the Democrats are so hell bent on stopping the wall; because it's not something that they can easily reverse.

It helped and did not cost us 8 gazillian dollar$. Much more cost effective than the wall. I am against illegal immigration, I just don't support the effectiveness of the wall over not attacking attacking the draw card for political reasons.

Well let me explain the problem and why the wall is the solution: Yes, we can put effective policies in place, but it won't have as good of a result as the wall. If Democrats get in charge of the country again, removing regulations and changing them back to their favor is less than a week process. Tearing down the wall however would be a huge process.

This is why the Democrats are so hell bent on stopping the wall; because it's not something that they can easily reverse.

A ladder and 15 seconds and you are over the wall.

I prefer to make them take the ladder and do the climbing. At least for those 15 seconds they make an easy target.

Jo

Not only that, but people have gotten seriously injured trying to climb over the walls we already have. Most people here have never been 30 feet in the air and had to be creative on getting down. I worked in construction earlier in my life. Let me tell you, 30 feet looks a lot higher when your up there than when you're on the ground looking up.

Once you climb and repel the Great Stone Door in Tennessee or the Black Canyon of the Gunnison in CO, it becomes hard to understand. I will say, there are many places way above my competence even in my younger days I would never attempt, but 30 feet over sand truly is child's play. Besides, they still find tunnels under boarder in California with lighting and I have heard ventilation.

Sure they do, but how many months does it take to build that tunnel? You can't start it ten feet from the wall. You have to start outside of view.

When border patrol picks up an illegal, they question them. They want to know how they got into the country. It only takes one person to tell them about the tunnel, and then we destroy it.

 

[rightwinger]

Trump beats Reagan in every category except manners. Reagan was a gentleman and a classy dude but his leadership doesn't hold a candle to Trump's. His economy doesn't either.

You cannot lead if nobody will follow

 

[rightwinger]

It will be torn down eventually

And whoever is in charge of that will have to explain how they are tearing down the wall but don't believe in open borders. Democrats won't be happy until a band of terrorists come here and kill everybody in a state. If that does happen, hopefully it will be a very liberal one.

You don’t have to tear it down

Just follow the Republican lead on Obamacare.....Defund it

Reallocate maintenance money to more important items
Reassign border agents elsewhere

After a few years, do a study on how effective the wall is at stopping immigration and then tear it down because it is doing no good

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Maybe not, but what asylum seekers did was get into the country legally to await their trial, and disappear never to be seen again. Most of them realize they don't qualify to get asylum in the US. But they came anyway hoping to have their application accepted for a court date. When their final court date came up, nowhere to be found.

Trump changed that. If you want to apply for asylum, fine. Make the application out at the US embassy in your own country. Also, Trump changed the rules that if you crossed a country to get here, and they offered you asylum and you refused, you are disqualified for US asylum.

Really did the trick.

It helped and did not cost us 8 gazillian dollar$. Much more cost effective than the wall. I am against illegal immigration, I just don't support the effectiveness of the wall over not attacking attacking the draw card for political reasons.

Well let me explain the problem and why the wall is the solution: Yes, we can put effective policies in place, but it won't have as good of a result as the wall. If Democrats get in charge of the country again, removing regulations and changing them back to their favor is less than a week process. Tearing down the wall however would be a huge process.

This is why the Democrats are so hell bent on stopping the wall; because it's not something that they can easily reverse.

I hear you and understand, but do not think the wall is the answer. Before Trump came in, one of the absolute largest problems was student, workers, visitors coming in overstaying their welcome and joining the underground economy and still is, and unless addressed in the way i proposed always will be. Cheap labor is a valuable resource. By supporting these underground employees, possibly collecting benefits while working the underground side or not working at all, the American public is footing the bill to the benefit of employers making money on the cheap labor source, in other words externalizing the true cost of the labor to society at large. Like one of my points about the wall, I am too frugal with my money to support externalized costs of employment, I am not benefiting from.

Look at it this way: The cost of the food stamp program in 2018 was over 65 billion dollars. We spend that every year plus or minus. The cost to build a wall is about 12 billion, and we only spend that once.

In other words, for what we pay for food stamps for less than three months, we could have a wall across strategic sections of our southern border.

In our system of government, a person is considered innocent until proven guilty. When it comes to employers busted with illegal immigrants, you have to prove they knew the employees were illegal. Fake ID's and documents are a big business in this country. Even if the employer suspects the documentation if less than authentic, it's good enough to get a not guilty verdict in a court of law.

Fake ID market bypasses anti-fraud measures | TechRadar

Court Rules Illegal Aliens Can Sue over “Discriminatory Employment Policy” Requiring Green Cards - Judicial Watch

So your solution is not as easy as that. It comes with a lot of complications, especially for employers.

What you say, could be very well true, but they haven't tried. When they did convict, fines were low and sentencing, non-existent. They have shut down whole meat processing plants, taking many illegal aliens at once, well know the company used illegal, yet light fines and no jail, certainly not lock up with horny Big Bubba. White collar corporate crime is not punished as Bubba was punished for street crime. A lot of those hard core lifers can take it. Greedy little MBA Business managers cannot handle that environment and I believe it would scare the BeJesus out of the ones that followed.

Perhaps, but it's not a total solution to anything. Like I said, illegals come here for all kinds of reasons. Let me put it to you this way: It's estimated by some we have 11 million people illegally in the country now. Some say the amount is much more closer to 20 or 25 million. Do you think all or most of those people are working in the country illegally?

Here is the stupidity of all this, we have a country with sanctuary cities and states, that allow illegals to drive, allow illegals to go to our schools knowingly, allows illegals to stand in line at a DMV in NYC for hours, and nobody does a thing. Some buy houses, others rent apartments or houses. All is fine in illegal alien land. But place hard fines and jail time for business owners because they hire them? It's ridiculous.

On one hand, you say that making it tough on them to get a job would solve the problem, but on the other hand, we have these Democrats that are trying to make them as comfortable as possible. They welcome these illegals with open arms; embrace them. They even warn them when they learn ICE is going to conduct major busts.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

It will be torn down eventually

And whoever is in charge of that will have to explain how they are tearing down the wall but don't believe in open borders. Democrats won't be happy until a band of terrorists come here and kill everybody in a state. If that does happen, hopefully it will be a very liberal one.

You don’t have to tear it down

Just follow the Republican lead on Obamacare.....Defund it

Reallocate maintenance money to more important items
Reassign border agents elsewhere

After a few years, do a study on how effective the wall is at stopping immigration and then tear it down

You're living in dream world RW. But then again, that's why you're a leftist.

 

[White 6]

Well let me explain the problem and why the wall is the solution: Yes, we can put effective policies in place, but it won't have as good of a result as the wall. If Democrats get in charge of the country again, removing regulations and changing them back to their favor is less than a week process. Tearing down the wall however would be a huge process.

This is why the Democrats are so hell bent on stopping the wall; because it's not something that they can easily reverse.

Well let me explain the problem and why the wall is the solution: Yes, we can put effective policies in place, but it won't have as good of a result as the wall. If Democrats get in charge of the country again, removing regulations and changing them back to their favor is less than a week process. Tearing down the wall however would be a huge process.

This is why the Democrats are so hell bent on stopping the wall; because it's not something that they can easily reverse.

A ladder and 15 seconds and you are over the wall.

I prefer to make them take the ladder and do the climbing. At least for those 15 seconds they make an easy target.

Jo

Not only that, but people have gotten seriously injured trying to climb over the walls we already have. Most people here have never been 30 feet in the air and had to be creative on getting down. I worked in construction earlier in my life. Let me tell you, 30 feet looks a lot higher when your up there than when you're on the ground looking up.

Once you climb and repel the Great Stone Door in Tennessee or the Black Canyon of the Gunnison in CO, it becomes hard to understand. I will say, there are many places way above my competence even in my younger days I would never attempt, but 30 feet over sand truly is child's play. Besides, they still find tunnels under boarder in California with lighting and I have heard ventilation.

Sure they do, but how many months does it take to build that tunnel? You can't start it ten feet from the wall. You have to start outside of view.

When border patrol picks up an illegal, they question them. They want to know how they got into the country. It only takes one person to tell them about the tunnel, and then we destroy it.

Probably only done for big time drug running, not immigration. I am just point out it is done walls have not stopped it, and most young people would not be scare of 30 foot heights over the sand.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

A ladder and 15 seconds and you are over the wall.

I prefer to make them take the ladder and do the climbing. At least for those 15 seconds they make an easy target.

Jo

Not only that, but people have gotten seriously injured trying to climb over the walls we already have. Most people here have never been 30 feet in the air and had to be creative on getting down. I worked in construction earlier in my life. Let me tell you, 30 feet looks a lot higher when your up there than when you're on the ground looking up.

Once you climb and repel the Great Stone Door in Tennessee or the Black Canyon of the Gunnison in CO, it becomes hard to understand. I will say, there are many places way above my competence even in my younger days I would never attempt, but 30 feet over sand truly is child's play. Besides, they still find tunnels under boarder in California with lighting and I have heard ventilation.

Sure they do, but how many months does it take to build that tunnel? You can't start it ten feet from the wall. You have to start outside of view.

When border patrol picks up an illegal, they question them. They want to know how they got into the country. It only takes one person to tell them about the tunnel, and then we destroy it.

Probably only done for big time drug running, not immigration. I am just point out it is done walls have not stopped it, and most young people would not be scare of 30 foot heights over the sand.

Some perhaps, but we've all read stories about a person who got killed five feet on a ladder. Sand or no sand, you fall from that high, you risk doing major damage if not death. But that's besides the fact that a wall will stop most people from trying to cross over.

 

[White 6]

It will be torn down eventually

And whoever is in charge of that will have to explain how they are tearing down the wall but don't believe in open borders. Democrats won't be happy until a band of terrorists come here and kill everybody in a state. If that does happen, hopefully it will be a very liberal one.

You don’t have to tear it down

Just follow the Republican lead on Obamacare.....Defund it

Reallocate maintenance money to more important items
Reassign border agents elsewhere

After a few years, do a study on how effective the wall is at stopping immigration and then tear it down because it is doing no good

Now you and I both know, Doofus was not spouting to that reporter promising to tear down any walls that were to be built or have been built. Sounded like he wanted to weasel out and move on, to me. We do not ever tear down anything until ti becomes a safety hazard like some of the dams and bridges.

 

[White 6]

It helped and did not cost us 8 gazillian dollar$. Much more cost effective than the wall. I am against illegal immigration, I just don't support the effectiveness of the wall over not attacking attacking the draw card for political reasons.

Well let me explain the problem and why the wall is the solution: Yes, we can put effective policies in place, but it won't have as good of a result as the wall. If Democrats get in charge of the country again, removing regulations and changing them back to their favor is less than a week process. Tearing down the wall however would be a huge process.

This is why the Democrats are so hell bent on stopping the wall; because it's not something that they can easily reverse.

I hear you and understand, but do not think the wall is the answer. Before Trump came in, one of the absolute largest problems was student, workers, visitors coming in overstaying their welcome and joining the underground economy and still is, and unless addressed in the way i proposed always will be. Cheap labor is a valuable resource. By supporting these underground employees, possibly collecting benefits while working the underground side or not working at all, the American public is footing the bill to the benefit of employers making money on the cheap labor source, in other words externalizing the true cost of the labor to society at large. Like one of my points about the wall, I am too frugal with my money to support externalized costs of employment, I am not benefiting from.

Look at it this way: The cost of the food stamp program in 2018 was over 65 billion dollars. We spend that every year plus or minus. The cost to build a wall is about 12 billion, and we only spend that once.

In other words, for what we pay for food stamps for less than three months, we could have a wall across strategic sections of our southern border.

In our system of government, a person is considered innocent until proven guilty. When it comes to employers busted with illegal immigrants, you have to prove they knew the employees were illegal. Fake ID's and documents are a big business in this country. Even if the employer suspects the documentation if less than authentic, it's good enough to get a not guilty verdict in a court of law.

Fake ID market bypasses anti-fraud measures | TechRadar

Court Rules Illegal Aliens Can Sue over “Discriminatory Employment Policy” Requiring Green Cards - Judicial Watch

So your solution is not as easy as that. It comes with a lot of complications, especially for employers.

What you say, could be very well true, but they haven't tried. When they did convict, fines were low and sentencing, non-existent. They have shut down whole meat processing plants, taking many illegal aliens at once, well know the company used illegal, yet light fines and no jail, certainly not lock up with horny Big Bubba. White collar corporate crime is not punished as Bubba was punished for street crime. A lot of those hard core lifers can take it. Greedy little MBA Business managers cannot handle that environment and I believe it would scare the BeJesus out of the ones that followed.

Perhaps, but it's not a total solution to anything. Like I said, illegals come here for all kinds of reasons. Let me put it to you this way: It's estimated by some we have 11 million people illegally in the country now. Some say the amount is much more closer to 20 or 25 million. Do you think all or most of those people are working in the country illegally?

Here is the stupidity of all this, we have a country with sanctuary cities and states, that allow illegals to drive, allow illegals to go to our schools knowingly, allows illegals to stand in line at a DMV in NYC for hours, and nobody does a thing. Some buy houses, others rent apartments or houses. All is fine in illegal alien land. But place hard fines and jail time for business owners because they hire them? It's ridiculous.

On one hand, you say that making it tough on them to get a job would solve the problem, but on the other hand, we have these Democrats that are trying to make them as comfortable as possible. They welcome these illegals with open arms; embrace them. They even warn them when they learn ICE is going to conduct major busts.

Ray, This time you are preaching to the choir and probably know and just strengthening the message. But, I'll play a moment. 1. If they are in the country illegally and working, they are working illegally in my opinion. 1a. If in the country illegally and not working, they are most likely using resources my tax dollars paid for. 2. Sanctuary cities are un-American, I feel they too are illegal and should lose all federal funding, including road construction and maintenance. Won't ever happen, but would not hurt my feelings a bit. Money is the primary thing driving the stream across the boarder and money is the only thing sanctuary cities might react to. I think there is big money of both sides of this issue, so nothing will be done by either party.

 

[rightwinger]

It will be torn down eventually

And whoever is in charge of that will have to explain how they are tearing down the wall but don't believe in open borders. Democrats won't be happy until a band of terrorists come here and kill everybody in a state. If that does happen, hopefully it will be a very liberal one.

You don’t have to tear it down

Just follow the Republican lead on Obamacare.....Defund it

Reallocate maintenance money to more important items
Reassign border agents elsewhere

After a few years, do a study on how effective the wall is at stopping immigration and then tear it down because it is doing no good

Now you and I both know, Doofus was not spouting to that reporter promising to tear down any walls that were to be built or have been built. Sounded like he wanted to weasel out and move on, to me. We do not ever tear down anything until ti becomes a safety hazard like some of the dams and bridges.

Just cut off funding and let it deteriorate and fall down

 

[White 6]

It will be torn down eventually

And whoever is in charge of that will have to explain how they are tearing down the wall but don't believe in open borders. Democrats won't be happy until a band of terrorists come here and kill everybody in a state. If that does happen, hopefully it will be a very liberal one.

You don’t have to tear it down

Just follow the Republican lead on Obamacare.....Defund it

Reallocate maintenance money to more important items
Reassign border agents elsewhere

After a few years, do a study on how effective the wall is at stopping immigration and then tear it down because it is doing no good

Now you and I both know, Doofus was not spouting to that reporter promising to tear down any walls that were to be built or have been built. Sounded like he wanted to weasel out and move on, to me. We do not ever tear down anything until ti becomes a safety hazard like some of the dams and bridges.

Just cut off funding and let it deteriorate and fall down

maybe time for Big Don to pay off on having Mexico pay for the wall if he can't steel enough from the military to build it.

 

[rightwinger]

It will be torn down eventually

And whoever is in charge of that will have to explain how they are tearing down the wall but don't believe in open borders. Democrats won't be happy until a band of terrorists come here and kill everybody in a state. If that does happen, hopefully it will be a very liberal one.

You don’t have to tear it down

Just follow the Republican lead on Obamacare.....Defund it

Reallocate maintenance money to more important items
Reassign border agents elsewhere

After a few years, do a study on how effective the wall is at stopping immigration and then tear it down because it is doing no good

Now you and I both know, Doofus was not spouting to that reporter promising to tear down any walls that were to be built or have been built. Sounded like he wanted to weasel out and move on, to me. We do not ever tear down anything until ti becomes a safety hazard like some of the dams and bridges.

Just cut off funding and let it deteriorate and fall down

maybe time for Big Don to pay off on having Mexico pay for the wall if he can't steel enough from the military to build it.

I am sure Mexico will pay to tear it down