Asian freedom alliance

[supermarine]

It seems that a new battleground is already taking shape in asia. Can the US monitor asia, as well as the Middle EAst. I think the Us is already outstretched. It's time to build new alliances. We need to get as many asian countries to our side as possible, before they are somhow perswayded to join china. The country i have my eye on the most is JApan. YEs i know we are already good friends with them, but i think we should let them reinstate a new offensive military. So they can rival the communist powers. IT may seem that it would devide asia up even more, but let me tell you, sides are being chosen. countries are flocking to wichever side they will benifit the most on. WIth a powerful ally like japan only miles away from the commies, we will get others to our side. singapore, thailand, and the phillipines. We need to isolate the chinese, scare them, before they get too strong. WE need to arm taiwan, so we dont have to take drastic measures ourselves if anything happens. we need to make our allies are prepaired, so we have more time to mobilize. THe sooner that Japan can build it's army to a great height, the less chance the commies would have to strike.

 

[Zhukov]

Do we have nuclear missiles stationed on the Japanese home islands? We should.

That and missile defence.

 

[Annie]

Do we have nuclear missiles stationed on the Japanese home islands? We should.

That and missile defence.

I would assume the submarines?

 

[Zhukov]

Well, I'd like the Japanese to have missiles of their own. They couldn't hope to repel a Chinese invasion with conventional forces alone.

 

[Annie]

Well, I'd like the Japanese to have missiles of their own. They couldn't hope to repel a Chinese invasion with conventional forces alone.

How long do you think it would take the Navy to help Japan if we saw the possible movements/preparations? Perhaps a better question for Nato or one of the other military guys?

 

[NATO AIR]

7th Fleet is starting patrols this fall in the Sea Of Japan.

http://www.stripes.com/article.asp?section=104&article=23472&archive=true

New job for 7th Fleet: Missile patrol in Sea of Japan


By Nancy Montgomery, Stars and Stripes
Pacific edition, Sunday, September 12, 2004


YOKOSUKA NAVAL BASE, Japan — The 7th Fleet begins a significant new mission in the next few weeks: patrolling the Sea of Japan to provide early warning of ballistic missiles fired from North Korea at the United States.

The ships tasked with the initial patrols — the first of their kind ever undertaken by the United States — are the USS Curtis Wilbur, the USS John S. McCain and the USS Fitzgerald, according to a publication of the Missile Defense Agency, part of the Defense Department.

All three are 7th Fleet destroyers equipped with an Aegis weapons system that has been modified to detect and track medium- and long-range missiles. The ships would provide earlier warning of a missile launch and transmit the information to other systems, including land-based systems in Alaska and California designed to intercept the missiles and scheduled to be up and working by year’s end.

Adm. Vern Clark, the Navy’s chief of naval operations, who was at Yokosuka on Thursday as part of a several-day visit to Japan, declined to say which ship would be the first on what he agreed would be a “historic” mission. Clark said the missile-tracking mission would be “providing for the defense of our country and our friends.”

North Korea possesses ballistic missiles capable of reaching the U.S. West Coast, as well as Hawaii and Alaska, former CIA Director George Tenet testified at a Senate committee hearing in February 2003. In 1998 the isolated, Stalinist nation test-fired a medium-range Taepodong 1 ballistic missile that arced over northern Honshu before splashing down in the Pacific Ocean.

Japanese Prime Minister Junichiro Koizumi in March told reporters that the deployment would enhance regional security. “I think it will serve as a deterrent,” he said in published reports.

Japan has worked cooperatively with the United States on missile defense for several years and has its own Aegis destroyers.

Seventh Fleet spokesmen declined to comment on the mission, which will add a new responsibility to the already busy fleet, or say which ship might be the first to do the watch.

But Lt. Cmdr. Marc Boyd, a 7th Fleet spokesman, did say, “We remain ready to do any mission as tasked.”

Secretary of the Navy Gordon England announced in a March speech that a destroyer would be deployed to the Sea of Japan in September for missile tracking “and on a virtually continuous basis thereafter.”

The new mission is in keeping with the Bush administration’s plan to begin fielding initial missile defense capabilities by the end of 2004.

“The worldwide proliferation of ballistic missiles, combined with the growing development of deadly nuclear, chemical and biological agents requires the United States to field defensive missiles as soon as possible,” according to the Missile Defense Agency.

Four other destroyers from the Navy’s San Diego-based 3rd Fleet also are being readied for the job: the USS Paul Hamilton, USS Stethem, USS Russell and USS John Paul Jones, according to Navy sources. The 3rd and 7th fleets comprise the Pacific Fleet.

By 2006, according to the Missile Defense Agency, 15 destroyers and three cruisers will be equipped for the long-range surveillance and tracking missions. The Pentagon has not said where they’ll all be deployed.

The sea-based systems initially would be capable only of tracking missiles but because of closer proximity to North Korea or other so-designated “rogue states” would provide earlier tracking and a clearer picture for land-based interceptors, according to a Bloomberg News story in July that quoted Chris Myers, Lockheed Martin Corps’ vice president of sea-based missile defense programs. Lockheed Martin was given an $812 million contract to modify the Aegis ships, according to Bloomberg News.

By next year, the Missile Defense Agency says, Aegis cruisers will be able to shoot down short- and medium-range ballistic missiles. Last December, the cruiser USS Lake Erie successfully fired a Standard Missile-3 at a test target warhead and scored a direct hit, according to the agency.

The Lake Erie will be joining the 7th Fleet this fall, according to a ship press release.

The 7th Fleet’s new mission likely will mean longer at-sea periods for sailors on those ships, which will rotate in and out of the Sea of Japan to perform the watch. It also would mean that 7th Fleet would have to adjust its busy schedule, which includes more than 100 joint exercises with the navies of numerous nations in its area of operation.

Three years ago, North Korean officials said they would “extinguish the [U.S.] aggressors” if the United States deploys Aegis destroyers to the Sea of Japan. And on Tuesday, Pyongyang issued a press release claiming that the U.S. plan to deploy warships and patrol craft in the area was “a plot to blockade the coast of the DPRK, put the territorial waters of the DPRK under its control and go unchallenged in naval warfare.”

The 1972 Antiballistic Missile Treat between the U.S. and Russia had prohibited sea-based missile defense systems. But in 2002, the U.S. withdrew from the treaty.

 

[NATO AIR]

as far as Vietnam... Vietnam has oil resources that China is going to require in the future. The two have also fought a war in the past in which China was humuliated, something they do not forget. Vietnam is forging close ties with China based on economic and social need, but at the same time, they will remain wary of the ultimate goal of China's intentions with them.

 

[NATO AIR]

http://english.epochtimes.com/news/4-4-21/21029.html

nice examination of japan's struggles to change its force nature... keep in mind though their defenses are very good, its their offense that has been lacking in the past (but is changing now because of the possibility of having to preemptively strike north korea)

we participate in a great number of exercises with the japanese, and so do the marines, army and air force. our militaries are much more serious and intent on better cooperation, cohesion and training in the post 9/11 world.

 

[padisha emperor]

GO BACK TO COLD WAR FOLKS !!!!

You speak like China want to invade Japan or USA.
You have the same mind than people during the 60's, 70's, and the Cold War.

Cold War is over.

Don't you think that if China see that USA put missiles and nuke weapons in Japan, Taiwan.....they would feel in danger ? So, they would also do an offensive strategy. And then, like during the Cold War, ESCALADE. escalade of the missiles, the WMD, the nuke missiles, the balistic missiles........

It seems that USA NEED to have a wide wide vital space around them. Even if it destruct the world peace. Like Germany during the 30's......


But that's not the subject.



You really do a come back to the Cold War........when I erad your messages, I have the feeling that China would soon attack the USA or Japan.......

Totally crazy.

good trip into the PARANOIA, tovaritchi !!!

 

[supermarine]

Come back to reality you liberal piece of crap. China has been preparing invasions of Japan and taiwan even before we were talking about this. China started this. And also it was the same people like you who said in the 30s, The great war is over, why start another one? Then u have wwii on ur front doorstep, with the germans a step ahead. It would take 5 long years to stop hitler. BUt if we striked germany before hitler had a chance to invade poland, there would be a lot more jews in the world. You miserable tyrant appeaser, you make me sick.

 

[Zhukov]

Cold War is over.

Why is it that every single liberal who has ever come on this board says exactly the same thing?


Last I checked the Chinese communists had directly or indirectly caused the deaths of anywhere between 40 and 60 million human beings.

Last I checked the Chinese communists were still in power, slave masters to over a billion people.

But who cares right?

They're not interested in Taiwan.

http://english.www.gov.tw/index.jsp?action=cna&cnaid=2480

Or Japan.

http://straitstimes.asia1.com.sg/asia/story/0,4386,273006,00.html

They are a helpful and upstanding member of the international community.

http://news.ft.com/cms/s/ac3a29e0-078c-11d9-9672-00000e2511c8.html

They are no threat to us.

http://www.cnn.com/2001/WORLD/asiapcf/east/04/03/china.aircollision.02/?s=10


The Cold War isn't over. The other side has only passed the baton.

 

[MrMarbles]

I voted no. I think though it would depend on the situation. Like if this 'crisis' envoke the communist hardline.

 

[padisha emperor]

If USA put nuke missiles and troops in Japan, in South Korea, and give weapons to Taiwan, hHina would feel insecure. So, China would make growing up her amry, her military potential.
And then : Escalade, like between USA and USSR before...

And other danger : if USA put some offensive military engines and troops in JApan, it could also awake N-Korea.. Maybe Pyongyang would feel also in danger, and would want to strike the first.


These are just suppositions. But they can become real

 

[wade]

PE,

Get real. China is the real threat and they are going to turn to conquest, the only question is when. If they are patient and wait another 15 years, we will probably not be able to stop them from conquering all of Southern Asia.

With the way the US is managing its economy and technology, China will be at military parity within 10-12 years.

Wade.

 

[rtwngAvngr]

PE,

Get real. China is the real threat and they are going to turn to conquest, the only question is when. If they are patient and wait another 15 years, we will probably not be able to stop them from conquering all of Southern Asia.

With the way the US is managing its economy and technology, China will be at military parity within 10-12 years.

Wade.

Do you want us to turn to fascist state controlled slave economies? Like them? I'm actually starting to feel like a leftist, thinking we should force them to treat their slaves like people with some kind of (gasp) International minimum wage?

 

[rtwngAvngr]

I also know that they keep the chinese currency artificially suppressed to keep a stranglehold on the world's production. How is this done? ANy WTO geeks around?

 

[NATO AIR]

didn't find that but i found a lot of blogs and website op-eds claiming this (and it makes me shudder)

Gold: The China Syndrome

Americans forewarned -- Of more concern, as goes the Chinese economy, so goes America's financial markets. By becoming the world's largest debtor nation, America has unknowingly allowed itself to be governed by the newest superpower, China. China has immense reserves now, second only to Japan. With $400 billion of foreign exchange reserves invested largely in United States Treasuries, the Chinese have financed a large part of the American deficits. Should China slowdown or alternatively decide to dump its bonds in favour of gold or euros, it would throw American financial markets into a tailspin, causing US interest rates to skyrocket - and that is the Achilles' heel of the American dream.

i found that this was the best explaination of all this so here is the link to the above
http://www.newsgateway.ca/gold_and_silver.htm

 

[wade]

Do you want us to turn to fascist state controlled slave economies? Like them? I'm actually starting to feel like a leftist, thinking we should force them to treat their slaves like people with some kind of (gasp) International minimum wage?

Do you not see that this country will, if left on its current course, evolve into nothing better than a fascist state with what is effectively a slave labor force?

I believe we (the West) should set standards for imported goods on the international market. I think "no slave labor" is cleary one such standard. I think "no child labor" and "no prisoner labor" is another.

I think that beyond that, some kind of distance tariff should be established for any good/service which is not exclusive to a region. The farther it is shipped or located from the point of use, the higher the tariff. Local production (and environmental consequences) should always be encouraged over imports based upon exploitation of living and labor costs.

As an example, look at the microchip industry. Costs of production are really not an issue - if that was the only issue, we'd still make most of our own semiconductors. But if you make semiconductors in the USA, disposal of waste products is a huge expense. In Asia (or to a lesser degree Mexico) however, they just dump it into the river and let it flow into the ocean. It is insane that we accept this and allow these practices to go on - it's killing the oceans and while it will effect them first, it is going to effect us too in the long run.

As for a world minimum wage - I'm not sure about that. However, the "company store" policies of many regimes we deal with must be outlawed - as these amount to nothing more than slavery in sheeps clothing. What happens is the workers are not paid enough to subsist, but are given credit to allow them to do so, but then are not allowed to leave their jobs until that debt is paid - which can never happen as they are not paid enough to subsist. This is wrong and we should never support such practices.

Wade.

 

[wade]

didn't find that but i found a lot of blogs and website op-eds claiming this (and it makes me shudder)

Gold: The China Syndrome

Americans forewarned -- Of more concern, as goes the Chinese economy, so goes America's financial markets. By becoming the world's largest debtor nation, America has unknowingly allowed itself to be governed by the newest superpower, China. China has immense reserves now, second only to Japan. With $400 billion of foreign exchange reserves invested largely in United States Treasuries, the Chinese have financed a large part of the American deficits. Should China slowdown or alternatively decide to dump its bonds in favour of gold or euros, it would throw American financial markets into a tailspin, causing US interest rates to skyrocket - and that is the Achilles' heel of the American dream.

i found that this was the best explaination of all this so here is the link to the above
http://www.newsgateway.ca/gold_and_silver.htm

I've made this point several times. The Bush recovery is really not a recovery at all. It is based upon cheap money which is funded by foriegn investment. Americans are encouraged to borrow and spend spend spend - and not to really worry about the debt. This fires up the economy and looks like growth on paper, but it is not really growth. Growth requires investment in productivity, and that is not going on.

We are in real trouble. The national debt is huge, and the consumer debt is astounding. Inevitably, this must bring inflation. Inflation will make our bonds very unattractive, and without bond sales, the cheap credit will dry up over night, consequently consumer spending will dry up, and the country will be thrown very quickly into a very harsh recession. If this is really bad, people will start to default on their debts, then the price of housing will fall and banks will no longer feel secure about the collateral behind their outsanding home lones, etc., etc., ... and walla ---> depression.

The war in Iraq just exacerbates the situation, every dollar we spend on this war brings the day of reckoning that much closer, and reduces the probability that we can somehow work our way out of this without a world wide depression.

And the Chineese holding the strings is very scary indeed, since they are well positioned to take advantage of such a depression and may well force one if/when they think it will benifit them to do so.

Wade.

 

[rtwngAvngr]

Do you not see that this country will, if left on its current course, evolve into nothing better than a fascist state with what is effectively a slave labor force?

I think that's a leap, rhetoric boy. Though china does concern me.

I believe we (the West) should set standards for imported goods on the international market. I think "no slave labor" is cleary one such standard. I think "no child labor" and "no prisoner labor" is another.

Can we enforce these? Should we just take their word for it? THat's happening now. But they lie about it.

I think that beyond that, some kind of distance tariff should be established for any good/service which is not exclusive to a region. The farther it is shipped or located from the point of use, the higher the tariff. Local production (and environmental consequences) should always be encouraged over imports based upon exploitation of living and labor costs.

What you say is a bit extreme. But there is a tiny bit of merit. Should people profit from differentials in the cost of living?

As an example, look at the microchip industry. Costs of production are really not an issue - if that was the only issue, we'd still make most of our own semiconductors. But if you make semiconductors in the USA, disposal of waste products is a huge expense. In Asia (or to a lesser degree Mexico) however, they just dump it into the river and let it flow into the ocean. It is insane that we accept this and allow these practices to go on - it's killing the oceans and while it will effect them first, it is going to effect us too in the long run.

Once again. Enforcement. What do you want us to do? Take over the world?

As for a world minimum wage - I'm not sure about that. However, the "company store" policies of many regimes we deal with must be outlawed - as these amount to nothing more than slavery in sheeps clothing. What happens is the workers are not paid enough to subsist, but are given credit to allow them to do so, but then are not allowed to leave their jobs until that debt is paid - which can never happen as they are not paid enough to subsist. This is wrong and we should never support such practices.

Wade.

So should we take over the world?