A question for the religious

[Intense]

 

[JBeukema]

Peace, Harmony, Communion.

Do you believe such is impossible to achieve on Earth? Do you believe everyone will be present to enjoy this or only those who share your beliefs and practices?

Not at all. You need to get out of Tucson more.

In three states, I've seen a lot of things. Not much inspires the confidence you seem to have.

Desert People never seem to get enough Ocean.

I don't like large standing bodies of water. Too many near-drownings.

 

[JBeukema]

How curious that I should now find my baptismal candle. I didn't know such things were used, let alone that it had been saved all these years and placed among my things at some point.

 

[JBeukema]

No idea.

So you don't know what it is that your faith tells you about what comes after death that is appealing? What do you believe happens when you die? Is there more than one possible outcome? If so, is one possible outcome appealing in itself (if so, what about it appeals to you?) or is it merely better than the alternative(s)?

Clarify

My interpretation is that it just tells me everything will be OK. I can't earn it

So how one lives has nothing to do with it? Do you believe wicked persons will also share this good thing you expect?

 

[JBeukema]

Why have you not addressed my earlier questions?

 

[Avatar4321]

What is it, exactly about what your religion promises that appeals to you? Is it the promise of setting eyes on deity? Is it the promise of a a Utopia free of illness and evil? Is it the mere promise of escaping death- for fear of death itself or for fear of the unknown? What is it about what you personally believe awaits you after death should you follow the commandments of your faith that draws you to it?

It offers me the truth and a way to learn more directly from God. It offers me power to change my life and the lives of others.

Im not worried about after death. In fact, I rarely think of it. Id rather live in the present.

 

[Agit8r]

I don't think that I count as religious. My beliefs promise me a completion of the cycle of entropy

 

[maatsmom843]

because most (religious) people have been raised in a way such that their religion is the thing that is most near and dear to their heart.

add to that the fact that the monotheistic religions tout a "blind faith or else" doctrine and it should be a bit easier to understand

when no one knows for sure what happens on the other side, and you've lived your life believing what you've been taught, and you've been conditioned to believe that hellfire awaits if you don't believe the right thing, well...

its a chance that I take, but many people won't

 

[Intense]

What is it, exactly about what your religion promises that appeals to you? Is it the promise of setting eyes on deity? Is it the promise of a a Utopia free of illness and evil? Is it the mere promise of escaping death- for fear of death itself or for fear of the unknown? What is it about what you personally believe awaits you after death should you follow the commandments of your faith that draws you to it?

Peace, Harmony, Communion.

Do you believe such is impossible to achieve on Earth? Do you believe everyone will be present to enjoy this or only those who share your beliefs and practices?

I think there are choices We Each have to make. We each should be focused with Conscience, and making peace with it, not focused on others, or what they think, in matters of determining Salvation. There is One God.

 

[Intense]

What is it, exactly about what your religion promises that appeals to you? Is it the promise of setting eyes on deity? Is it the promise of a a Utopia free of illness and evil? Is it the mere promise of escaping death- for fear of death itself or for fear of the unknown? What is it about what you personally believe awaits you after death should you follow the commandments of your faith that draws you to it?

Peace, Harmony, Communion.

Do you believe such is impossible to achieve on Earth? Do you believe everyone will be present to enjoy this or only those who share your beliefs and practices?

We have been over this before.

Religious Freedom Page: Memorial and Remonstrance Against Religious Assessments, James Madison (1785)

 

[Mini 14]

 

[Intense]

Also, Intense, do you believe human nature will somehow be changes upon entering Heaven to prevent that communion from failing as people form their own cliques as here on Earth? Or will only a select few who share your views be present so that there is no disagreement?

Are we being made ready? Are we being prepared? There are two sides to the Veil, that we claim to know or believe in. We have a hard enough time understanding this side of Life. Why speak as an Authority about something that we have no knowledge of in this State of Being??? What purpose does it serve??? Do I believe in God??? Yes. Do I believe in Spirit and Soul??? Yes. Do I believe in Life after Death??? Yes. I sense it. That's the best I can say. From a perspective of Living in Faith.... We are Each Created and Purposed by Our Maker, in Heaven, Each of Unique Value, with different measures of the Same Gift, Each, we have our Own Cross to bear, our own life lessons, each is governed by Cause and Effect. Are the Tangents we create more significant than Our Individual Purpose for being??? I believe if We learn to put God first in all things, no. Still, I'm not the one standing at the Gate of Heaven denying Anyone entry. I believe for Each, we will pass through Judgement at the Will of the Powers that be to whatever End or New Beginning.

 

[Intense]

Why have you not addressed my earlier questions?

You see this as a Testimony against God. I see this as a Testimony of the Tangents we create. Why do we blame God for what We do with the Free Will He gave Us?

Be Fruitful, Multiply, and Replenish the Earth? We derailed that one way back.

 

[JBeukema]

What is it, exactly about what your religion promises that appeals to you? Is it the promise of setting eyes on deity? Is it the promise of a a Utopia free of illness and evil? Is it the mere promise of escaping death- for fear of death itself or for fear of the unknown? What is it about what you personally believe awaits you after death should you follow the commandments of your faith that draws you to it?

It offers me the truth and a way to learn more directly from God. It offers me power to change my life and the lives of others.

You don't believe you could improve yourself and the world around you if your god didn't exist?

 

[JBeukema]

Peace, Harmony, Communion.

Do you believe such is impossible to achieve on Earth? Do you believe everyone will be present to enjoy this or only those who share your beliefs and practices?

We have been over this before.

Religious Freedom Page: Memorial and Remonstrance Against Religious Assessments, James Madison (1785)

Sounds like an attempt to dodge the question. Is it because you can't answer it for your own self? How can your communion occur if everyone in heaven isn't of one mind any more than it does on Earth? Will God change people's minds somehow? Will only those who agree with you share your heaven? How do you account for human nature? I don't understand how this is supposed to work. Do you simply ignore such concerns in order to accept this vision of Heaven?

 

[amrchaos]

I still don't understand the "We are destined to live in Heaven, that is why we are on Earth"-arguement posed by Christianity and Islam.

Why can't it be that we are meant for Earth, that is why we are on Earth?

 

[Avatar4321]

because most (religious) people have been raised in a way such that their religion is the thing that is most near and dear to their heart.

add to that the fact that the monotheistic religions tout a "blind faith or else" doctrine and it should be a bit easier to understand

when no one knows for sure what happens on the other side, and you've lived your life believing what you've been taught, and you've been conditioned to believe that hellfire awaits if you don't believe the right thing, well...

its a chance that I take, but many people won't

No offense, but I dont think you understand religious people at all.

 

[Intense]

Do you believe such is impossible to achieve on Earth? Do you believe everyone will be present to enjoy this or only those who share your beliefs and practices?

We have been over this before.

Religious Freedom Page: Memorial and Remonstrance Against Religious Assessments, James Madison (1785)

Sounds like an attempt to dodge the question. Is it because you can't answer it for your own self? How can your communion occur if everyone in heaven isn't of one mind any more than it does on Earth? Will God change people's minds somehow? Will only those who agree with you share your heaven? How do you account for human nature? I don't understand how this is supposed to work. Do you simply ignore such concerns in order to accept this vision of Heaven?

Not evading at all. From a Locke or Madison perspective, Matters of Conscience are between Each of Us and Our Maker, Individually. No Arm bending, No Manipulating. You can't force Conscience JB. You can't Make Everyone be like you. No One can. Locke's Point in part, We being Unique, learn to be true to Conscience, develop that bond, improve with age, by choice. I'm in no way telling you to believe like me. I'm telling you to listen to your own inner self, your own conscience. "The Emperor's New Suit"-Hans Christian Anderson. Hans Christian Andersen: The Emperor?s New Suit Why is Society so determined to crush Individual Conscience and Individual Witness to the ground and beat it to death, rather than learn from it's mistakes and alter course??? Faith and Conviction is the remedy to Hell on Earth. There is a part of our Nature at war with the Forces of Creation. There is a part of each of us not ready for what comes next. Do not confuse the process with the prize.

 

[Intense]

I still don't understand the "We are destined to live in Heaven, that is why we are on Earth"-arguement posed by Christianity and Islam.

Why can't it be that we are meant for Earth, that is why we are on Earth?

There is nothing wrong with living in the present. There is also more to us than flesh and bone.

 

[JBeukema]

You can't Make Everyone be like you.

I repeat my earlier question:

How can your communion occur if everyone in heaven isn't of one mind any more than it does on Earth? Will God change people's minds somehow? Will only those who agree with you share your heaven? How do you account for human nature?

No One can. Locke's Point in part, We being Unique, learn to be true to Conscience, develop that bond, improve with age, by choice. I'm in no way telling you to believe like me. I'm telling you to listen to your own inner self, your own conscience.

My conscience tells me the world would be better without any humans in it... It tells me that developing the White Plague would be the best thing to happen since the Flood.