Why Education is Failing

Hobbit

Senior Member
Mar 25, 2004
5,099
423
48
Near Atlanta, GA
There's a big stink about education around the country. School kids are dumber than they used to be. Test scores are lower. While some students still manage to excel, many others fall through the cracks. As always, the government uses the only solution to everything, throw money at it. The schools are getting more money so they can afford better facilities and more faculty, but is that the problem. As with most things, no, lack of funding was a problem, but a relatively minor one. The No Child Left Behind Act was a good-spirited law meant to clean up the schools, but is still attacking from the wrong angle and is too "cookie cutter" to fit even a sizable portion of troubled schools. The angle to attack education is always how well the kids are being taught. However, how well the teachers are being taught is not the equivalent of how well they are learning. It's logically the first place to look, but not the only place. Here, in this post, I'll present what I think are the failing factors in education. As the son of an insider (teacher), I've got a pretty good perspective, and unlike the mummies in Washington, I know that money can't be the solution to everything. In my opinion, it all boils down to three areas.

1. Political Correctness Indoctrination - This is one of the biggest problems facing education today. All classes must be edited, cropped, and altered until fact is obscured by a watered down version that is guaranteed not to offend anybody except those who actually put stock in facts and learning. This "sensitive" material contains nothing that could possibly be considered offensive to blacks, hispanics, women, gays, or any other group that isn't Christian white males. The Civil Rights Movement gets ten times more attention than World War II, the greatest conflict in the history of mankind. Communism is marginalized while racism is portrayed as a larger blight than the Black Plague.

On the other side of this politically correct spectrum is how the classes are taught. Students may no longer be seperated by ability. High achievers can no longer be put into "honors" classes to move at a faster pace and slow students can no longer be put into special ed to teach them in way that better suits their needs. Instead, all students must be put in the same class so nobody feels inferior. I was stuck in an English class with a guy who didn't speak English. My mom has a retarded kid in her 4th period class, which must be co-taught by a special ed teacher who is stone deaf, requiring a translator. She's a crappy teacher, to boot.

Then there's all the time focusing on taking away a child's innocence to make sure that sex is taught as a safe and natural, perfectly acceptable activity as long as it's with a condom before the evil conservatives can move in and make it something sacred.

With all the political correctness taught, there's no time to fit in actual curriculum.

2. Culture - 20+ years ago, culture propped up astronauts and scientists as heroes. These guys were getting us into space. Smart people were regarded as people worth modeling your life after. If you worked hard enough and got a good education, you could be like one of these guys. Now, the heroes are 'gangstas,' rappers, athletes, and several other knuckleheads who have no education, are dumb as a stump, and glorify similar careers that lead mostly to ruin. With people like these guys as heroes, children just aren't interested in education. They don't think they'll ever use it, and won't care until it's too late and they realize that college is out of reach and the only career they'll have involves french fries, because the careers they thought would lead to riches and fame are very exclusive and available only to a handful of people.

Then comes the entitlement culture. It's the same reason service is so bad now. Everybody thinks that showing up is all that's needed. They punch in, punch out, and want a paycheck, regardless of the in-between. Now, they punch in, punch out, and want their grade. That's all they should have to do. You have to give them everything else, because it's not your place to withold it. Hard work has no value in today's society, because everybody seems to have an attitude that the world owes them and that they shouldn't have to work for it.

3. Parents - Parents are ruining more children every day than even KKKarl Rove's hurricane factory could hope to do in a year. Instead of pressuring their kids to excel at what they do, they instead yell and gripe every time the kids get in trouble or make a bad grade. They take the attitude that their children are perfect, so if they get in trouble or get a bad mark, it must be that the teacher has it out for them, or is racist, or is mean, or whatever. What they do is teach their kids that they can do whatever they want, because mommy and daddy will always make it all better. Are mommy and daddy still gonna bail them out when they get sent to jail for 20 years because the only job the kid could get is drug-dealer?

No amount of money thrown at schools can get these problems fixed. The "No Child Left Behind Act" puts everything on the teachers, but it's rarely the teacher's fault, since most of the kids simply don't want to learn. When this legislation was introduced, somebody came to my mom's school to explain it. When shown the fact that the kids would have to pass tests for the teachers to get credit for doing a good job, somebody asked why that was. The guy said, "Well, I used to make grape jelly for a reason, but I couldn't just make jelly. It had to be good jelly or I could never sell it. It's just like that here. Your product is students who know the subject. You have to turn this product out in order to succeed in this business, just like any other." The next question was, "What would happen if you got a shipment of sour grapes from the produce truck?" The obvious reply was, "Oh, I'd tell the produce guy I wouldn't take them. I can't work with sour grapes." You know, the teachers cannot simply refuse bad students, so why are we concentrating on them when the real problem lies in the students? Everything else possible is being blamed for education, but the real fault lies on the students. The sooner we realize this, the better, because PC, lawsuit-controlled indoctrination centers are turning out total idiots with high self-esteem and no way to handle criticism.
 
Maybe that's the whole point. Stupid people who are indoctrinated to think a certain way and are totally dependent on the government will be so much easier to rule over..... like sheep in a stockade. Also, criticism is a no-no, even better for those who want to rule. If you can't criticize anyone, you can't criticize those who rule, either.
 
KarlMarx said:
Maybe that's the whole point. Stupid people who are indoctrinated to think a certain way and are totally dependent on the government will be so much easier to rule over..... like sheep in a stockade. Also, criticism is a no-no, even better for those who want to rule. If you can't criticize anyone, you can't criticize those who rule, either.

BRILLIANT!! Rep points for you. :thup:
 
my state spends 50cents for every tax dollar on education, yet the people here still bitch that we need to spend more money.

how about we get rid of 4 of the 5 secretaries that each the superintendants have? how about making kids more responsible for their own learning? how about not spending money (i have seen as high as $50k on one) on stupid motivational speakers that the kids just mock and make fun of afterward? how about not coddling people who refuse to learn in high school. they are old enough to know that if they don't at least have a hs diploma, they will be hard pressed later in life. how about parents not blaming the teachers for their kids' behavior problems, when everything (nearly) starts at home.
 
When are they going to invent a machine that just puts all the information in your head automatically like in that crappy Scientology movie with John Travolta? I'd buy stock in that!
 
Hobbit said:
There's a big stink about education around the country. School kids are dumber than they used to be.
No they aren't. We 'teach' less, because of demands of parents, lack of support by administration, and in many districts an emphasis on tests. There are also the problems of dealing with sexual orientation, parental problems, peer problems, and addiction issues.
Test scores are lower. While some students still manage to excel, many others fall through the cracks. As always, the government uses the only solution to everything, throw money at it.
Tests scores are actually mixed. The tests have been dumbed down, but some of that is the result of a drive by business for more 'process teaching' rather than direct instruction. That is problematic though, since kids really don't get the process prior to seeing a broader picture. I can see the argument from the pov of business, for many reasons, kids come out of high school without the basics of what they need. Education, in its infinate ability to screw things up even more, have started emphasizing processes in 3rd grade-8th grade, when there is no groundwork. Go figure. [/quote]
The schools are getting more money so they can afford better facilities and more faculty, but is that the problem. As with most things, no, lack of funding was a problem, but a relatively minor one.
Minor or non-existant in most good suburban schools. Dire problem in lower income/many city schools-guess who gets the money? Guess who can afford to hire grant writers?
The No Child Left Behind Act was a good-spirited law meant to clean up the schools, but is still attacking from the wrong angle and is too "cookie cutter" to fit even a sizable portion of troubled schools.
Actually other than being 'all inclusive', meaning even those with just a brain stem, Down's syndrome, life threatening illnesses, being included in standardized test scores, not a horrible criteria. One other issue is there are no accomodations made for ESL students, they cannot score at the level of US born children-thus lowering the 'ability of especially Hispanics' across the board'.
The angle to attack education is always how well the kids are being taught. However, how well the teachers are being taught is not the equivalent of how well they are learning. It's logically the first place to look, but not the only place. Here, in this post, I'll present what I think are the failing factors in education.
I'm kind of confused with where you are going here. Are you speaking of children being taught or what 'education departments' are teaching wannabe teachers?
As the son of an insider (teacher), I've got a pretty good perspective, and unlike the mummies in Washington, I know that money can't be the solution to everything. In my opinion, it all boils down to three areas.

1. Political Correctness Indoctrination - This is one of the biggest problems facing education today. All classes must be edited, cropped, and altered until fact is obscured by a watered down version that is guaranteed not to offend anybody except those who actually put stock in facts and learning. This "sensitive" material contains nothing that could possibly be considered offensive to blacks, hispanics, women, gays, or any other group that isn't Christian white males. The Civil Rights Movement gets ten times more attention than World War II, the greatest conflict in the history of mankind. Communism is marginalized while racism is portrayed as a larger blight than the Black Plague.

On the other side of this politically correct spectrum is how the classes are taught. Students may no longer be seperated by ability. High achievers can no longer be put into "honors" classes to move at a faster pace and slow students can no longer be put into special ed to teach them in way that better suits their needs. Instead, all students must be put in the same class so nobody feels inferior. I was stuck in an English class with a guy who didn't speak English. My mom has a retarded kid in her 4th period class, which must be co-taught by a special ed teacher who is stone deaf, requiring a translator. She's a crappy teacher, to boot.

Then there's all the time focusing on taking away a child's innocence to make sure that sex is taught as a safe and natural, perfectly acceptable activity as long as it's with a condom before the evil conservatives can move in and make it something sacred.

With all the political correctness taught, there's no time to fit in actual curriculum.
Have to agree with you here. All the data backs tracking by ability, from special ed-giftedness. Yet the education community clings to their 'vision' of 'self-esteem' with no data to back it up. In a class of 25, there may be 2-3 'gifted' students; 2-5 with some sort of 'LD' problems, and 1 with a serious BD problem, who may be part of the other 2 groups or not. Three groups, with the BD kid either standing alone or integrated if possible with support, would be much better served than trying to get the high helping the low. The middle kids are always left out now...
2. Culture - 20+ years ago, culture propped up astronauts and scientists as heroes. These guys were getting us into space. Smart people were regarded as people worth modeling your life after. If you worked hard enough and got a good education, you could be like one of these guys. Now, the heroes are 'gangstas,' rappers, athletes, and several other knuckleheads who have no education, are dumb as a stump, and glorify similar careers that lead mostly to ruin. With people like these guys as heroes, children just aren't interested in education. They don't think they'll ever use it, and won't care until it's too late and they realize that college is out of reach and the only career they'll have involves french fries, because the careers they thought would lead to riches and fame are very exclusive and available only to a handful of people.

Then comes the entitlement culture. It's the same reason service is so bad now. Everybody thinks that showing up is all that's needed. They punch in, punch out, and want a paycheck, regardless of the in-between. Now, they punch in, punch out, and want their grade. That's all they should have to do. You have to give them everything else, because it's not your place to withold it. Hard work has no value in today's society, because everybody seems to have an attitude that the world owes them and that they shouldn't have to work for it.
In all honesty, have not seen this in public or parochial schools. In either case, the worst that can be said for 'hero making' is saying that some 'minority' stood up and was blown away as an example.

As for 'showing up' being enough. More than agree with you here, though you are drifting towards the 3rd point.
3. Parents - Parents are ruining more children every day than even KKKarl Rove's hurricane factory could hope to do in a year. Instead of pressuring their kids to excel at what they do, they instead yell and gripe every time the kids get in trouble or make a bad grade. They take the attitude that their children are perfect, so if they get in trouble or get a bad mark, it must be that the teacher has it out for them, or is racist, or is mean, or whatever. What they do is teach their kids that they can do whatever they want, because mommy and daddy will always make it all better. Are mommy and daddy still gonna bail them out when they get sent to jail for 20 years because the only job the kid could get is drug-dealer?
You have no idea how big a problem this is! You would NEVER say your child should get away with doing less than there best, because your family had something to attend to. You would NEVER say that their practice last night should be a reason that their homework should be accepted late, for Full Credit! You would NEVER demand that they should have their work given in advance or that accomodations should be made for time lost, because you want to take them out of school for 3 days-21 days, because YOU cannot fit your vacation within a 3 months summer, 2 weeks at Christmas, excuse me, winter break; or 1 week in the Spring. Your job is just SO difficult.
No amount of money thrown at schools can get these problems fixed. The "No Child Left Behind Act" puts everything on the teachers, but it's rarely the teacher's fault, since most of the kids simply don't want to learn.
Actually there are a lot of really bad teachers. There are way too many that are fixated on one subject in the lower grades, especially reading. They do not seem able to understand that you can teach reading, while teaching science, social studies, geography, math, etc. In the upper grades there are too many teachers unwilling to accomodate for different abilities and interests. I get that with social studies, many are 'turned off', yet they like science or literature. I do know how to use the time periods for grabbing them. In high school, one has to show them what's in it for them.
When this legislation was introduced, somebody came to my mom's school to explain it. When shown the fact that the kids would have to pass tests for the teachers to get credit for doing a good job, somebody asked why that was. The guy said, "Well, I used to make grape jelly for a reason, but I couldn't just make jelly. It had to be good jelly or I could never sell it. It's just like that here. Your product is students who know the subject. You have to turn this product out in order to succeed in this business, just like any other." The next question was, "What would happen if you got a shipment of sour grapes from the produce truck?" The obvious reply was, "Oh, I'd tell the produce guy I wouldn't take them. I can't work with sour grapes." You know, the teachers cannot simply refuse bad students, so why are we concentrating on them when the real problem lies in the students? Everything else possible is being blamed for education, but the real fault lies on the students. The sooner we realize this, the better, because PC, lawsuit-controlled indoctrination centers are turning out total idiots with high self-esteem and no way to handle criticism.
I may seem like Miss Nicey, but rarely is it the kids' fault. Parents', yeah. Teachers', yeah. Administration, yeah. Kids? Not really. What I hold the kids accountable for is their behavior and attitude. It may be parochial school, I have my students for 3 years. I let them know me, while I get to know them. I can think of only 2 kids that I felt were so 'problematic' there was little hope for, that I could see. I do hope that they found someone they could look up to...
 
Well stated. Can't rep you, though. Now, I know I've got skewed perspectives, but I have a small sample size.

Now, I understand your view of blaming parents instead of students, but I think it lies in both places. Sure, it's the parents' fault the kids weren't raised right, but these kids have been shown how important a degree is, yet the MAJORITY of my mom's English students keep saying stupid crap like, "I don't need to talk good just to get a job," or "My daddy cut pulp wood and my grandaddy cut pulp wood and if it's good enough for them, it's good enough for me, and I don't need to know all this [deleted] to cut no pulp wood." They show up and they don't pay attention, they do no work, they don't even try to learn anything, and then their parents gripe out my mom when they fail and have to take remidial English over the summer. Most programs attack the teachers. The fault lies on the parents, kids, and idiotic beaurocrats who just don't get it, in that order.
 
1. Home - Discipline at home today is lacking. How many times in public have you seen a child talking to their mother like a dog? They then take their little monsters and drop them off so they can rest and expect teachers them to do the parenting. Many of today’s adults are nothing more than big kids themselves and they don't support the schools are teachers. I've seen many of them at my son’s schools breaking rules and giggling about it. What a wonderful message to send the children. I don't think this problem can be fixed. It is the way of our society and you can see this in extremes the farther you go down the social ladder. With supportive and stable parents you don't have a very good foundation to build character.

2. Schools - Why are teachers the only people on earth that are paid if they produce results or not? There are many high trained dedicated teachers that work their tails off but they get paid the same amount as the teacher that pushes worksheets and plays on the computer. There is no free market system but simply a version of communism in schools. After a while many just say the heck with it and push paper and watch the clock.
Discipline is a major issue. You can't do anything that might upset the little tykes or hurt their self esteem. Basically the only option a teacher has is some sort of timeout system. Also when you do resort to this you better get a lawyer because their parents will come after you. The teacher is not just on the level of the student but in reality below it.

3. Certification - This is the biggest scam. Do you know that in most states a teacher only needs 12 hours in the subject they plan to teach? That's four classes which hardly makes you a master in the field. I knew math teachers that couldn't do simple Algebra. Let anyone with a degree in the field get in there and try to do their job. If they can't then get rid of them. Teaching is an art that some have and some do not. I firmly believe that certification is only in place to keep the education professors at colleges employed. Ask any certified teacher if they use or even remember the junk they push. Also certification creates an artificial barrier into the profession.

4. Flavor of the month teaching methods - Education should be fun right? BS. It should be fun if the teacher is good enough and you have a natural aptitude for the subject that you want to know more. I could have had the best Math and English teachers in the world but I would have hated it. I learned Math and English to get through college by countless hours of hard work. Not a bad life lesson. I love some of the things schools have tried like cooperative learning (doing your homework with a buddy) and my all time favorite group testing (taking a test with your buddy). Also they push activities and group projects over lectures and testing. Do you want your airplane pilot to have learned his profession through this method? The kids do have fun with all of this but they don’t really learn anything. Parents love looking at their kids projects so the principal is happy. Everyone is happy but the student didn’t learn very much.

In short, the attitude at home has to change which I think is impossible. Teachers need to discipline and also be paid on results. Get rid of year long contracts and certification and use good old fashion capitalism. Get discipline methods that actually work (I don’t see what’s wrong with corporal punishment if done right). Go back to the old ways of teaching and stop worrying about if the students are being entertained. Throwing money at the problem will only enrich the school board. You might be able to tell that I use to teach.
:eek:
 
To answer an interesting question cajun posed, I'll paraphrase my mom. Teachers don't get merit-based pay because merit-based pay would have to be based on test scores. Teachers can't be graded on the performance of students because teachers don't get to hand pick their classes. My mom works her butt off every day trying to teach her kids, but most of them simply don't want to learn, resulting in about a 50% pass rate. Down the hall is a worksheet pushing robot who's only been teaching for a couple of years, but has a couple of neato sounding certifications, so she gets nothing but honor students. She gets teacher of the year almost every year. That's why teachers can't be graded on merit, because nobody actually wants to come up with a merit system that's fair to the teachers with bad students.
 
Hobbit said:
To answer an interesting question cajun posed, I'll paraphrase my mom. Teachers don't get merit-based pay because merit-based pay would have to be based on test scores. Teachers can't be graded on the performance of students because teachers don't get to hand pick their classes. My mom works her butt off every day trying to teach her kids, but most of them simply don't want to learn, resulting in about a 50% pass rate. Down the hall is a worksheet pushing robot who's only been teaching for a couple of years, but has a couple of neato sounding certifications, so she gets nothing but honor students. She gets teacher of the year almost every year. That's why teachers can't be graded on merit, because nobody actually wants to come up with a merit system that's fair to the teachers with bad students.


There the problem lays with at least teachers. You could have a dedicated good teacher doing their best each day yet if they have a room full of future wards of the state, then their work will have been for not. I don't suggest that a teacher should be paid off of student performance on standardized test but rather on what they do each day. Standardized test are a bit of scam also. I know a teacher that use to give the students or "help" them to get the right answers where her kids always got high grades. Standarized test also might shock you what they actually test. The social studies portion doesn't ask you basic history questions that everyone should know but instead word problems like "if Apu eats a lot of fish and knows how to swim, then little Apu is likely to live near what?" Principals use to walk around and actually see what's going on in the classroom. Pay teachers on what they are actually doing and any improvement that the same group of kids show from one year to the next on achievement tests. I don't know if it would work but someone needs to come up with a system where people like your mom that are working their tails off is paid more than a worksheet pusher.
 
Hobbit said:
Well stated. Can't rep you, though. Now, I know I've got skewed perspectives, but I have a small sample size.

Now, I understand your view of blaming parents instead of students, but I think it lies in both places. Sure, it's the parents' fault the kids weren't raised right, but these kids have been shown how important a degree is, yet the MAJORITY of my mom's English students keep saying stupid crap like, "I don't need to talk good just to get a job," or "My daddy cut pulp wood and my grandaddy cut pulp wood and if it's good enough for them, it's good enough for me, and I don't need to know all this [deleted] to cut no pulp wood." They show up and they don't pay attention, they do no work, they don't even try to learn anything, and then their parents gripe out my mom when they fail and have to take remidial English over the summer. Most programs attack the teachers. The fault lies on the parents, kids, and idiotic beaurocrats who just don't get it, in that order.


Ok, there could be a difference in locales with something like that. While I'm not teaching in one of the 'primo' areas in the county, the country itself is quite expensive-most of the parents in our school have college degrees.
The kids and their parents think they should have Harvard entrance background with minimal work. :rolleyes: The kids come in though to the school with good speaking and understanding vocabularies, which is probably why they do score high on standardized tests. Last year's 7th grade composite for reading was 12+ on Terra Novas.
 
rcajun90 said:
1. Home - Discipline at home today is lacking. How many times in public have you seen a child talking to their mother like a dog? They then take their little monsters and drop them off so they can rest and expect teachers them to do the parenting. Many of today’s adults are nothing more than big kids themselves and they don't support the schools are teachers. I've seen many of them at my son’s schools breaking rules and giggling about it. What a wonderful message to send the children. I don't think this problem can be fixed. It is the way of our society and you can see this in extremes the farther you go down the social ladder. With supportive and stable parents you don't have a very good foundation to build character.

2. Schools - Why are teachers the only people on earth that are paid if they produce results or not? There are many high trained dedicated teachers that work their tails off but they get paid the same amount as the teacher that pushes worksheets and plays on the computer. There is no free market system but simply a version of communism in schools. After a while many just say the heck with it and push paper and watch the clock.
Discipline is a major issue. You can't do anything that might upset the little tykes or hurt their self esteem. Basically the only option a teacher has is some sort of timeout system. Also when you do resort to this you better get a lawyer because their parents will come after you. The teacher is not just on the level of the student but in reality below it.

3. Certification - This is the biggest scam. Do you know that in most states a teacher only needs 12 hours in the subject they plan to teach? That's four classes which hardly makes you a master in the field. I knew math teachers that couldn't do simple Algebra. Let anyone with a degree in the field get in there and try to do their job. If they can't then get rid of them. Teaching is an art that some have and some do not. I firmly believe that certification is only in place to keep the education professors at colleges employed. Ask any certified teacher if they use or even remember the junk they push. Also certification creates an artificial barrier into the profession.

4. Flavor of the month teaching methods - Education should be fun right? BS. It should be fun if the teacher is good enough and you have a natural aptitude for the subject that you want to know more. I could have had the best Math and English teachers in the world but I would have hated it. I learned Math and English to get through college by countless hours of hard work. Not a bad life lesson. I love some of the things schools have tried like cooperative learning (doing your homework with a buddy) and my all time favorite group testing (taking a test with your buddy). Also they push activities and group projects over lectures and testing. Do you want your airplane pilot to have learned his profession through this method? The kids do have fun with all of this but they don’t really learn anything. Parents love looking at their kids projects so the principal is happy. Everyone is happy but the student didn’t learn very much.

In short, the attitude at home has to change which I think is impossible. Teachers need to discipline and also be paid on results. Get rid of year long contracts and certification and use good old fashion capitalism. Get discipline methods that actually work (I don’t see what’s wrong with corporal punishment if done right). Go back to the old ways of teaching and stop worrying about if the students are being entertained. Throwing money at the problem will only enrich the school board. You might be able to tell that I use to teach.
:eek:


Wow, I agree with everything you said here. Discipline is missing from home and schools. Teachers in too many cases are not well prepared academically themselves.
 
Tests scores are actually mixed. The tests have been dumbed down, but some of that is the result of a drive by business for more 'process teaching' rather than direct instruction. That is problematic though, since kids really don't get the process prior to seeing a broader picture. I can see the argument from the pov of business, for many reasons, kids come out of high school without the basics of what they need. Education, in its infinate ability to screw things up even more, have started emphasizing processes in 3rd grade-8th grade, when there is no groundwork. Go figure.

THANK YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!

My poor daughter was in tears last years learning multiplication bc the teacher gave her three different ways to solve every problem, BEFORE she even really understood the basic concept of what multiplication was. I finally had to tell her to just ignore her teacher. I told her she was just going to have to memorize them, and drilled her every night on the multiplication tables. Finally, AFTER she had worked with the numbers, she began to see patterns, and could understand shortcuts (like, for nines, just multiply by 10 and subtract 1). But to throw these at her when she didn't even understand multiplication to begin with!!!! I was so mad!!!

Same thing with my son in kgarten. They give him these sight words, BEFORE they teach them letters and letter sounds!!!! So he sees a word that begins with 'S', and it is automatically "See." They have no other recourse but to just guess at the word. They say it raises self-esteem. I, personally, would feel better about myself if I could ACTUALLY read instead of just guessing and memorizing. Luckily for my kids, I teach them this stuff before they even begin school. But I volunteer in the classroom, and I can tell you, some of these kids don't know their letters. Yet, they are supposed to be "reading" books!

It's times like these that I really consider homeschooling. I'm doing the teaching, anyway!
 
Have to agree with you here. All the data backs tracking by ability, from special ed-giftedness. Yet the education community clings to their 'vision' of 'self-esteem' with no data to back it up. In a class of 25, there may be 2-3 'gifted' students; 2-5 with some sort of 'LD' problems, and 1 with a serious BD problem, who may be part of the other 2 groups or not. Three groups, with the BD kid either standing alone or integrated if possible with support, would be much better served than trying to get the high helping the low. The middle kids are always left out now...
Once again, THANK YOU!!!!!

Same daughter that was having trouble with multiplication, generally a model student (every teacher she has had told me they wished they had a classroom full of "Abbies")... She started showing signs of depression in 2nd grade, crying, moping, overeating, withdrawl from people. So I went in to observe in her classroom. The teacher (an award-winning teacher) had been pairing her with a LD/BD kid, on a constant basis. She had no opportunity to work with other kids in the class, make other friends, bc the LD kid latched onto her. Plus, what about challenging HER? She is an exceptional reader; why not move her up levels? I know the teacher was overworked, having these kids in the class, and Abbie is the type that will try to teach the other kid or help in any way, but I have to stick up for my daughter. I feel sorry for the slower kids, but really, what is the point? You are just hanging a millstone around the neck of your brighter students, and for what? Self-esteem? Do they really think the kids can't figure out who the slower ones are just bc they aren't in a tracking system? Give me a break!

(Just to be fair, after talking to the teacher, she agreed to move Abbie around. We also made her get involved in an extra-curricular and invite kids for overnights. This improved her depression symptoms.)
 
Kathianne said:
Anyhow, yes beware of your tolerant child being made the caretaker of the class misfits! If the teacher will not help your kid, get involved!
It happened to her last year too, but not to the same extent as it did in 2nd grade. She seems ok this year; her teacher is older and more strict. Even though she has the same BD kid in her class as last year and she does have to sit near him again, I don't think she is doing as much "caretaking" this year!

Good luck with your kids! I feel for the teachers, and I know it's hard. My sister is a special ed teacher in a public school, so I have heard some stories. Hang in there, and just keep in mind that SOME parents do appreciate what teachers have to go through!
 
This is one of the problems, I'm taking a bye on this one. I tend to get these kind of 'invites' because of some things I've published and some of my past professors. These count 'a lot' on 'credentials', but I can't sit through them:

Northern Illinois University

College of Liberal Arts & Sciences

Department of English, Department of History, and Center for Southeast Asian Studies

announce a one‑day “New Ideas” conference



New Ideas in History and English



THE CULTURE OF DIFFERENCE

Race, Ethnic, and Gender Relations in the Classroom and Beyond

The New Illinois Mandate (HB 312) on Genocide Education



Holmes Student Center, DeKalb, Illinois

Monday, November 7, 2005

8:00 a.m. to 2:30 p.m.





Conference Faculty



Katherine W. Andraski, M.F.A., University of Arkansas

Jerome Bowers, Ph.D., Indiana University

Chris Carger, Ph.D., University of Illinois

Margaret M. Cook, M.S.Ed., Northern Illinois University

Stephen Franklin, Ph.D., Northern Illinois University

Carla D. Goar, Ph.D., Texas A&M University

Gregory Green, M.A./M.L.S., University of California, Berkeley/University of Arizona

Julia Lamb, M.S.Ed., Northern Illinois University

Judy Ledgerwood, Ph.D., Cornell University

Andrea Molnar, Ph.D., Australian National University

Clark D. Neher, Ph.D., University of California, Los Angeles





“As we teach our kids the important lessons of history, we have to be sure that they understand that racial, national, ethnic and religious hatred can lead to horrible tragedies.”

Governor Rod R. Blagojevich



Even as cultural differences enrich, challenge and divide our classrooms, they are writing new history around the world. Join us at this fall’s New Ideas in History and English conference to discover the implications of Illinois HB 312 which mandates the teaching of global genocide. Learn from NIU experts how to present the lessons of difference through literature. From lunchtime keynote speaker, Jerome Bowers, Ph.D., Coordinator of Secondary Teacher Certification for History and Social Sciences, gain inspiration to teach the phenomenon of global genocide through the proactive stance of human rights.



Whether you are a first-time New Ideas participant or a returning colleague, this professional development day will provide you, a key teacher in an Illinois middle school, high school, or community college, with opportunities to explore new subjects, refresh your teaching resources, and collaborate with others.



To Register, call Northern Illinois University at 1-800-345-9472. Call today!





TENTATIVE PROGRAM



7:30-8:00 a.m. Check In and Registration



8:00-8:20 a.m.Welcome

Joseph Grush, Ph.D., Dean, College of Liberal Arts and Sciences

Kenton Clymer, Ph.D., Chair, Department of History

Deborah Holdstein, Ph.D., Chair, Department of English



8:30-9:30 a.m.

1A “Classroom Contexts and Resources on Southeast Asia” Julia Lamb, M.S.Ed., Outreach Coordinator for the Center for Southeast Asian Studies

or

1B “Teaching the History of the Holocaust Through Literature” Stephen Franklin, Ph.D., Visiting Assistant Professor, Department of English



9:45-10:45 a.m.

2A “Genocide as Global Phenomenon” Clark D. Neher, Ph.D., Distinguished Presidential Teaching Professor, Department of Political Science

or

2B “Teaching about Difference through Rachel Simon’s Riding on the Bus with My Sister” Katherine Andraski, M.F.A., Instructor, Department of English

or

2C “Tour of Northern Illinois University’s Southeast Asia Collection” Gregory Green, M.L.S./M.A., Curator of the Southeast Asia Collection (limit 15)



11:00-Noon

3A “Genocide in Asia’s Newest Country of East Timor” Andrea Molnar, Ph.D., Associate Professor, Department of Anthropology

or

3B “Sexual Orientation and Gender Identity as an Aspect of Difference in the School Setting” Margaret Cook, M.S.Ed., Director, Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual and Transgender Resource Center



Noon-1:15

Networking Lunch with NIU Faculty

Keynote Address “The Intertwined Issues of Genocide and Human Rights” Jerome Bowers, Ph.D., Assistant Professor and Coordinator of Secondary Teacher Certification for History and Social Sciences

Although the terms “genocide” and “human rights” were not coined until the middle of the 20th century, there is a long-standing historical and philosophical heritage to both. Genocide has occurred in Armenia, Germany, Cambodia, Bosnia, Rwanda, Iraq, and Sudan, as well as against such groups as Native Americans, Native Hawaiians, women, homosexuals, and others. The causes, courses, and consequences of genocidal violence can be taught through history, literature, and film, as well as through political action.



1:30-2:30 p.m.

4A “Race and Ethnic Relations in our Schools” Carla Goar, Ph.D., Assistant Professor, Department of Sociology

or

4B “Understanding the Holocaust and Other Genocides Through Children’s Literature”

Chris Carger, Ph.D., Associate Professor, Department of Literacy Education

or

4C “Teaching the Cambodian Genocide” Judy Ledgerwood, Ph.D., Chair and Associate Professor, Department of Anthropology
 
mom4 said:
It happened to her last year too, but not to the same extent as it did in 2nd grade. She seems ok this year; her teacher is older and more strict. Even though she has the same BD kid in her class as last year and she does have to sit near him again, I don't think she is doing as much "caretaking" this year!

Good luck with your kids! I feel for the teachers, and I know it's hard. My sister is a special ed teacher in a public school, so I have heard some stories. Hang in there, and just keep in mind that SOME parents do appreciate what teachers have to go through!

You are right. I'm lucky in that the parents of the kids do show their appreciation. Day before yesterday, had to chaperone the middle schoolers because once again, the art teacher had scedualed a field trip to the Art Institute. Once again, she had done no prep with the kids, they were clueless to what was going to be 'studied'. Luckily for the first time, it was ancient artifacts. They were more than prepared, but they also knew there was no 'tie in' to curriculum for art. That led to my bad day yesterday. Unlike the 6th grade, the 7th is like a BD class. They trashed the bus. $100 fine. They are my homeroom. :coffee3:

55 minutes at the Art Institute. 1.75 hours at Portillo's, (lunch). Not my idea of a field trip. :coffee3:

However, both the parents solicited as chaperones wanted to buy my lunch. I said, "Hey, even I can afford $5.00". No way. One paid for my lunch, the other gave me $5 saying to buy lunch tomorrow. Gotta love the parents.
 
Re: Post #17
I often wonder if the social "differences" in our society would be less of a problem if we would just quit spending so much time dwelling on them. It's like they want to antagonize the issue by continually pointing it out. Drives you crazy.
 
mom4 said:
Re: Post #17
I often wonder if the social "differences" in our society would be less of a problem if we would just quit spending so much time dwelling on them. It's like they want to antagonize the issue by continually pointing it out. Drives you crazy.
Ah but the 'education community' thrives on these issues. Me, I like history and politics. I know, I hide it well... :laugh:
 
KarlMarx said:
Maybe that's the whole point. Stupid people who are indoctrinated to think a certain way and are totally dependent on the government will be so much easier to rule over..... like sheep in a stockade. Also, criticism is a no-no, even better for those who want to rule. If you can't criticize anyone, you can't criticize those who rule, either.

What Hobbit said. This is an excellent observation.

Public school basically trains people to be complacent, unquestioning worker bees and consumers. It rewards following directions and punishes original thinking. John Taylor Gatto is a good writer on this topic.

Homeschooling may not be practical for all, but I love the idea in concept. It's a big "F-you" to the system.
 

Forum List

Back
Top