Where do you stand on State succession?

[rdean]

Well the far left wants the US to be more like Europe so each state should become it's country and then join a political union to inflate the US currency.

No, you would have all these educated rich northern states and a lot of poor and ignorant southern states. The lack of environmental laws and regulations in the southern states would let the pollution bleed over into the northern states and cause a lot of problems. Not to mention all those hungry white southerners trying to sneak over the border to find a job.

 

[kaz]

For most of my life, I could not have contemplated the idea that I would support such a thing. But the curve of the country towards socialism and away from liberty is so steep that I would now not only embrace the idea, but move to a State that secession. What say you?

If we can stop Red States from bleeding Blue States dry, I think that would be a good thing. 150 years of conservative policies in Red States and the divide between the rich and the poor is enormous. Huge numbers have no health care and are in poverty. Trashing environmental laws has turned a number of those states into cess pools.

I'm afraid if they were allowed to secede, they would attempt to start up slavery again.

Wow, I was actually laughing out loud at you

 

[natstew]

Looks like Obama is getting ready to go 'Lincoln'.

The Last Great Stand » THIS SHOULD GIVE YOU NIGHTMARES: Author Says Obama Wants Military Leaders Who Will Fire On U.S. Citizens

Obama has surpassed Hugo Chavez in Tyranny!

 

[natstew]

Well the far left wants the US to be more like Europe so each state should become it's country and then join a political union to inflate the US currency.

No, you would have all these educated rich northern states and a lot of poor and ignorant southern states. The lack of environmental laws and regulations in the southern states would let the pollution bleed over into the northern states and cause a lot of problems. Not to mention all those hungry white southerners trying to sneak over the border to find a job.

RDEAN, You really should see a Doctor ASAP!

 

[JWBooth]

For most of my life, I could not have contemplated the idea that I would support such a thing. But the curve of the country towards socialism and away from liberty is so steep that I would now not only embrace the idea, but move to a State that secession. What say you?

If we can stop Red States from bleeding Blue States dry, I think that would be a good thing. 150 years of conservative policies in Red States and the divide between the rich and the poor is enormous. Huge numbers have no health care and are in poverty. Trashing environmental laws has turned a number of those states into cess pools.

I'm afraid if they were allowed to secede, they would attempt to start up slavery again.

Deano that is some over the top funny stuff. One would think you are intentionally trying to sabotage your own argument with this nonsense.

 

[SwimExpert]

Well the far left wants the US to be more like Europe so each state should become it's country and then join a political union to inflate the US currency.

No, you would have all these educated rich northern states and a lot of poor and ignorant southern states. The lack of environmental laws and regulations in the southern states would let the pollution bleed over into the northern states and cause a lot of problems. Not to mention all those hungry white southerners trying to sneak over the border to find a job.

RDEAN, You really should see a Doctor ASAP!

You're just as stupid as he is. God forbid you all should ever have angry sex. You might give rise to a new species of humans with 74 and 3/4 chromosomes per cell.

 

[editec]

So the STATES can secede because that's fair.

Okay, can the cities secede, too?

How about a neighborhood of a city?

How about one guy who decided he wants his own country?

Don't bother looking to the constitution for an answer, cause the COTUS does not address this issue.

IF you believe the states can secede, then why not any and every one?

 

[mamooth]

If Texas seceded, we wouldn't have to build a wall around it. Like East Germany, any conservative nation-state would quickly build a wall to keep its people in, to stop them from fleeing to a democracy.

They'd especially need to keep the slaves controlled. Though they'd call them "perpetual contractees" or something like that, and declare that, in accordance with libertarian principles, those people "voluntarily" sold themselves into eternal servitude to TheCompany, so the eternal servitude is totally acceptable in the name of economic liberty.

Me, I'd feel morally obligated to move to a conservative state, so I could get an Underground Railroad type thing going. I have no troubles with passing for conservative when I want to.

 

[Truthmatters]

see the right desire a fractioning of our country?


these people do not love this country


They do not love democracy



they want right wing rule no matter what the majority wants

 

[natstew]

The states cannot secede.

The Constitution doesn't prohibit it. The Declaration Of Independence proclaims it, calls it our DUTY when our Government ignores our God given rights.

Our Forefathers gave us a Constitution as the Supreme Law Of The Land. Our Government has practically shredded it. That is reason enough to Secede.

This gives the States Authority to Secede if they so chose:

AMENDMENT X
The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.

Authority to secede is not delegated to the United States, (meaning the States don't need permission from the United States Government to Secede,) nor prohibited by the Constitution to the States, so the Authority to Secede remains with the States. Even if it was prohibited to the States it would remain with the people. The People could vote to Secede and form a new and separate Government.

Abraham Lincoln understood this, that is why he needed the South to fire the first shot, so he could claim the Confederate States started the war. Fort Sumpter was his, "Gulf Of Tonkin", incident, his Pearl Harbor. Lincoln had his Army poised and ready to invade Virginia. He intimidated Charleston, blocked shipping in and out of the largest Cotton port in the South at the time, knowing the citizens of Charleston would demand the port be opened by whatever means it took.
Prior to invading Virginia Abraham Lincoln sided with the right of States to secede if the State thought it was not being represented fairly in Congress.

I don't know what the World would be like if Lincoln had not Unconstitutionally invaded Virginia, but I know that when he did it was the end of the Republic and the birth of the Empire. The States that exercised their Constitutional Right to withdraw from the Union were Conquered by force of arms and subjected to rule by the tyrannical Federal Government. Nothing you can scream through your foaming mouth can change that!

This is Constitutional Law! No matter what you Liberal/Progressive/Democrat/Socialist tyrants post here, this doesn't change.

 

[jon_berzerk]

Section 10 - Powers prohibited of States
No State shall enter into any Treaty, Alliance, or Confederation; grant Letters of Marque
and Reprisal; coin Money; emit Bills of Credit; make any Thing but gold and silver Coin
a Tender in Payment of Debts; pass any Bill of Attainder, ex post facto Law, or Law
impairing the Obligation of Contracts, or grant any Title of Nobility.
No State shall, without the Consent of the Congress, lay any Imposts or Duties on
Imports or Exports, except what may be absolutely necessary for executing it's inspection
Laws: and the net Produce of all Duties and Imposts, laid by any State on Imports or
Exports, shall be for the Use of the Treasury of the United States; and all such Laws shall
be subject to the Revision and Controul of the Congress.
No State shall, without the Consent of Congress, lay any duty of Tonnage, keep Troops,
or Ships of War in time of Peace, enter into any Agreement or Compact with another
State, or with a foreign Power, or engage in War, unless actually invaded, or in such
imminent Danger as will not admit of delay

http://www.usconstitution.net/const.pdf

point out where it says a state can not leave the union

 

[SwimExpert]

This gives the States Authority to Secede if they so chose:

AMENDMENT X
The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.

False. The 10th amendment reserves the original powers of the states, prior to the ratification of the constitution. It does not grant to the states any power whatsoever. It does not grant to the states any power that did not exist before. It is impossible for the states to have enjoyed a power to secede from the union before the ratification of the constitution. The Articles of Confederation declared that the union were perpetual. And prior to that, the union did not exist.

 

[jon_berzerk]

This gives the States Authority to Secede if they so chose:

AMENDMENT X
The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.

False. The 10th amendment reserves the original powers of the states, prior to the ratification of the constitution. It does not grant to the states any power whatsoever. It does not grant to the states any power that did not exist before. It is impossible for the states to have enjoyed a power to secede from the union before the ratification of the constitution. The Articles of Confederation declared that the union were perpetual. And prior to that, the union did not exist.

any say congress would have is if the state

wanted to be another state within the union

 

[SwimExpert]

This gives the States Authority to Secede if they so chose:

AMENDMENT X
The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.

False. The 10th amendment reserves the original powers of the states, prior to the ratification of the constitution. It does not grant to the states any power whatsoever. It does not grant to the states any power that did not exist before. It is impossible for the states to have enjoyed a power to secede from the union before the ratification of the constitution. The Articles of Confederation declared that the union were perpetual. And prior to that, the union did not exist.

any say congress would have is if the state

wanted to be another state within the union

Why do you say that?

 

[natstew]

The right to withdraw was not addressed directly for a reason. If it was denied the Constitution would never have been ratified. Even though the majority favored the right to withdraw, some States wanted it to be denied and if it was openly addressed they would not have ratified the Document.
That is one theory.

Another, which explains why it wasn't directly addressed, and the one I endorse, is that all the States took it for granted that they could withdraw if they were being abused by a Tyrannical Federal Government. (percieved is real to the perciever) This one fits the facts!

 

[bripat9643]

The states cannot secede.

Not when the federal government will lay waste to them if they do.

But that's the only reason.

 

[natstew]

This gives the States Authority to Secede if they so chose:

AMENDMENT X
The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.

False. The 10th amendment reserves the original powers of the states, prior to the ratification of the constitution. It does not grant to the states any power whatsoever. It does not grant to the states any power that did not exist before. It is impossible for the states to have enjoyed a power to secede from the union before the ratification of the constitution. The Articles of Confederation declared that the union were perpetual. And prior to that, the union did not exist.

False. The Articles Of Confederation are null and void, do not apply at all. The Constitution begins with all powers belonging to the PEOPLE, not a Document!

 

[bripat9643]

Well the far left wants the US to be more like Europe so each state should become it's country and then join a political union to inflate the US currency.

No, you would have all these educated rich northern states and a lot of poor and ignorant southern states. The lack of environmental laws and regulations in the southern states would let the pollution bleed over into the northern states and cause a lot of problems. Not to mention all those hungry white southerners trying to sneak over the border to find a job.

Well, it's true that all the parasites who don't want to work and only want to squeeze out puppies for others to cloth, house and feed would all head North. Are you saying the Northern states wouldn't call them "immigrants" and refuse to grant them amnesty?

 

[bripat9643]

Looks like Obama is getting ready to go 'Lincoln'.

The Last Great Stand » THIS SHOULD GIVE YOU NIGHTMARES: Author Says Obama Wants Military Leaders Who Will Fire On U.S. Citizens

Obama has surpassed Hugo Chavez in Tyranny!

A lot of right-wingers say U.S. troops would never fire on American citizens. That may be true now, but the military can be converted into a force that would. It would only take a couple more administrations like this one.

 

[bripat9643]

So the STATES can secede because that's fair.

Okay, can the cities secede, too?

How about a neighborhood of a city?

How about one guy who decided he wants his own country?

Don't bother looking to the constitution for an answer, cause the COTUS does not address this issue.

IF you believe the states can secede, then why not any and every one?

Yes, they should all be able to secede. That you would truly have a government ruled by the consent of the governed.