Where Bad Ideas Are Born

Hobbit

Senior Member
Joined
Mar 25, 2004
Messages
5,099
Reaction score
421
Points
48
Location
Near Atlanta, GA
Here's an interesting article on the philosophies of the Teachers' College at Columbia University. It's the same graduate school where such ideas as new math, outcome-based education, and whole language originated. Apparantly, their new 'framework,' which is the length of a small novel, expresses that such outdated ideas as "merit" and "individual responsibility" are nothing more than "ideologies" which are used as "excuses to descriminate" and that it is the responsibility of teachers to end such descrimination. It also sharply criticizes the teaching industry for have white, middle-class teachers in the majority.

http://www.townhall.com/columnists/MonaCharen/2006/10/13/letting_the_pc_slip_show
 

Abbey Normal

Senior Member
Joined
Jul 9, 2005
Messages
4,825
Reaction score
393
Points
48
Location
Mid-Atlantic region
Here's an interesting article on the philosophies of the Teachers' College at Columbia University. It's the same graduate school where such ideas as new math, outcome-based education, and whole language. Apparantly, their new 'framework,' which is the length of a small novel, expresses that such outdated ideas as "merit" and "individual responsibility" are nothing more than "ideologies" which are used as "excuses to descriminate" and that it is the responsibility of teachers to end such descrimination. It also sharply criticizes the teaching industry for have white, middle-class teachers in the majority.

http://www.townhall.com/columnists/MonaCharen/2006/10/13/letting_the_pc_slip_show
This is no joke, and it is already here. I have myself heard our District supervisors say, in a derogatory tone, that anyone on the school board who is concerned about high-achieving students is an "elitist".
 

jillian

Princess
Joined
Apr 4, 2006
Messages
84,488
Reaction score
16,372
Points
2,220
Location
The Other Side of Paradise
Here's an interesting article on the philosophies of the Teachers' College at Columbia University. It's the same graduate school where such ideas as new math, outcome-based education, and whole language originated. Apparantly, their new 'framework,' which is the length of a small novel, expresses that such outdated ideas as "merit" and "individual responsibility" are nothing more than "ideologies" which are used as "excuses to descriminate" and that it is the responsibility of teachers to end such descrimination. It also sharply criticizes the teaching industry for have white, middle-class teachers in the majority.

http://www.townhall.com/columnists/MonaCharen/2006/10/13/letting_the_pc_slip_show

See... this is where propaganda works so well... Mona Charen, some right-wing extremist type on Townhall.com (real credible site, there.. lol!) says

you name the fad and it probably originated in Morningside Heights in New York.

And Hobbit comes back and says "It's the same graduate school where such ideas as new math, outcome-based education, and whole language originated.". Dude, she was making stuff up... you just repeated it as an affirmative factual statement.

Moreover, where's the framework she's talking about? Not a link to it. In other words, the article is a piece of puffery and has absolutely no factual validity.

While some of what she's saying may be valid, you'll forgive me if I get my facts straight and not filtered through Mona Charen's biases.
 
OP
Hobbit

Hobbit

Senior Member
Joined
Mar 25, 2004
Messages
5,099
Reaction score
421
Points
48
Location
Near Atlanta, GA
See... this is where propaganda works so well... Mona Charen, some right-wing extremist type on Townhall.com (real credible site, there.. lol!) says

you name the fad and it probably originated in Morningside Heights in New York.

And Hobbit comes back and says "It's the same graduate school where such ideas as new math, outcome-based education, and whole language originated.". Dude, she was making stuff up... you just repeated it as an affirmative factual statement.

Moreover, where's the framework she's talking about? Not a link to it. In other words, the article is a piece of puffery and has absolutely no factual validity.

While some of what she's saying may be valid, you'll forgive me if I get my facts straight and not filtered through Mona Charen's biases.
You can't attack the message, so you attack the messenger. If you can come back with some proof that anything she said was false, rather than just screaming "SHE'S TEH RITE WING LIAR!!!!!!!" then maybe I'll argue.
 

Nienna

VIP Member
Joined
Feb 24, 2005
Messages
4,515
Reaction score
334
Points
83
Location
Ohio
This is no joke, and it is already here. I have myself heard our District supervisors say, in a derogatory tone, that anyone on the school board who is concerned about high-achieving students is an "elitist".
My sister is a special ed teacher, and she repeats what she was taught in school... that "smart" kids will excel without help, but less gifted kids cannot do this. What a crock! Not many kids will discipline themselves to learn, no matter how bright they are. What they are doing is leaving the best & the brightest to become lazy underachievers. I am all for giving help to the less-gifted kids, but it is done to the detriment of the smarter kids these days.
 

Annie

Diamond Member
Joined
Nov 22, 2003
Messages
50,848
Reaction score
4,826
Points
1,790
See... this is where propaganda works so well... Mona Charen, some right-wing extremist type on Townhall.com (real credible site, there.. lol!) says

you name the fad and it probably originated in Morningside Heights in New York.

And Hobbit comes back and says "It's the same graduate school where such ideas as new math, outcome-based education, and whole language originated.". Dude, she was making stuff up... you just repeated it as an affirmative factual statement.

Moreover, where's the framework she's talking about? Not a link to it. In other words, the article is a piece of puffery and has absolutely no factual validity.

While some of what she's saying may be valid, you'll forgive me if I get my facts straight and not filtered through Mona Charen's biases.
Jillian, I agree that you are probably on the mark here. I think it would be impossible to say what universities came up with the ideas of 'new math', 'cooperative grouping', 'whole language' for the norm, multiple intelligences based teaching, mainstreaming, diversified classes, etc.

Bottom line, it's educational departments at most universities, published and advertised by those never stepping into a classroom as a general education teacher. It's hurt countless number of children.
 

jillian

Princess
Joined
Apr 4, 2006
Messages
84,488
Reaction score
16,372
Points
2,220
Location
The Other Side of Paradise
You can't attack the message, so you attack the messenger. If you can come back with some proof that anything she said was false, rather than just screaming "SHE'S TEH RITE WING LIAR!!!!!!!" then maybe I'll argue.
There was no message. She said it "probably" came from Morningside Heights.... in other words she has no clue and she made it up.

I don't have to scream, "she's a liar". She just isn't conveying anything but her opinion, which, given her initial assertion, is valueless.

You then took her surmise and stated it as if it were fact when she clearly, clearly used the word "probably" which means she was guessing and thought she'd take a potshot at the NY lib ivy league, even though she had no basis.
 

jillian

Princess
Joined
Apr 4, 2006
Messages
84,488
Reaction score
16,372
Points
2,220
Location
The Other Side of Paradise
Jillian, I agree that you are probably on the mark here. I think it would be impossible to say what universities came up with the ideas of 'new math', 'cooperative grouping', 'whole language' for the norm, multiple intelligences based teaching, mainstreaming, diversified classes, etc.

Bottom line, it's educational departments at most universities, published and advertised by those never stepping into a classroom as a general education teacher. It's hurt countless number of children.
There are definitely things which need to be fixed in education and I wouldn't mind reading the document they referred to. I always think it's a problem when people who have never been in the field give the marching orders to those who are.
 

Annie

Diamond Member
Joined
Nov 22, 2003
Messages
50,848
Reaction score
4,826
Points
1,790
There are definitely things which need to be fixed in education and I wouldn't mind reading the document they referred to. I always think it's a problem when people who have never been in the field give the marching orders to those who are.
Problem is very perplexing when those who haven't are teaching those who will. Only in education, perhaps because it does attract those that fit no where else? Secondary teachers are better, but only marginally. Notice there is much less of 'education theory' that filters 'up', though the results do.

We now have university professors complaining of the results of the new teaching methods.
 

Gunny

Gold Member
Joined
Dec 27, 2004
Messages
44,689
Reaction score
6,852
Points
198
Location
The Republic of Texas
There was no message. She said it "probably" came from Morningside Heights.... in other words she has no clue and she made it up.

I don't have to scream, "she's a liar". She just isn't conveying anything but her opinion, which, given her initial assertion, is valueless.

You then took her surmise and stated it as if it were fact when she clearly, clearly used the word "probably" which means she was guessing and thought she'd take a potshot at the NY lib ivy league, even though she had no basis.
Gotta' love THIS. Her opinion is "valueless" because your opinion doesn't like hers.

She has no basis to believe the NY lib ivy league is a bunch of eltist intellectuals with about as much personality as a microchip?:rolleyes:
 

Most reactions - Past 7 days

Forum List

Top