What do you all think of hydrogen fuel cells to power trucks and cars?

[MarathonMike]

I just started reading about Nikola and their use of hydrogen fuel cells in trucks. I've been interested in hydrogen as a fuel since the early 90s when I first saw a demo of it. Apparently hydrogen fuel cells were used in the Space Shuttle program for decades, something I didn't know. What do you think, is this a viable alternative to EVs? Apparently the range is 500+ miles between recharge.

Nikola Corporation Hydrogen in heavy-duty transport: EWG supports E.ON and Nikola in international H2 project -

E.ON and Nikola, together with partners and interested customers, are working to develop a package for hydrogen-powered heavy-duty transport. With expertise in energy, infrastructure and transportation, the Essen-based energy company and the U.S. hydrogen pioneer have set themselves the goal of...

nikolamotor.com

 

[Polishprince]

I just started reading about Nikola and their use of hydrogen fuel cells in trucks. I've been interested in hydrogen as a fuel since the early 90s when I first saw a demo of it. Apparently hydrogen fuel cells were used in the Space Shuttle program for decades, something I didn't know. What do you think, is this a viable alternative to EVs? Apparently the range is 500+ miles between recharge.

Nikola Corporation Hydrogen in heavy-duty transport: EWG supports E.ON and Nikola in international H2 project -

E.ON and Nikola, together with partners and interested customers, are working to develop a package for hydrogen-powered heavy-duty transport. With expertise in energy, infrastructure and transportation, the Essen-based energy company and the U.S. hydrogen pioneer have set themselves the goal of...

nikolamotor.com

The great thing about hydrogen is that when it burns , it produces water.

If the could be recaptured, it could be recycled and burned again and again.

 

[22lcidw]

W. Bush pushed this when he was President. When the Progs took over they eliminated it.

 

[Daryl Hunt]

W. Bush pushed this when he was President. When the Progs took over they eliminated it.

The problem with Hydrogen is, it's the smallest molecule and that pesky little critter has a tendency to leak though the best of the seals. Now unless you are NASA or the equiv and have the facility to deal with it (lots of distance and lack of other things) then you may not want to be around a hydrogen powered car. One of the worst problems with them is when it leaks, it collects in places like fender wells and other places and just waits for something to set it off. If you do put it in a fuel cell, the cost of operation is so high it's not a viable alternative to anything but it's at least safer. Politics didn't kill it, common sense did.

 

[Grumblenuts]

Nicola?
Ricola!

Fascinating stuff!

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

I just started reading about Nikola and their use of hydrogen fuel cells in trucks. I've been interested in hydrogen as a fuel since the early 90s when I first saw a demo of it. Apparently hydrogen fuel cells were used in the Space Shuttle program for decades, something I didn't know. What do you think, is this a viable alternative to EVs? Apparently the range is 500+ miles between recharge.

Nikola Corporation Hydrogen in heavy-duty transport: EWG supports E.ON and Nikola in international H2 project -

E.ON and Nikola, together with partners and interested customers, are working to develop a package for hydrogen-powered heavy-duty transport. With expertise in energy, infrastructure and transportation, the Essen-based energy company and the U.S. hydrogen pioneer have set themselves the goal of...

nikolamotor.com

Waste of money and energy.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

If the could be recaptured, it could be recycled and burned again and again.

But why would you want to?

 

[westwall]

I just started reading about Nikola and their use of hydrogen fuel cells in trucks. I've been interested in hydrogen as a fuel since the early 90s when I first saw a demo of it. Apparently hydrogen fuel cells were used in the Space Shuttle program for decades, something I didn't know. What do you think, is this a viable alternative to EVs? Apparently the range is 500+ miles between recharge.

Nikola Corporation Hydrogen in heavy-duty transport: EWG supports E.ON and Nikola in international H2 project -

E.ON and Nikola, together with partners and interested customers, are working to develop a package for hydrogen-powered heavy-duty transport. With expertise in energy, infrastructure and transportation, the Essen-based energy company and the U.S. hydrogen pioneer have set themselves the goal of...

nikolamotor.com

Hydrogen fuel cells are, IMO the way to go. Recharge is just like a gasoline powered car, except you use liquid H.

 

[westwall]

I just started reading about Nikola and their use of hydrogen fuel cells in trucks. I've been interested in hydrogen as a fuel since the early 90s when I first saw a demo of it. Apparently hydrogen fuel cells were used in the Space Shuttle program for decades, something I didn't know. What do you think, is this a viable alternative to EVs? Apparently the range is 500+ miles between recharge.

Nikola Corporation Hydrogen in heavy-duty transport: EWG supports E.ON and Nikola in international H2 project -

E.ON and Nikola, together with partners and interested customers, are working to develop a package for hydrogen-powered heavy-duty transport. With expertise in energy, infrastructure and transportation, the Essen-based energy company and the U.S. hydrogen pioneer have set themselves the goal of...

nikolamotor.com

Waste of money and energy.

I disagree. The technology development alone will be beneficial down the road.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

I just started reading about Nikola and their use of hydrogen fuel cells in trucks. I've been interested in hydrogen as a fuel since the early 90s when I first saw a demo of it. Apparently hydrogen fuel cells were used in the Space Shuttle program for decades, something I didn't know. What do you think, is this a viable alternative to EVs? Apparently the range is 500+ miles between recharge.

Nikola Corporation Hydrogen in heavy-duty transport: EWG supports E.ON and Nikola in international H2 project -

E.ON and Nikola, together with partners and interested customers, are working to develop a package for hydrogen-powered heavy-duty transport. With expertise in energy, infrastructure and transportation, the Essen-based energy company and the U.S. hydrogen pioneer have set themselves the goal of...

nikolamotor.com

Hydrogen fuel cells are, IMO the way to go. Recharge is just like a gasoline powered car, except you use liquid H.

How much are cryogenic fuel tanks going to cost?
Any danger of explosion in a crash?
How often do you need to refuel?
Where do you get the hydrogen?

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

I just started reading about Nikola and their use of hydrogen fuel cells in trucks. I've been interested in hydrogen as a fuel since the early 90s when I first saw a demo of it. Apparently hydrogen fuel cells were used in the Space Shuttle program for decades, something I didn't know. What do you think, is this a viable alternative to EVs? Apparently the range is 500+ miles between recharge.

Nikola Corporation Hydrogen in heavy-duty transport: EWG supports E.ON and Nikola in international H2 project -

E.ON and Nikola, together with partners and interested customers, are working to develop a package for hydrogen-powered heavy-duty transport. With expertise in energy, infrastructure and transportation, the Essen-based energy company and the U.S. hydrogen pioneer have set themselves the goal of...

nikolamotor.com

Waste of money and energy.

I disagree. The technology development alone will be beneficial down the road.

Beneficial to what?

 

[westwall]

I just started reading about Nikola and their use of hydrogen fuel cells in trucks. I've been interested in hydrogen as a fuel since the early 90s when I first saw a demo of it. Apparently hydrogen fuel cells were used in the Space Shuttle program for decades, something I didn't know. What do you think, is this a viable alternative to EVs? Apparently the range is 500+ miles between recharge.

Nikola Corporation Hydrogen in heavy-duty transport: EWG supports E.ON and Nikola in international H2 project -

E.ON and Nikola, together with partners and interested customers, are working to develop a package for hydrogen-powered heavy-duty transport. With expertise in energy, infrastructure and transportation, the Essen-based energy company and the U.S. hydrogen pioneer have set themselves the goal of...

nikolamotor.com

Waste of money and energy.

I disagree. The technology development alone will be beneficial down the road.

Beneficial to what?

Space travel, power generation, undersea uses, anyplace that conventional power doesn't work well.

 

[Dick Foster]

I just started reading about Nikola and their use of hydrogen fuel cells in trucks. I've been interested in hydrogen as a fuel since the early 90s when I first saw a demo of it. Apparently hydrogen fuel cells were used in the Space Shuttle program for decades, something I didn't know. What do you think, is this a viable alternative to EVs? Apparently the range is 500+ miles between recharge.

Nikola Corporation Hydrogen in heavy-duty transport: EWG supports E.ON and Nikola in international H2 project -

E.ON and Nikola, together with partners and interested customers, are working to develop a package for hydrogen-powered heavy-duty transport. With expertise in energy, infrastructure and transportation, the Essen-based energy company and the U.S. hydrogen pioneer have set themselves the goal of...

nikolamotor.com

Pretty niffty idea once you solve the problem of where all the hydrogen is going to come from. Currently it's from oil which doesn't really get us anywhere. Its like electric cars in that respect as the vast majority of electic cars end up as just a grossly inefficient way to use fossil fuel to power a car indirectly. Every time energy is converted from one form to another you suffer whats known as conversion loss, typically in the form of heat. Put you hand on an electibc motor, the heat you feel is basically conversion loss. When you charge a battery and both the battery and the charger heat up, thats more conversion loss, then there's the transmission loss incurred just from getting the electricity from the fossil fueled generating station to your wall socket, where you plug in the charger that's gonna get hot charging up the batteries which in turn heat up, etc and that's before the car moves an inch down the road.
However as far as fuel cells are concerned you might be better off just burning the hydrogen and skipping all of the inbetween steps and sidestepping all the conversion loss along the way in the process. The exhaust is still only pure water.

 

[Grumblenuts]

The technology development alone will be beneficial down the road.

That's possible. Then again, it's actually far from being anything new. Much better investments likely at this point.

 

[westwall]

I just started reading about Nikola and their use of hydrogen fuel cells in trucks. I've been interested in hydrogen as a fuel since the early 90s when I first saw a demo of it. Apparently hydrogen fuel cells were used in the Space Shuttle program for decades, something I didn't know. What do you think, is this a viable alternative to EVs? Apparently the range is 500+ miles between recharge.

Nikola Corporation Hydrogen in heavy-duty transport: EWG supports E.ON and Nikola in international H2 project -

E.ON and Nikola, together with partners and interested customers, are working to develop a package for hydrogen-powered heavy-duty transport. With expertise in energy, infrastructure and transportation, the Essen-based energy company and the U.S. hydrogen pioneer have set themselves the goal of...

nikolamotor.com

Hydrogen fuel cells are, IMO the way to go. Recharge is just like a gasoline powered car, except you use liquid H.

How much are cryogenic fuel tanks going to cost?
Any danger of explosion in a crash?
How often do you need to refuel?
Where do you get the hydrogen?

Cost has already been lowered by half. After just a couple of years of research. No real danger with liquid H if it is stored properly. Same as a car. Hydrogen extraction is THE big cost now. Tech research will lower that.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

I just started reading about Nikola and their use of hydrogen fuel cells in trucks. I've been interested in hydrogen as a fuel since the early 90s when I first saw a demo of it. Apparently hydrogen fuel cells were used in the Space Shuttle program for decades, something I didn't know. What do you think, is this a viable alternative to EVs? Apparently the range is 500+ miles between recharge.

Nikola Corporation Hydrogen in heavy-duty transport: EWG supports E.ON and Nikola in international H2 project -

E.ON and Nikola, together with partners and interested customers, are working to develop a package for hydrogen-powered heavy-duty transport. With expertise in energy, infrastructure and transportation, the Essen-based energy company and the U.S. hydrogen pioneer have set themselves the goal of...

nikolamotor.com

Waste of money and energy.

I disagree. The technology development alone will be beneficial down the road.

Beneficial to what?

Space travel, power generation, undersea uses, anyplace that conventional power doesn't work well.

Space travel, power generation,

We have plenty of experience with fuel cells in space.
Why would you want to "generate power" with liquid H2?

anyplace that conventional power doesn't work well.

So that leaves out automobiles.

 

[MarathonMike]

W. Bush pushed this when he was President. When the Progs took over they eliminated it.

The problem with Hydrogen is, it's the smallest molecule and that pesky little critter has a tendency to leak though the best of the seals. Now unless you are NASA or the equiv and have the facility to deal with it (lots of distance and lack of other things) then you may not want to be around a hydrogen powered car. One of the worst problems with them is when it leaks, it collects in places like fender wells and other places and just waits for something to set it off. If you do put it in a fuel cell, the cost of operation is so high it's not a viable alternative to anything but it's at least safer. Politics didn't kill it, common sense did.

Those are reasonable points. But it would seem that decades of experience with the Space Shuttle program the safety and leaking problems would have been solved.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

I just started reading about Nikola and their use of hydrogen fuel cells in trucks. I've been interested in hydrogen as a fuel since the early 90s when I first saw a demo of it. Apparently hydrogen fuel cells were used in the Space Shuttle program for decades, something I didn't know. What do you think, is this a viable alternative to EVs? Apparently the range is 500+ miles between recharge.

Nikola Corporation Hydrogen in heavy-duty transport: EWG supports E.ON and Nikola in international H2 project -

E.ON and Nikola, together with partners and interested customers, are working to develop a package for hydrogen-powered heavy-duty transport. With expertise in energy, infrastructure and transportation, the Essen-based energy company and the U.S. hydrogen pioneer have set themselves the goal of...

nikolamotor.com

Hydrogen fuel cells are, IMO the way to go. Recharge is just like a gasoline powered car, except you use liquid H.

How much are cryogenic fuel tanks going to cost?
Any danger of explosion in a crash?
How often do you need to refuel?
Where do you get the hydrogen?

Cost has already been lowered by half. After just a couple of years of research. No real danger with liquid H if it is stored properly. Same as a car. Hydrogen extraction is THE big cost now. Tech research will lower that.

Cost has already been lowered by half.

So now it's only 3 times the cost and half the energy?

No real danger with liquid H if it is stored properly.

And if it's not or it's in a crash?????

Hydrogen extraction is THE big cost now.

And the big energy waste. I don't see the attraction.
Is it fear of CO2?

 

[harmonica]

I just started reading about Nikola and their use of hydrogen fuel cells in trucks. I've been interested in hydrogen as a fuel since the early 90s when I first saw a demo of it. Apparently hydrogen fuel cells were used in the Space Shuttle program for decades, something I didn't know. What do you think, is this a viable alternative to EVs? Apparently the range is 500+ miles between recharge.

Nikola Corporation Hydrogen in heavy-duty transport: EWG supports E.ON and Nikola in international H2 project -

E.ON and Nikola, together with partners and interested customers, are working to develop a package for hydrogen-powered heavy-duty transport. With expertise in energy, infrastructure and transportation, the Essen-based energy company and the U.S. hydrogen pioneer have set themselves the goal of...

nikolamotor.com

Waste of money and energy.

I disagree. The technology development alone will be beneficial down the road.

NOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!! WRONG and stupid !!!!
much better to go FARRRRRRRR away in space to get the stuff we need
that's what you guys say

Would anyone benefit from a moon base...

...other than NA$A???

www.usmessageboard.com

 

[westwall]

The technology development alone will be beneficial down the road.

That's possible. Then again, it's actually far from being anything new. Much better investments likely at this point.

Like what? Windmills? Talk about ancient technology!